What our Points are Worth!

[10gigi]

I am sorry to have to write this but, I am not happy with what people are doing to the value of our points. I have no problem what so ever renting or exchanging points to other DVC members. I on the other hand am starting to have a huge problem with non DVC owners. I have put the expense, time and yearly dues into DVC to enjoy my yearly trip to Disney with my family but, when I get reponses from non DVC members telling me what my points are worth then, I have a serious problem. We are making our investment worth less everyday that we allow non DVC people to rent our points. I understand that some people want to rent their points because they make money and they don't use all their points every year but, we need to seperate renting points to members and non members. Non members have become so rude about getting Disney villas for cheap that they are actually telling DVC people how much points are worth. This in turn will make any resale value of our investment low! Why are we renting to non DVC people for the same price as DVC people and why are they not in a seperate locations on this site?
Very Upset with the way we are handling our value of our points!

 

[PamOKW]

Rental of points is an individual transaction. You are free to rent to whomever you wish at whatever price you wish. The price that is paid is set by the market. The impression has gotten out there that renting points is a cheap way to go to WDW. There will be some people who demand "cheap". If the price is not right, don't rent to those people. Couple the idea of "cheap" with the impression that room capacity is just a "guideline" and we have the potential for abuse.

I have a general problem with people who rent as a busines. If the bottom falls out of that market it might be a good thing for all of us. I have found ways to use and/or gift my points. The other day I wrestled with renting my Christmas reservations or returning them to DVC so that the next member in line could get their wait list request. I went with the latter. To me, that's how the system should work. If it's not lucrative to rent points to the open market, maybe that will cease. My feeling is that rentals should be done among friends and family and not on the open Internet.

DVC is not a monetary investment. It is an investment in quality vacations. Maintaining the quality of the resorts and the resort experience is my primary concern. If we do that, the resale value should stay at a point where it's a bonus to members to be able to sell if necessary.

 

[Disney Doll]

If I were to ever rent my points(which is highly unlikely because even though we recently purchased more, I still don't feel like I have enough!!!!! ) I would set a price for them that I felt was fair and I wouldn't rent them for less, nor would I allow a non-member to dictate to me what price would be paid for my points.

Now, I might not be renting points too much with that attitude, but in that case, I'd rather gift them to friends and family that I know would appreciate the value of the gift they were receiving, rather than renting them to some stranger trying to nickel and dime me to death.

Those people who do rent them as a "business"...well, that's their choice I guess. Not one that I would make.

 

[NHLFAN]

10gigi,

Welcome to the boards...

Well first of all did you buy into the DVC as an investment to make a profit or to use as a Time Share?

Most people might agree DVC isn't the best real estate investment out there to turn a profit...it's just an affordable way to stay at a deluxe property IF you travel to WDW on a regular basis.

AS for renting out points...the market will bare what people are willing to pay.

I personally would never buy DVC thinking I could resale it for a profit in the future...just doesn't make sense.

 

[crisi]

I don't care what non-DVC members value my points at. I'm not renting them out to anyone, and if I do, I certainly wouldn't do it for less than what I think they are worth. And I don't care what other DVC members value my points at. I do care slightly what the resale market values my points at - because DVC is an asset (non-liquid and not an investment - but an asset) that I include in my yearly financial calculations.

 

[CaptainMidnight]

Well,
There's this discussion of that question:
http://disboards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=383812

 

[10gigi]

I purchased Disney for my family, so we could go to Disney every year like we have been for the past 20 plus years. We go every year and will keep going until we can't. I did not buy it for the investment money wise but, for the opportunity to stay in a nice place. I also own Marriott and have never traded or missed a year there either. Maybe I wrote this wrong, what I am upset about is that we as owners should not let NON-DVC people dictate what our points are worth and I also feel that they should not pay the same as DVC owners. Our resorts are not cheap places to stay and thats what we are making them out to be by renting our resorts out for $90.00 a night. If and only if I decide to rent points out to people other than DVC owners, I will not rent them for the same price. My points are like gold to me and I will treat them that way from now on. I tried to rent some out a few times and nothing came of it and I guess that was a lesson to me not to ever do it again. My points are way to important to give away!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[spiceycat]

alot of the times - your problem is the II - when their resort is exchanged with DVC - often the member (of this other resort) - who got it through Interval International - will come on the DVC rental/trade board and try to rent it - you can immediately see which these are - they say that they can't change the dates (members using points can) and they want the renter to pay the $95 exchange fee - these are generally price above the $10 per point - but when it fails to sell they decrease their price sharply - these are not DVC members - so if it really starts to bother you - get the email for II and start sending these to II - it is against the rules for exchanges to sold to anyone. If II can determine who it is they will take away their membership rights.

kept in mind that they only paid the exchange fee (generally $125) for this week - they are also generally trying to get their annual fee out of it - but sometimes the price is so high - that most of it is profit - II will not allow this to happen if they can find the member responsbile.

 

[CaptainMidnight]

Originally posted by 10gigi
I purchased Disney for my family, so we could go to Disney every year like we have been for the past 20 plus years. We go every year and will keep going until we can't. I did not buy it for the investment money wise but, for the opportunity to stay in a nice place. I also own Marriott and have never traded or missed a year there either. Maybe I wrote this wrong, what I am upset about is that we as owners should not let NON-DVC people dictate what our points are worth and I also feel that they should not pay the same as DVC owners. Our resorts are not cheap places to stay and thats what we are making them out to be by renting our resorts out for $90.00 a night. If and only if I decide to rent points out to people other than DVC owners, I will not rent them for the same price. My points are like gold to me and I will treat them that way from now on. I tried to rent some out a few times and nothing came of it and I guess that was a lesson to me not to ever do it again. My points are way to important to give away!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The flip side of that is that we have been able to extend our vacations a couple of times by renting points to combine with the points we already own. One time, 3 additional points made a difference for us.

I also think it is wise for potential new members to rent out some points at thier potential home resort to make sure it is really the home resort they want to choose. Things happen in life, if I were laid off, it would be nice to have the option to rent out the points a couple of years instead of being forced into selling them. Renting is not a bad thing in my view.

 

[ptrbryant]

I just wanted to add my two cents. We're renting points for a studio at VWL in Jan. for the first time. We've thought about becoming DVC members, but didn't want to until we experienced them for ourselves. Short-term, we just love WL, but with no room-only discounts, we couldn't justify the 200+ per night for a woodsview room there. I watched the DVC Trade board for months and never had an opportunity to pay less than $10 per point--which is what we're willingly paying. It's my understanding that $10/pt. is the DVC member rate as well. (BTW, there were several people trying to rent out points at $15/pt.) It seemed to me that the people who were offering points "cheap" were ones who were stuck---they had a reservation coming up very soon that they weren't able to keep or bank the points, etc. It seemed like a last-resort effort to get something back on a loss for that specific reservation.
Karla B.

 

[PamOKW]

10gigi, I think we have similar feelings in that we don't like to see DVC "cheapened". Your suggestion is to make sure points are rented at a premium to non-DVC owners. My suggestion is that rental be limited -- along the lines you suggest -- of just to members needing a point here or there and/or family and friends. Unfortunately, neither suggestion can be used by DVC. My understanding is that rental is an all or nothing proposition. It seems the only thing that might be stopped is someone setting up a storefront outside the WDW gates with a big "RENT DVC CHEAP" sign.

The only hope is that not that many people will offer their points for rental on the open market like E--Bay.

 

[KNWVIKING]

..... all I'm thinking is: "Where's NutHut ??"

 

[10gigi]

Renting is not bad in my view either. Its the fact that we need to seperate DVC and Non DVC owners. I truly agree with the fact of if laid off or for any other reason you can't pay, then renting is a much better option instead of selling but, at the price of making our family vacation investment cheap. Saying that, should we be giving our points away and making our resorts a cheap place to stay. I am seeing this on the rent/trade board. People are saying "need a cheap place to stay and heard Disboards is the place!" I am sorry but Disney is not cheap and we should not let our valuable points out as a cheap vacation! I also agree with people saying that selling points as a business is crazy because it just doesn't add up. I tried to sell my reservations I could not use and never sold but, it did cost me money, time and headaces and now I have a bad feeling for non DVC people telling me what my points are worth. I will never try to sell my points again!!!!! I on the other hand will trade/rent to DVC owners
Thanks for listening!

 

[nuthut]

Originally posted by KNWVIKING
..... all I'm thinking is: "Where's NutHut ??"

Here I am... Could not agree more, $10 a point is a cheap give away price. That's why I charge $12.50, which is more in line with my costs to own DVC. More than 50% of the person I have rented to have joined DVC. Now if I could only get the referal bonus in Michigan...

 

[Kelly&John]

10gigi,

I totally agree! I have rented points for an Alaskan vacation. I ended up renting them to another DVC member. However, I got several non-DVC individuals TELLING ME what they would rent my points for! HA!

I have also been on the other side. I needed some extra points for a family get together. I nice member was able to transfer the few points I needed.

Therefore, I believe renting is a good thing. However, never take less than what you think is appropriate.

Kelly

 

[crisi]

So you guys are saying that you post to the rent board - say something like "I have 73 points use by April, $10 a point" and people come back and offer $6? Or do you post for $15 and people offer $10? What are you listing and what are they offering? Two or three would be laughable and insulting - but they may not understand that. Are the people bargaining educated - are they offering "dues" or "dues plus a handling fee" or the "cost" figure of around $6 often bandied about here -- or are they just plain ignorant? Have they heard about someone who got a firesale bargain and want the same deal?

Seems to me that people on the rent trade board have a right to bargain - some of it may be ludicrious and a waste of your time. And it is certainly impolite if you post your price as "firm" and someone wants to by your points for 70% of your asking price....But without knowing what you think your points are worth and what someone is offering you for them, I can't judge if the behavior of either party is reasonable.

But if you don't want to rent your points - don't. And if you do but don't want to deal with the rent/trade board - find another mechanism to do so.

 

[chris1gill]

I had just two points... The first point is the more important point Rental prices IN NO WAY affect sales value of your contract!! Disney has the Right Of First Refusal on all contracts, if a price is too low, they buy it.... If somebody wants to buy a contract, they have to raise the price above that.... So, don't sweat over the "value" of your contract.

Secondly, YOU are the only person that can say what your points are worth, you & only you!!! I laugh at the people who generously offer you like six dollars a point!!! I mean it's pretty funny... Just laugh it off!!

 

[Zurg]

I think liquidity (the ability to convert an asset to cash easily) improves the value of any asset.

Worrying about rates that are set in open markets is in my humble opinion nuts.

 

[DisneyKidds]

I see no need to treat renters who don't own DVC any differently than renters who do. I've rented to both and have always received $10 per point, give or take. Yes, when I had posted availability of points for $10 per I did get questions from people as to how much I wanted (I guess they missed that I stated $10 per in my post ) and a few offering less than $10. I just ignored those offers for less than $10. I don't believe non-members are dictating price. They are free to ask for a lower price..................sometimes they will find it, but not from me.

Would I like to get $15 a point when I rent? Sure...............but buyers willing to pay that won't be as easy to come by as buyers willing to pay $10. I'm into easy..................so I have set the price I am willing to accept based on my desire to limit the hassles associated with finding a renter.

Don't be insulted or upset if someone offers you less than you think your points are worth. Just say no thank you or ignorethem.

 

[Tinkrbell]

As long as Disney keeps SELLING DVC, there will be members who will RENT DVC.

The more Disney sells, the lower the rental prices fall. With over 70,000 families, theres going to be some who just need to pay off their dues/monthly fee.

Scarcity of a product drives up the price. Excess of a product will lower it.