Sorry to bring up again, but does anyone feel like me? How do I get past this?

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by denisenh
I don't see anything noticeably "bad" so I am trying to find out what it is that you are saying is bad.

If you don't think that it's a vile place, then I would be wasting my time trying to "splain" it to you.

 

[denisenh]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Then obviously you're part of it.

<a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_6_102.gif' alt='Dismay' border=0></a>

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by denisenh
<a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_6_102.gif' alt='Dismay' border=0></a>

I see you caught my response before I edited it.

That's ok.

 

[LisaZoe]

Originally posted by Kendra17
You are crying foul over the tissue comment, yet give the suicide bomber comment a pass. It's sheer hypocrisy, I believe.

I didn't give it a pass but felt that there were many, many others who had already responded and saw no need to jump on the bandwagon.

Again, the person who started this thread did not make the suicide bomber comment. I was offering support of the OP not the one who did make the latter comment.

As for extremes in language, I did not read posts of any of the things to which you refer so cannot say much more than that I would agree such comparison of Bush to Hitler are extreme. I attempt to avoid the extremists on either side as they are either ridiculous or frightening. To even consider them representative of the majority of the DNC, though, doesn't seem reasonable.

To Elwood and others: Here are a few examples of extremists on the "other side". I certainly do not believe in any way that these represent the GOP or it's views nor even more than a very small minority of that party.

http://www.satansrapture.com/kerrysatan.htm
http://www.texemarrs.com/092004/hail_kerry_hail_satan.htm
http://www.thetrenchcoat.com/archives/2004/02/26/john-kerry-antichrist/
http://jesuspolitics.typepad.com/jesus_politics/2004/10/you_might_as_we.html

 

[oracle]

Originally posted by Kendra17
I would if I could. But, i really honestly cannot. I have never heard any republicans speak the way that the Democrats do.

That's quite a selective memory you've got. You've never heard of an extreme Republican? I think even your friends on the right would laugh at that one. Let's do a little refresher, shall we?

"The country might have been better off if the Confederacy had won the Civil War. Given how bad things have gotten in the old U.S.A., it’s not hard to believe that history might have taken a better turn…Race relations in the South were damaged not by slavery but by reconstruction and migration of blacks to the North."
-- Excerpts from an article written by conservative commentator William Lind, and distributed by California GOP Vice Chair Bill Back via email in 1999. The email has resurfaced as Back campaigns for GOP Chair.

“Knowing your propensity to avoid public appearances, as the job of black Republican window dressing requires, I would have been inclined to hire someone appropriately black.”
-- Randy Ridgel, member of the California GOP Board of Directors, in response to GOP Sec. Shannon Reeves’ concerns that the GOP treats him like window dressing.

“Look at who run all the convenience stores across the country.”
-- Republican Rep. Sue Myrick (NC) referring to Arab-Americans in talking about domestic security threats.

“One amendment today said we could not sell guns to anybody under drug treatment. So does that mean that if you go into a black community you can’t sell any guns to any black person?”
-- Rep. Barbara Cubin (R-WY), The Washington Post, “Debate on Gun Rights In House Turns Racial,” April 10, 2003; Page A03.

"Booker T. Washington, the great black ******, uh, the black, uh, educator, excuse me for making that, uh ..."
-- Former Texas Agriculture Commissioner Reagan Brown, April 29th, 1981, in a speech during his 1982 re-election bid, attempting to quote Washington's views on education.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by oracle
That's quite a selective memory you've got. You've never heard of an extreme Republican? I think even your friends on the right would laugh at that one. Let's do a little refresher, shall we?

"The country might have been better off if the Confederacy had won the Civil War. Given how bad things have gotten in the old U.S.A., it’s not hard to believe that history might have taken a better turn…Race relations in the South were damaged not by slavery but by reconstruction and migration of blacks to the North."
-- Excerpts from an article written by conservative commentator William Lind, and distributed by California GOP Vice Chair Bill Back via email in 1999. The email has resurfaced as Back campaigns for GOP Chair.

“Knowing your propensity to avoid public appearances, as the job of black Republican window dressing requires, I would have been inclined to hire someone appropriately black.”
-- Randy Ridgel, member of the California GOP Board of Directors, in response to GOP Sec. Shannon Reeves’ concerns that the GOP treats him like window dressing.

“Look at who run all the convenience stores across the country.”
-- Republican Rep. Sue Myrick (NC) referring to Arab-Americans in talking about domestic security threats.

“One amendment today said we could not sell guns to anybody under drug treatment. So does that mean that if you go into a black community you can’t sell any guns to any black person?”
-- Rep. Barbara Cubin (R-WY), The Washington Post, “Debate on Gun Rights In House Turns Racial,” April 10, 2003; Page A03.

"Booker T. Washington, the great black ******, uh, the black, uh, educator, excuse me for making that, uh ..."
-- Former Texas Agriculture Commissioner Reagan Brown, April 29th, 1981, in a speech during his 1982 re-election bid, attempting to quote Washington's views on education.

Are you serious about comparing that to the vile garbage that get spewed on dug?

Don't misunderstand but the above quotes are bad but not nearly as bad as DUG.

 

[oracle]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Are you serious about comparing that to the vile garbage that get spewed on dug?

Don't misunderstand but the above quotes are bad but not nearly as bad as DUG.

I haven't read DUG, nor do I intend to. Those are not official Democratic party statements, so what would be the point of comparison? I was just pointing out that it's ridiculous to suggest that the Republicans don't have their own share of extremists. They're on both sides, that's what I'm trying to say.

 

[dmadman43]

Originally posted by oracle
I haven't read DUG, nor do I intend to. Those are not official Democratic party statements, so what would be the point of comparison? I was just pointing out that it's ridiculous to suggest that the Republicans don't have their own share of extremists. They're on both sides, that's what I'm trying to say.

Examples, please? Of "official" Republican party representatives?

 

[dmadman43]

Originally posted by oracle
That's quite a selective memory you've got. You've never heard of an extreme Republican? I think even your friends on the right would laugh at that one. Let's do a little refresher, shall we?

"The country might have been better off if the Confederacy had won the Civil War. Given how bad things have gotten in the old U.S.A., it’s not hard to believe that history might have taken a better turn…Race relations in the South were damaged not by slavery but by reconstruction and migration of blacks to the North."
-- Excerpts from an article written by conservative commentator William Lind, and distributed by California GOP Vice Chair Bill Back via email in 1999. The email has resurfaced as Back campaigns for GOP Chair.

“Knowing your propensity to avoid public appearances, as the job of black Republican window dressing requires, I would have been inclined to hire someone appropriately black.”
-- Randy Ridgel, member of the California GOP Board of Directors, in response to GOP Sec. Shannon Reeves’ concerns that the GOP treats him like window dressing.

“Look at who run all the convenience stores across the country.”
-- Republican Rep. Sue Myrick (NC) referring to Arab-Americans in talking about domestic security threats.

“One amendment today said we could not sell guns to anybody under drug treatment. So does that mean that if you go into a black community you can’t sell any guns to any black person?”
-- Rep. Barbara Cubin (R-WY), The Washington Post, “Debate on Gun Rights In House Turns Racial,” April 10, 2003; Page A03.

"Booker T. Washington, the great black ******, uh, the black, uh, educator, excuse me for making that, uh ..."
-- Former Texas Agriculture Commissioner Reagan Brown, April 29th, 1981, in a speech during his 1982 re-election bid, attempting to quote Washington's views on education.

You mean Democrats speak this way, too? Because that what Kendra was asking for examples of.

Good to know.

 

[denisenh]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
I see you caught my response before I edited it.

That's ok.

I probably would have given the same response to the new post anyway. That's OK.

 

[oracle]

Originally posted by dmadman43
You mean Democrats speak this way, too? Because that what Kendra was asking for examples of.

What are you talking about? She said that Republicans didn't talk in extremes like the Democrats do, and I provided examples that they do. Maybe you should re-read the thread, and the quote I was responding to.

 

[Kendra17]

Originally posted by oracle
What are you talking about? She said that Republicans didn't talk in extremes like the Democrats do, and I provided examples that they do. Maybe you should re-read the thread, and the quote I was responding to.

Your examples are interesting, Oracle, kind of. But, it's not the same, in my opinion. These are stupid, off the cuff remarks. Some are inexcusable, definitely, but they do not have the cruel INTENT of comparing Bush to Hitler, Saddam, OBL, or other Nazis or Islamofascists.

It's obvious this point is just lost on most of you. Again, which is worse? The comparison to the suicide bombers earlier on this thread, or that little "get a tissue" comment?

I have heard of extreme Republicans. I don't think that's what i said. . .if I did, please let me amend that. I said that i don't hear the same angry rhetoric coming from Republicans. And, truth be told. . .some of those comments you just posted are awfully bad. Im assuming that most of those folks apologized for those remarks and/or were disparaged by other members of their party. Mainstream republicans are NOT racist and hate that those associated with our party may speak this way.

However, what about all these comparisons to the Administration with Nazis and islamofascists? These comparisons have happened right here on this board. And, that is considered OKAY by all of you when they've happened. This is considered mainstream by most of you. Posting pictures of Bush with a Hitler mustache and Nazi armband is considered acceptable by many of you. That is what I don't understand and will continue to be perplexed by.

So, let me just say that if you defend your postings and state they're equivalent to my examples, I disagree. I realize most of you equivocate with these things. I understand you don't see the difference between the statements you posted and the examples of agitprop I gave you. But, in my opinion, that's why your guy lost the election. That's why we gained seats in the House and Senate. That's really why all of you have to come back to the center.

 

[megan4777]

OK

 

[LisaZoe]

Originally posted by Kendra17
However, what about all these comparisons to the Administration with Nazis and islamofascists? These comparisons have happened right here on this board. And, that is considered OKAY by all of you when they've happened. This is considered mainstream by most of you. Posting pictures of Bush with a Hitler mustache and Nazi armband is considered acceptable by many of you. That is what I don't understand and will continue to be perplexed by.

How do you make the leap from some people posting these things on this board to all of us in support of Kerry condoning or agreeing with those posts? I certainly don't believe that you would condone the comments made in all posts from those on the Bush side so it would be nice if you would not make such big assumptions about what we condone. I doubt any of us have the time or interest in reading all posts on all threads yet you seem to hold us accountable for them. I know I did not see the picture to which you refer above. How can you then chastise me for not doing anything about them?

Using the terms "all", "most" and "many" in reference to those who post such pictures or applaud such posts is unfair to the majority of Democrats and others on this board who voted for Kerry. I don't believe that the "illegal voter" and "voter fraud" conspiracy theory threads accusing Democrats of such tactics represents the vast majority of Bush supporters on this board. Can you not do the same in return? (Note: I avoided the majority of posts directed against Kerry Supporters so probably missed many that were much worse than those I mentioned.)

 

[LisaZoe]

Originally posted by megan4777
BREATHE

Thanks, I need a reminder once in awhile. Luckily for my family and friends, I am not this verbose in person.

 

[tonyswife]

yikes! Is this thread still going on? I'm not realy a PD person, but...well, ok...I'm going to sprinkle some. I like all of the people here that have been going back and forth, I wish we could all take a deep breath and get back to discussing the issues without fighting and name calling. I sure wish that the OP could have had her thread for support from other Kerry voters without all this controversy.

Ok?

 

[megan4777]

take a breath......You have soooooooooooo many ahead of you....

 

[LisaZoe]

Originally posted by tonyswife
yikes! Is this thread still going on? I'm not realy a PD person, but...well, ok...I'm going to sprinkle some. I like all of the people here that have been going back and forth, I wish we could all take a deep breath and get back to discussing the issues without fighting and name calling. I sure wish that the OP could have had her thread for support from other Kerry voters without all this controversy.

Ok?

 

[Kendra17]

Originally posted by LisaZoe
How do you make the leap from some people posting these things on this board to all of us in support of Kerry condoning or agreeing with those posts? I certainly don't believe that you would condone the comments made in all posts from those on the Bush side so it would be nice if you would not make such big assumptions about what we condone. I doubt any of us have the time or interest in reading all posts on all threads yet you seem to hold us accountable for them. I know I did not see the picture to which you refer above. How can you then chastise me for not doing anything about them?

Using the terms "all", "most" and "many" in reference to those who post such pictures or applaud such posts is unfair to the majority of Democrats and others on this board who voted for Kerry. I don't believe that the "illegal voter" and "voter fraud" conspiracy theory threads accusing Democrats of such tactics represents the vast majority of Bush supporters on this board. Can you not do the same in return? (Note: I avoided the majority of posts directed against Kerry Supporters so probably missed many that were much worse than those I mentioned.)

You know, I am not accusing you specifically. However, in all those posts that were made during the campaign, not one Democrat came out against these pics and statements. Not only that, when confronted, not one Democrat seemed to even think it was wrong.

I still can't understand how you don't see the difference between this and the examples Oracle cited or that you are presently citing-- the voter fraud comments, for instance. Actually, there were real events that caused some to be concerned about voter fraud. In my opinion, the first issue is the angry rhetoric that many Democrats shared. That kind of anger leads people to do strange things. This, in addition to the reports regarding the census as compared to registered voters in Columbus (which wound up being the most important state, as it turned out), the news bits regarding a) some that were registered to vote in both Florida AND another state, b) the story about the woman trying to buy votes with cocaine, c) the unproven claims that so many would-be voters were disenfranchised, d) the fact that the United Nations had been requested (by the Democrats) to oversee our election and e) the fact that there was the whole idea that the Democrats were planning to take legal action if it looked like they might lose (note the many suits that were written and ready to be filed at a moment's notice). I'm sure there was more reason for concern, but that's what I can come up with right now.

Your examples are not examples of agitprop. Neither are Oracle's examples. There is a difference in comparing Bush to Nazis and Islamofascists and being worried of possible voter fraud in light of certain events. There is a difference between comparing the Administration members to Nazis and Islamofascists and the ugly comments that Oracle posted.

You recently took offense at a Republican poster's comment that was interpreted as racist. I, like you, questioned that poster and requested clarification. I have not seen ANY of you do the same when any one has posted anything as offensive as the comparisons I've mentioned.

Even now, the suicide bombing post was deemed insignificant and inconsequential by most, if not all, of you, while at least 10 of you decided to characterize the "get a tissue" poster so disparagingly.

If you can't recognize the difference here, alright. I guess I am not too surpirsed, just continually disappointed.

 

[bubie2.5]

Originally posted by babar
I really feel very upset about this election. I don't mean that it wasn't fair, but I honestly felt that Bush needed to go. I felt it very strongly!!

How do I get past this? How can I feel I'm being spoken for or represented in this country? This is one of the worst days I can remember.....

A lot of people feel like you Babar. But the majority made a choice and we have to accept it, not necessarily without feeling sad. I’ve found that when you have a government you don’t agree 100% with, it pushes you to work harder for what you believe in. There are a lot of ways you can feel better and maybe not so helpless, like volunteering in your community or helping a cause that matters to you. We may not feel good about the choice that was made on Tuesday, but maybe each one of us will make something good out of it, maybe it will inspired us to work harder for our country, a time for personal growth.