the Blessed Virgin Mary

[Crankyshank]

I'm not arguing about it- I was just pointing out that in all of the Churches I've been to and all of my time in Catholic school I has never seen it done before. I went to a really strict old school Catholic school too.
We do keep our heads bowed in the procession on the way to Communion the whole time.

 

[Crankyshank]

Not in the subject , but Crankyshank , do you speak french , since your grand-maman was french ?

sadly I am half French on both sides of my family and do not
I plan to learn though.

 

[JoyG]

This is interesting! My only immediate response was "Lo, I will be with you always, even to the close of the age." Last chapter of Matthew.

Also, not a direct quote because I can't remember it directly, but "whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven" (help me out here!) This tells me the early church most definitely was/is inspired! Perfect? Maybe not. But guided by the Spirit? Yes.

How about Pentacost? Another reason to point out that the early church fathers were inspired.


This is good interesting discussion! I like how everyone is very tactful and curious! Love the Baptist commandments!

I think we're working off a different definition of "inspired."

When I say the word of God (scripture) is inspired or God Breathed, I mean it IS a perfect representation of what God wanted us to know. That it contains no lies, falsehoods, contradictions (and I'm sure atheists would love to debate that point...another thread maybe) and it was written by GOD using the hand of man.

That is not something I can say about early church tradition. I don't believe church tradition can be held up to the same level that the scriptures can because I believe there are some areas that the church erred (even from the beginning)...Paul wrote about early church errors in his books in the New Testament.

I would agree that the Early Church was spirit filled and spirit led, by not "inspired" in the "God Breathed" definition I apply to scriptures. Did I explain that well enough?

 

[JoyG]

THE 10 COMMANDMENTS are the excactly same for all these 3 faiths. Absolutely no difference!
Did you ever hear the saying "it is set in stone"...That saying derives from the 10 commandments were written in stone & cannot be changed. Where as the Bible was written on parchment, and some believe/some dont has been altered throughout the centuries.

You missed a whole discussion about this in another thread.

Although Jewish, Catholic and Protestants have the same scripture in Exodus that we take the ten commandments from....we actually seperate the verses differently, creating different sets of commandments.

If you were to ask a Jew, Catholic, and Protestant to write down the ten commandments and then compare their lists...all three lists would be different!

Here's a link that explains it further.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_10c4.htm

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

Quoting a verse from the Bible won't change the minds of thousands of Catholic about Mary. Sorry.

When Jesus then saw his mother, and the disciple whom He loved standing nearby, He said to his mother, "Woman, behold, your son!" Then He said to the disciple, "Behold, your mother!" (John 19:26-27) Catholics believe at that moment Mary was given as mother to all Christians.

Interesting theory, but the tri-une God is all things to us spiritually and Mary is not part of the trinity.

If quoting a Bible verse won't change the minds of thousands of Catholics about Mary, as you say, then how can a single Bible verse you quote establish Mary's role to all Catholics?

Nothing against Mary, but I only pay homage to God.

This applies to other "saints" too, as ALL believers are saints.

 

[MouseWorshipin]

Interesting theory, but the tri-une God is all things to us spiritually and Mary is not part of the trinity.

If quoting a Bible verse won't change the minds of thousands of Catholics about Mary, as you say, then how can a single Bible verse you quote establish Mary's role to all Catholics?

Nothing against Mary, but I only pay homage to God.

This applies to other "saints" too, as ALL believers are saints.

Joe, the trinity (or, Holy Trinity, for us Catholics) is not all things spiritually to all Christians.

You aren't big on Mary. Nobody is asking you to be.

Catholics don't believe that all believers are saints. There are all kinds of requirements to cannonization. I'm a believer, but not even close to a saint! I almost was St. Mouse once, you might recall, when I performed my miracle...but it didn't work out.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

[sodaseller]

Interesting theory, but the tri-une God is all things to us spiritually and Mary is not part of the trinity.

If quoting a Bible verse won't change the minds of thousands of Catholics about Mary, as you say, then how can a single Bible verse you quote establish Mary's role to all Catholics?

Nothing against Mary, but I only pay homage to God.

This applies to other "saints" too, as ALL believers are saints.

And the Devil's Advocate weighs in to divide

 

[MouseWorshipin]

THE 10 COMMANDMENTS are the excactly same for all these 3 faiths. Absolutely no difference!
Did you ever hear the saying "it is set in stone"...That saying derives from the 10 commandments were written in stone & cannot be changed. Where as the Bible was written on parchment, and some believe/some dont has been altered throughout the centuries.

I don't read the bible. Most Catholics don't. The ones that do are usually converts (not always, but usually). The Catholic Church encourages us to read the bible, but doesn't make it mandatory. So, when Joy (I think it was Joy) posted her set of commandments from the bible and there were little numbers running along the side, I had no clue that they were line numbers from the bible.

I was sitting there thinking, "The Baptists have 17 Ten Commandments? No, that's not possible? Why would they have 17?" I didn't get it.

The joke is on me. I'm the doofus. They had to explain it to me.

 

[Buckalew11]

I don't read the bible. Most Catholics don't. The ones that do are usually converts (not always, but usually). The Catholic Church encourages us to read the bible, but doesn't make it mandatory. So, when Joy (I think it was Joy) posted her set of commandments from the bible and there were little numbers running along the side, I had no clue that they were line numbers from the bible.

I was sitting there thinking, "The Baptists have 17 Ten Commandments? No, that's not possible? Why would they have 17?" I didn't get it.

The joke is on me. I'm the doofus. They had to explain it to me.

Yup, but you're OUR doofus!

 

[MouseWorshipin]

Yup, but you're OUR doofus!

Aww, thanks!

 

[auntpolly]

I've never seen anyone bow or genuflect before Communion - we do it just after receiving Communion and also make the sign of the cross

Isn't that a relatively new thing? I remember the priests explaining to us about a year and a half ago that they wanted us to bow before taking communion from them on. I was under the impression that that came from the vatican, not from them.

That said no one is refusing anyone communion if they do it differently.

 

[MouseWorshipin]

Isn't that a relatively new thing? I remember the priests explaining to us about a year and a half ago that they wanted us to bow before taking communion from them on. I was under the impression that that came from the vatican, not from them.

That said no one is refusing anyone communion if they do it differently.

I made my First communion 29 years ago. (Oh, Lord, has it been that long?!) They taught us to keep our head down while the priest raised the host, then raise it for him to place it on our tongue.

The genuflecting I hadn't heard about and would like to discourage.

 

[auntpolly]

I don't read the bible. Most Catholics don't. .

Actually, that's one of the things I like about the church. The Bible is complicated, partly because of the mystery of the faith, partly because we don't know enough about the historical context, and partly because it, as we catholics believe, it has so much in there that is meant to guide us, rather than give us factual accounts of things. I always got so confused when I read the Bible -- I like having the help of the priests. It's just another thing to love about the mass -- I learn something new every week.

 

[auntpolly]

I made my First communion 29 years ago. (Oh, Lord, has it been that long?!) They taught us to keep our head down while the priest raised the host, then raise it for him to place it on our tongue.

There was something new though -- was it that you aren't supposed to make the sign of the cross any more? Or am I dreaming?

 

[AuntieM03]

Actually, that's one of the things I like about the church. The Bible is complicated, partly because of the mystery of the faith, partly because we don't know enough about the historical context, and partly because it, as we catholics believe, it has so much in there that is meant to guide us, rather than give us factual accounts of things. I always got so confused when I read the Bible -- I like having the help of the priests. It's just another thing to love about the mass -- I learn something new every week.

Just curious, is the Bible used in mass? When I did go to Catholic church as a child it was in latin. I never had any idea what was being said.

 

[MouseWorshipin]

There was something new though -- was it that you aren't supposed to make the sign of the cross any more? Or am I dreaming?

The sign of the cross wasn't required. Some folks like to do it, but you don't have to. Just like you don't have to do it before you sit down (or enter the pew), but some like to.

I've never done it. But I do kneel when you're supposed to! In the whole church, it is like 2 little old ladies and I are the only ones who kneel.

 

[auntpolly]

Just curious, is the Bible used in mass? When I did go to Catholic church as a child it was in latin. I never had any idea what was being said.

We have readings, and the priest talks about one or all of them in his sermon. Like I said, I converted when I was about 19, so I never did Latin masses. I like it this way, but I don't know anything different.

 

[auntpolly]

The sign of the cross wasn't required. Some folks like to do it, but you don't have to. Just like you don't have to do it before you sit down (or enter the pew), but some like to.

I've never done it. But I do kneel when you're supposed to! In the whole church, it is like 2 little old ladies and I are the only ones who kneel.

There are those things I missed by not growing up in the church! When I went to classes, we focused on the faith and beliefs, and they never really went through the mechanics! I just always tried to do what other people were doing, and that varied a little from parish to parish.

 

[MouseWorshipin]

Just curious, is the Bible used in mass? When I did go to Catholic church as a child it was in latin. I never had any idea what was being said.

Yes, there are readings from the bible, there always were.

And anytime the mass is said in Latin (including 60 years ago), there one side in Latin and the other side in English for those who don't know it.

It is difficult to find Latin masses in many parts of America today. But I like them and wish there'd be more.

 

[SpecialK]

That's where protestants differ. We don't believe that the tradition of the early church is inspired, but we do agree that scripture is inspired by God.


I'm with a few other posters on this thread, I believe Mary was a special woman to be chosen however I don't pray to her or ask her help. My only intercessor is Jesus.

I understand the Catholic church says they don't worship her (instead ask her to pray for them). However, the few times I've been in a Catholic church (most recently for a wedding), I saw people bowing in front of her statue? Can anyone tell me what that was for?

To answer your question...Where I grew up (south side of Chicago - very Irish-Catholic neighborhood)) it was a tradition for the bride to bring flowers to Mary and ask for Mary's intercession for the happiness of her marriage and future family. Some brides continue this tradition today. Sometimes the groom wil accompany the bride.