Why SO Many Complaints?

[CTH3]

I'm a little confused by this whole idea of cutting Disney some slack because of the bad economy.

I can understand feeling blessed (or at least fortunate) because I am in solid-enough financial shape that I can afford to take my family to WDW. Got it. That makes sense.

But how is that Disney's doing? How is Disney blessing me, exactly? And how do they, therefore, deserve for me to cut them some slack?

Personally, it's a little hard for me to feel "blessed" by Disney when I'm paying them thousands of dollars for a service. I'm paying them that money in the expectation (marketed by them) of having a "magical" vacation--which I think we all realistically take to mean a vacation that is a significant cut above the experience we would have elsewhere in terms of customer service, ambiance, entertainment opportunities, and overall atmosphere. I don't expect to have a "magical" experience when I go to Wal-Mart, or Olive Garden, or even Six Flags. But I do expect that at WDW. That's exactly what they have promised me and that's what I'm paying for.

Of course I don't expect WDW to be perfect, no place is perfect, but I do expect to get what I pay for. A vacation at WDW costs much more than almost any other kind of domestic family vacation. There has to be a reason for paying all that extra money--otherwise, why bother?

The OP correctly pointed out that WDW is a business. Exactly. It is a business that provides a very specific kind of service. Disney has, in essence, contracted with all of us to provide a certain kind of vacation experience. An experience which will be, in their own words, "magical." The more they cut back on the "magic" of that experience, the closer they come to being in breach of contract with all of us.

When Disney stops charging me lots and lots of money to stay at their resorts and visit their theme parks, or when they stop marketing the experience as "magical" (as described above), I'll cut them some slack and lower my expectations. Until then, I'll treat them as I would any other for-profit company I do business with. I'll always have a positive attitude going in, assume it's going to be a good experience, always give them the benefit of the doubt, and always recognize that no one (company or employee) is perfect. But just like at Wal-Mart and Olive Garden and Six Flags, I will expect to get what I paid for.

I don't think that's an unreasonable expectation.

 

[styron]

I do expect to get what I pay for... just like at Wal-Mart and Olive Garden and Six Flags, I will expect to get what I paid for.

I don't think that's an unreasonable expectation.

So if you pay less, you can expect to get what you pay for - which is less.


Anyway, Disney has a pretty good cancellation policy. There's no penalty for something like 45 days beforehand, and there's only a very small penalty after that. All these have been public announcements. You know exactly what you're going to get, so this talk about not fulfilling expectations doesn't ring complete. We know what to expect, and we can go or not go.

 

[tinksgilrs251520]

What has disney cut to be exactly?????????????????? After 80 posts lets get down to the nitty gritty..... Please list becuase we are returning in August and I would like to brace myself ??? ( MY DH wants to know )

 

[KigerKat]

How is Disney blessing me, exactly? And how do they, therefore, deserve for me to cut them some slack?

Wow.

I think that's exactly the kind of attitude that people here are complaining about. Do you really expect Disney to go on unaffected by the economy and not raise prices or make any cuts at all?

 

[KigerKat]

What has disney cut to be exactly?????????????????? After 80 posts lets get down to the nitty gritty..... Please list becuase we are returning in August and I would like to brace myself ??? ( MY DH wants to know )

Here are a couple of things that I've read about:

Fewer Fantasmic! shows each week
Breakfast canceled at Boatwright's
Magical Express limiting hours (I think they cut the middle of the night pick-ups)
Fewer PhotoPass Photographers in the parks
Closed down Pleasure Island
Removed Characters from Liberty Tree Tavern (although I heard they might be bringing them back)

 

[twokids0204]

As for your argument on dropping prices, I still disagree. All businesses offer deals for you to give them your business over someone else, and Disney has ALWAYS done this. There will always be special discounts and deals. Are you suggesting that we trade the quality of the vacation to compensate for the deal they are offering? in essence - you are not actually getting a deal, you are just paying less for less.

So if you pay less, you can expect to get what you pay for - which is less.

.

Goes back to my original question.... Are you suggesting, because we pay less, we should get less?

I don't think we should.

Sounds like you are conceding that a Disney vacation IS NOT what it used to be, but that's ok because they aren't charging as much.

Nonsense.

You want to compete for our tourism dollars, do what you have to, but in the end, if you cut enough service, and offer less "magic" it won't go unnoticed.

That's all we are trying to say.

 

[a1tinkfans]

so you started a thread to complain about the complaints threads? efficient?

 

[styron]

Goes back to my original question.... Are you suggesting, because we pay less, we should get less?

I don't think we should.

Sounds like you are conceding that a Disney vacation IS NOT what it used to be, but that's ok because they aren't charging as much.

I'm not conceding any such thing, I'm just avoiding saying straight out that I don't think the argument holds water.

People want magic. "Disney promised me magic!" There is no such thing as magic. There's a wonderful Disney experience where you actually DON'T need to get 56+ parades and fireworks extravaganzas in one week, to heck with the cost.

Magic, when you use it to mean the sky's the limit and forget about reality, is not a reasonable expectation.

Disney is competing for tourism dollars based on price. They are cutting prices, and that's why people are still coming in droves - because of the sales. Everyone has the option of saying, "Hey, wait a minute, there are fewer roaming photographers so that's not magical enough for me!" So then you can cancel. They're offering something very clear and very specific, and people have the right to go or not go. Most of us honestly do not think that parade overkill and extra Disney photographers equal "magic" so we are saying, "Yes, give us a better price and I'll take this excellent vacation the way you have offered it."

 

[tinksgilrs251520]

Here are a couple of things that I've read about:

Fewer Fantasmic! shows each week
Breakfast canceled at Boatwright's
Magical Express limiting hours (I think they cut the middle of the night pick-ups)
Fewer PhotoPass Photographers in the parks
Closed down Pleasure Island

First of all i am not flaming and would like to thank you for posting for the things listed and just on a note if this is what people are complaining about.... Its is very sad ... I know I know that we pay alot doe a DIsney vacation and most of us save for a long time becuase I am one of them but my god lets be thankful that disney is still standing and still able to provide magic whether at 100% or at 50%... do you honestly think that most families that travel with kids of any age notice that the lines are longer than the year before or that theier are fewer shows... probably not so just go and have fun and try not to dwell on what is not there and have fun with what is still there

 

[CTH3]

You know exactly what you're going to get, so this talk about not fulfilling expectations doesn't ring complete. We know what to expect, and we can go or not go.

Well, no...I don't know exactly what I'm going to get. The DIS forums are terrific, but no forum (or website or brochure or DVD) could prepare me for exactly what to expect every minute of every day I'm at WDW. In fact, that's sort of the point of this thread. Many posters have mentioned various ways, both general and specific, that the WDW magic has (in their opinions) suffered of late. When I'm there (20 days from now) I don't know if I will share their opinions. It's entirely possible I won't, that I'll find absolutely nothing to complain about. I certainly hope so, and as I said, I'm heading there with high hopes and a good attitude, assuming it will indeed be magical.

All I'm saying is, WDW isn't like a non-profit entertainment event where it's all for charity and I give them a break and don't expect excellence because, heck, they mean well and its all for a good cause. WDW is a business that has happily accepted thousands of dollars of my money. And I am happy to pay those thousands of dollars because I have every expectation that they will provide the magical vacation they promised. If all goes well (and I hope and expect that it will) it'll be a win-win situation for Disney and me. But it will still, in the end, be a mutually successful business transaction, not a "blessing" from Disney.

 

[styron]

But it will still, in the end, be a mutually successful business transaction, not a "blessing" from Disney.

Yeah, I know what you mean, I'm not great at all this talk about "magic" and "blessings" either. I think along the lines of realistic expectations and reasonable, excellent delivery of services. I think people have unrealistic expectations if they think costs shouldn't matter and Disney should give them the moon just because it would make them "believe in the magic" more. I don't get that.

 

[twokids0204]

Yeah, I know what you mean, I'm not great at all this talk about "magic" and "blessings" either. I think along the lines of realistic expectations and reasonable, excellent delivery of services. I think people have unrealistic expectations if they think costs shouldn't matter and Disney should give them the moon just because it would make them "believe in the magic" more. I don't get that.

No one's looking for a magical moon fairy.

We are simnply suggesting, that we are still paying our hard earned dollars, we should get the same service and opportunity we would have last year.

 

[WDSearcher]

I'm a little confused by this whole idea of cutting Disney some slack because of the bad economy.

I can understand feeling blessed (or at least fortunate) because I am in solid-enough financial shape that I can afford to take my family to WDW. Got it. That makes sense.

But how is that Disney's doing? How is Disney blessing me, exactly? And how do they, therefore, deserve for me to cut them some slack?

Personally, it's a little hard for me to feel "blessed" by Disney when I'm paying them thousands of dollars for a service.

Disney is not blessing you at all. Nor are they (or anyone else) telling you they are. The world -- or whatever god you believe in -- is blessing you by making it possible for you to still have the funds or the means to visit WDW. When people say they are blessed to still be able to go, they mean that they are lucky to still have a job and money coming in and the funds to make the trip. You are not "blessed by Disney", you are "blessed to be able to go to Disney." And Disney, I suppose, is blessed because you still choose to go there.

When Disney stops charging me lots and lots of money to stay at their resorts and visit their theme parks, or when they stop marketing the experience as "magical" (as described above), I'll cut them some slack and lower my expectations. Until then, I'll treat them as I would any other for-profit company I do business with. I'll always have a positive attitude going in, assume it's going to be a good experience, always give them the benefit of the doubt, and always recognize that no one (company or employee) is perfect. But just like at Wal-Mart and Olive Garden and Six Flags, I will expect to get what I paid for.

I don't think that's an unreasonable expectation.

And Disney very much wants to meet and exceed that expectation. However, I think it also needs to be said that Disney doesn't create 100% of the magic. Some of that has to come from you too. You either decide to have a great vacation or you decide not to -- and that's true wherever you go and however much money you spend.

If you decide that you're going to have a great vacation in your backyard, sitting in a kiddie pool with a glass of wine, watching your kids play in the sprinkler and listening to CDs of French accordian music and making believe you're on the Riviera, then I guarantee you that you will have a great vacation. If you decide that you're going to have a lousy time at WDW staying at the Grand FL and having a VIP guide every day and eating at California Grill while watching Wishes, then I guarantee that you will have a lousy vacation. Disney is not 100% responsible for you having a great vacation. You hold some responsibility there as well.

My biggest worry with all the complaining and back-and-forth discussions about the cuts and the economy is that people will walk into WDW EXPECTING to be unhappy. They will EXPECT their trip to be less than the last one. They won't go in thinking, "I'm going to have a great Disney vacation with my family!", they're going to go in thinking, "Oh man ... Disney's cutting back and that's SO going to spoil this trip." It's up to you to decide whether you still get your money's worth from WDW even without Fant! every night or three concierges at the desk or 45 characters on the street instead of 48. And if the value isn't there for you, then please do complain to Disney. Ask for your money back. Cancel your next trip. Stop buying the DVDs. Whatever you need to do to let Disney know. But if you do still have a magical time and you enjoy yourself and you find that it was just as great a vacation as last time, let people know that too.

 

[Shock13]

Disney is not blessing you at all. Nor are they (or anyone else) telling you they are. The world -- or whatever god you believe in -- is blessing you by making it possible for you to still have the funds or the means to visit WDW. When people say they are blessed to still be able to go, they mean that they are lucky to still have a job and money coming in and the funds to make the trip. You are not "blessed by Disney", you are "blessed to be able to go to Disney." And Disney, I suppose, is blessed because you still choose to go there.


And Disney very much wants to meet and exceed that expectation. However, I think it also needs to be said that Disney doesn't create 100% of the magic. Some of that has to come from you too. You either decide to have a great vacation or you decide not to -- and that's true wherever you go and however much money you spend.

If you decide that you're going to have a great vacation in your backyard, sitting in a kiddie pool with a glass of wine, watching your kids play in the sprinkler and listening to CDs of French accordian music and making believe you're on the Riviera, then I guarantee you that you will have a great vacation. If you decide that you're going to have a lousy time at WDW staying at the Grand FL and having a VIP guide every day and eating at California Grill while watching Wishes, then I guarantee that you will have a lousy vacation. Disney is not 100% responsible for you having a great vacation. You hold some responsibility there as well.

My biggest worry with all the complaining and back-and-forth discussions about the cuts and the economy is that people will walk into WDW EXPECTING to be unhappy. They will EXPECT their trip to be less than the last one. They won't go in thinking, "I'm going to have a great Disney vacation with my family!", they're going to go in thinking, "Oh man ... Disney's cutting back and that's SO going to spoil this trip." It's up to you to decide whether you still get your money's worth from WDW even without Fant! every night or three concierges at the desk or 45 characters on the street instead of 48. And if the value isn't there for you, then please do complain to Disney. Ask for your money back. Cancel your next trip. Stop buying the DVDs. Whatever you need to do to let Disney know. But if you do still have a magical time and you enjoy yourself and you find that it was just as great a vacation as last time, let people know that too.

 

[WDSearcher]

No one's looking for a magical moon fairy.

We are simnply suggesting, that we are still paying our hard earned dollars, we should get the same service and opportunity we would have last year.

Are there a lot of trip reports from people saying that? I mean, I don't think anyone wants to go anywhere that will give them lousy value for their hard-earned dollars. But are people coming back complaining more than they normally complain? (Because we all know that things could be zip-a-dee-doo-dah ducky and some people would still find things that were wrong.) I haven't seen anyone yet who has returned and posted, "Disney was crap and I want my money back!"

But then, I don't read the trip reports.

 

[CTH3]

Do you really expect Disney to go on unaffected by the economy and not raise prices or make any cuts at all?

No, of course not. It's a question of at what point do cut backs (or higher prices) remove a sufficient amount of "magic" that a vacation at WDW becomes little better than an "ordinary" vacation at a far less expensive destination.

Now, I have no idea if WDW is anywhere near that point for me. I doubt it, frankly. None of the cut backs mentioned thus far worry me much. And WDW provides such a terrific experience that it would have to slip a lot before it got to the point of being "no longer worth the money" for me.

Again, the only point I was trying (and perhaps failing) to make was that WDW is a business, not the nice guy down the street who puts on puppet shows for the kids and should be forgiven when his puppets start looking a little raggedy. Disney is a business that charges us money and we have a perfect right to expect something in return. Yes, what that "something" is will vary from guest to guest, and yes, some guests have their expectations unreasonably set on "perfect," and yes, most of the employees of the business called WDW genuinely love their jobs and are good-hearted people who genuinely enjoy making magic for Disney guests. But that doesn't somehow turn WDW into a charitable organization. We pay them money, they provide us with a terrific vacation experience. If they keep doing that (and I'm very confident they still are), all is well. If not, not.

 

[CTH3]

However, I think it also needs to be said that Disney doesn't create 100% of the magic. Some of that has to come from you too. You either decide to have a great vacation or you decide not to -- and that's true wherever you go and however much money you spend.

Disney is not 100% responsible for you having a great vacation. You hold some responsibility there as well.

I absolutely 150% agree with you. You are quite correct. Attitude is everything.

 

[KigerKat]

No, of course not. It's a question of at what point do cut backs (or higher prices) remove a sufficient amount of "magic" that a vacation at WDW becomes little better than an "ordinary" vacation at a far less expensive destination.

Now, I have no idea if WDW is anywhere near that point for me. I doubt it, frankly. None of the cut backs mentioned thus far worry me much. And WDW provides such a terrific experience that it would have to slip a lot before it got to the point of being "no longer worth the money" for me.

Again, the only point I was trying (and perhaps failing) to make was that WDW is a business, not the nice guy down the street who puts on puppet shows for the kids and should be forgiven when his puppets start looking a little raggedy. Disney is a business that charges us money and we have a perfect right to expect something in return. Yes, what that "something" is will vary from guest to guest, and yes, some guests have their expectations unreasonably set on "perfect," and yes, most of the employees of the business called WDW genuinely love their jobs and are good-hearted people who genuinely enjoy making magic for Disney guests. But that doesn't somehow turn WDW into a charitable organization. We pay them money, they provide us with a terrific vacation experience. If they keep doing that (and I'm very confident they still are), all is well. If not, not.

I don't think people here are saying to have pity on Disney because of the hard economic times. There definitely is a difference between the Fantasmic! show and the puppet show down the street. I just think that the complainers of the complainers are wondering just how the minor changes WDW has made can have such a profound impact on their "magical" WDW experience.

I'm sure they've made these cuts with their customer's best interests in mind. Small things that have nothing to do with the other, so hopefully the fewest amount of people would be affected by them.

I would just hope that people here can understand that there is no "magic" that can protect WDW from the recession, and it's extrememly selfish and unrealistic of them to expect the exact same thing at the exact same price they got before these hard times. Is the "magic" really ruined because of these small changes?

I'm glad to see that you will be going next month with an open mind, and I hope you have a wonderful trip!!

 

[Buzz Litebeer]

If you decide that you're going to have a great vacation in your backyard, sitting in a kiddie pool with a glass of wine, watching your kids play in the sprinkler and listening to CDs of French accordian music and making believe you're on the Riviera, then I guarantee you that you will have a great vacation. If you decide that you're going to have a lousy time at WDW staying at the Grand FL and having a VIP guide every day and eating at California Grill while watching Wishes, then I guarantee that you will have a lousy vacation. Disney is not 100% responsible for you having a great vacation. You hold some responsibility there as well.

 

[CTH3]

I'm glad to see that you will be going next month with an open mind, and I hope you have a wonderful trip!!

Thanks for the dust! Believe it or not, I'm a very easy-going person, very quick (my wife would say too quick) to forgive mistakes, and extremely excited and optimistic about our pending trip. I regret if my previous posts gave the opposite impression. We haven't been in many years, so the whole "it's not as good as it used to be" thing will be a non-issue for us. I'm very confident we'll have a terrific time!

(BTW, my wife and I went to UGA and later lived in Marietta for a few years. We miss Atlanta and the Southeast!)