The Running Thread - 2021

Hello All,

I have been MIA again for months now. I have had a lot going on. I tore my meniscus in December. I was out snow blowing and some of my kids came running out telling me my youngest wasn't breathing. I took off inside and slipped on the cement floor in the garage with my wet boots and my knee has been hurting since. Had to take off a few weeks of running after that. My daughter was fine BTW, she was playing and just got the wind knocked out of her so no major deal, certainly not worth injuring myself but who knew at the time.

About 2 months ago I started at a chiropractor. I have been running with pain in my back for the last couple of years. I am not one to run to doctors for everything but I finally decided to go. He took Xrays and everything. He told me my pelvis is all out of alignment. He showed me on the Xray that one side is about an inch higher than the other. He said my back muscles are so tight it is messing everything up. I definitely feel tight for sure so it seemed legit. I get pains down my legs when I run and he told me my lower back is all inflamed and it is pinching the nerve.

Today I started at PT for my knee, I finally went to the doctor for my knee last week and he gave me orders for the PT. I asked her about my back while I was there as her website says she specializes in back injuries. She told me the chiro is 100% wrong. She told me there is nothing down there to inflame, it is all bone. She said my disks have most likely worn away and that is causing the pinching. She said losing weight and proper strength training for the core will likely help but it won't ever go away, it will likely just get worse over time but keeping myself in the best possible shape will help (I have been on a new weight loss program as I was stalled despite still regularly exercising). She also told me my running days are most likely limited or done. She said I may be able to do 2-3 days of running a week and do the rest of training on my bike but marathons should no longer be on the radar, probably no 1/2's, and settle for 10k's. She said it is a serious condition and she worked 2 years in a spine center so she has seen it a lot.

So I was fighting back the tears in her office. I wasn't fully believing the chiro when he told me he would fix me. I have been 13 times and no cracks, no relief what so ever. She told me I should have seen some improvement after just 2-3 visits. I told her I can't stop running, I need it for my mental health. When I told me wife, I told her I need it for that too and she said why not just ride your bike an do bike races. I said I enjoy riding my bike but it isn't the same as running for some reason.

My dreams of Boston seem to be slipping away. My dreams of running Dopey or Goofy, or even just the Disney marathon again seem to be slipping away.

The PT told me I could go to a doctor that she knows does great work and get an MRI to confirm everything but honestly, I don't think I need to right now. The chiro showed me the Xrays he took and compared them to a normal looking xray and I could see the lack of space where the disks are supposed to be. She recommended I take the money I was spending on chiro co-pays and get a deep tissue massage every other week. She thinks that will help loosen things up and have a bigger impact. PT also thinks getting a desk that can stand or sit will help keep me from getting stiff.

So why am I here after so many months away? Because I want to see if anyone has has success with chiro or PT, or massage. I don't know who to trust at this point, although I am leaning toward not trusting the chiro. I have been strength training the last couple of months to try and fight off injury. The PT said she will give me specific core exercises and stretches to do to improve my situation as some will actually make it worse.

It is too much to ask to get a couple more years of running in before I resort to a bike. I can accept maybe only doing one or two more marathons if I can improve my situation enough. I'd be fine limiting my 1/2's as well. I'd like to be able to at least do some 10k's. I can have fun at a Disney 10K still!

I know I haven't been contributing much here but it is hard to come on and contribute when I haven't been able to run much. We bought a brand new treadmill and I have barely gotten to use it. I did my virtual 10K from marathon weekend last month and I haven't run much since. I still have the 1/2 medal sitting in plastic waiting to be earned so I need to do that!

One more thing. I am doing the weight loss through Metpro. They advertise on the MTA podcast. I know some people here listen to that. They now have an app. By Sunday it will be two weeks and I will be down about 5-6 pounds, which is more than I have lost since December on my own. Anyone have sucess with this program?

OK, I am done rambling.
 
@Waiting2goback I am so sorry you find yourself in your current situation. I will say I have no experience with your particular situation. I have had cervical disc issues (C5/C6) and have also been given the assessment that "you're older, arthritis in your spine/stenosis...." etc etc. I've done the whole MRI thing and found it to be marginally helpful--maybe because the Ortho doc did such a poor job of really clearly explaining my issue, and also because it didn't lead to any additional concrete action other than PT. I have done PT with "success". I put it in quotes only because I am still somehow convinced that it is basic rest that accounts for at least half of abatement of symptoms. But I will also say that the stretching/strengthening/body work that the PT does helps--in some cases mentally as much as physically. One of my PTs commented that if people spent regular time on "bodywork" (massage, strengthen, stretch) it would be beneficial--I am coming around to that view. I have no experience with chiropractors, and am personally not really open to them.

I guess in your situation I would definitely pursue the exercises and massage. It takes time--which is frustrating. Please don't ever feel reluctant to come here and talk/rant/ramble/ask/whine/ or whatever you need to do. Who else will understand your situation better than this diverse group of runners/walkers. And as hard as it is (and as cliched as it may sound), please don't project too far into the future--just take it one day at a time (yeah, I said it).

Take care.
 
Hello All,

I have been MIA again for months now. I have had a lot going on. I tore my meniscus in December. I was out snow blowing and some of my kids came running out telling me my youngest wasn't breathing. I took off inside and slipped on the cement floor in the garage with my wet boots and my knee has been hurting since. Had to take off a few weeks of running after that. My daughter was fine BTW, she was playing and just got the wind knocked out of her so no major deal, certainly not worth injuring myself but who knew at the time.

About 2 months ago I started at a chiropractor. I have been running with pain in my back for the last couple of years. I am not one to run to doctors for everything but I finally decided to go. He took Xrays and everything. He told me my pelvis is all out of alignment. He showed me on the Xray that one side is about an inch higher than the other. He said my back muscles are so tight it is messing everything up. I definitely feel tight for sure so it seemed legit. I get pains down my legs when I run and he told me my lower back is all inflamed and it is pinching the nerve.

Today I started at PT for my knee, I finally went to the doctor for my knee last week and he gave me orders for the PT. I asked her about my back while I was there as her website says she specializes in back injuries. She told me the chiro is 100% wrong. She told me there is nothing down there to inflame, it is all bone. She said my disks have most likely worn away and that is causing the pinching. She said losing weight and proper strength training for the core will likely help but it won't ever go away, it will likely just get worse over time but keeping myself in the best possible shape will help (I have been on a new weight loss program as I was stalled despite still regularly exercising). She also told me my running days are most likely limited or done. She said I may be able to do 2-3 days of running a week and do the rest of training on my bike but marathons should no longer be on the radar, probably no 1/2's, and settle for 10k's. She said it is a serious condition and she worked 2 years in a spine center so she has seen it a lot.

So I was fighting back the tears in her office. I wasn't fully believing the chiro when he told me he would fix me. I have been 13 times and no cracks, no relief what so ever. She told me I should have seen some improvement after just 2-3 visits. I told her I can't stop running, I need it for my mental health. When I told me wife, I told her I need it for that too and she said why not just ride your bike an do bike races. I said I enjoy riding my bike but it isn't the same as running for some reason.

My dreams of Boston seem to be slipping away. My dreams of running Dopey or Goofy, or even just the Disney marathon again seem to be slipping away.

The PT told me I could go to a doctor that she knows does great work and get an MRI to confirm everything but honestly, I don't think I need to right now. The chiro showed me the Xrays he took and compared them to a normal looking xray and I could see the lack of space where the disks are supposed to be. She recommended I take the money I was spending on chiro co-pays and get a deep tissue massage every other week. She thinks that will help loosen things up and have a bigger impact. PT also thinks getting a desk that can stand or sit will help keep me from getting stiff.

So why am I here after so many months away? Because I want to see if anyone has has success with chiro or PT, or massage. I don't know who to trust at this point, although I am leaning toward not trusting the chiro. I have been strength training the last couple of months to try and fight off injury. The PT said she will give me specific core exercises and stretches to do to improve my situation as some will actually make it worse.

It is too much to ask to get a couple more years of running in before I resort to a bike. I can accept maybe only doing one or two more marathons if I can improve my situation enough. I'd be fine limiting my 1/2's as well. I'd like to be able to at least do some 10k's. I can have fun at a Disney 10K still!

I know I haven't been contributing much here but it is hard to come on and contribute when I haven't been able to run much. We bought a brand new treadmill and I have barely gotten to use it. I did my virtual 10K from marathon weekend last month and I haven't run much since. I still have the 1/2 medal sitting in plastic waiting to be earned so I need to do that!

One more thing. I am doing the weight loss through Metpro. They advertise on the MTA podcast. I know some people here listen to that. They now have an app. By Sunday it will be two weeks and I will be down about 5-6 pounds, which is more than I have lost since December on my own. Anyone have sucess with this program?

OK, I am done rambling.

It is good to see you - if that is the right thing to say. I am so sorry about your back issues. I do not have any experience with that level of back issues but I know my PT stresses core strength, flexibility and weight loss as the best factors for back health. Iwould encourage you to speak to some other experts and get some other opinions maybe there are other options. Wishing you the best!
 

Hello All,

I have been MIA again for months now. I have had a lot going on. I tore my meniscus in December. I was out snow blowing and some of my kids came running out telling me my youngest wasn't breathing. I took off inside and slipped on the cement floor in the garage with my wet boots and my knee has been hurting since. Had to take off a few weeks of running after that. My daughter was fine BTW, she was playing and just got the wind knocked out of her so no major deal, certainly not worth injuring myself but who knew at the time.

About 2 months ago I started at a chiropractor. I have been running with pain in my back for the last couple of years. I am not one to run to doctors for everything but I finally decided to go. He took Xrays and everything. He told me my pelvis is all out of alignment. He showed me on the Xray that one side is about an inch higher than the other. He said my back muscles are so tight it is messing everything up. I definitely feel tight for sure so it seemed legit. I get pains down my legs when I run and he told me my lower back is all inflamed and it is pinching the nerve.

Today I started at PT for my knee, I finally went to the doctor for my knee last week and he gave me orders for the PT. I asked her about my back while I was there as her website says she specializes in back injuries. She told me the chiro is 100% wrong. She told me there is nothing down there to inflame, it is all bone. She said my disks have most likely worn away and that is causing the pinching. She said losing weight and proper strength training for the core will likely help but it won't ever go away, it will likely just get worse over time but keeping myself in the best possible shape will help (I have been on a new weight loss program as I was stalled despite still regularly exercising). She also told me my running days are most likely limited or done. She said I may be able to do 2-3 days of running a week and do the rest of training on my bike but marathons should no longer be on the radar, probably no 1/2's, and settle for 10k's. She said it is a serious condition and she worked 2 years in a spine center so she has seen it a lot.

So I was fighting back the tears in her office. I wasn't fully believing the chiro when he told me he would fix me. I have been 13 times and no cracks, no relief what so ever. She told me I should have seen some improvement after just 2-3 visits. I told her I can't stop running, I need it for my mental health. When I told me wife, I told her I need it for that too and she said why not just ride your bike an do bike races. I said I enjoy riding my bike but it isn't the same as running for some reason.

My dreams of Boston seem to be slipping away. My dreams of running Dopey or Goofy, or even just the Disney marathon again seem to be slipping away.

The PT told me I could go to a doctor that she knows does great work and get an MRI to confirm everything but honestly, I don't think I need to right now. The chiro showed me the Xrays he took and compared them to a normal looking xray and I could see the lack of space where the disks are supposed to be. She recommended I take the money I was spending on chiro co-pays and get a deep tissue massage every other week. She thinks that will help loosen things up and have a bigger impact. PT also thinks getting a desk that can stand or sit will help keep me from getting stiff.

So why am I here after so many months away? Because I want to see if anyone has has success with chiro or PT, or massage. I don't know who to trust at this point, although I am leaning toward not trusting the chiro. I have been strength training the last couple of months to try and fight off injury. The PT said she will give me specific core exercises and stretches to do to improve my situation as some will actually make it worse.

It is too much to ask to get a couple more years of running in before I resort to a bike. I can accept maybe only doing one or two more marathons if I can improve my situation enough. I'd be fine limiting my 1/2's as well. I'd like to be able to at least do some 10k's. I can have fun at a Disney 10K still!

I know I haven't been contributing much here but it is hard to come on and contribute when I haven't been able to run much. We bought a brand new treadmill and I have barely gotten to use it. I did my virtual 10K from marathon weekend last month and I haven't run much since. I still have the 1/2 medal sitting in plastic waiting to be earned so I need to do that!

One more thing. I am doing the weight loss through Metpro. They advertise on the MTA podcast. I know some people here listen to that. They now have an app. By Sunday it will be two weeks and I will be down about 5-6 pounds, which is more than I have lost since December on my own. Anyone have sucess with this program?

OK, I am done rambling.

I would spend the money and go to a sports ortho. Running is very important to you. Before you decide to up and quit working towards your dream races, get the full picture. Your PT could be right, but there’s also that off chance she’s wrong???

I have no experience with chiropractors. My DH goes, but I don’t care for the place.

I get a monthly trigger point or sports massage depending on my aches and pains. I find that it helps me more than a standard massage.

Just a little story....
My DH was always plagued with back issues and was told time and again it was a disc issue and he would have to live with it and there was nothing that could be done or he had to have major back surgery to fuse his discs. After living with the pain for 15 years he finally found a good sports ortho that put him on the right path with no surgery He just set state powerlifting records in the squat and deadlift for his age and weight class. He is heading to Nationals in June to compete and has the potential to qualify for the world show. He is 54yo.
 
The PT told me I could go to a doctor that she knows does great work and get an MRI to confirm everything but honestly, I don't think I need to right now. The chiro showed me the Xrays he took and compared them to a normal looking xray and I could see the lack of space where the disks are supposed to be. She recommended I take the money I was spending on chiro co-pays and get a deep tissue massage every other week. She thinks that will help loosen things up and have a bigger impact. PT also thinks getting a desk that can stand or sit will help keep me from getting stiff.

So why am I here after so many months away? Because I want to see if anyone has has success with chiro or PT, or massage. I don't know who to trust at this point, although I am leaning toward not trusting the chiro. I have been strength training the last couple of months to try and fight off injury. The PT said she will give me specific core exercises and stretches to do to improve my situation as some will actually make it worse.
Sorry to hear about your challenges. I threw my back out in college and dealt with those issues for many years. Not a major issue in day to day life so I didn't need to see a doctor, et all about it, but it limited my usefulness when lifting heavy objects and such. Oddly enough, the problem finally went away after my first half marathon. I think that's a function of the training helping strengthen my core. So maybe that will help you.

As to whether or not the back pain derails running hopes, dreams, and goals, it doesn't necessarily have to, at least on the runDisney front. I am not very fast at all. Every time I have really tried to go faster, it usually ends in disaster so I've decided that slow and moving is always better than fast and in pain. I have finished multiple runDisney events including Dopey after needing to walk all or major portions of races either due to just 3 weeks of training or recovering from a nasty cold that left me unable to speak without fear of coughing up a lung or just to preserve energy and legs for longer races. Including photo stops for races, although I have to decide if I really want that particular photo or not. It doesn't have to be the end.

Best of luck in what you decide and recognize that we are here to lend a listening ear when a good vent or expression of fear and frustration is needed.
 
I would spend the money and go to a sports ortho. Running is very important to you. Before you decide to up and quit working towards your dream races, get the full picture. Your PT could be right, but there’s also that off chance she’s wrong???

I have no experience with chiropractors. My DH goes, but I don’t care for the place.

I get a monthly trigger point or sports massage depending on my aches and pains. I find that it helps me more than a standard massage.

Just a little story....
My DH was always plagued with back issues and was told time and again it was a disc issue and he would have to live with it and there was nothing that could be done or he had to have major back surgery to fuse his discs. After living with the pain for 15 years he finally found a good sports ortho that put him on the right path with no surgery He just set state powerlifting records in the squat and deadlift for his age and weight class. He is heading to Nationals in June to compete and has the potential to qualify for the world show. He is 54yo.

Thanks for the responses. I am going to stop the chiro, I was thinking of doing that anyway. I’ll give the massage a try and see if that helps. I’ll see what exercises the PT can give me a d see if those help. I am on track to hopefully lose the final 30 pounds I have wanted to lose for a few years now. Once I do all of that I will reevaluate and then try the ortho if it is still needed.
 
@Waiting2goback Sorry to hear of your health woes! As an older runner myself (51yo), I can definitely empathize. Don't lose hope about your running future, though; humans continue to defy the odds in their ability to recover and overcome health obstacles. Fred Lebow, founder of the NYC Marathon, was told in early 1990 that he had brain cancer and had no more than six months to live. At that time, he'd never actually run the NYC Marathon in its current five-borough format, since he'd been busying directing it all those years. Despite being told he had six months to live, he lived for nearly four more years, and got to run the NYC Marathon in November 1992. With time and the right medical care, you may be able to continue running. Best of luck on a healthy recovery!
 
@Waiting2goback - I am glad your daughter turned out to be ok, that must have been terrifying.
I wanted to echo @jmasgat and suggest reigning in your future sight and any assessment that limits your future activities. I will also add my +1 on massage and state I was doubtful about the standing desk but found it to be helpful.

Massage- my low back/hips have been a constant problem since injuring the growth plate in my femur/hip joint, not specifically for running which I took up later in life, but it was noticeable in many other activities. When a friend needed someone to practice on while getting certified, I found massage to be helpful in alleviating much low back & hip discomfort. I then forgot about it for 10 years until I was pregnant with twins and in enough pain that even walking was difficult. My Doc suggested PT, floating in a pool, and massage, with the latter being easier to schedule I went with that first. I walked out of the place with slightly less discomfort, but with a noticeable change in my step- literally. I kept going back and found that my gait was notably changed and I walked more than waddled for the three days following a massage. So, I am here to say you should give it a try unless there is a medical reason to avoid it. When running, I have found it to also be helpful, but not necessary to maintain my recreational status and not possible given my current level of public health comfort.

Standing Desk- We got them at work and I thought it silly. Eventually I used it just to get a change in light level in our cave-like cube farm. I really missed it when we went to endless WFH, and so I got my own. It allows me to stand and take pressure off my lower back as well as stretch my calves while working. Even a do-it-yourself riser for a laptop could be helpful.

Not-so-used treadmill-I got one recently when very frustrated by endless ice and snow. Given my past experience, frustration and boredom with a treadmill, I did not anticipate using it for much more than 3 miles of running at a time- and that was judged to be better than me not running at all. I do find myself using it to walk when on phone calls or meetings I can turn off my video and mostly be on mute. I got in a walking 10K on corporate quality day calls! So while it is not what most people use it for and I wish I were more dedicated in general, I do love having it.
 
February totals:

(I like the sense of accomplishment that adding these up this afternoon gave me so I’m going to keep doing it for now.)

Runs completed: 13
Running distance : 30.7 miles
Time spent running: 6 hours, 40 minutes, 25 seconds
Average pace per mile: 13:00

Workouts completed: 12
Time spent: 6 hours, 12 minutes

Biking sessions: 3
Time spent: 1 hour, 45 minutes

Total exercise time: 14 hours, 37 minutes, 25 seconds.
 
February Totals:

Running: 100 miles
Average Pace: 9:33

It took an ad hoc 2.7 mile run this morning, but this is the first time I've hit a hundred since November. Pace is trending faster. Not bad for the coldest and shortest month of the year. Still hitting 2 strength training session, and 1 yoga session per week.
 
February Total: 9.4 miles
Yep, you read that right.
Travel + snow + quarantine (actual government-mandated quarantine, not the stay at home I've been doing for a year) meant I didn't get out for my first run of the month until last week, and it was a busy week so I only had time for a few short runs. tbh, I wasn't sure I'd get any running in this month, so I'm happy with this. March should be back to normal-ish.
 
February Totals
201.41 miles
7:13 avg/mile

Had a live in-person race this morning. Spring Thaw 10 miler here in Pittsburgh. (1:06:39/1:06:11)
Lovely weather for it: 41 degrees and pouring the whole time. But kind of like the old fishing adage, the worst running weather is still better than nothing or the treadmill. Regardless of the weather, still nice to be out and have somewhat normalcy with a race. Good safety measures the whole time. Field was only 213 people. Ran a new PR for that distance: 1:06:11.
 
What method do people use for finding monthly pacing information? I have free strava and garmin connect, can't find it.
Kudos to all if you're manually figuring this out.
 
What method do people use for finding monthly pacing information? I have free strava and garmin connect, can't find it.
Kudos to all if you're manually figuring this out.

In Garmin Connect on laptop (and Connect sucks), you can go to Reports-Progress Summary, then select an activity (Running) and a time period (This Month) and it will show you results. Go to the small Customize drop-down on the right and you can change which fields it will show you.

Feb total: 91.5 miles--which is the most I have run since May of last year. I continue to do a 5k training plan--and hope to find a live race. On a side note, it was pretty amusing to see that the overwhelming favorite for "least favorite race" was 5k.

My cross training has been awful. It seems that strength training doesn't like me, as I have a case of tendinitis in my elbow. But I can still fit in yoga--just been slacking off, I guess.
 
What method do people use for finding monthly pacing information? I have free strava and garmin connect, can't find it.
Kudos to all if you're manually figuring this out.
On Garmin Connect, if you go to Reports -> Running -> Average Pace and choose either the 6 months or 1 year view, it shows the average pace for each month.

February Running:
Distance: 67.9, including my Princess Virtual Half! (lots of snow meant not so much running this month but lots of shoveling)
Average Pace: 11:29 (faster average month for me, because so much of the miles were in my virtual half and then just running the pace I want after)
 
I use the Garmin connect reports -> progress summary
Change the pull-down from "All days" to "This month" and the "all Activities" pull-down to "Running"...

Activities 20
Total Distance 115.50 mi
Total Activity Time 18:32:48 h:m:s
Activity Calories 12,996 C
Total Elev Gain 2,137 ft
Average Speed 6.2 mph (or 60/6.2 = 9:41 min/mi.)
Average Heart Rate 145 bpm
Average Run Cadence 173 spm
 
February 2021 Training Summary

Running duration = 11:17 hours
Running mileage = 79.5 miles
Average Pace = 8:31 min/mile (about 90 sec/mile slower than estimated Marathon Tempo)
Average HR = 132 (16 bpm lower than Marathon Pace)
Indoor Cycling duration = 17:45 hours
Indoor Cycling mileage = 303 miles
Indoor Cycling average power = 174 watts
Indoor Cycling average Normalized Power = 194 watts
Strength = 4:10 hours
Total Training Time = 33:12 hours

February was a busy month. I was a guest on a running podcast. I threw my daughter a Harry Potter themed virtual birthday party. We welcomed a new member to the family.

Screen Shot 2021-02-28 at 5.50.58 PM.png

My ankle still hasn't healed from my November injury. It's made progress but not where I want it to be. I've finished out my phase 1 of training for the Non-Cancelled Marathon on May 1st. The goal was to suppress my fitness level based on Garmin VO2max based on how my body responds to training. Now I enter the last 9 weeks of training with the intent of staying healthy and being prepared for the race.
 
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