The Running Thread - 2018

[JBinORL]

RE: Coke vs. Pepsi. I did my grad school internship with Pepsi. Do you have ANY idea how hard it is to order a rum and Pepsi instead of a rum and coke? And how bad it tastes?

 

[cavepig]

ATTQOTD - I've ran when it was 100 and I've ran when it's 0, give or take a few degrees. Not sure on feels like with Humidity and wind chills though, but I've ran in a lot. I will take heat over freezing any day, slow down & drink is better than freezing up like a TaunTaun. Humidity drains me though for sure, but freezing I've had my body get all messed up as well. They both suck in their own very special ways really!

 

[cburnett11]

ATTQOTD: Hottest is probably about 90 degrees with high humidity. Lowest temp is single digits. I'd pick the cold weather every time.

 

[run.minnie.miles]

I know this doesn't exactly answer the question, but my least favorite running condition is WIND. Yuck.

Also (Diet) Coke for life. This is definitely a Pepsi state though... watching a Husker game in any of the venues would be SO much better with Coke products. All of the high schools around here also have Pepsi. My husband is a non-teacher HS basketball coach, so I go to a LOT of boys basketball games in the winter and sometimes sneak a bottle of Diet Coke in to have with my gourmet supper of popcorn.

 

[JM735]

Ok, being away from the boards for a bit is almost detrimental - I don't think there is such a thing as catching up. But after a quick skim, it looks like I will need to spend a few hours seeing what I missed.

Because I'm adamant about it, I'll say now: Diet Coke. Period. There is no other option for me. If I can't tell from the menu, my first question is always 'Coke or Pepsi?', since a Rum and Diet is made only with Diet Coke!

Anyway, for today's question, I'd say the warmest I've run in is low 90s and the coldest is in the mid 30s. I'd probably prefer the heat, but in general I'm a treadmill runner so I can be in a climate-controlled environment. Between Marathon weekend and (formerly) Dark Side weekend, Disney events can certainly push both temperature extremes.

 

[Capang]

ATTQOTD: highs: somewhere in the 90s last summer. Cold: about 20 during my 5k this winter. Not really cold by Ohio standards but usually I move indoors during winter not because of cold but because of ice.

 

[PrincessV]

On pop (former WNYer here)...
I took the Pepsi Challenge 3 times. I nailed it all 3 times on the first sip. Pepsi only for me. Though it's not something I drink regularly in the first place: I only reach for a cola if I feel a migraine coming on, and only Pepsi works for that for reasons unknown to me. I've tried Coke in a pinch when that was all I could get, but it didn't work well and tasted like swill to boot. I don't drink pop/soda at all under normal conditions... unless there's Vernors around, then I'm all in.

 

[GreatLakes]

Coke vs Pepsi: I don't like pop so neither for me.

 

[apdebord]

ATTQOTD: It was 95° Sunday, felt like 105° when I ran. That’s the warmest I can think of right now. Coldest is probably low 30s. I’ll take the warmer any day because I have no issue with slowing it down and getting through it. I have a hard time recovering after cold runs with my breathing and can’t stop coughing for a few hours.

 

[run.minnie.miles]

Because I'm adamant about it, I'll say now: Diet Coke. Period. There is no other option for me. If I can't tell from the menu, my first question is always 'Coke or Pepsi?', since a Rum and Diet is made only with Diet Coke!

I knew I liked you.

 

[rteetz]

Has anyone been to Disney yet and have to pay the resort parking fee? I am curious how this charge comes across? Do you get a bill showing "x" charge per "x" night for a total, or just you owe $x dollars for parking?

From what I understand is been kind of hit or miss with how it operates. Right after it was implemented people were able to get away without paying. I’m sure they have cracked down a bit more now but there hasn’t been a lot of talk about it.

 

[rteetz]

QOTD: What is the warmest temps you have gone out for a run in? What about the coldest? Which would you prefer of the two extremes?

Probably mid 80s with some humidity. I don’t think I have run in the 90s.

As for cold I’ve been out in the 20s and that’s about my lowest I’ll go outside. I hate wearing so many layers for a run.

I don’t mind running in the heat as long as it’s early in the morning before it’s really hot.

 

[gjramsey]

ATTQOTD: The Habanero Hundred relay I was part of last August was the hottest. my first leg was at mid afternoon and the temps were 98 degrees and the trail had a lot of sandy sections with no shade and the temps in those areas was around 130.... coldest was upper teens. Give me cold weather! I can layer up as needed

 

[Sanchez]

I will stick with this calendar year. I ran a half marathon at 31 degrees. That was fine after mile 2 (except for the significant wind) but the pre-race and start were too cold for me.

South Carolina summers are not pleasant. Last week I did a track workout with a T+D of 174. I assume there is some benefit to preparing for race conditions but at this point I would rather run indoors than deal with the conditions.

 

[PrincessV]

Has anyone been to Disney yet and have to pay the resort parking fee? I am curious how this charge comes across? Do you get a bill showing "x" charge per "x" night for a total, or just you owe $x dollars for parking?

Not yet, but soon for me. The'e a thread going with real-life experiences and it's all over the place: some have had the parking fee added to their final bill, others had none at all.

QOTD: What is the warmest temps you have gone out for a run in? What about the coldest? Which would you prefer of the two extremes?

ATTQOTD: Warmest was a Feels Like of 108 - I think the actual temp was 99. Coldest is a toss-up between this year's WDW marathon weekend and the Frozen 5K in 2015; not sure which was technically colder, but we had to scrape ice off the car's windshield for this year's 5K, so I'm giving the edge to that one, lol! I hate both extremes and would like to only run when it's 70-75 degrees and 70% humidity

 

[DopeyBadger]

A hearty Thanks! to @GreatLakes and @DopeyBadger for the explanations.
A solid bonus of DopeyBadger's posts is that all the equations and graphs makes it look like I am doing paid work, not reading up on LT and trying to compute my mm based on current VO2max. I now have plenty of new questions stewing away, but the one I still have is regarding the statement of cumulative fatigue and stacking long runs which turn out in the example given in the post to not simply be additive. Is this hyperbole or is there some additional basis to this? I have no plans to intentionally do this, but I would like to understand.

The short answer is that it's not so easy to say that a 7 mile easy run + an 11 mile long run the next day provides the same stimulus as day off + an 18 mile long run, it does not have to be perfectly additive. Or in my terms, a 60 min easy run + 85 min LR does not necessarily equal a 135 min LR. The goal is to receive a similar stimulus from the stacked workouts in order to lessen the risk of injury.

But I'll take a stab at the longer answer (because you knew I would at least try).

First, to understand what I'm talking about, read this background information on TRIMP (link) and HRSS (link). The short version of those is that TRIMP and HRSS are methods to calculate the stress (or training load) of a workout using duration and relative HR (based on someone's resting HR, max HR, and LT HR). Also, "Fitness" builds slower than "Fatigue" as both are measures of training load averages over timeframes of 6 weeks and 2 weeks. So it takes longer to build fitness, and fatigue can be erased at a faster rate.

The goal of training is to provide a stimulus such that you get an adaptation. Two different methods are to be rested entering the workout (0 easy + 18 mile LR) and the other is to be fatigued entering the workout (7 mile easy + 11 mile LR). The idea is that with the lesser stacked workout (i.e. not taking the duration further out) you should have less of a fatigue feeling entering the next workout (come Tuesday) then you would if you did an 18 mile LR alone.

I'm going to use my own dataset for the example, since that's the most extensive set of examples I can give.

Let's say two runners enter a peak week at the same "Fitness" (defined in TRIMP as 6 week average training load) and "Fatigue" (defined in TRIMP as 2 week average training load). One problem with this example is going to be that two runners following these two different types of plans may not end up with the same "Fitness"/"Fatigue" entering peak week.

Runner A does the following week -

M- OFF
T- 3 mile easy
W- OFF
R- 3 mile easy
F- OFF
Sa- OFF
Su- 26 mile LR

Total = 32 miles

Runner B does the following week -

M- 1 mile Easy + 2 x 1.5 mile at 10k w/ 0.5 mile RI + 1 mile Easy
T- 4 mile Easy
W- OFF
R- 1 mile Easy + 4 mile M Tempo + 1 mile Easy
F- OFF
Sa- 6 mile Easy
Su- 12 mile LR

Total = 33.5 miles

Based on my own data set (extrapolated using someone else's paces but my durations, so they should be equivalent), then we get the following training load data set:

Fatigue = 65
Fitness = 50

Runner A

M- OFF = -13% from Fatigue and -2.5% from Fitness (Fatigue = 55.9, Fitness = 48.75)
T- 3 mile Easy = -4% from Fatigue and 0% from Fitness (Fatigue = 53.66, Fitness = 48.75)
W- OFF = -13% from Fatigue and -2.5% from Fitness (Fatigue = 46.6, Fitness = 47.5)
R- 3 mile Easy = -4% from Fatigue and 0% from Fitness (Fatigue = 44.7, Fitness = 47.5)
F- OFF = -13% from Fatigue and -2.5% from Fitness (Fatigue = 38.8, Fitness = 46.3)
Sa- OFF = -13% from Fatigue and -2.5% from Fitness (Fatigue = 33.8, Fitness = 45.1)

So entering the Sunday LR, this runner has dropped their "optimal" training from +15 down to -12 (now in "race mode" entering their LR).

Su - 26 mile LR = +44% from Fatigue and +12% from Fitness (Fatigue = 48.7, Fitness = 50.5)

So this runner lost about 16.3 points in Fatigue through the week and gained 0.5 points in Fitness

Runner B

M- 1 mile Easy + 2 x 1.5 mile at 10k w/ 0.5 mile RI + 1 mile Easy = +12% from Fatigue and +3% from Fitness (Fatigue = 72.8 and Fitness = 51.5)
T- 4 mile Easy = -4% from Fatigue and 0% from Fitness (Fatigue = 69.8, Fitness = 51.5)
W- OFF = -13% from Fatigue and -2.5% from Fitness (Fatigue = 60.7, Fitness = 50.2)
R- 1 mile Easy + 4 mile M Tempo + 1 mile Easy = +14% from Fatigue and +2.5% from Fitness (Fatigue = 69.2, Fitness = 51.5)
F- OFF = -13% from Fatigue and -2.5% from Fitness (Fatigue = 60.2, Fitness = 50.2)
Sa- 6 mile Easy = +3% from Fatigue and +1% from Fitness (Fatigue = 62, Fitness = 52)

So entering the Sunday LR, this runner has maintained their "optimal" training from +15 down to +10. So still fatigued entering the run.

Su- 12 mile LR = +20% from Fatigue and +4% from Fitness (Fatigue = 74.4, Fitness = 54.1)

So this runner gained about 9 points in Fatigue through the week (thereby maintaining the cumulative fatigue) and gained 4.1 points in Fitness.

While the total mileage was similar (32 vs 33) there was a much larger gain based on TRIMP and HRSS for the runner doing schedule B than was for schedule A. That's because schedule B allowed for other types of training since you weren't so focused on the ability to do the long run.

This is the best way I can quantitate it for you to show the difference between the two. The TRIMP and HRSS are not the end all be all, but merely a method of analyzing training in a quantitive sense.

QOTD: What is the warmest temps you have gone out for a run in? What about the coldest? Which would you prefer of the two extremes?

I believe the hottest was a T+D of 165. I believe the coldest was a wind chill of -30F. Honestly, they're both brutal. I'm not sure my family will let me run in the super cold anymore, so I guess that would mean I must prefer the hotter temps moving forward (although I like cold running).

 

[huskies90]

QOTD: What is the warmest temps you have gone out for a run in? What about the coldest? Which would you prefer of the two extremes?

ATTQOTD: I prefer heat over cold. The warmest run - definitely in the 90's mid day with humidity but I can't tell you exactly. I almost never not go out due to heat. As for cold, I also try not to not go out due to cold weather even though I hate the cold so much. And since the last few winters have not been too bad, I would say I have enjoyed the cold runs recently more than I did in the past. Probably mid teens is the coldest I'll go out.

I know this doesn't exactly answer the question, but my least favorite running condition is WIND. Yuck.

+1 I think wind is way worse than the cold and I probably be more inclined to not go out on a windy wind chilly day than a normal cold day.

 

[SarahDisney]

ATTQOTD: hottest was probably 80s. Coldestwas single digits, feels like -10. I dont like either one, but if i had to choose, then cold - i can add layers more easily than I can subtract them.

 

[cavepig]

I know this doesn't exactly answer the question, but my least favorite running condition is WIND. Yuck.

So, Yes, to this, wind can be so tiring!

 

[FFigawi]

QOTD: What is the warmest temps you have gone out for a run in? What about the coldest? Which would you prefer of the two extremes?

Hottest: 105 in the Middle East
Coldest: -5 in Russia

I much prefer running in the cold over the heat. I can dress appropriately for the cold. I can only undress so far in the heat.