SARATOGA questions on location....

[bigkid@disney]

Hello everyone,

My DW and I are considering becoming DVC members. A couple of questions. We have 3 children, ages 7, 5, and 1 and will spend much time in Magic Kingdom for several years to come. The SSV seems a looooong way away from Magic Kingdom and most parks.

How long does it take to get to the different parks? Which resort seems best for children?

Any suggestions anyone would like to offer for someone considerign buying? I've also been trying to figure out the savings if I buy from someone else or directly from Disney?

Thanks in advance to anyone that has any advice or suggestions that I need to think about or consider in making my decisions.

I'm thinking about 200 points per year, or in that neighborhood.

Thanks,

Dennis

 

[COACHSTING]

We have been DVC members for a year now and believe it is a great investment. Our home villas are at the Beach Club, but we are seriously considering getting points at the SSR.

I am sure that there will be adequate busing from SSR to all of the parks. I would not let the location be the deciding factor.

As for the best resorts for kids, the younger kids obviously will enjoy the Magic Kingdom, but as they get older, they will enjoy all of the parks.

Part of the fun growing up with our kids was seeing how they developed different interests in what each park had to offer. Heck now, they are starting to like going to Downtown Disney.

Going to Disney is like taking a break from the daily rat race of the kids lives and our work requirements. We relax in Disney like no other place. It's where we get to escape from the real world and re-discover each other.

You will be happy in any resort. There is a poll somewhere on these boards that shows how people feel aboutn their investment in DVC. It's postive in nearly 98% of those polled.

I wish we invested 15 years ago.

I hope this helps.....

 

[bigkid@disney]

Thanks for the input..... I'm sure we will love all the resorts and they each have something special to offer.

You mentioned about getting extra points for SSR? What do you mean? As a club member you could stay at the SSR, or do you mean pay two memberships?

Just curious.

I can't believe how quickly questions keep popping into my head as I read these boards.

I don't want to miss out on the discount for SSR, but I don't want to rush and feel I made a bad choice either. I'm already an impulse buyer, so I want to make sure before my DW and I make the purchase.

Thanks again for your help.....

 

[Granny]

The SSV seems a looooong way away from Magic Kingdom and most parks.

How long does it take to get to the different parks? Which resort seems best for children?

You will get a lot of opinions on both topics raised here. And here's my two cents...

Location: I happen to think that the WDW transportation system is pretty efficient, as long as you aren't trying to squeeze every minute of park time out of the day, or running on a very tight schedule. Since we go every year, we've found that waiting 15 minutes or so for a bus is not that big of a deal. However, you can still drive to the parks and other WDW destinations and your DVC stay will allow you to park for no charge.


Best resort for children: Some will say that BCV is best because of the awesome pool they have, Stormalong Bay. And it is a wonderful pool. Others may argue for VWL because it's a short boat ride over to Magic Kingdom. And yet others will say that the roominess and quiet of OKW is a great place to escape the overstimulation atmosphere of the parks.

To me, you are in WDW so it's a kid-friendly destination whereever you stay. And Disney bends over backwards to make children feel welcome everywhere, IMHO.

If you are young enough, the 50 years of usage at SSR is a pretty enticing thing. Plus the point system there is very reasonable...lower than the rates at VWL, BCV and BWV Preferred Views. Lastly, you can still stay at those other places if you like...but during the peak DVC vacationing periods, you might find it hard to book in one of those places.

So you really can't go wrong with any choice. In general, I'd advise you to go with the theming and features that are most important to you.

 

[bobbiwoz]

Hi bigkid@disney (and aren't we all!)

We just bought into DVC, our deeds will be recorded sometime in Oct. When COACHSTING mentioned points at SSR, I assume that he's thinking of buying some points at SSR so he will have an additional home resort. You are able to make a reservation at your home resort (for up to the number of points that you have available at your home resort) at an 11 month window, and you have a 7 month window at all of the other DVC resorts.

Conventional wisdom says to "Buy where you most want to stay." If you really really want a home resort that is sold out, go to one of the resale websites, find what you want, make a bid, AND THEN if you get past the ROFR you will have your home where you most want to stay.

Disney has the right to buy any resale at the same conditions that an outside buyer agrees to give the owner. So, you may find the resale that you want, and Disney buys it from the seller and you are out of the loop. That happened to us when we bid on a property at VWL. Now that I've read these boards more, I realize that we should have bid more than the asking price, but even then, there is no guarantee that Disney wouldn't buy it. Anyway, we bought BWV from Disney, and then have added on 50 points at the VWL.

But I think the extra years at SSR could cause the prevailing wisdom to change. We're empty-nesters and buying SSR doesn't appeal to us, but staying there does. It may take a few years, and maybe we'll have to go on a weekend, and use those extra weekend points, but I think we'll be able to stay there, even though we don't own there.

Also, the waiting, waiting, waiting for Disney to decide on ROFR was hard for us. After we found out that Disney bought the property, we called our guide and bought from Disney that very day. We had first looked into DVC in 1996 and then put it on hold. When we realized that our chance to buy at Boardwalk was quickly disappearing, we didn't want to try another resale. And then the waitlist for the VWL only took 2 weeks, so now, we're set.

Good luck, however long it takes you to decide, take the time and ask questions, lots and lots of people are here to help. This is a great resource.

 

[RweTHEREyet]

You mentioned about getting extra points for SSR? What do you mean? As a club member you could stay at the SSR, or do you mean pay two memberships?

I get the impression that you might think if you buy at SSR that SSR is the only place you can stay. By being a DVC member you have the opportunity to stay at any DVC Resort. You can make reservations at your home resort 11-months in advance and at other resorts, like Beach Club and Old Key West 7 months advance.

 

[BriarRose59]

We made our first purchase as DVC members in August at SSR. One of the reasons I was attracted to this resort was the central location to not only Disney parks but Universal as well. My girls are 12 and 16 and enjoy all the amusement parks in Orlando as well as DTD. I love the Victorian theme and I think this will be a good resort for us. The 50 year contract was also attractive because (even though I will be 94 at its end) my girls will very likely be grandparents by then and will be able to use the points to take their children and grandchildren on wonderful vacations a whole lot cheaper than if they were paying cash. I am looking at this as a lifetime investment, not as a short term one. Those extra years were important to me because I am not just looking at the time I can spend there, but the time my descendants will spend there as well.

Good luck on your decision.

 

[Dean]

No one size fits all. You must assimilate the information and decide what's best for you and your family. Decide where you want to go most of the time, whether you will usually travel off season and what type of accomodations you will need. As noted, you can buy any DVC resort and travel to where you want to go most of the time. The advantage to owning a specific resort is that you can reserve at 11 months out while you will only be able to reserve at 7 months out for all other DVC resorts.

In your situation VWL might be the best for you as it's close to MK and a very nice resort. The points per stay are higher than SSR (but overall thesame for BWV and BCV though a few of the units at BWV are less points.) but that's true whether you own SSR and stay at VWL or own there. Now in a few years, you may likely tire of MK as the children get older and then Epcot may become a better choice. Getting from VWL to other parks outside MK is a little inconvenient at times. Other factors include whether you will have a car and if you will be willing to use it. It also depends on when you usually travel.

OKW will be the cheapest onsite in terms of both cost and number of points needed. If you think you may want to get a 3 BR at times for family issues, you may want to consider OKW. If you will have a car and don't mind using it, it's also a great option. It's also the only resort at WDW where the studios have 2 Queens and all the 2 BR have 2 queens in the second. As the children get older, this may be an issue, especially if they are different gender. It's true that some of the 2 BR at VWL and BCV have 2 queens in the second for the DEDICATED 2 BR units, it's not something you can count on.

I would strongly discourage buying offsite (VB and HH) with the purpose of staying at WDW routinely even though the points may be a little cheaper on the front end. They are both great resorts though and if you think you may stay at either routinely, it's definitely worth considering.

I'd buy where you want to stay if you can figure that out. If not go and visit either for cash or by renting points then decide. If you will travel during Easter, early Dec or Xmas, the choice of home resorts is far more critical.

 

[bigkid@disney]

I truly can't thank everyone enough for the information and insight.

I love these boards and have for a few years now.

I'm probably leaning toward the SSR, but still searching for as much information as I can get.

I understand about the 7 and 11 months and from what I'm seen of SSR and read about it, I'm sure I would never have a problem staying there if everything else was booked up. My wife and I are pretty easy to please and love Disney and like any resort that is clean and kept up. I figure the SSR should be pretty clean and kept up for being new. Actually, this time we are staying at the new Pop Century resort in January, of course, my wife is trying to figure out if we get our money worth's with DVC if we would just stay at the value resorts every time we vacation. I prefer other resorts to the value resorts, just my opinion.

Our travel habits for now are traveling in the off season, for example, we are going the 3rd week of January in 2004, but will be doing some summer travel over the next few years, but will avoid the highest crowds all the time.

I'm looking at this as an investment, for myself and my family. My wife and I are both 35 and hope for many years of family vacations with children and grandchildren.

A few more questions:

I'm considering 200 points as my buy-in because I think this will support our vacation habits and allow us a one bedroom, which should work until our children get older. Some people have mentioned getting $10 per point off, is that the same offer in the material I received that says "up to a $1500 credit or more" if I buy before October 31st?

Will the dues stay the same every year or can I expect them to change? I thought they never change, but wanted to ask for sure.

What happens at the end of the 50 years?

Thought about going with the option of 10 years financing, like another post stated. Lower payments but can pay off early with no penalties. I've never had a loan for the length it stated, I like to pay extra every month.

How long can I bank my points? I thought I could only bank them for one year, for example, in 2004 I can bank them until 2005, go in 2005 and use the 2004 points, the 2005 points and if I wanted, borrow the 2006 points. Do I have this right? It does sound like if I go with SSR and purchase before October 31st to get the better deal, I should select December as my "renewal month" or "year date" to get an extra year? Sound right?

Last question for now.....

How are some people getting no payments until May of next year? Is that just common for the way this works or is it a special deal for SSR right now to keep selling more?

I've only talked to my Vacation Club Guide (Robin) once to request the info. Figure I'm getting great information here...

Thanks,

Dennis

 

[Happy Birthday Cat]

Some people have mentioned getting $10 per point off, is that the same offer in the material I received that says "up to a $1500 credit or more" if I buy before October 31st?

Yes that is the same. The $1,500.00 comes from $10.00 per point for the minimum 150 points.

Will the dues stay the same every year

No. Dues will change. They generally go up about what the cost of living is. Most have gone up 4% or so a year. Some have actually had decreases at times.

Will the dues stay the same every year

You will be 85 years old and have had 50 years of memories. Who really knows though. There has been much speculation about this but that's all it really is.

I thought I could only bank them for one year, for example, in 2004 I can bank them until 2005, go in 2005 and use the 2004 points, the 2005 points and if I wanted, borrow the 2006 points. Do I have this right?

You have it right.

I don't know the answer to your last question but that is the date that SSR is opening. I'm guessing that it's part of the incentive that you don't have to pay until it does so but I really don't know if that's accurate.

I do know that if you compare the costs at value resorts to DVC and only plan on going once a year, the value price will win. You really can't compare apples and lemons in this case.

Good luck with your decision.

HBC

 

[tjkraz]

Originally posted by Happy Birthday Cat
No. Dues will change. They generally go up about what the cost of living is. Most have gone up 4% or so a year. Some have actually had decreases at times.

I'll just add that resort dues are entirely based upon the operating costs of the resort. By law, DVC cannot pad their expenses and increase dues by any figure that they choose. The CAN do whatever is reasonable to insure the proper upkeep of the resort, including room renovations as necessary. But, remember Disney has a reputation at stake with regard to DVC. It wouldn't to them much good to start displaying bad faith toward members.

I looked at this historical dues at OKW, the oldest resort, and I believe the average increases were only 2-3% per year. There was a bit of a hit after 9/11 due to insurance increases, but as "Cat" said, dues have actually gone down in the past.

 

[DrTomorrow]

Originally posted by bigkid@disney
How are some people getting no payments until May of next year? Is that just common for the way this works or is it a special deal for SSR right now to keep selling more?
Dennis

We just became owners at SSR a few weeks ago and financed through Disney for 10 years. We had to make a down payment (or deposit) now, but since the place won't open until May 2004, our monthly payments don't start until then.

Keep asking those questions: I was asking them a month ago, and now I'm answering them!

Best of luck!

 

[bigkid@disney]

I can't get enough of the discussions or should I say answers....

Thanks to everyone.... I'm currently leaning towards SSA, but admit, I'm sure we will try several resorts after we purchase. We live in the St. Louis area, so it's not like we can drive down for a couple of days and back home again, but I'm really liking the idea of owning and making this a life long investment.... well, most of my life anyway...

Does anyone know about how far of a walk it is to DTD? Also, it has been years, really long years, since I've been to DTD, but does it have boat access to anywhere? Is there any boat rental or water sports there?

Thanks again to everyone.....

Your all the best!

 

[CK1]

Hey Bigkid... looks like we have kids roughly the same ages (we have a 8,7,and 3). We've enjoyed every resort we have visited. We have never had a problem switching over to our resort of choice (I always book at our home -- BWV -- at 11 mos mark, then switch at 7 mos!) We invariably get a 2br (those family of 5 dynamics just lend themselves to a 2 br... we always bring a few family members along to join the fun!) We have 205 pts. I can totally see us adding about 45 more to make it 250. We found that with our travel distance, we would rather take one long trip every 2 years than more frequent small ones. (WDW is about a 15-16 hr drive for us, and due to crummy logistics, a 5 to 9 hr flight with no less than 1 to 3 changeovers -- ugh! So we drive!) Plus, we like to reallllly unwind, to soak up all that the resorts and area have to offer, and it takes us a good 12 days to do that! And even THEN... we still leave wanting more...

In our case, all that was offered was BWV when we joined, and naive souls that we were, we knew NOTHING about a resale. Had we known, we *might* have gotten an OKW resale... hard to say. If we were buying for the first time today, what would I do? Hmmmm.... again, we might check out resale. We might put in an offer on 250 pts at VWL (although DH would probably fight me for BCV...). But in the end, I think we would look at that extra 12 yrs, and the presale offer, and transaction ease (no ROFR worries), and the WDW financing... and it would just be too easy to go DVC through Disney and buy at SSR. Unless you're intrinsically opposed to the SSR themeing, or you want optimal leverage for say, a GV at OKW, I can't see how you'll go wrong with SSR. And I don't think basing a choice on dues is a sure thing either -- can't always predict which resort will rise/faal/maintain its dues rate. (Sure wish BWV rates would fall, though!) Just do yourselves a favor and really look hard at how many pts you want... check not just your needs now but your needs 10 yrs down the road. When kids are in school and sports, it sure changes your schedule, and your pts needs. We used to go in January... now with school, baseball, and soccer about the only free time we have is August! Big diff in pts. Renting a 2br (versus a 1br or studio) sure changes things too. We had 2 small boys when we joined, but then added a dd, so as they grow up the gender diffs will make sleeping arrangements more complicated. I wish we had just bought 250 when we joined -- but by our calculations, 175 was just right. We added 30 pts this spring, and *should* have added 50 or 75 instead, but economy and company stock being what it is / was, and school tuitions and college funds needing to be paid... we were chicken, I admit it! Hindsight is 20/20, but we goofed by not originally thinking of school issues, size of room, and that a long vacation (that includes wkends) would be more preferable, all at the very beginning when were financing. (We financed our main contract, but paid it off this yr, so all our DVC -- except dues -- is paid for!) Of course, had we bought 250 then, we probably would now be saying we WISH we had bought 300! Points are addictive... just read these boards and you'll see!

As for comparing a value resort to DVC -- DON'T. A friend of mine with 3 kids (dds aged 8,7,and 2) just returned from a week-long stay in a moderate. She had previously stayed in only deluxe. She noted to me that NEVER AGAIN would they do that...and there were no specific problems with the room, and yes, it was geared for 5 (had the daybed option). Her description of her 2 yr old bouncing like tigger on all their heads makes me laugh now, but for her, I can clearly see it was just NOT a vacation in the room! She hadn't realized how cramped the room would feel at night, with all 5 in there. I can't even imagine what her thoughts would have been had she ever stayed in a DVC villa. Night and day. Also consider what you gain in a dvc villa that a simple room can't offer... kitchen and laundry facilities alone save a family major bucks and hassle. It's one thing to all eat cereal in the room, huddled on the bed or at a tiny table in the corner, using the milk you kept on ice in a cooler or rental fridge. It's another to have the kids eating cereal (or pancakes and bacon, even!) at a nice big table, you're on the couch comfortably sipping coffee and watching the morning weather on TV, and DH is peacefully sleeping late in the king bed in the other room. Now THAT's a vacation! And with the washer/dryer in the 1 and 2 br villas -- it sure saves packing space, especially with kids who are known for (a) being creatures of habit, sometimes wanting to wear the same outfits again and again and (b) are able to soil that outfit within the first 5 minutes of wearing it! I can throw clothes in at night, and have them ready in the am... can't get that in a value resort.

Sorry to be so long-winded. Good luck with your decision and can't wait to wish you a welcome home!

Cindy

 

[DrTomorrow]

Hey Cindy; so, do you like the DVC or not?

Bigkid, I'll let you know about the walking distance between SSR and DTD after we get back - that's on our list for this trip! It doesn't look that far, and there will be (already is?) a walkway in place. One key factor will be which set of buildings you end up in. The first set of four will be the closest to DTD; the ones yet to be started seem to be a good deal farther away. Not miles or anything, but perhaps a doubling of walking time.

Update: I just took a look at that hi-res picture of WDW that someone posted recently, and it looks like the walking distance from the first quiet pool (smack dab in the middle of the first four units) to the DTD bus lot is the same as the distance from one end of the Polynesian Resort to the other; and I've read that that's about a 10-12 minute walk. Of course, YMMV (ha ha, get it? Mileage, walking.... Tough room).

 

[bigkid@disney]

Thanks CK1,

and never worry about being long winded. It doesn't take much to get me going also.

I agree with the crowded space at Disney with 3 kids. We are going in a few months and going to try out the Pop Century. This trip is a little different, my parents and my wife's parents are going along also. So that's 3 rooms for 6 adults and 3 grandkids. Who know's night to night where the little one's will sleep. My wife and I have talked about the future, only two or three years away a "normal" room just won't do. Our kids will be 10, 8 and 4 'ish and I want to relax on vacation!!!!

I understand what you mean about schedules and going during some summer months. I'm trying to take advantage of this trip and going in what is considered the slow period for Disney, because my wife hates to take the kids out of school and as they get older, will be tougher.

I do need to play with the points a bit more and figure one longer vacation every 2 years, or the odd year maybe a short quick trip when air fares allow. I'm confident we will enjoy every resort we stay in, my kids enjoy the local Holiday Inn with the pool on New Year's Eve. Of course, as they get older, it might take a bit more to impress them!

When you go for 12 days, do you stay in the same resort or mix it up a bit?
If we go with 200 points and I find a want to stay a few extra days, how do I buy points for just that stay or do I just pay cash for the extra nights? I understand I can borrow and save points from previous year and will probably make my vacation "fit" the number of points I have coming.

DrTomorrow,
Thanks for checking. I just haven't seen a good map that has Downtown Disney along with SSA listed. I can see maps of one or the other, but haven't seen a good one yet showing both to get an idea of the distance.

Thanks again to everyone for the input and answering the questions.... I know the special runs out at the end of October, so I'm trying to learn as much as possible.

 

[Dean]

You can rent points from another member but there's no mechanism within the system to rent extra points from DVC. You can try for a cash rental through DVC but it's not usually available. but if it is, you can sometimes get a 25% discount. You can rent cash directly from WDW's CRO but no guarantee you'll be in the same room so you might have to change rooms. In general, banking and borrowing is the easiest and best. Many do pay cash for weekends as the points are higher then and represent a bigger points savings when using cash. Good luck.

 

[CK1]

Originally posted by bigkid@disney

I do need to play with the points a bit more and figure one longer vacation every 2 years, or the odd year maybe a short quick trip when air fares allow. I'm confident we will enjoy every resort we stay in, my kids enjoy the local Holiday Inn with the pool on New Year's Eve. Of course, as they get older, it might take a bit more to impress them!

When you go for 12 days, do you stay in the same resort or mix it up a bit?
If we go with 200 points and I find a want to stay a few extra days, how do I buy points for just that stay or do I just pay cash for the extra nights? I understand I can borrow and save points from previous year and will probably make my vacation "fit" the number of points I have coming.

I used an EXCEL spreadsheet to basically figure out our pts needs over the next several years to come. If I can swing just a few more pts (like I said before, about 45 to make an even 250), we should have enough for my dream set up: 12 days at WDW every other yr, and 5 days at HHI for Turkey Week on the "off" year. Of course, I also know that further down the road, the kids will want to try the "other" park (Universal), and when that happens, we will probably stay on a wkend at the end of Orlando, then shift down to DVC for the remainder. That will mean fewer DVC pts for the same vacation time... (ohhh, that means an extra day at HHI the next year!! )

We always bring family with us (for one thing, they LOVE to come, for another, our kids just enjoy it that much more! ) We always get a 2br, it seems, as a result. For our trip next summer, we are mixing things up a bit! Our guests have offered to pay for the weekend to start things off and we actually got a 1br and studio at BCV at 10.5 mos out for the DVC discount! (We're hoping a 2 br will become available,though -- it would be slightly cheaper and secures our chances of being together, rather than possibly floors apart.) Then, after 2 days of soaking up SAB, we're moving over to BWV for 8 nts in a std view 2br. THen, our guests are leaving and dh and our trio are headed either back to BCV, over to SSR, or possibly staying put at BWV for 3 more nights. I have the ressie at BWV -- I'll try to switch it at the 7 mos window for BCV, then when SSR opens up on Feb 4, I'll see if I can get us anything there... ) Gotta love all those options!

We bank our pts over into the next yr and then we have 2 years worth. (We started this the year I was pg with our 3rd child). When you find you're borrowing too much... that's when you either have to travel at less pts-costly times, cut back on the # of days, or add-on, my friend! We did the add-on this spring for that very reason -- I looked at my spreadsheet and soon learned that at our current pts spending rate, and for what we enjoyed, we weren't going to be able to continue without having to -- gasp -- skip a year! We conserve as best we can -- we usually start our vacation on a Sunday and then carry it over into the next week, allowing us to get up to 12 nights with only one weekend of "high" points use. We've never done the resort-switching thing before -- this will be a whole new experience for us in August next year! One nice thing about the summer... the water parks are soooooo nice! Our kids just love those now. Going for 12 days allows you to see a little of everything with LOTS of R&R inbetween (very very important when traveling with kids!) We do a park one day, then have a "do nuthin day" around the resort, pool, DTD... WOnderful!

 

[pumpkinboy]

Originally posted by bigkid@disney
How are some people getting no payments until May of next year? Is that just common for the way this works or is it a special deal for SSR right now to keep selling more?

As a Disney Visa credit card holder, you can put your downpayment on the Card, and get 0% interest for 6 months (we did!), and do the same with prepayments on the loan! One caveat here is that any payments you make on the Card during that time are applied to the 0% portion and not regular purchases (which is cheesy IMHO), so start with an empty card when you do this. In addition to the 0%, you earn a Disney $ for every $100 charged on the card, so we got $40 Disney bucks for our $4000 downpayment. Once we empty the Card again, we are going to do a big prepayment on our 10 yr loan, get more Disney $s, and so on every 6 months. But start with an empty card.

just a thought

As for the # of points you should buy, our guide was very helpful, and talked us down (!!!) from our initial estimate. She built up a lot of credibility with us in the transaction by being very frank and helpful. No pressure at all thru the entire process.

 

[Jillpie]

Cindy, I can't believe how perfectly you described our situation (5 people in a moderate room trying to have breakfast at a small table).
We have done this the past 4 trips. Now, mind you, we have loved every minute of it because we love POR, but I never really looked at it quite how you described it, but it is so true. But it is all we have known, so we never complained about it.
However, the way you described the villas is just what I am looking forward to....space and more of it. We are going on our very first DVC trip in January and I cannot wait to see how big these villas are compared to our small space that we had at POR. I will probably pass out! Anyway, perfect description of how we had our breakfast every day!!