republicans vote down minimum wage again

[DISUNC]

Yeah--okay..you got me..that's why I took it...NOT!!!!!

Let's be honest. No one is forced to work at gun point for any wage at all.

Some of my jobs were NOT the only ones out there--but I chose them b/c they were fun! Can't beat free concerts in college!!! (Rollling Stones gig--minimum wage...got to see the concert for FREE. NOONE held me at gunpoint to take that job!) In fact there was competition to work for that place and not everyone got hired--a position that was in high demand to be filled. They did not want for employees.

See post #280

 

[DISUNC]

Nope, I don't. But katerkat's husband does, or did you not read her post?

Just because someone has a spouse in the Military does not AUTOMATICALLY make them a traveling Nomad!

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

There are Thousands of people who are the SOLE support of their families or themselves and dont have the options you have....and YES they are saying the same as you! This is a blight on our country!

And you are implying that there is nothing they can do about it.

Hard to believe that 100% of those in that situation can do absolutely nothing about it.

Suggesting to make the minimum wage livable will not change a darn thing. The poverty line will just be higher than it was before.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

See post #280

See post #283.

 

[Bob Slydell]

See post #283.

See post #136

Actually, I don't even know what post #136 is -- I just thought this was some sort of new game

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

See post #136

Actually, I don't even know what post #136 is -- I just thought this was some sort of new game

 

[richiebaseball]

Stop with the Right Wing CULT garble! Wake up & think for yourself!

Just because you've made the choice to be lazy doesn't mean everyone else should be forced to make sure you get your share. Man up and do it yourself.

 

[georgia4now]

Well, let's take a look at the numbers from Belgium, The U.K, Canada and the US

Life expectancy:

Belgium: Women 82 and men 75
The U.K.: Women 81 and men 76
Canada: Women 82 and men 77
US: Women 80 and men 75

Conclusion: They live longer than folks in the US

Maternal mortality (per 100,000 births)

Belgium: 10
The U.K. : 13
Canada: 6
US: 17

Conclusion: Fewer women die in childbirth than in the US.

Infant mortality (per 1000 births)

Belgium: 4
The U.K.: 5
Canada: 5
US: 7

Conclusion: Fewer babies die at birth than in the US.

Those are the numbers. It begs the question that if their healthcare systems are so horrible, why do they live longer, have fewer woman die in childbirth, have fewer babies die at birth, and the costs are cheaper?

http://unstats.un.org/unsd/demographic/products/indwm/indwm2.htm

Now, maybe someone can explain why they don't want to live longer, want more women to die in childbirth, have more babies die at birth, and pay through the nose for privilege?

What's wrong with this picture?

Well, I guess that one, single, lone, solitary factoid can be used to explain the whole entire healthcare issue. How simple-minded can one be?

I've said it in 3 other posts, and still no one will tell me: WHO IS GOING TO PAY FOR THIS? Start raising taxes for healthcare, raise the minimum wage, and every other "You owe it to me entitlement program" you guys are in to, and everyone (from middle-class down) will suffer.

 

[bsmcneil]

Wow, you hope I loose my job? And you are supposed to be the thoughtful one? I love it when you libs show your true, hateful colors.

My job is to manage a budget...THAT'S IT. When I go in to my Tuesday morning meeting, I have to show how my division (marketing) made money and supported other departments to do the same. And guess what - WHEN I DO THAT, I CAN GO HIRE MORE PEOPLE!!! WE ARE RECRUITING FOR 3 MORE RIGHT NOW - Your way of thinking is busted. I am NOT running a charity...I'm running a BUSINESS unit. When my company is successful, I am successful, and the team I manage is successful. I don't expect you to get that, but it works!

And as far as making money for myself - you're absolutely right. My mission is to make my family as comfortable as possible, send my kids to the best schools, take care of our ageing parents, etc. so that society does not have to do it for me. Your job is to tkae care of yourself. Personal responsibility is the name of the game!

I'll carry on helping the economy, you keep reminding people that they are slaves to big business. I'll give them opportunities (like pay for 80% college tuition) and you remind them they don't have a chance. I'll have quarterly meetings with them to help them plan their career paths, you give them a million reasons why it wont work.

You should be ashamed of yourself. And you EVERYBODY on my staff an apology.

Bay the way, the lowest paid person I have is making $11 per hour. She also goes to college part time on the company dime.

I don't owe anybody an apology. To think so is a little weird. But ok. And yes, since you're all for some capitalism and since some might have to lose jobs so that the poorest of the poor can have a little bit of extra money, I think you should eventually be on the receiving end of a bad situation.

 

[LuvDuke]

Quite honestly, I don't understand the drift of this conversation from who took what job to who moves around, the country, etc.

The purpose of the minimum wage, as it was set up in the 1930's, was to prevent the exploitation of lower wage earners.

The minimum wage hasn't been raised since 1997 and a potful has happened since then. Raising the minimum is the decent thing to do regardless of how you feel about those jobs or who does them.

There is no evidence that raising the minimum wage causes job losses or inflation and beyond logical fallacies and anecdotal evidence, no one has come up with hard facts to dispute it. Here are some studies done on the results of raising the minimum wage:

http://www.epinet.org/content.cfm/issueguides_minwage_minwagefaq

http://www.cbpp.org/529ormw.htm

http://stage.aflcio.org:4664/yourjobeconomy/minimumwage/myths/myths7.cfm (google the footnotes on the bottom)

Furthermore, I'm of the belief that if someone is in favor of something they should understand why, understand the consequences and be honest about it. If you remove the floor of minimum wage, you will leave lower wage earners open to exploitation. Now, some have no problem with exploitation. Fine, at least have the cajones to say so. Others want to see minimum wage as some sort of punishment for not being ambitious enough. Again, fine if that's what floats your boat. But, be honest about it.

And if people are going to come up with all these wild claims about the evils of the minimum wage or raising the minimum wage, please some come up with some hard evidence backing those evils. Without hard facts, an argument is just an opinion and like backpassages, we all have one.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Quite honestly, I don't understand the drift of this conversation from who took what job to who moves around, the country, etc.

The purpose of the minimum wage, as it was set up in the 1930's, was to prevent the exploitation of lower wage earners.

The minimum wage hasn't been raised since 1997 and a potful has happened since then. Raising the minimum is the decent thing to do regardless of how you feel about those jobs or who does them.

There is no evidence that raising the minimum wage causes job losses or inflation and beyond logical fallacies and anecdotal evidence, no one has come up with hard facts to dispute it. Here are some studies done on the results of raising the minimum wage:

http://www.epinet.org/content.cfm/issueguides_minwage_minwagefaq

http://www.cbpp.org/529ormw.htm

http://stage.aflcio.org:4664/yourjobeconomy/minimumwage/myths/myths7.cfm (google the footnotes on the bottom)

Furthermore, I'm of the belief that if someone is in favor of something they should understand why, understand the consequences and be honest about it. If you remove the floor of minimum wage, you will leave lower wage earners open to exploitation. Now, some have no problem with exploitation. Fine, at least have the cajones to say so. Others want to see minimum wage as some sort of punishment for not being ambitious enough. Again, fine if that's what floats your boat. But, be honest about it.

And if people are going to come up with all these wild claims about the evils of the minimum wage or raising the minimum wage, please some come up with some hard evidence backing those evils. Without hard facts, an argument is just an opinion and like backpassages, we all have one.

I have no problem with seeing an increase in minimum wage.

I have a problem with making it livable which none of your links can provide evidence for the impact of that. Today to make it livable would require a significant raise. More than 50 cents or a dollar.

From one of your links (emphasis mine):

Taking into account the EITC, the current minimum wage is still inadequate to support a single parent with two children. In 2003, a single parent working full time with two children would have a combined earnings and tax credit of $14,097, only 95% of the 2003 poverty threshold of $14,824 for a family of three. The proposal to raise the minimum wage to $7.25 fixes this problem. If the minimum wage were increased to $7.25 by 2007, the minimum wage and the EITC would work in tandem to raise this family's income to $17,790, which is 16% above the estimated 2005 poverty line of $15,317. It would still, however, be much lower than the income needed to support a family as calculated by "family budget" measures of poverty, which range from $23,000 to $46,000 for a family of three.

People who make only $20K as single parents struggle--and that is $6K more per year than minimum.

It was set up to prevent exploitation but where is the evidence that it was set up to be a liveable wage and keep up with cost of living increases?

 

[georgia4now]

WRONG...AGAIN! Most US Middleclass pay 40% & more..in taxes! Only the wealthy pay less taxes! The UK & Canada Health care system is in GREAT shape! In Fact MANY Americans NOW are turning to Foreign Countries for their MUCH CHEAPER & Better healthcare!

Our Economy is weak!!!!! Maybe you should stay home more and pay attention!

The top 5% of wage earners pay 53.25% of all taxes in this country, and the top 50% of wage earners pay 96.03% of all taxes (2003 calendar year). You're barking up the wrong tree here.

Why don't you and your Lib friends start an organization where you pay a voluntary 10% tax above and beyond so you can help the "victims" of capitalism? Oh wait, because you want ME to have to pay more! No thanks. Put your money where your mouth is or shut up!

Oh yeah, and when's the last time you bumped into someone on his way to Cuba, France, or Canada to see a doctor?

 

[LuvDuke]

Well, I guess that one, single, lone, solitary factoid can be used to explain the whole entire healthcare issue. How simple-minded can one be?

I've said it in 3 other posts, and still no one will tell me: WHO IS GOING TO PAY FOR THIS? Start raising taxes for healthcare, raise the minimum wage, and every other "You owe it to me entitlement program" you guys are in to, and everyone (from middle-class down) will suffer.

So let's see if I understand this: A country with a healthcare system that has a lower life expectancy, a higher rate of maternal death, a higher rate of infant mortality, and costs more is a better health care system than one that has the opposites of just those things? Is that it? Is that your defintion of better?

You ignore the facts presented,throw around your assertions without a shred of evidence to back them up, and you have the cajones to call someone else simple-minded? Truly this is one of those things that speaks for itself.

So I'll ask you: Why do you have a problem with a longer life, less maternal death, fewer babies dying at birth, and a cheaper cost? That, after all the BS smoke clears, is the debate.

What entitlement program? Folks in those countries with universal healthcare pay for it in a variety of ways from income taxes to gas taxes. We pay all of those things plus healthcare costs. Add up what you pay in this country for all taxes (sales, gas, excise, etc.) plus healthcare and you're way above that 40% you casually threw out. Couple that cost with the nearly 40,000,0000 why have no healthcare coverage, the costs are spiraling out of control and 40% will look like a cake walk.

Let's see some evidence to back up your assertions.

 

[Planogirl]

Why would anyone go to Cuba, France or Canada to see a doctor when they're not covered by the national health insurance there? That comment doesn't make sense.

Healthcare is lacking in the US and it's a problem that needs to be resolved at some point. What does it have to do with minimum wage though? I've lost the train of thought here.

 

[LuvDuke]

The top 5% of wage earners pay 53.25% of all taxes in this country, and the top 50% of wage earners pay 96.03% of all taxes (2003 calendar year). You're barking up the wrong tree here.

Why don't you and your Lib friends start an organization where you pay a voluntary 10% tax above and beyond so you can help the "victims" of capitalism? Oh wait, because you want ME to have to pay more! No thanks. Put your money where your mouth is or shut up!

Oh yeah, and when's the last time you bumped into someone on his way to Cuba, France, or Canada to see a doctor?

Finally some honesty. Someone is finally admitting it really is all about them and the hell with everyone else.

I take my hat off to you.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Healthcare is lacking in the US and it's a problem that needs to be resolved at some point. What does it have to do with minimum wage though? I've lost the train of thought here.

I'm lost on that as well.

 

[LuvDuke]

Why would anyone go to Cuba, France or Canada to see a doctor when they're not covered by the national health insurance there? That comment doesn't make sense.

Healthcare is lacking in the US and it's a problem that needs to be resolved at some point. What does it have to do with minimum wage though? I've lost the train of thought here.

This entire debate against raising the minimum wage and universal healthcare doesn't make sense because it's based on hot air and not facts.

 

[MzDiz]

My advice to you: read a book.

Is it possible to get your point across without making such harsh statements?

 

[georgia4now]

I don't owe anybody an apology. To think so is a little weird. But ok. And yes, since you're all for some capitalism and since some might have to lose jobs so that the poorest of the poor can have a little bit of extra money, I think you should eventually be on the receiving end of a bad situation.

You insult millions of men and women who work for minimum wage while they are trying to progress...you DO owe each and everyone of them an apology. But enough about that...

Who do you think employs the "poorest of poor" as you call them? CAPITALISTS! Who has the capital (etymology is fun) to take risks to build business and offer jobs? CAPITALISTS! I use the term Capitalist, but the rest of us call them "educated, resourceful, risk-takers".

By they way, I've been on the receiving end of a bad situation...that's why we moved from FL to GA. My company sold, so the CEO could make millions (sucks for me, but that's the game) and me and about 60 other people had to scramble to find jobs...but we did, and now we're fine. I guess I could have spent my time crying about it, instead I enrolled in grad school and found myself another way to pay the bills!

I'm getting on a plane in 20 minutes. I'll pick this back up later. I'm intrigued by the liberal mind!

 

[georgia4now]

Is it possible to get your point across without making such harsh statements?

It's possible, but not nearly as much fun! Have you read some of th other comments? I believe my comments are completely appropriate.