Rumor of future discounts

[nrpofp]

There is no such thing as "should be able to go and stay Deluxe" --- There is no such entitlement.
Many of my friends and colleagues are doctors, and most people I know are in that income bracket. They don't stay at value resorts, but they also aren't going to pay rack rate for a Grand Floridian club room.

The only people who "should be able to go Deluxe" --- are those that can afford it. If the people that can afford it, don't want it.... Then Disney does have to lower the price.

But if Disney can get the maximum rate, then there is no reason for them to make it more affordable. There is no grand rule that says Disney has to make all their rooms affordable for the upper middle class.

Disney does seek to make Disney affordable for most people, to maximize potential guests. And to maximize their revenues, they offer price discrimination -- They offer some products that are affordable even for the lower middle class, and they offer some products that are only affordable for the wealthy.. and everything in between.

There seems to be an attitude in this thread that middle class... or upper middle class should be entitled to an affordable deluxe hotel. Disney has every right to try to extract the maximum $$$ out of their bookings.

I fe
I feel people making over 150,000 a year should be able to afford a deluxe resort .I fthey can't then the resorts are overpriced. Just my opinion

 

[wdwfan]

I've moved on from the comment about teachers. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and they're free to express it.

 

[saskdw]

I fe
I feel people making over 150,000 a year should be able to afford a deluxe resort .I fthey can't then the resorts are overpriced. Just my opinion

There are resorts in the world you wouldn't be able to afford on a $150k income, but the Disney Deluxe resorts aren't even close to being at that level. Thats why they are overpriced.

 

[Princess Disney Mom]

I love Disney however their resort are overpriced and outrageous in some cases. Without a discount my large extended family will stay elsewhere. I've stayed onside many times but the price needs to be reasonable. I've stayed off site and had terrific stays also. The parks are going up so we are going less. They can stop the discounts and I will stop going. If they don't care that is fine.

 

[nrpofp]

There are resorts in the world you wouldn't be able to afford on a $150k income, but the Disney Deluxe resorts aren't even close to being at that level. Thats why they are overpriced.

Exactly. Iwould not expect to be able to afford any resort. Disney is afamily destination. If you are in the top 5-10% income bracket. You should be able to afford at least a standard room at a deluxe resort. You should not have to stay in a tiny value or moderate to be able to go. I know many people making 6 figures that would not pay 500+ a night to go to disney and would not be happy staying value. I now at least 5 people that have gone once, and did not feel it was worth the money, and won't return.

 

[LaurieN]

Wow - I am a teacher in a wealthy Michigan suburb, at the top of the pay scale with a BS, masters, and ed specialist degrees and I make no where near that much. I think that number is a little inflated. Maybe adminstration but not a normal teacher that does not coach or do "extra" money stipends.

I am not saying that teaching does not provide a good middle class income - it does. But it is not a six figure job. Adminstration YES - teaching NO.

Here in NJ there are A LOT of teachers making six figures, a few of my friends teach and are at that point. Part of the reason NJ has such high taxes, but that is a discussion for another time and place.

I am not sure if this is accurate. My husband falls in this salary range (on Long Island, not a teacher) and we could never afford GF ever and forget club level. We stay at the POP sometimes a mod if we can swing it but never a deluxe. Way out of our range. I admit we are free dining brats. We go in early Dec. and are not sure if we can afford to go to WDW without FD this year. We are waiting.

My husband also falls in tht salary range and we could NEVER afford the GF CL. Even if we could I wouldn't stay there: 1. the price is insane and 2. I don't care for it, I'm more of a Beach Club girl

That being said, we are taking our 3rd on-site trip this Nov. (before kids we stayed off-site), we are staying Deluxe and so far we are paying "rack rate" which we did budget for. I would much rather save a boat load of $$$$ and stay off-site but this is a special trip for us and I think it will be the last one for awhile. DH feels it's time to give WDW a "rest" and go on other vacations. Do I think we will visit WDW again: YES! Do I think we will stay on-site: not too sure
Just my two cents,
Laurie

 

[Amy&Dan]

Exactly. Iwould not expect to be able to afford any resort. Disney is afamily destination. If you are in the top 5-10% income bracket. You should be able to afford at least a standard room at a deluxe resort. You should not have to stay in a tiny value or moderate to be able to go. I know many people making 6 figures that would not pay 500+ a night to go to disney and would not be happy staying value. I now at least 5 people that have gone once, and did not feel it was worth the money, and won't return.

That right there says it all. We can talk about what teachers make, who occupies the premium rooms and all sorts of other things.

But generally the simplest answer is the right one. On average a family in the top 5-10% income earnings should be able to afford a deluxe or at the very least a moderate.

Disney trips aren't just about hotels. They are extremely expensive so somewhere in that whole enchilada of a Disney trip there needs to be a discount off something. Because at full price with the current rack rates and the curren ticket prices and worst of all the current meal prices, not very many people will be able or willing to pay. Period.

 

[nemofans]

A friend of my DH's is a guidance counselor (used to teach spec ed) at a suburban high school & he makes $120,000. He is 38 yrs old. The high school teachers make alot more than elementary here & I know b/c I taught elementary level. I taught in an elementary school where starting pay w/a Bachelor's was $33,000 & make $40,000 w/in the 1st 3 yrs. Superintendents make from $250,000-400,000. So, no I am not exaggerating, but no not all teachers make that pay either. Teachers' salary are public record & you can look it up online.

Here is an article from The Chicago Tribune about teacher salaries:
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...0100714_1_school-teachers-salaries-six-figure

Check this website out for IL superintendents salary: http://www.illinoisloop.org/salary.html

I don't mean to go off subject, but wanted to show proof that YES in IL, there are teachers making ALOT of money, not just administrators. In this area, teachers make close to what drs make & administrators make more than drs.

 

[havoc315]

I fe
I feel people making over 150,000 a year should be able to afford a deluxe resort .I fthey can't then the resorts are overpriced. Just my opinion

They are only overpriced if Disney can't book them.

It's known that there is a guest room at Cinderella's Castle. It's used for VIPs, promotions, etc. But if Disney were to open it up for regular bookings, I could easily imagine them getting $10,000 per night for it. Certainly, more than can be afforded on a 150k income. Does that make it over-priced?

Disney doesn't have any moral imperative to make any particular room affordable for any particular customer.

They have an obligation to their stockholders to maximize their profits. So if they can get a trillion dollars per night from their hotel rooms, then they should!

If they can't get bookings at that price, then they lower the price.

 

[Soupy5]

To begin, I'm sorry, but I might be little passionate about Disney discounts
Most travelers to Disney do not expect discounts, they hope for them because they need them.

To me, the discounts that Disney offers offset the sky high cost of going to Disney World. Its like using a discount card at the grocery store. Prices are already considerably inflated, the card simply puts cost back down to a reasonable level of affordability. Or in retail stores, where sale prices are offered on extensively marked-up products to bring the price closer to suggested retail. In other words, it just decreases the highest mark-up, but the grocer/store still makes money because there isn't really a loss realized because large amounts of money are still being generated on other products being sold and they haven't gone below cost on said product in most cases. Furthermore, in the case of Disney, any lost revenue is surely regained during peak season. The point is, they are still making money folks and are far from going broke on discounts! It's crazy to say that discounts aren't warranted or should be discontinued. Disney can obviously afford to offer the discount. I think we all know the amount of people that flock here in a day and times that by a year and there is definitely major revenue potential. Its not like they're losing money by making occasional offers to decrease their mark-up in certain areas. And let's not forget, you can only use one discount at a time when Disney wants you to use it which is usually during times when they would typically lose money due to decreased patronage anyway. Hello! Every business offers discounts to increase patronage. It works! The discounts that Disney offers are the only way we can rationalize staying on property because there are far cheaper options. I have to strongly express that I feel costs at Disney are astronomical for the average family in the wake of the present day economy and high prices make it hard for such families to return periodically without certain attractive discounts. So far, free dining benefits our family the most, as well as, traveling during fall months. The amount of money we save on dining for a family of five and EMHs are our incentives for staying on property. But hey, I guess we can live without discounts, if Disney lowers their prices, or, I guess, Disney can live without average income patrons vacationing with them periodically. In my opinion, there will be less families taking vacations on property (I know we would be one of those families that would have to reconsider our vacation options) and less families traveling to Disney at all without discounts or better pricing options because in the grand scheme of things affodability and cost do matter to the average joe who has to pay bills and care for their children. This being said, just because you have these reponsibilities doesn't mean you should have to forgo vacationing to conserve and you shouldn't have to max out on credit cards or mortgage the house to do it. There should be realistically affordable options for these people at Disney and discounts are a big help for families that want to go to Disney that may not have a large amount of spending dough for vacationing. The payment options Disney offers also help families a great deal too. I love this option. That was an awesome idea Disney! Value resorts are great too, but just a note: value resorts don't help much if your family consists of more than four.

Bottom line: I love Disney! My family and I make the annual trek when free dining is offered. Sadly though, if they take away the discounts, they'll have to lower prices to keep us coming back.

 

[havoc315]

But generally the simplest answer is the right one. On average a family in the top 5-10% income earnings should be able to afford a deluxe or at the very least a moderate.

Many of the Deluxe rooms are still quite affordable by those standards.
What's the off-season rack rate at the Wilderness Lodge? I think it's about $265.... Not cheap, but certainly affordable to someone in the top 5-10% of earners.

As I said... Disney is smart to provide alternatives for just about every budget.

Where it gets super expensive, are the real premium rooms... like club level at the Grand Floridian.... especially during peak periods... which starts at over $1,000 per night.

Now, how many such rooms are there? Not that many. In fact, the 3 monorail deluxe resorts only have less than 3,000 rooms combined. Out of those, how many are deluxe level?

If Disney wants to price those small number of rooms for only the top 1% of earners... They can go ahead and try. And supply and demand, might back them up. Certainly, during the recession, supply and demand did not back them up, so they offered steep discounts.
But if they think supply/demand will support it now... They have every right--- even obligation to their stockholders--- to try.

 

[saskdw]

They are only overpriced if Disney can't book them.

It's known that there is a guest room at Cinderella's Castle. It's used for VIPs, promotions, etc. But if Disney were to open it up for regular bookings, I could easily imagine them getting $10,000 per night for it. Certainly, more than can be afforded on a 150k income. Does that make it over-priced?

Disney doesn't have any moral imperative to make any particular room affordable for any particular customer.

They have an obligation to their stockholders to maximize their profits. So if they can get a trillion dollars per night from their hotel rooms, then they should!

If they can't get bookings at that price, then they lower the price.

Overpriced is probably the wrong word. Priced way above the market compared to other similar resorts. I've agreed with you all along that if Disney can fill the rooms than that's smart business. I just don't think they can fill the Deluxe and Mod resorts at the current rack rate.

 

[tlenzendorf]

It's all about business. If they feel they need more money from resort stays they are free to not offer discounts. Just like if I feel I am not getting a good value for my money it's my right to stay offsite or, shockingly, do something else! One way or another they will get my money, a set amount, when I go. Personally if I don't get a good enough discount then it affects how much I will spend on dining or souvenirs. My budget is my budget and I won't go over. They can be happy they got it in the resorts budget, but it won't be as much in the park or food budget. If rack rate is too high and there are no discounts, I'll be flying SW so I can stay offsite or change my flights and go someplace totally different.

I understand this upsets a lot of people because of what Disney means to us, but there are other places to go. I for one am looking at the cut back of discounts as a good thing. It cuts the strong pull Disney has on me and will expand my horizons taking my kids to see other places in the country. There is Disneyland, after all. Seriously, though, we are going on our 3rd trip to WDW in 3 years and I still want to take my kids to different coastal areas, the grand canyon, New York, Washington DC, Niagara Falls... the list goes on and on and my oldest DD is getting closer and closer to leaving the nest and maybe not being able to do family vacation with us since we can only do 1 family vacation per year.

 

[havoc315]

Overpriced is probably the wrong word. Priced way above the market compared to other similar resorts. I've agreed with you all along that if Disney can fill the rooms than that's smart business. I just don't think they can fill the Deluxe and Mod resorts at the current rack rate.

Who knows whether they can fill the rooms or not. Guess we'll find out during the next few corporate earnings releases.

Further, it's hard to compare the rooms to other resorts. Afterall.... there are far more beach front villas, then there are Magic Kingdom view villas. On-site Universal Hotels are expensive -- but much cheaper than Disney. But-- they also don't have the draw of Disney.

It's like comparing the price of an apartment in Manhattan, with an apartment in Des Moines. You just can't compare.

Location, location, location.

 

[wdwfan]

I just don't think they can fill the Deluxe and Mod resorts at the current rack rate.

I totally agree here. Disney can try, try, try, to fill the deluxe resort rooms, but the reality of the situation is that in this current economy, it is not happening. The economy is still sluggish, and will most likely still be that way come 2012. Regardless of your income bracket, inflation and the cost of living effects all of us.

 

[skier_pete]

Part of the inflation of Disney hotel prices is captured in that original post. Disney is an international resort, and in the last 5 years the US dollar has fallen considerably against much of the world's currency. So while $200-$400 a night for a hotel seems very expensive to most americans, if you live in Europe, or Japan, or Australia, or even Canada. it actually probably seems very reasonable, or at least MORE reasonable than it does to us. We actually used to vacation in Canada quite frequently, but the dollar situation has almost stopped us completely.

If Disney can sell more rooms internationally at these prices...then they have less incentive to keep it reasonable for us Americans.

The best thing that could happen to WDW fans would be an important in the US dollar versus the world economy. Visitors from other countries would start seeing how expensive a Disney stay is as well, and would come less (or stay shorter) and this would drive more discounts.

 

[sharadoc]

In the last management shuffle, didn't they appoint a "finance" guy to head up the theme parks division? I think that's where all this is coming from. They used to give us a great experience, now they're looking at the bottom line of everything - running "scenarios", breaking down cost to individual components, etc.

I think the worst thing they did was to create all of these "seasons". We used to pay the same cost for a room every day of the year. Then they started breaking it out into seasons. The 2012 season schedule is ridiculous - plus they added weekday and weekends rates within those seasons. So, a $300 goes up to $600 on a holiday peak season!!! Ridiculous.

I DID send an e-mail to Disney and I broke out the dollars spent. We cancelled our November trip, didn't renew our AP, etc. etc. We don't do Free Dining, we pay for our food so here's what you missed from our cancelling our trip.

My major complaint is the lack of reward for us repeat customers. Bouncebacks should not have blackouts, and AP holders should not need a PIN code to book at a discount, which they did this past year for the first time.

I am most annoyed by people who tell me that discounts are not guaranteed! I'm not stupid and I know that. My frustration is the random discounts, pin codes and blackouts. I'm just asking for access to the discounts based on my repeat business. Not making me wait in line until everyone else has gotten a discount, then I'll get the dregs that are left.

My note to Disney just illustrated the result of their policies. I wasn't whining so I'll ask in advance that people don't give me a hard time about it. Thanks!

 

[Colleen27]

I think the overwhelming feeling regarding discounts for all levels of Disney resorts, is that if they do away with discounts, rooms and packages might be 20-30% higher just one year/vacation later. It won't matter if you are wealthy staying at the GF or struggling to make ends meet and wanting to stay at Pop, that is a large increase.

Exactly. The rack rate of the package we're considering for Nov 2011 went up 7.xx% for 2012, which is a pretty significant increase even if discounts remained the same. Start scaling back the discounts (we're seeing 10% PIN codes this year where last year the offer was 30% at moderates) and it gets even worse. In the end I fully expect that if we choose to go back in 2012 we'll be paying 25% more than in 2011.

 

[Disneyfan1977]

The "memory" package makes it a smaller discount. Much smaller, for some people. (For example, 2 adults, staying the minimum number of nights in a value resort--- the photobook dramatically lessens the discount).

But also, September "hurricane season" has always been a slow month, and they offered discounts for September, even before the "Great Recession."

Am I missing something with this memory book? I am headed down for free dining and september and thought the memory book was included for free??? Am I wrong????

 

[FourBees]

The way I understood it you are paying $99 extra for the memory book but get the dining for free by booking that particular package.