Riviera vs. Aulani vs. Disneyland Hotel: WWYD

[RoseGold]

I should clarify that while my family travels to WDW usually once every 3 years, we could conceivably travel to the Aulani more frequently since we live on the west coast.

It's hard to know how much to buy in, if you don't know how often you are going. Lots of people on these boards like buying into DVC so they are kind of forced to take the trip, it's a form of planning for them. To me that's a downside, not an upside, but maybe it is how you look at it.

Your style of travel also matters. If you're booking "last minute" by DVC standards, like 3-4 months out, or traveling during peak times, that will change the availability and the strategy. Also worth noting you can rent points for RIV including grandfathered resale, not just RIV points or direct points.

 

[Paul Stupin]

I think assuming that DLT points will be cheaper than VGC and that the point chart will be cheaper are big assumptions. If you follow the precedent of RIV and VGF, it will scrape under the VGC chart and be priced way higher. They can also play games with the chart, like the views, to hike up total point count, like Riviera, making categories exceed VGC. I think it will look a lot like the VGF/RIV charts. Roughly the same points for a property I consider far inferior.

VGC is rock solid, compared to all other DVC properties IMO. If you are done with it, you sell. This is in contrast to Aulani or even DLT direct, which as a buy I view as more risky and complicated with exit strategy. Comparing buying these two properties makes this contrast more stark. No one has any idea what will happen to DLT resale or Aulani in the future. And heck, maybe DLT resale needs to be in this discussion as well.

Thats definitely one way of looking at it. But another way is that DLT is a small, basically unthemed all studio building with a good chunk of the units facing a super bland residential area. Its hard for me to buy that its charts will be similar to a larger, beautifully themed flagship property like VGC that features its own immersive world.
This is one we can debate for the next year or two!

And I do think that in spite of its many superiorities to DLT, VGC is still 20 years old with some rooms showing their age, and that some percentage of potential VGC buyers will opt for the newer, shinier DLT in spite of its lack of theming. And if it's cheaper, that percentage will grow. And to think that VGC pricing will face no downward pressure in spite of having viable competition for the first time, and no longer being the only game in town, is a big assumption as well. I actually do think VGC is pretty safe, but there's no guarantee.

One other thing. Everyone is assuming that the demand for DLT will be gargantuan. But the Disneyland resort area is no Disney World, and aside from hardcore fans like ourselves, the millions of new points might not fly off the shelves as fast as many think, or attract throngs of west coasters who know nothing about DVC. The pricing, initially, might very well be more competitive than anticipated like, very possibly, VGF2.

This is one where only time will tell. At least the endless VGF debate is almost over!

 

[Royal Consort]

Thats definitely one way of looking at it. But another way is that DLT is a small, basically unthemed all studio building with a good chunk of the units facing a super bland residential area. Its hard for me to buy that its charts will be similar to a larger, beautifully themed flagship property like VGC that features its own immersive world.

I am going a bit off topic but the majority of the DLT will have views of transmission towers, car parks, or suburbia (and few balconies). I think the point chart will start below VGC and then shoot high for the limited number of rooms that actually face the gardens and pool. There is a reason Disney is building the tower on the worst parcel of land. I bought sky high VGC resale for this reason. Even stayed in a room at DLH in Frontier Tower to check out the view.

And I do think that in spite of its many superiorities to DLT, VGC is still 20 years old with some rooms showing their age, and that some percentage of potential VGC buyers will opt for the newer, shinier DLT in spite of its lack of theming. And if it's cheaper, that percentage will grow. And to think that VGC pricing will face no downward pressure in spite of having viable competition for the first time, and no longer being the only game in town, is a big assumption as well. I actually do think VGC is pretty safe, but there's no guarantee.

VGC will be getting a complete hard goods refurb one year after DLT opens in 2024. They have just jacked up the maintenance fees for this reason. Both properties will feel pretty new afterwards and I imagine they will do a tasteful job on VGC. Views, balconies, theming and a small pool of rooms will continue to support the VGC price. However I do think the resale price will reduce a bit as a correction from recent peaks.

One other thing. Everyone is assuming that the demand for DLT will be gargantuan. But the Disneyland resort area is no Disney World, and aside from hardcore fans like ourselves, the millions of new points might not fly off the shelves as fast as many think, or attract throngs of west coasters who know nothing about DVC.

DVC has little presence in Disneyland. I think DVC would need to reintroduce the product almost from scratch for a completely different audience.

 

[Paul Stupin]

I am going a bit off topic but the majority of the DLT will have views of transmission towers, car parks, or suburbia (and few balconies). I think the point chart will start below VGC and then shoot high for the limited number of rooms that actually face the gardens and pool. There is a reason Disney is building the tower on the worst parcel of land. I bought sky high VGC resale for this reason. Even stayed in a room at DLH in Frontier Tower to check out the view.



VGC will be getting a complete hard goods refurb one year after DLT opens in 2024. They have just jacked up the maintenance fees for this reason. Both properties will feel pretty new afterwards and I imagine they will do a tasteful job on VGC. Views, balconies, theming and a small pool of rooms will continue to support the VGC price. However I do think the resale price will reduce a bit as a correction from recent peaks.



DVC has little presence in Disneyland. I think DVC would need to reintroduce the product almost from scratch for a completely different audience.

Great info and I agree with you!

 

[eMoneyBug]

I wish the OP would have jumped on the year end super sale on AULANI direct, would have been primed for points at Aulani and able to book anywhere old and new. Maybe if the next AULANI direct incentive comes out and it's really good, jump on it this next go around! I use my Aulani points at WDW easily, and of course also at Aulani, which if you read up on "value" points or SAP, it rates in the top 1/2, so its a solid choice.

 

[vacay77]

I wish the OP would have jumped on the year end super sale on AULANI direct, would have been primed for points at Aulani and able to book anywhere old and new. Maybe if the next AULANI direct incentive comes out and it's really good, jump on it this next go around! I use my Aulani points at WDW easily, and of course also at Aulani, which if you read up on "value" points or SAP, it rates in the top 1/2, so its a solid choice.

Which WDW resorts are you able to book? I've tried a few times, using my VGC points, and the resorts I were interested in were all booked up by the time the 7 month window rolled around. Now that I've stayed in the 1 BR at VGC, though, I don't plan on using my VGC points to book elsewhere, lol. I thought about buying points at Aulani when they had the super sale but my husband tried to convince me to wait for the Disneyland Hotel. I'm just not as convinced for the reasons that others mentioned above. We'd travel to Aulani more than WDW, but I'm thinking that Riviera will have more longevity, for example, if we need to sell at some point. I also think it would be more difficult to book a WDW resort 7 months out versus the Aulani. I don't regret our VGC purchase.

 

[Wedgeout]

Never regret that VGC purchase. You have it and others don’t. An issue with buying RIV direct is how liked will that resort be 10+ years from now if decide to sell. Someone has to really like RIV to purchase a resale contract there. Limits the buyer pool.

 

[eMoneyBug]

Which WDW resorts are you able to book? I've tried a few times, using my VGC points, and the resorts I were interested in were all booked up by the time the 7 month window rolled around. Now that I've stayed in the 1 BR at VGC, though, I don't plan on using my VGC points to book elsewhere, lol. I thought about buying points at Aulani when they had the super sale but my husband tried to convince me to wait for the Disneyland Hotel. I'm just not as convinced for the reasons that others mentioned above. We'd travel to Aulani more than WDW, but I'm thinking that Riviera will have more longevity, for example, if we need to sell at some point. I also think it would be more difficult to book a WDW resort 7 months out versus the Aulani. I don't regret our VGC purchase.

I'm originally Aug use year and was saving $ for Disneyland Direct, but couldn't resist the Aulani super sale, picked up Dec use year in mid Nov, so got the 2020 and 2021 points. I work from home so have a lot of time to stalk during the day, so basically can grab a lot of good wdw resorts + dates under 7months and also wife allows for a split stay if we are staying 4-6nights, so my AUL direct has booked everything from Poly to BW std to Beach Club to Riv to AKL Value, it's all possible with a lot of click work Wait List sometimes comes thru also, but typically the day you WL comes available and you have to DIY.

 

[Shivanair]

I’m leery of renting points due to a negative experience my family had the last time we rented points. The Aulani was literally closed during our planned stay and the rental agency refused to give us our money back. I had to dispute it with my credit card company.

We had a trip to Oahu planned for early 2020 and the rental company (non-dvc property) wasn't going to give us our deposit back despite flights to Hawaii getting cancelled and shutdowns going into effect. Eventually we got our money back, but it left a sore taste in my mouth so I get what you mean. I'd like to think that the chance of that happening again is really low, but these days...never know.

 

[Wedgeout]

Just a thought. Ditch the RIV idea and find yourself a good resale contract matching your UY at one of the other 10 DVC resort options that your family also likes to stay at. You will have the booking priority there for WDW trips. Those points can be used for your 7 month Aulani plans as well as extra points to grab nights here and there at your VGC.

 

[vacay77]

We had a trip to Oahu planned for early 2020 and the rental company (non-dvc property) wasn't going to give us our deposit back despite flights to Hawaii getting cancelled and shutdowns going into effect. Eventually we got our money back, but it left a sore taste in my mouth so I get what you mean. I'd like to think that the chance of that happening again is really low, but these days...never know.

Exactly! I didn’t think it would ever happen….until it happened.

 

[vacay77]

I'm originally Aug use year and was saving $ for Disneyland Direct, but couldn't resist the Aulani super sale, picked up Dec use year in mid Nov, so got the 2020 and 2021 points. I work from home so have a lot of time to stalk during the day, so basically can grab a lot of good wdw resorts + dates under 7months and also wife allows for a split stay if we are staying 4-6nights, so my AUL direct has booked everything from Poly to BW std to Beach Club to Riv to AKL Value, it's all possible with a lot of click work Wait List sometimes comes thru also, but typically the day you WL comes available and you have to DIY.

That’s a great selection!

 

[vacay77]

Just a thought. Ditch the RIV idea and find yourself a good resale contract matching your UY at one of the other 10 DVC resort options that your family also likes to stay at. You will have the booking priority there for WDW trips. Those points can be used for your 7 month Aulani plans as well as extra points to grab nights here and there at your VGC.

I like this idea. We could definitely buy resale.

 

[cruisehopeful]

So much to think about and so many choices. The good news is that you certainly don't have to decide right now. I have been planning on buying the DLT, but that could change whenever it comes up for sale. I have a very small Poly contract and live 90 minutes from DL in Anaheim. I love Hawaii, but prefer other parts of the island and like to visit all the islands. I know that I'll always visit DL for short trips approx 4-6 times per year as long as I live where I live. That helps me see where I should buy if I buy. In the meantime, I have rented VGC directly from owners and use my tiny Poly contract for a couple nights at VGC. Are you in a position to really look ahead 5-10 years and be totally certain what you travel habits will be? Having that ability in my case really helped me navigate between all these desires to add on and feelings of FOMO.

Also I totally get the bad experience with renting. It's possible that you wouldn't have as bad of an experience renting from an owner directly who is active on this board or another. It just feels like a more personal relationship, even if it's still a stranger.

 

[HIRyeDVC]

Before, my heart was completely set on buying DLT but it’s starting to waiver. Anything above $225pp and I’m starting to question its overall value when you could buy Aulani or Riviera direct for so much cheaper. And with 350 studios planned for DLT, I don’t think 7 month availability will be an issue unless you’re trying to compete for one of those 19 one bedroom villas. But that means you’ll probably haveto buy at least 150+ points which will probably set you back $40k! I too bought VGC early last year, knowing that DLT is coming. We love it but man that points chart is BRUTAL. Given all this, I think Disney is sitting pretty with Riviera and probably won’t have a problem selling it out. Unless VGF2 derails it. Speaking of, VGF2 pricing will probably be a good indicator of where they’ll price DLT. The suspense is killing me!

 

[Paul Stupin]

Before, my heart was completely set on buying DLT but it’s starting to waiver. Anything above $225pp and I’m starting to question its overall value when you could buy Aulani or Riviera direct for so much cheaper. And with 350 studios planned for DLT, I don’t think 7 month availability will be an issue unless you’re trying to compete for one of those 19 one bedroom villas. But that means you’ll probably haveto buy at least 150+ points which will probably set you back $40k! I too bought VGC early last year, knowing that DLT is coming. We love it but man that points chart is BRUTAL. Given all this, I think Disney is sitting pretty with Riviera and probably won’t have a problem selling it out. Unless VGF2 derails it. Speaking of, VGF2 pricing will probably be a good indicator of where they’ll price DLT. The suspense is killing me!

The suspense is killing me too! Can’t wait to buy some VGF2 if the currently conventional wisdom on pricing is correct. I‘ve kind of soured on DLT as well. We drive down from our home in LA every few months, and stayed at the Disneyland Hotel for a night right before Christmas. Doesn’t hold a candle to VGC, and is kind of showing its age. The new tower renderings also look generic and bland, and just don’t compare to the theming and majesty of the WDW properties.

 

[HIRyeDVC]

The suspense is killing me too! Can’t wait to buy some VGF2 if the currently conventional wisdom on pricing is correct. I‘ve kind of soured on DLT as well. We drive down from our home in LA every few months, and stayed at the Disneyland Hotel for a night right before Christmas. Doesn’t hold a candle to VGC, and is kind of showing its age. The new tower renderings also look generic and bland, and just don’t compare to the theming and majesty of the WDW properties.

What bothers me most is the small inventory of 1,2,3 BRs and limited dining. Disney expects DLT guests to just eat in DT Disney or something. It'll be interesting what the real demand will look like once the final product and prices get rolled out. Perhaps Disney is banking on Disneyland Forward. Once it gets built, DLT would be inside the park. I wish they'd turn Paradise Pier into DVC. It's probably a close location?

 

[vacay77]

Are you in a position to really look ahead 5-10 years and be totally certain what you travel habits will be? Having that ability in my case really helped me navigate between all these desires to add on and feelings of FOMO.

These are all great points. My husband and I hope to be the 60something, 70something year olds still traveling to Disney (we are in our 40s now). I think we are in this for the long haul (instead of having a quinceneara, I opted to go to Disneyland; instead of a bar mitzvah, my husband opted for WDW; for our honeymoon, we went to WDW). This is something I'd like to pass on for our son, but I know that he might not be as interested in it as much as we are. My only regret is that I wish we had joined DVC earlier, but we were not financially able to at the time.

 

[vacay77]

Before, my heart was completely set on buying DLT but it’s starting to waiver. Anything above $225pp and I’m starting to question its overall value when you could buy Aulani or Riviera direct for so much cheaper. And with 350 studios planned for DLT, I don’t think 7 month availability will be an issue unless you’re trying to compete for one of those 19 one bedroom villas. But that means you’ll probably haveto buy at least 150+ points which will probably set you back $40k! I too bought VGC early last year, knowing that DLT is coming. We love it but man that points chart is BRUTAL. Given all this, I think Disney is sitting pretty with Riviera and probably won’t have a problem selling it out. Unless VGF2 derails it. Speaking of, VGF2 pricing will probably be a good indicator of where they’ll price DLT. The suspense is killing me!

The suspense is killing me too! Can’t wait to buy some VGF2 if the currently conventional wisdom on pricing is correct. I‘ve kind of soured on DLT as well. We drive down from our home in LA every few months, and stayed at the Disneyland Hotel for a night right before Christmas. Doesn’t hold a candle to VGC, and is kind of showing its age. The new tower renderings also look generic and bland, and just don’t compare to the theming and majesty of the WDW properties.

Yeah, the more I think about DLT, the more my interest wanes. I'm really happy with VGC. I'm just really torn between the Aulani vs. the Riviera. We hope to travel to WDW next year and that's one of the reasons why I want to make a decision sooner rather than later.

 

[HIRyeDVC]

Yeah, the more I think about DLT, the more my interest wanes. I'm really happy with VGC. I'm just really torn between the Aulani vs. the Riviera. We hope to travel to WDW next year and that's one of the reasons why I want to make a decision sooner rather than later.

If I was in your shoes, I’d buy Riviera. It has the longest contract length and it will be cheaper to buy relative to DLT. In the long run, Riviera’s annual dues will be cheaper than Aulani IMO. Aulani’s oceanfront location is a prime target for annual hurricanes and expensive hurricane insurance. Hawaii also has one of the lowest minimum wage in the country at $10.25/hr. There is a lot of political talk and support of raising that to @18/hr, which will dramatically impact annual dues. There is also a lot of talk of raising hotel and Transit Accommodation Taxes to raise government revenue. In short, EVERYTHING in Hawaii is and will get more expensive, including DVC. I live on Oahu and I would never own Aulani as I could easily find availability during non peak seasons.