Woman Dies After Riding "Mission: Space"

[mrsR123]

The ride appears to be perfectly safe if you follow the posted safety warnings. The two dead guests both had medical conditions that were ticking timebombs, and they should never have gotten into the capsules. Disney cannot he held accountable for their mistake, whether or not they were aware of their condition.

I do think Disney can do more than just have the 26 or so safety warnings that are currently in place. They need to state in clear, unthemed and un-pixie-dusted language that, while safe for healthy individuals, anyone with certain medical conditions can become gravely ill as a result of the physical stress placed on the body by this ride. Not the current "it is intense - sign up for mission control duty if you don't have what it takes" type warnings. This is a unique attraction, and playing it cute apparently doesn't work very well.

Or, even better, they should change the preshow to include a mandatory blood pressure check and preclude anyone with elevated levels from riding. Sounds ridiculous and will never be done, but fits the theme of the pavilion perfectly... getting your pre-flight physical, just like a real astronaut!

REAL Disney rides are supposed to be about story and immersion. If this machine is so intense that it requires breaking those philosohical basics to be safe for its guests, then it really doesn't belong in a Disney park. If this is the best answer ( and I don't think it is), then the ride doesn't belong.

 

[FigNewton]

I say shut it down, how can Disney honestly expect every single rider to be in absolute top physical condition?

They don't expect that. They expect riders to lack serious medical conditions. The people who died had serious medical conditions. There's a serious difference between the two. I'm nowhere near top physical condition but to the best of my knowlege I have no real problems either.

 

[annie1995]

Or, even better, they should change the preshow to include a mandatory blood pressure check and preclude anyone with elevated levels from riding. Sounds ridiculous and will never be done, but fits the theme of the pavilion perfectly... getting your pre-flight physical, just like a real astronaut!

I think thats a wonderful idea! I agree, this would never be done, but it still sounds great!

 

[DancingBear]

This almosts sounds like an awesome episode for CSI.

Coincidentally, the Orange/Osceola Medical Examiner has a show on Discovery Channel.

 

[wdw4us2]

This is not like getting on a motorcycle and experiencing something you've done many times before. Physical thrill rides and this one in particular subject our bodies to things we simply do not experience with any kind of regularity anywhere else, unless we are an astronaut, professional race car driver, etc.

I personally feel that if the current rate of deaths occuring on M:S is statistically representative of the risks, then its not acceptable. But again, that is my personal opinion, and I am not basing my opinions on what Disney should do on that.

Well stated, Matt, I agree with your opinion 100%. I also agree with this statement:

REAL Disney rides are supposed to be about story and immersion. If this machine is so intense that it requires breaking those philosohical basics to be safe for its guests, then it really doesn't belong in a Disney park.

I know I won't ride it again. My kids (ages 11 & 14) have seen the extensive media coverage since we live in Florida. Neither one of them want to ride again - my daughter said she didn't think it was that great anyway and she loves most thrill rides.

 

[G8RFAN]

After reading this thread, I started to post about the huge challenges of using a two year sample size using assumptions of the physiological condition of MS participants vs the general population, but decided to delete it all. What is more interesting is what I see from the dialogue here. We always hear about the huge punitive award for the woman who burned her legs and groin area from a hot McDonalds coffee in the drive thru. The fact of the matter is that a jury of our peers decided that MickyD's was primarily at fault and that the judge found the defendant's conduct reckless, callous and willful. We now have coffe pretty much served everywhere at 140° or less, safety cutoffs from lawnmowers to treadmills, denatured alcohol, and safety disclosures for shampoo. Ignoring all the "That's the way Walt would want it" posts, what will probably happen is a cost-benefit analysis by the powers at be and we may wind up having a toned down MS in the near future. Maybe 1.5 G's or less. Or maybe they will sell the whole ride to Cedar's Park. As long as enough of us will continue to bring our vacation dollars to their door step, they will tweek or discard the MS franchise altogether.

The funny thing is that we were just on vacation in Albuquerque and Sante Fe last week (where the Micky D's coffee incident happened) and spent a few days hiking and exploring ruins in the various National Parks. We all have some cuts, scrapes, and bruises from the steep trails, loose rocks, and sharp and formidible desert plant life. I can see mandatory knee, elbow and helmets in the future......

 

[ChrisFL]

warning labels on other products have absolutely ZERO to do with what's happening with M:S so there's no reason to even bring it up.

Let's look at the facts...

Mission Space gets more complaints than any other Disney ride about ill effects, more actual hospital visits, more deaths in its short operating span than most other thrill rides, and more people who have sworn to never ride it because they fear health effects.

So why shouldn't Disney do something at all to change it?

Please don't hate me for bringing this comparison into it, but down the road at Islands of Adventure, Dudley Do Right's Ripsaw Falls since it's opened have had it's share of complaints and injuries. Again the ride was operating normally but the guests weren't...not keeping themselves sitting up during the drops or whatever. Apparently the angle of the splashdown, etc. was causing problems for a very small percentage of guests.

But Universal has clearly realized there were problems and decided to do a lot of work to change the ride to make it safer. They've done many things to correct the issue including changing the entire final drop twice and installing different seats in the "boats" to make a better arrangement.

Mission:Space either isn't as easily done that way unless they just tone down the ride. I also believe that if they indeed DID tone down the G forces they could also make the ride longer. As it is right now, it seems short.

 

[Mickmse2002]

The ride appears to be perfectly safe if you follow the posted safety warnings. The two dead guests both had medical conditions that were ticking timebombs, and they should never have gotten into the capsules. Disney cannot he held accountable for their mistake, whether or not they were aware of their condition.

How do you know that two dead guests both had medical conditions? I think the central question here is whether Disney can be held accountable. The ride itself may not be the causal factor in any death but it could be a contributing factor. If it is a contributing factor then it needs to be studied and addressed. Inferring that someone who knows they have a specific medical condition shouldn't ride is easy, it's the low hanging fruit. The real challenge for Disney to be concerned about is whether they've created an attraction that contributes to an undiagnosed medical condition resulting in serious injury or death.

 

[pedro2112]

How do you know that two dead guests both had medical conditions?

Because that's what the medical examiner's reports stated.

I think the central question here is whether Disney can be held accountable. The ride itself may not be the causal factor in any death but it could be a contributing factor. If it is a contributing factor then it needs to be studied and addressed. Inferring that someone who knows they have a specific medical condition shouldn't ride is easy, it's the low hanging fruit. The real challenge for Disney to be concerned about is whether they've created an attraction that contributes to an undiagnosed medical condition resulting in serious injury or death.

Based on the medical conditions of the two guests that died, the water slide at POR could have contributed to their deaths. They were walking time bombs, and anything stressful could have triggered their deaths. Based on your logic, you would need to shut down not only MS, but also TOT, RnR, Space Mountain, Splash, BTMRR, EE, Teacups, Primeaval Whirl, Test Track, and last, but not least, calling for CRT breakfast at 7:00am.

 

[DancingBear]

Does anyone dispute the following:

Fact: Pre-existing conditions or not, the stresses of the ride led to the deaths of these two people.

Fact: Mission:Space creates sustained G-forces which are greater than any other known attraction (certainly more than any other Disney attraction).

Fact: There is not a lot of science out there about the effect of these sorts of forces on "average" people. Most of this work (as far as I can see) has been done on prospective astronauts and fighter pilots and such.

Is that not worth looking into further?

 

[DWatWDW]

I took my daughter to Space Camp at the US Space and Rocket center in Huntsville, AL last summer. They have a centrifuge (open to the public) that creates 6Gs. It was skull jarring. But it made M:S look pale by comparison

 

[peter11435]

Fact: Mission:Space creates sustained G-forces which are greater than any other known attraction (certainly more than any other Disney attraction).

Mission: Space's G-forces are not that high. They are right around 2 g's.

Many attractions (including more than 1 at WDW) achieve higher G-forces than Mission Space. Even the gravitron ride (which has been around since 1983) found at most traveling carnivals acheives G-forces much higher than M:S and that are sustained for much longer periods of time.

 

[DancingBear]

I understand that other rides have higher G forces, but isn't it true that M:S's sustained g-forces are greater; that is, that the higher gs on other rides are relatively momentary?

 

[peter11435]

I understand that other rides have higher G forces, but isn't it true that M:S's sustained g-forces are greater; that is, that the higher gs on other rides are relatively momentary?

On rides like RnRC and Everest yes. There G's while higher than M:S are only felt for very brief periods of time. However there are rides out there that have far more intense and sustained G's than M:S. Again I bring up the gravitron ride which can be found at traveling carnivals all over the world. The ride reaches 4 g's and sustains them for up to 90 seconds at a time. M:S on the other hand only reaches 2 g's and the longest sustained period is only about 10 seconds.

 

[YoHo]

Because that's what the medical examiner's reports stated.




Based on the medical conditions of the two guests that died, the water slide at POR could have contributed to their deaths. They were walking time bombs, and anything stressful could have triggered their deaths. Based on your logic, you would need to shut down not only MS, but also TOT, RnR, Space Mountain, Splash, BTMRR, EE, Teacups, Primeaval Whirl, Test Track, and last, but not least, calling for CRT breakfast at 7:00am.

Many of the rides listed have been in operation for Decades. How many pre-existing condition deaths have occured on those rides?

The answer is very very low if not zero.
So if these people were ticking timebombs and these ticking timebombs are around all the time, then how has Disney managed to avoid a higher casualty rate?

In short, this argument holds no water. If those other rides presented as great a danger, then they'd have death counts that were equivelent.

 

[ChrisFL]

On rides like RnRC and Everest yes. There G's while higher than M:S are only felt for very brief periods of time. However there are rides out there that have far more intense and sustained G's than M:S. Again I bring up the gravitron ride which can be found at traveling carnivals all over the world. The ride reaches 4 g's and sustains them for up to 90 seconds at a time. M:S on the other hand only reaches 2 g's and the longest sustained period is only about 10 seconds.

So is Disney supposed to set their standards based on the safety record of carnival rides?

 

[DancingBear]

On rides like RnRC and Everest yes. There G's while higher than M:S are only felt for very brief periods of time. However there are rides out there that have far more intense and sustained G's than M:S. Again I bring up the gravitron ride which can be found at traveling carnivals all over the world. The ride reaches 4 g's and sustains them for up to 90 seconds at a time. M:S on the other hand only reaches 2 g's and the longest sustained period is only about 10 seconds.

Fair enough. So why hasn't any ticking time bomb died on a Gravitron (assuming they haven't)? Is it the self-selection issue? Is there something different about being plastered against the wall moving sideways than facing forward in the centrifuge, or the degree of incline, etc.? The visual component?

I mean, these aren't just cases of someone dropping dead from a heart attack which could easily have happened 10 minutes before they got on the ride. The ride's stresses triggered the deadly event. So is it completely random that these have happened on M:S and not Big Thunder? Or is there something different on M:S? Do we really know?

 

[peter11435]

Fair enough. So why hasn't any ticking time bomb died on a Gravitron (assuming they haven't)?

Well., ticking time bombs have died on the Gravitron. But for a number of reasons it is no where near the news story that a death on M:S is. But besides that I think the "problem" in Mission: Space's case is simply that guests can't see what they are getting themeselves into despite the warnings. I think there are hundreds of people every day who get on M:S that would never ride the gravitron simply because they don't realize what it is. Most just assume it is simply a simulator and doesn't really do anything.

 

[peter11435]

So is Disney supposed to set their standards based on the safety record of carnival rides?

I never said that. And that has nothing to do with what I was saying.

My point was simply that M:S is not the most intense ride out there and that the forces it puts on riders are no stronger or longer sustained than those on some other rides that have been around for decades

 

[Mickmse2002]

Because that's what the medical examiner's reports stated.




Based on the medical conditions of the two guests that died, the water slide at POR could have contributed to their deaths. They were walking time bombs, and anything stressful could have triggered their deaths. Based on your logic, you would need to shut down not only MS, but also TOT, RnR, Space Mountain, Splash, BTMRR, EE, Teacups, Primeaval Whirl, Test Track, and last, but not least, calling for CRT breakfast at 7:00am.

What two are you talking about? One death just occurred so there is no medical report. And no report I have seen has referred to anyone being a walking time bomb, that is a characterization people here have placed on people, not a ME report. And I never disagreed that something else stressful COULD have triggered a death, I was merely pointing out that there is evidence to suggest a problem with M:S. You did not hear me placing blame on the ride, or Disney, or anyone. I merely suggested that perhaps a little more reasoned research and thought should go into both the ride and discussions.