Why, oh Why Dont they Listen???

[Dentam]

I do think that Disney crams way too many people into their parks during peak times of the year. I also don't like that they reduce staff during non-peak times so you still have to wait in lines. I get that it's about making money for them, but I found myself wondering on this last trip how Walt would feel if he walked through the parks and saw the way everything was being run and the attitudes of some of the CM's. Something tells me that changes would be made.

 

[daae3]

As a planner, I love Disney. I was asked recently why I keep going back and my response is that Disney is easy for me. I have planned so many trips, I can do it in my sleep. I also take international trips and I plan those extensively as well. Those who travel with me will whine, moan and complain. But they come back and admit they had the trip of the their lifetime. That is the difference-you can go to Disney with no plans and maybe have a fine time. You may wait in more lines and not get to all the cool restaurants, but if you don't plan, you may not know what you miss. Same with travel to other countries. You can travel to Paris and see the sites and eat in the cafes and have a grand time. But on my trip, you had dinner in the Eiffel Tower...lunch overlooking Notre Dame in a restaurant that has been there for centuries and explored a Christmas festival on the Champs Elysees. I do the planning because I want more than a vacation...I want an amazing experience. I don't think you can convince others that it makes a difference...I have tried.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Can you not fathom that altho rides may be super important to you, they're not necessarily to everyone?

First, to address this:

1. I never said rides were super important to me.
2. I never said that rides were the only reason people go to WDW.

I was responding to the assertion that "Disney World is so effective at grabbing the typical midlife family with young kids" because they "offer the complete vacation package. Some rides, some relaxation, some swimming, some dining, etc. Most guests are simply not out to maximize rides like you're saying."

I never said this assertion was not a valid answer. I was responding to say I don't think it is the *only* reason that WDW attracts the "typical midlife family with young kids." As that typical family with young kids, I was just *adding* what the reason is that WDW grabs us and not Six Flags. I'm sure there are people who go to WDW because they offer a little bit of everything. I have no doubt of that, and didn't say anything negative about it at all. Simply shared that there may be other reasons as well, and what our "other" reasons are.

This may be the reason you go, and can be a factor in why other families go too, but it is not the only reason. Six Flags offers a rather unthemed, uninteresting, ride-centric experience. Disney World offers a family vacation. The theming, the food, and some nostalgic rides, characters, and experiences that appeal to families. Disney even has fewer rides per park than an equivalent 6 Flags, so it's to many families more than just the rides.

As for this, that may be true numerically, but of the 30+ attractions in MK, there are only about a handful that DD *can't* ride. Six Flags could have 100+ attractions, but when they have less than 10 attractions that DD *can* ride, they're not getting our "family vacation" money. It isn't a family vacation spot if DD has to be on the sidelines. There are parks near us that are for little kids as well, but those parks have the opposite problem..they have maximum height requirements, where we can't ride with DD b/c we're too tall. Disney works best for our family vacation dollars, because it's somewhere we can go and experience pretty much everything *together*. I would venture to say this is a pretty big reason many go to Disney (note I said many, not all or even most ). It was the reason Walt built Disneyland after all - so that parents and children could experience the park together.

 

[rangermom]

I know when we booked our first trip we booked it six months out through Disney and I pretty much did not do too much planning except a guide book until about Feb or March and our trip was in the last week on May/First week of June. This was in 2007. I had never even heard of disboards or an online forum before and I did not have any friends or family that had gone before. I went in HS with the band, but that was in the 90's. Luckily my BIL and his family were joining us on this trip and his wife knew of the boards and had started planning earlier and got me in the planning mode. DH picked on me about being obsessed with planning, maybe a little too obsessed.

I think I had my hopes up a little too much and set my set up for disappointment because we had everything planned to the hour and in the first few days overwhelmed and wore my family. Not good when we you have three young kiddos. I was still an over planner for the next couple of trips and finally DH convinced me to plan with a very fluid plan and enjoy life in the moment. So what if we didn't get a certain TS meal or we didn't ride SpM everyday we were in MK. We were together and at DISNEY!

Long story short...well not really... Everyone has their happy medium of what level of planning they want to do and also what they want experience. I'm very glad there was someone in my traveling party that was smart enough to know that pre-planning was a good idea, because I don't know if we would have experienced as much as we did if we had not planned. But it is very liberating to just decide to go and just get what you get when you show up. Last year we lived 3 hr from WDW and took several trips planned the day before and we able to enjoy ourselves and many times it was on holiday weekends.

To family and friends they now we go a lot and if they want advise I offer it, but I do push the information on them.

 

[cjparker0110]

I'm just jumping in here so I haven't read the whole thing. This is in response to the OP.

I know the feeling. I haven't been to WDW in several years, but I still know MUCH more than most people that I know who are planning their first (or second) trip. As soon as I hear about someone planning a trip, I start asking them questions about where they are staying, FP, meals, etc,.. and offer them advise. Especially as they say they are overwhelmed by trying to make plans. Yet nobody is willing to listen to me. It's gotten to the point that now I just tell people to ask if they have questions because it's pointless to waste my time talking about something when nobody is listening

 

[cjparker0110]

Yes I own up to it and yes I feel I am forced... by Disney for coming up with the ridiculous time rule of 180 plus days... We wouldn't have this issue if they came up with a policy that makes sense ( at 45 days when payed in full for on-site and 30 for rest for example). I dont go crazy with double bookings.. just the for sure things. We don't do parkhoppers so we have to do this as i cannot say ( weather/ hours released later) which park I visit. I refuse to give Disney more money for this flexability via a PH to be able to dine anywhere.

Also I was especially glad I did this this year and we changed our park days around and MK hours were extended/updated well beyond the 180 day mark.

I don't know what difference this makes. What does it matter if you can book 45 days out instead of 180? You have already said you won't book your trip by the hour so booking ADRs 180 days out makes no sense. In that case, 45 makes no sense either. People who double book and horde their ADRs make it harder for everyone else trying to do it right...especially when you add to it that stupid website that sells ADRs because they book tons of them. I'm wondering if they get them from people who double book to begin with? Don't know...just saying. It's not right. Can't decide? Then wait and take your chances so that others have a chance.

 

[jdrasin]

I can offer an outside perspective as someone who is planning their first Disney trip in 15+ years (and back then I wasn't really part of the planning) for Jan-Feb/2016. Frankly, for many, the whole concept is very intimidating and to come to a place like this, or engage with people who are so into it and in-the-know can be overwhelming. I am a planner by nature (I plan the cruise trips my extended family takes and such) and trade and it is still overwhelming to me. I can imagine that if I approached one of you at work and started to get the laundry list of important to-dos, I would likely start to shut down mentally. Thinking about someone who is not into planning their trips, it would be like speaking a foreign language.
I think the person who suggested pointing the person to a good website about first visits is spot on. That will spark lots of questions which the person will come then ask about.

We did find some websites, then learned more, got the book, came here, etc... It's been a lot more work than we've done for any other trip (including foreign travel, family reunions, etc...) And yes, I was the person who got up at 5AM 180 days out out to make 4 ADRs that we really wanted to do (the rest we'll wing).

Oh and really, while you may find it frustrating, don't take it so personally when someone ignores your advice. It really doesn't hurt you.

You guys are all incredibly knowledgable and have lots of insights. I have learned a tremendous amount on these boards. But just be aware that what you find fun and energizing others find overwhelming and intimidating.

Cheers!
Joseph

 

[Angel Ariel]

I couldn't agree with you more, jdrasin. Planning a WDW trip can be very intimidating in the first place, and having an influx of information thrown at you definitely doesn't help.

I planned a trip for a friend of mine last year. I think the most important thing I found, for myself, to keep in mind while planning was that it was *her* trip, not mine. Rather than inundating her with a ton of information, I asked her questions. I found out what they absolutely *had* to do, what they wanted to do but if missed it was OK, and what they really weren't interested in at all. I did the actual booking of restaurants and FP+ for them, but she made the decision on where to eat and what rides to FP+. I only presented her with information that she requested, so it wasn't as overwhelming for her.

As it all turned out, their DD ended up being more scared of lots of rides than they thought she would be, so most of their FP+s they missed. They had to change their expectations of what they wanted out of their trip, but they did, and they still had a fantastic time.

I think it's sometimes easy to get lost in wanting people we know or who are close to us to have the *perfect* Disney trip. But it's important to keep in mind that what constitutes a perfect trip is different for everyone.

 

[dalmatian7]

I have given up on this too. If I am spending money on something I am going to research it. I don't care if I am going to the beach or WDW. I usually offer a link to easywdw for the month they mention going. And unless another question is asked, I don't offer anymore. I know my SIL is thinking about going in Feb and her DH isn't into it. So I can already predict that they will go presidents weekend, with no plans, and then complain about crowds and I will continue to be the crazy person that likes Disney. My DH who does zero planning even recognizes that when I plan, it works. I don't plan to the minute but I like ADRs and a general list of what we want to get done. Lucky for us our normal schedule is early mornings so rope drop is sleeping in for us. Now if I could only get him to speed walk..........

 

[cisco911]

I think the fair thing to say is that its okay to either plan or not plan as long as you are okay with the outcome. What upsets people like me is people that don't plan and then complain about it not going well like wanting to see Anna and Elsa and not booking their fast passes and then complaining that they had to spend 2 hours in line for it. As for people going and not realizing they have to book things in advance, I think that is a cop out. IN today's day and age where we have access to everything at our fingertips, there is no reason why you can't be informed about something. It is the equivalent of booking a crazy deal for a down south all inclusive vacation and then complaining about getting food poisoning because you didn't know it was a crappy resort. Maybe you should have researched it.

 

[mousefan73]

I don't know what difference this makes. What does it matter if you can book 45 days out instead of 180? You have already said you won't book your trip by the hour so booking ADRs 180 days out makes no sense. In that case, 45 makes no sense either. People who double book and horde their ADRs make it harder for everyone else trying to do it right...especially when you add to it that stupid website that sells ADRs because they book tons of them. I'm wondering if they get them from people who double book to begin with? Don't know...just saying. It's not right. Can't decide? Then wait and take your chances so that others have a chance.

Oh come on 135 days is a huge difference.!!!!! At our 180 point park hrs were not set, wishes etcc changed on us, a few rides closed, and party dates were not released. So how am I to make dining decisions based on my park planning when Disney themselves havent finalized plans. Plus 135 days is alot more time to,research and change minds on what I want to do. For. 5000 plus dollar trip I refuse to make plans I cannot change without losing my ADRs.

 

[ArwenMarie]

180 versus 45 is a big difference. I'm not sure what the right number is though, maybe 90 days.

 

[Robo]

180 versus 45 is a big difference. I'm not sure what the right number is though, maybe 90 days.

Booking WDW ADRs have (in the past) been set up at 90 days in advance, and not very long ago.

 

[rpb718]

Booking WDW ADRs have been set up at 90 days in advance, and not very long ago.

I still think 90 days is plenty for ADRs, and still don't understand why it needed to move to 180. I swear it was 90 days back in 2012, or was it 2009, I can't remember what it was for our last trip before this year but I don't think it was 180.

I think 90 days for everyone for ADRs; 60 days for resort guest FP+ and 45 days for non-resort guest FP+ would be the most fair for everyone.

 

[midnightlouise]

Unfortunately I am one of those people who has a hard time being quiet when I see someone heading for disaster. However, there is a right and wrong way to go about it. I don't give people chapter and verse about planning strategy, because A) it's unlikely that they'll believe me and B) they would ignore me anyway. But when my SIL planned 2 days at Disney less than 3 weeks out and intended to take her girls to CRT and to ride all of the rides, etc. etc., well, I just couldn't let that pass, because my nieces would have been heartbroken. She didn't have reservations, had just booked an off-property hotel, did not have tickets...

So I said, "wow, that will be cool. CRT is a hard reservation to get, what time are you going?" *insert cricket sounds here* So I steered her toward calling Disney, and I figured they could take it from there. (She did not get CRT, surprise, surprise, but they did hook up her with Akershus.) I also sent her a couple of links to WDW info sites, and I figured she could take it or leave it. I would have felt bad if I'd said nothing, because the girls had their hearts set on a Princess meal, and they would have missed out if they'd just showed up like so many people think you can still do.

I mean, you CAN, but if you have a lot of specific things you want to do, you'll be disappointed. The problem is that a number of people want to experience Disney in a way that can only be accomplished by long-term planning. If you don't care where you eat, and if you're flexible about waiting in line, you can still have a perfectly good time. It's just that so often the expectations vs. the amount of pre-trip planning are incompatible.

 

[eliza61]

I have not read all the responses so I apologize if I've repeated all that was said.
I am a huge NON planner, in fact the one time I followed the "Dis" rules we hated the trip. We just left wdw with 18 people. I made a bunch of adr's that I ended up cancelling. Next, I'm not sure if Veterans day is a heavy attendance season or not.

1) never was there one day where we did not get an adr.
2) we got CRT almost 2 days back to back.
3) we got last minute BOG reservations (meal was ok and extremely overhyped so no way would I stress over getting that one).
4) remember that you guys actually Like the planning. not everyone wants to meter out their vacation times in nanoseconds.
5) lastly, last minute trips can be wildly fun precisely because you don't get stressed out wiht the "must have the perfect" adr. we did two and you know how we picked the park to visit? whichever bus came first. We had no adr's and some how contrary to what the belief of the dis boards, we ate ts each and every night.
We didn't ride TSM and you know what, we had a magical time. encourage your coworker to make do with what they can do instead of harping on how ill planned they are.

 

[Robo]

Too much planning going on around here.

 

[cjparker0110]

Oh come on 135 days is a huge difference.!!!!! At our 180 point park hrs were not set, wishes etcc changed on us, a few rides closed, and party dates were not released. So how am I to make dining decisions based on my park planning when Disney themselves havent finalized plans. Plus 135 days is alot more time to,research and change minds on what I want to do. For. 5000 plus dollar trip I refuse to make plans I cannot change without losing my ADRs.

I agree there is a big difference in those amount of days. From your previous post I got the impression that you had a problem with planing by the hour in general and would not make ADRs for that reason alone. That said, I still feel it is wrong to double book. Imagine if you couldn't get the flight you wanted because someone double booked every flight to your destination, and didn't cancel until you had purchased a crappy flight time or more expensive, non-transferable/refundable tickets. Personally, I think it's wrong. Is 180 a bit ridiculous? Yes. Just a tiny bit. But if that's the game they want to play, then that's the game we all have to play. It is something in which I feel they should change...especially in light of Extra Magic Hours and such. For the people who are planning ahead, they should have all info available to them.

I can't recall how far out I made ADRs for my 2006 trip, but I feel like it was only 60 days. I know for my 05, and 07 trips I just walked up and never had a problem except for the Coral Reef which I had to wait 45 minutes for.

 

[eliza61]

I agree there is a big difference in those amount of days. From your previous post I got the impression that you had a problem with planing by the hour in general and would not make ADRs for that reason alone. That said, I still feel it is wrong to double book. Imagine if you couldn't get the flight you wanted because someone double booked every flight to your destination, and didn't cancel until you had purchased a crappy flight time or more expensive, non-transferable/refundable tickets. Personally, I think it's wrong. Is 180 a bit ridiculous? Yes. Just a tiny bit. But if that's the game they want to play, then that's the game we all have to play. It is something in which I feel they should change...especially in light of Extra Magic Hours and such. For the people who are planning ahead, they should have all info available to them.

I can't recall how far out I made ADRs for my 2006 trip, but I feel like it was only 60 days. I know for my 05, and 07 trips I just walked up and never had a problem except for the Coral Reef which I had to wait 45 minutes for.

I think the big difference is that with air flight, most people have a general idea of when they want to fly. Using your example the difference would be in me trying to get a flight in May and then October. Basic life doesn't usually support that. family, jobs, school all have to be planned around.

Now take into account eating at a restaurant, forget the sheer stupidity of having to decide what you want to eat 6 months in advance, you now have to try and forecast the weather, forecast the crowd and other small factors that could easily throw off your schedule.


But case in point: we just got back from a visit to the world the last week in August to the first of September. as luck would have it Hurricane Erika came a calling. Actually the weather wasn't horrible but it forced us to get up and tour early and eat earlier due to the fact that by late afternoon, torrential downpours came along. So now I had a better idea of what places I wanted to keep because we had a better idea of how we would tour.

Now in the interest of full disclosure, yes I double book, then I weed out but truthfully I don't make all that many ADR's. this trip was a bit of an anomaly because we had relatives with us on this trip.

I totally understand your frustration though and it doesn't make me happy that imo Disney forces me to play this game.