The debate board.. please read

[Pin Wizard]

Originally posted by sha_lyn
faithinkara... here is a quote from the post I was refering too

it is on the first page of that thread






LOL... yep we better be careful about forming opinions that aren't made out of pixie dust LOL... It is a joke folks.. yes DB'ers can joke


Oh and love what you said here...
I think you summed up very well what I am feeling.

Hey, Sharon! Now I have to back track and see what you didn't like about my comment. I wasn't keeping up with this thread. LOL!

 

[Pin Wizard]

Originally posted by DSNY FN
I am sorry Alex but this will alienate a number of posters from the DIS if you start to close and lock posts and threads because of content I remember a debate about censorship this falls into the category of it IMHO.

Alex said it needs to stay within guidelines. If people can't stay within them, then they have no business posting.

 

[Pin Wizard]

Originally posted by JerseyJanice
Thanks, Alex and Pete, for sprucing up the landscape around here.

Not to worry, folks, about where the argumentative will go. I'm sure the DB regulars can find another BB on which to have meetings of their great minds.

But Janice, now their "stuff" will be scattered all over the CB. I'd rather their "stuff" be over somewhere by itself.

 

[vernon]

Alex said

Well Jipsy.. kind of but not really.. the debate board was originally created as a place to move stuff too... when we polled the mods we found out that hardly anyone did anymore, stuff was just deleted. It had basically become a "free standing" board and one that didn't contribute to the site.
So far nobody has been able to answer my question on WHY a disney site needs a "debate board"

AS I said on the mods board, a reasonable answer to the lack of need to move posts were that the DIS members were becoming knowledgable enough to know that the subject "deserved" to be on the debate board in the first place. IMHO the fact that mods were not having to move posts there isn't an indication of it's redundancy, just an indication that people knew where the subjects belonged without having to be told.

I'm also not sure how having two of the most active boards basically "rolled" into one is going to help the site, IMHO it's potentially going to mean it's difficult for the readers to keep up with topics of interest and it's going to be almost impossible for those that moderate it.

As far as the "need" for a debate board I would guess that it rather depends if this site is seen as a business or a community.

For a business I may possibly agree with you (I can at least see the argument), but as many people have mentioned they came to this site largely because they felt the debate board provided something to them. Once here they would also contribute to other aspects of the site and have developed a "customer loyalty" to the DIS, wdwinfo.com and Dreams Unlimited travel. As a business decision, I think it's a debatable one.

However if we are indeed a cyber community I disagree with the decision that's been made. On a personal level I found it invaluable to be able to get an understanding of how some/many Americans feel on issues that affect the "real world" in which we live. IMHO the American media is very insular and the internet is one of the great instruments that shrink our world and give us the chance to "converse" one to one. I find that being within a site that is ostensibly for another purpose means that one gets a good spread of backgrounds and interests, you really are talking to "the man on the street" I feel that one gets a much better feel for a society if you're in a wide based crosssection of a society as opposed to a minority interest "pressure" group.

If we are a community, there's a big wide and at times bad world out there. I understand there are those that don't want or need to share in the murkier side to our existance, but there are places on this site for them to shelter from that. There are those who feel they learn from the ability to share others views on these issues and by closing down this aspect of the site I feel you are doing not only them a disservice, but for those that don't want to look at these issues may stumble into them when they are aired on alternate boards.

If we are a community, I think it would have been proper to at least have allowed some discussion on the subject prior to making a decision.



To those I've had the chance to debate with (and against) I'd like to say that with very few exceptions I've enjoyed the chance to agree and disagree with you at various times. I've always found the insight valuable no matter if I agree with you or not. I'd particularly like to say thanks to, in no particular order AFR, Emmagata, Dmad, treesinger, SOTM (couple of nice posts on this thread IMHO) , Doug dub and hopkins2 . I'm sure I've missed a few out.

 

[emmagata]

Originally posted by Disney Dee
I have to say to those who think they could have moderated the DB better that just last week I gave out more then 1 warning about closing a thread why do we need to give a warning about closing a board? I also locked afew and deleted afew posts and threads. One day I had 12 reported posts when I got home from work! How many "PLAY NICE" warnings did we have to make???? So the moderating was not non exsistant as some of you think. You all knew the rules.......... There was just to many who constantly broke the already relaxed guidelines over and over again.
.

I'm very curious as to the nature of those complaints. I visited that board several times every day and I can't really recall anything that I read that *I* would have crybabied to a MOD rather than handle it myself (which was rarely needed).

 

[emmagata]

Originally posted by wdwdvcdad
I think people got confused about the notion of attacking an idea rather than attacking a person.

First, some people thought than when their silly ideas are attacked, they were being personally attacked. They then responded personally, rather than dealing with the idea at hand.

I agree but will add that there's a fine line between calling an idea silly and calling the person silly and some peoples skin was a lot thinner than others.



IOW, shoot the message, not the messenger.

 

[DSNY FN]

Good post Vernon and ITA with your comment John there was nothing over there that was that far out of line we were all consenting adults in the debate board and I think for the most part it was all handled by one another very well yes there were some personal attacks and name calling but nothing worse than someone would have endured in school. Let me guess those people went running to the teacher or their mom and didn't handle it then either. Sorry folks but this is part of life we all have to be able to deal with it most things are said in the heat of the moment and not actually meant as personal attacks but more a retaliation just like in hockey or baseball etc a pitcher throws at a hitter they have words end of story.

 

[ToriLammy]

Originally posted by wdwdvcdad
I think people got confused about the notion of attacking an idea rather than attacking a person.

First, some people thought than when their silly ideas are attacked, they were being personally attacked. They then responded personally, rather than dealing with the idea at hand.

I think that is one of the biggest problems some people had, seeing the difference between personal attacks and attacks on their posts or ideas. To some people disagreeing with them, no matter how nicely worded was a "personal" attack and they got upset. Over the two years I posted on the debate board I saw that happen time and time and time again, then some of them would come back to the CB and complain about how mean everyone was on the DB

 

[faithinkarma]

Originally posted by emmagata
I'm very curious as to the nature of those complaints. I visited that board several times every day and I can't really recall anything that I read that *I* would have crybabied to a MOD rather than handle it myself (which was rarely needed).

John, I am happy to step up and tell you that I am responsible for one of the reports. Someone had posted something as "originally posted faithinkarma" and it was absolutely not anything I had ever said or would have ever said. In fact, a quick search showed that the quote actually came from the person claiming to be quoting me. I asked the poster several times to remove it and he refused to do so. I believe that almost anyone faced with this situation would have done the same thing.

 

[minniepumpernickel]

Great post as usual Vernon!

Janice, I remember you were quite the debator for awhile. A very good one I might add! You were on our side, politically. Do you not care about politics, anymore!

 

[faithinkarma]

Originally posted by DSNY FN
Good post Vernon and ITA with your comment John there was nothing over there that was that far out of line we were all consenting adults in the debate board and I think for the most part it was all handled by one another very well yes there were some personal attacks and name calling but nothing worse than someone would have endured in school. Let me guess those people went running to the teacher or their mom and didn't handle it then either. Sorry folks but this is part of life we all have to be able to deal with it most things are said in the heat of the moment and not actually meant as personal attacks but more a retaliation just like in hockey or baseball etc a pitcher throws at a hitter they have words end of story.

I have to disagree with you on this. In the past couple of weeks there were several brand new posters who did little other than attack. They attacked other posters, and whole groups of people. I think that was their only purpose in being there and I think that right now they are sitting somewhere high fiving each other, elated over their success in closing down the board.

 

[Pin Wizard]

Originally posted by ear_poppin
use the " ignore" button now as there are a few posters whose threads I do not want to read.

That's my plan as soon as I get through this thread.

 

[DSNY FN]

Makes you wonder if it wasn't a ploy by certain people that were agains the DB to begin with doesn't it.

 

[Dan Murphy]

Well stated thoughts, Vernon. And I must say, even though I never went to nor participated on the DB, several of well stated thoughts, as Vernon's above or Jason's a bit earlier, certainly do make some sense to a non-participant like me.

 

[minniepumpernickel]

Originally posted by DSNY FN
Makes you wonder if it wasn't a ploy by certain people that were agains the DB to begin with doesn't it.

Ah yes, I love conspiracy theories! Was it from the right, or left? Some type of pixie dust cult perhaps?

I'll keep checking back to see if we have gotten to the bottom of this yet!

 

[faithinkarma]

Originally posted by DSNY FN
Makes you wonder if it wasn't a ploy by certain people that were agains the DB to begin with doesn't it.

Well, you know how I love a good conspiracy theory

But, I am not convinced there is no truth to this one. Certainly the posters to whom I refer have been completely absent from the CB. Both before and after the closing of the DB. I might have thought they had been banned, but it seems that banning just means you have to get a new screen name. Whether or not VH was JJ, I do not know. JJ pretty much predated my involvement in the DB. But I have seen another very frequent DIS poster on another board bragging about how they got banned from the DIS and came back the next day reinvented with a new screen name. And the fact that they easily gave out both their banned name and their new name, led me to believe that this was an accepted practice.

 

[Pin Wizard]

Originally posted by sunni
After seeing how nasty, mean-spirited and close-minded the CB is capable of being, I seriously think they need to consider shutting down this board as well. Only then will the DIS will be a happier, brighter place.

 

[DSNY FN]

Exactly FIK JJ/VH posted on here stating he would not debate on here or something to that effect makes you wonder if he didn't just try to stir the pot a little to much.

 

[minniepumpernickel]

Originally posted by faithinkarma
Well, you know how I love a good conspiracy theory

But, I am not convinced there is no truth to this one. Certainly the posters to whom I refer have been completely absent from the CB. Both before and after the closing of the DB. I might have thought they had been banned, but it seems that banning just means you have to get a new screen name. Whether or not VH was JJ, I do not know. JJ pretty much predated my involvement in the DB. But I have seen another very frequent DIS poster on another board bragging about how they got banned from the DIS and came back the next day reinvented with a new screen name. And the fact that they easily gave out both their banned name and their new name, led me to believe that this was an accepted practice.

Eek! A British conspiracy! Well it doesn't sound like Vernon was in on it atleast!

 

[faithinkarma]

Respectfully, the way you quoted that might leave some people thinking I had called for the shutting down of the CB. It is hardly fair to take what someone said when agreeing with a post of mine without the actual post. That leaves people believing the

nasty, mean-spirited and close-minded the CB is capable of being

originated with me.