WDW's Coaster Phobia

[Kimosabe]

...But, what about poor Epcot.....

Yeah, Epcot is definitely having an identity crisis, at least in Future World. There were the rumors/plans of a Mt. Fuji coaster back in Japan, and I'd be OK with that, just to have something new, but am honestly wishing they could recapture some sort of vision for FW. Hoping the new Imagineer-in-charge at Epcot was put in place to get something done to revitalize that front half of the park. Perhaps some sort of simulated coaster within one of the abandoned (or otherwise underutilized) pavilions? I would love to see a new "edutainment" type of ride where the ride vehicles are sucked into a computer/video-game and spend a few minutes interacting with programs, games, etc. -- basically a TRON theme, but whether people like that movie or not, the general concept of the movie still works well in FW. Perhaps the "coaster" aspect of it could come in the form of a motorcycle-based ride vehicle riding through the lightcycle game grid from the TRON: Legacy movie (have seen several motorcycle-themed coasters online, and I don't think there is anything like it in the Orlando market, whether simulated or real, so if nothing else, there would be significant interest just for the uniqueness of the attraction).

Do simulated coasters count as "real" coasters on this thread?! (I almost made myself sick "riding" my own design-your-own coaster at DisneyQuest, so to some degree, they can certainly seem real.) I suppose Sum of All Thrills is the same design-your-own idea, but if you pull up "Tron Legacy lightcycle scene" on Youtube, that grid could provide a pretty thrilling experience...and in a pretty small area, compared to the space required for a full-blooded coaster, which I'm not sure could fit into FW.

 

[fairyprincess88]

I'm just going to put this here:

Hmmm I'm not sure this picture supports the coaster junkie vs Disney prices argument though. This picture is all about the Potter fandom and I will tell you that we are a rare breed of crazy. The picture you posted is not comparable at all to the content of this discussion and has nothing to do with a coaster or coaster junkies.

Although I am all for WDW adding a good, high thrill coaster I will say I doubt that such a coaster would ever bring forth the insanity of what happened when Potter opened.

 

[asmit4]

Aren't we splitting hairs here? I think we can all agree that Disney doesn't have a lot for the over 10 or 12 crowd who like thrills AND theming....

So the point was to discuss why Disney doesn't ever seem to build (in recent history) rides that focus on the part of 'childhood' after age 10 or 12.

What is the answer to this? I know they could build whatever they want. I wonder if maybe the won't/don't is because they know Universal already does that.

DW is a family park- and it should be.....but what kind of family--- because families GROW UP. Kids don't stay 6 forever....

 

[mickeyluv'r]

The idea that coaster non-riders would be in for a dull day pre-supposes that the hundreds of existing rides at WDW would be taken away from such guests.

Not at all. It just that every ride they don't ride tips the balance away from the image they are buying. They come to buy the image.

And if you polled the people in line at EE or RnR and asked them if they would want to see Disney build a ride that is 20% "more" than EE or RnR, do you really think that the majority would say "no"?

Actually, I do.

The first thing I said was that Disney needs more rides like Spiderman, Splash- I think those were the exact examples I used. (in my mind they are in the same realm) At 40"-44"mins, a majority of children can ride it. If the four year old rides, then grandma/grandpa are likely to at least consider riding. Everyone is also more likely to push their limit if the ride has great special effects, tells a great story, or offers a special perk (TSM vs. teacups).

Other parks have different demographics, but that's the experience WDW sells

Poll the folks waiting around the exterior of EE and SM while others ride. The look on their faces alone tells me they would not relish an additional opportunity to wait around for half an hour, not at WDW prices!

They pick WDW because they want the image in the commercials, not time apart. Family time is a precious commodity.

 

[JoshuaShaw]

Hmmm I'm not sure this picture supports the coaster junkie vs Disney prices argument though. This picture is all about the Potter fandom and I will tell you that we are a rare breed of crazy.

Not as rare as you may think. Fans are fans and every segment of pop culture has their crazies. Harry Potter hardly has the market cornered.

The picture you posted is not comparable at all to the content of this discussion and has nothing to do with a coaster or coaster junkies.

This is what's known as an analogy. The point was brought up that a diehard group of fans would never go to a theme park for one coaster. The addition of WWoHP to Universal, which only added a single new ride, brought hordes of fans out of the woodwork. It doesn't matter that they didn't show up for a roller coaster, as the point being made was that diehard fans will go to a park even if the entire park is not dedicated to them.

Although I am all for WDW adding a good, high thrill coaster I will say I doubt that such a coaster would ever bring forth the insanity of what happened when Potter opened.

Again, it was an analogy, not meant to be an exact replication of what would happen were Disney to build more thrill rides.

 

[JoshuaShaw]

They pick WDW because they want the image in the commercials, not time apart. Family time is a precious commodity.

You're presupposing that the addition of one or two thrill rides would hamper this, which is untrue, as the existence of Space Mountain, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster, and Tower of Terror does not compromise the family image Disney strives for. They're also three of the most-waited for attractions, as previously pointed out, proving that the demand is clearly there.

 

[mickeyluv'r]

You're presupposing that the addition of one or two thrill rides would hamper this, which is untrue, as the existence of Space Mountain, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster, and Tower of Terror does not compromise the family image Disney strives for. They're also three of the most-waited for attractions, as previously pointed out, proving that the demand is clearly there.

Um , again it appears only half my post is being read. Twice in this thread I've talked about the need for more attractions in the SM range. Sigh.

I get it, there's an agenda. Extreme roller coasters or bust. The "why" in the first post was rhetorical and not an actual subject to be investigated. It has now been answered many times over.
***************

HP was MUCH more than 'just one ride.' It was an epic story come to life. (epic in the sense of Homer's classic epics) It's an entire franchise/land of the park. Even if one opts to skip the main attraction(s) there's still an opportunity to taste butterbeer, see flying ghosts (queue), fly like a Hippogriff, buy an official magic wand, to walk inside a beloved fairytale.

And that brings around any real potential this thread has to have a discussion...

Because Disney did drop the ball. Star Wars is arguably just as much in the epic category as the HP franchise. Disney's Star Wars area should be on par with the whole HP area. ST has some great elements, and it is great that ST has added multiple versions, and better technology. But it is no WW of Harry Potter.

Disney has pathetically missed the boat where Star Wars is concerned. Disney could pack an entire theme park around the Star Wars theme. Though I have not been on the 7D's yet, I've seen the rest of New Fantasyland and it also totally missed the opportunity to be stellar. The Little Mermaid storyline had huge potential to be amazing, and it isn't. It's just another Pooh. It could have been a haunted mansion kind of cool. (creative special effects-wise).

Big roller coasters just aren't all that innovative. They drop, they spin, they have hills. All the world's coasters are made by a handful of companies. the most innovative coaster technology can be bought by anyone. What's going to separate a new WDW attraction from the masses is the use of innovative technology, not building the world's biggest drop. Someone else just builds a bigger hill. Only Disney can bring the Disney fairy tales to life!

 

[Angel Ariel]

Let's examine this a bit more closely. There is a tendency to equate DCA with the parks at WDW. But for whatever reason, they are not comparable. For example, both parks have a Toy Story Mania. At WDW, it is a "run to" attraction and the expected wait times today (according to TP) will range from 18 to 79 minutes on a Crowd Calendar day of "7". Out west at DCA, on a day when the Crowd Calendar is predicting a "9", the expected wait times for TSM range from 12 minutes at opening to 32 minutes at peak. How about Soarin'? At WDW, the wait times will range from 15 at park opening to 92 on a day when the crowd at Epcot will be an "8". At DCA, the wait times start out at 10 minutes and peak at 30. And this is on a "9" day. What of California Screamin'? 12-18 minutes. Is that a short wait time in comparison to RnR? Sure. But when TSM is 32 minutes and Soarin' is 30 minutes, 18 minutes is not a dead "walk-on". That park just doesn't build crowds. If you are going to argue that CS is an unpopular attraction that should be torn down, then you could say the same thing about TSM and Soarin'. 30 minutes on a "9" day? Get rid of 'em!

Exactly..thanks, jimmy .

 

[LBIJim]

First of all... I find it hard to believe that any true Coaster Junkie would go to Disney of ONE Coaster. With ticket prices and crowd levels being the why they are... I can't buy into that.

You could put Millennium Force in Disney but I highly doubt any Coaster Junkie would pay that Disney's prices JUST to ride that coaster.

Of course no one would pay Disney prices JUST for an awesome coaster. They'd enjoy the rest of the park while they were there. And try to ride the awesome coaster multiple times.

Many coaster junkies WILL plan a trip around a specific coaster. That's why Six Flags and others add a new coaster every few years. To get the junkies to keep coming back. Yes, they'll ride the older coasters too, but the new coaster is the TOP reason for visiting.

Jim

 

[LBIJim]

It's all good. I got your intent. I do shoulder some blame for the use of non-objective criteria. But I think that I have said clearly enough that my OP was not intended as a battle cry for a Top 10 Coaster. Or a plea for the creation of a plethora of coasters. And you got that. So did most others. But no matter how many times those thoughts are presented, there will always be people who have to chime in and say that WDW is no place for ten new coasters that go 120+ mph with 400 ft drops. Can't fight ignorance. People see what they want to see.

A main objection among the naysayers seems to be that if Disney offers the junkies one toke of marijuana, it will inevitably lead to Six Flags heroin.

Jim

 

[mummabear]

California Screamin' is not a popular ride and is always walk on!! Now- on to Cheetah-----first time I've heard of this!!!! After reading the stats I would put Cheetah Hunt in the moderately thrilling category right along with Expedition Everest.

It's nice.....but long!!!! The ride looks like it's stretched out across half the park......the bright yellow steel poles appear to be everywhere!!!!! Really nice coaster -------but it's not Disney, IMO. It's more than obvious that Disney can't put monstrosities like this inside of mountains!!!!!!!!!!

Cheetah is Amazing! I don't see why this couldn't be built at AK...

 

[mummabear]

I don't think the M:S point is very valid.

I love coasters. The more thrilling, the better. The bigger the drops, the faster the speed, etc.

That being said, I don't care much for Mission Space. It's not a roller coaster, and that's why it's a "dud."

Thank you, it is not exciting or thrilling...it's actually a little boring.

 

[mummabear]

First of all... I find it hard to believe that any true Coaster Junkie would go to Disney of ONE Coaster. With ticket prices and crowd levels being the why they are... I can't buy into that.

You could put Millennium Force in Disney but I highly doubt any Coaster Junkie would pay that Disney's prices JUST to ride that coaster.

First of all a coaster junkie would if the ride was exciting enough.
Secondly no one is suggesting that Disney attempt to attract a huge crowd of coaster junkies but that it needs a) more rides in line with the existing mountains and b) some rides at DHS and/or AK or a 5th gate that are more thrilling than those, something that would break into the top 30-50 coasters in the world.

The people who want these rides are Disney fans but who also love thrill coasters and/or who have kids outgrowing the excitement of BTMRR given these are made for 4 year olds

 

[mummabear]

I may be in the minority here- but I can safely tell you----Once my son hits around 9 or 10yo....DW will lose me 100% as a guest. There simply isn't enough 'thrill' for a preteen boy at Disney as it stands at this time.

Frankly- my husband and I are 34yo and for us- the bigger the faster the better- so we will welcome our time at Universal and Cedar Point I LOVE DW for their fantastic theming but the time will come when theming is not going to cut it.

Perhaps 2 parents with a 12yo boy is not DWs demographic....and that's ok....but we will be going elsewhere.

Amen!

 

[mummabear]

I don't know jack-squat about Cheetah Hunt itself, but that sort of theming would fit seamlessly into DAK. Theme it around Scar and the hyenas from Lion King if you want a movie connection, or theme it around dinosaurs and find a place back in Dino-Land for it (to give a major attraction in each of the four "corners" of the park, once Avatarland is in place, too). Ideally (at least in my feeble mind), make it a "flying" coaster like Manta at SeaWorld, so that the riders are positioned on their bellies like a lion/hyena running or a pterodactyl flying after prey, and, whammo, DAK is more than a full-day park without any argument, with this addition, Avatar and the new night show. Frankly, something like this wouldn't even have to be at some mindlessly insane thrill level, but enough to get people (including kids) interested.

I am a big fan of DHS, have lots of ideas for how to overhaul that park and want nothing more than to see it built out with Star Wars and Pixar, but I'd be willing to delay my plans for DHS (ha!) if they said they were committing the effort to putting in a ride like this at DAK, simply to get DAK "finished" in most people's minds. I can appreciate that DAK was never intended to be a ride-heavy park, but come on...just one more!

I think the imagineers just need to invite us in for a quick coffee so we can share our utterly brilliant ideas

 

[mummabear]

I'm just going to put this here:

 

[mummabear]

Close, but that's missing my main point. WDW's expertise is attractions with broad appeal across many demographics, not me personally.

Disney is so expert at drawing a broad demographic (plus the rest of the MCO area), that the Orlando area is well know in the restaurant business as a concept proving ground. If it sells in Orlando, it sells across America and beyond.


May I suggest watching a few Disney commercials. That's the image they want to project.

If they are then why are the ignoring an entire part of the market?

The image they are attempting to project is the princess dress wearing, earhat adored, balloon carrying, Mickey plush cuddling cutie toddling down towards the castle-all about MK. But what about her older brother? No one is suggesting this/these be built at MK again and again we have stated DHS/DAK or a 5th gate.

 

[mummabear]

My heart just skipped a beat!!!!! I wouldn't know what to do if Disney built a Lion King coaster!!!! A coaster themed around Scar and the hyena's is an amazing, magnificent idea!! The flying aspect like superman is great too!! AK could use another coaster or three. Isn't it a shame that we didn't know about this Cheetah Hunt until now???? Cheetah Hunt was built in 2011....I love Disney World as much as the next person but it's also good to explore other places!!!! Look at what we're missing out on. Ha!!!! I'm already on board for Star Wars and Pixar at DHS!! But, what about poor Epcot.....I know it's the least likely park to get a coaster but I sure wouldn't mind!!

We went to Busch Gardens last trip and ended up dropping an AK day to head back to Busch because it was so great (and note at this point we had a almost 2year old DD and a 3.5DD)

 

[mummabear]

Yeah, Epcot is definitely having an identity crisis, at least in Future World. There were the rumors/plans of a Mt. Fuji coaster back in Japan, and I'd be OK with that, just to have something new, but am honestly wishing they could recapture some sort of vision for FW. Hoping the new Imagineer-in-charge at Epcot was put in place to get something done to revitalize that front half of the park. Perhaps some sort of simulated coaster within one of the abandoned (or otherwise underutilized) pavilions? I would love to see a new "edutainment" type of ride where the ride vehicles are sucked into a computer/video-game and spend a few minutes interacting with programs, games, etc. -- basically a TRON theme, but whether people like that movie or not, the general concept of the movie still works well in FW. Perhaps the "coaster" aspect of it could come in the form of a motorcycle-based ride vehicle riding through the lightcycle game grid from the TRON: Legacy movie (have seen several motorcycle-themed coasters online, and I don't think there is anything like it in the Orlando market, whether simulated or real, so if nothing else, there would be significant interest just for the uniqueness of the attraction).

Do simulated coasters count as "real" coasters on this thread?! (I almost made myself sick "riding" my own design-your-own coaster at DisneyQuest, so to some degree, they can certainly seem real.) I suppose Sum of All Thrills is the same design-your-own idea, but if you pull up "Tron Legacy lightcycle scene" on Youtube, that grid could provide a pretty thrilling experience...and in a pretty small area, compared to the space required for a full-blooded coaster, which I'm not sure could fit into FW.

Nah, not saying it wouldnt be cool and shouldn't be built but not the same.
For example The Simpsons ride at US is meh

 

[mummabear]

Don't forget, first Disney is going to demolish every family attraction they have. Because apparently it's all or none.