republicans vote down minimum wage again

[Cool-Beans]

I've done it at home over the years and that's bad enough.

I think that minimum wage was set at a certain level for a reason. Since then the cost of living has increased and I just want the minimum wage to track along with it. It seems only fair.

I'm a bit puzzled by those on this thread that keep talking about $100 an hour or the minimum wage worker making the same as higher level workers. Such extremes seem a bit bizarre and offer nothing to the conversation IMO. Keeping up with inflation doesn't seem exactly all that demanding.

The point is that it doesn't matter where the minimum wage is set. You raise it $.10 or $1.00 or $100.00, the same stuff happens, just in different amounts.

The minimum wage folks would still be making minimum wage and have less than everyone else.

I am not opposed to raising it for this reason. And if they raise it to $100/hr, that's fine.

Whatever they raise it to, everyone else gets bumped up in salary, too and the cost is passed on by raising prices.

It just doesn't matter. It won't help the poor and it won't hurt the rich.

So, raise it to whatever amount makes everyone happy.

 

[DISUNC]

Even if a CEO makes 2 million per year, he or she is likely running a Fortune 300 company. Based on published figures (and the payroll at my company), that's probably 0.001% of gross, and around 0.01% of net. It's *nothing*. But raise the minimum wage from $6.35 to $8.00 and you have yourself a 26% increase. Wages are the single largest controllable expense in any company or department. Bump the bottom line payables by 26% and watch how many people loose their jobs. A staff of 10 will be a staff of 7 by the end of fiscal.

And that bit about financial slavery was was just stupid.

When you factor in pass-thru manufacturing costs, minor inflation, transportation costs, and a boat load of entry-level positions going away to China, you could have yourself a real mess. Plus like another poster said on this topic: Raise minimum wage to $15 per hour, and the LIVING wage will instantly become $16 per hour. There will always be abottom 5% of society. Mathematically, there has to be.

Your posts are proof positive that liberalism is based on all feeling and no brain power. Anyone who has sat through Economics 101 and managed a department with a few direct reports can tell you that any ripple - regardless of how small - will turn into a tidal wave. That's why it's such a big deal when the Feds raise interest rates one half of one percent - they could shut down the economy!

Bashing big business is stupid - we all work for big business, or start small business ourselves.

My advice to you: read a book.

My advice to you is put down the latest Ann Coulter diarrhea blog...and pick up a REAL NEWSPAPER...not the Star!
'Wages are the single largest controllable expense in any company" ...Not any more....Healthcare cost are!

 

[BuckNaked]

If all these jobs were so good, why didnt you keep any?

Did you read the part where she said her husband was in the military? It's a bit hard to keep a job when you are living on the opposite side of the country...

 

[DISUNC]

You forgot to add they pay 40%+ income taxes, people from Canada are flooding in to Michigan and New York for healthcare because the waiting list is so long, and many people in the EU don't own homes. I work 25% in Belgium and 25% in the U.K., and I don't want any part of the mess they have going on over there. Great people, lovely countries, but a weak economy.

WRONG...AGAIN! Most US Middleclass pay 40% & more..in taxes! Only the wealthy pay less taxes! The UK & Canada Health care system is in GREAT shape! In Fact MANY Americans NOW are turning to Foreign Countries for their MUCH CHEAPER & Better healthcare!

Our Economy is weak!!!!! Maybe you should stay home more and pay attention!

 

[LuvDuke]

You forgot to add they pay 40%+ income taxes, people from Canada are flooding in to Michigan and New York for healthcare because the waiting list is so long, and many people in the EU don't own homes. I work 25% in Belgium and 25% in the U.K., and I don't want any part of the mess they have going on over there. Great people, lovely countries, but a weak economy.

Liberals are always using the "bleeding heart" smoke screen to deter from the fact that their ideas, though admirable and likely rooted in good-faith, can not be supported in a capitalistic system. Who's going to pay for all this stuff? Raise minimum wage, pay for healthcare, double education funding, double medical research funding, send poor kids to college, feed the rest of the world, give illegal immigrants welfare, education, and helthcare, defend our interests BUT never go to war, the list goes on and on.

Again, the only way we can pay for all of this is Marxism "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need." Sound familiar?

"New York Times: In addition, the amount of time a Canadian patient must wait before receiving medical care is notorious. "This is a country in which dogs can get a hip replacement in under a week and in which humans can wait two to three years," said Dr. Brian Day in a recent New York Times article on Canada's health care crisis." http://www.reason.com/rb/rb030306.shtml[/URL

Well, let's take a look at the numbers from Belgium, The U.K, Canada and the US

Life expectancy:

Belgium: Women 82 and men 75
The U.K.: Women 81 and men 76
Canada: Women 82 and men 77
US: Women 80 and men 75

Conclusion: They live longer than folks in the US

Maternal mortality (per 100,000 births)

Belgium: 10
The U.K. : 13
Canada: 6
US: 17

Conclusion: Fewer women die in childbirth than in the US.

Infant mortality (per 1000 births)

Belgium: 4
The U.K.: 5
Canada: 5
US: 7

Conclusion: Fewer babies die at birth than in the US.

Those are the numbers. It begs the question that if their healthcare systems are so horrible, why do they live longer, have fewer woman die in childbirth, have fewer babies die at birth, and the costs are cheaper?

[url]http://unstats.un.org/unsd/demographic/products/indwm/indwm2.htm

Now, maybe someone can explain why they don't want to live longer, want more women to die in childbirth, have more babies die at birth, and pay through the nose for privilege?

What's wrong with this picture?

 

[DISUNC]

Some people don't need a lot of money but work for love of something. Volunteers would be an extreme example of that.

People who work at minimum wage for 'the love of something', have somebody else supporting them!

That still doesn't mean that a minimum wage worker that does a good job and enjoys that same job doesn't deserve a raise at some point. Just like anyone else.

That is also, MY POINT!!!

 

[DISUNC]

Did you read the part where she said her husband was in the military? It's a bit hard to keep a job when you are living on the opposite side of the country...

Are you saying you move around allot?

 

[Cool-Beans]

WRONG...AGAIN! Most US Middleclass pay 40% & more..in taxes! Only the wealthy pay less taxes! The UK & Canada Health care system is in GREAT shape! In Fact MANY Americans NOW are turning to Foreign Countries for their MUCH CHEAPER & Better healthcare!

Our Economy is weak!!!!! Maybe you should stay home more and pay attention!

Sometimes I really like your posts, but have to disagree with you here.

I work for the Cleveland Clinic and can tell you that people ARE coming in from Canada all the time with horror stories about LINES and other problems with their system. And all those rich oil arabs also come here for their medical care. People from all over the world comes to the U.S. for healthcare. And lots of them come to the Clinic.

A friend of mine actually MOVED to the US - got work to transfer him - to get his toddler with heart problems the proper medical care. Canada was basically going to let the kid die.

There are a couple things I think should never be opposed on political bases and healthcare is one of them. When you are sick or in pain, it is good to have the best healthcare in the world available. We shouldn't lower our standards to that of Canada because it is politically popular.

The last part is my opinion, but the fact that people flock to the U.S. for care is FACT.

 

[LuvDuke]

The dismal failure comes not from the quality of healthcare, but the accessability to it and the unbelieveable cost. Do a google search for goodness sake! Ignore the right-wing rhetoric and the left-wing socialist tripe, and take a look at statistics....

Dismal failure? Living longer, fewer women dying in childbirth, fewer babies dying at birth, AND a cheaper cost is the new definltion of dismal failure? I don't think so.

Here's the numbers on the cost of healthcare (as a percentage of GDP):

Belgium: 7.6%
The U.K.: 6.9%
Canada: 9.3%
US: 14%

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Health/HealthSpendingCountries.html

There are no such thing as conservative facts or liberal facts or middle-of-the-road facts. Facts are facts and numbers are numbers.

We pay more for our healthcare, we have a shorter life expectancy, more women die in childbirth, and more babies die at birth. Those are the facts.

 

[LuvDuke]

Sometimes I really like your posts, but have to disagree with you here.

I work for the Cleveland Clinic and can tell you that people ARE coming in from Canada all the time with horror stories about LINES and other problems with their system. And all those rich oil arabs also come here for their medical care. People from all over the world comes to the U.S. for healthcare. And lots of them come to the Clinic.

A friend of mine actually MOVED to the US - got work to transfer him - to get his toddler with heart problems the proper medical care. Canada was basically going to let the kid die.

There are a couple things I think should never be opposed on political bases and healthcare is one of them. When you are sick or in pain, it is good to have the best healthcare in the world available. We shouldn't lower our standards to that of Canada because it is politically popular.

The last part is my opinion, but the fact that people flock to the U.S. for care is FACT.

How can you say it's the "best healthcare system in the world" when we have a shorter life expectancy, have more women die in childbirth, and have more babies die at birth than any industrialized country in the world?

 

[DISUNC]

Off topic! Sorry guys!

Sometimes I really like your posts,

Thanks!

but have to disagree with you here.,

Now I'm

I work for the Cleveland Clinic and can tell you that people ARE coming in from Canada all the time with horror stories about LINES and other problems with their system. .,

I am not saying the Canadian Health System doesn't have its kinks! But because of your physical location of Cleveland ...you will get the BRUNT of they unhappy Canadians. I went to a regular Drs. office just last week and waited & waited & waited. Trust me, and you know as well, We Americans have our share of Medical Horror stories too. But overall Canadas Health care is much better. Dont forget that includes Dental, Eye glasses, Perscriptions, MATERNITY LEAVE for both parents...etc!

And all those rich oil arabs also come here for their medical care. People from all over the world comes to the U.S. for healthcare. And lots of them come to the Clinic. .,

Depends on where they are from. Rich oil Arabs have $$$$$, and the foreigners who come to Clinics usually come from 3rd World countries.

A friend of mine actually MOVED to the US - got work to transfer him - to get his toddler with heart problems the proper medical care. Canada was basically going to let the kid die.

OMG! How is the kid? What happened?
That is VERY scary. But again those stories are here too with all the major Insurance Companies. Its not like ALL Children in Canada with Heart problems will die.

There are a couple things I think should never be opposed on political bases and healthcare is one of them. When you are sick or in pain, it is good to have the best healthcare in the world available..

TOTAL Agreement here

We shouldn't lower our standards to that of Canada because it is politically popular.

Ok this is the disagree part. I really dont believe that Canada has lower their standards at all. In fact...Gonna say its the opposite. Maybe we should start a new board and let our Northern friends chime in! They certainly Know more about their Health care system than I.

The last part is my opinion, but the fact that people flock to the U.S. for care is FACT.

I do agree with you on that...to a point. For the most part its Foreigners with $$$, and the tide seems to be changing on that. My Aunt(RN) worked for many years in NYC @ the Hospital for Special Surgery, many of the worlds tycoons were her patients. However...from recent articles published.....that does seems to be changing. India offers some pretty AMAZING medical technology...and some AMAZING prices.

 

[katerkat]

You are kidding right? You had the choice to work 10.00 a hour or Mimimun wage...So YOU CHOOSE MINIMUM WAGE??????? If all these jobs were so good, why didnt you keep any?

The newspaper hired you because you work cheap, not because of your skills!!!

Wow, I'll have to tell the people I beat out for my first newspaper job that I got it because I promised to work cheaper than them.

And yes, since my husband is military, we moved four times in five years. (Actually, four times in three years!)

And, since you seem to doubt me - yes, I chose, when we moved to Oklahoma and then to Washington, to take a retail job instead of a newspaper job. At minimum wage. Because I was pregnant and wanted a low-stress job that I could leave when the baby was born. But I honestly, truly, loved working at the bookstore. I'd do it again if I could afford the gas and daycare. Because the money wasn't important - being happy at my job was. Shocking, I know!!

(But heck - I chose to work at WDW as a CP at $5.65 an hour, so what does that say about me?)

 

[cteddiesgirl]

I don't know WHY you make only $3 over minimum wage with a college degree. For answers like that, you need to look at yourself.

You've said before that you have extenuating circumstances in your life that set you back and that is why you live with your parents...did that have anything to do with your employment problems?

All I know is that there isn't any law saying Teddiesgirl can't make very much money. And it isn't anyone else's fault.

I have a friend who has a GED (never finished high school!) who is making $42K working in a hotel. Another friend who never finished college making about the same working for a title company, another who started as a bank teller is now making a bunch doing some kind of high-level banking. And none of them are especially bright. So, it can be done.

Our nurse's aids make $12-14/hour - that takes a one or two week course, I think. You could try that.

I also know a guy who started out with nothing and made millions. But he is really smart.

If you want more money, go get it. It's out there. Or, believe everyone who tells you that you can't (and why) and see how happy that makes you.

Yeah. Real easy for you to say these kinds of things. First of all, I know I could never work in Nursing. Secondly, I don't have the money to pay for any kind of class. I can't even afford a car.
And as I have no car, I can't get to very many places. Especially since the public transportation in this city is crappy.
I have no one to loan money to me. I can't even pay it back if I did.
My dad can only let me live in his house. He was just recently had his pay cut in half by his job. And at his age (64) He can't get another job that pays as much as he already makes. To add to that, he just had a heart attack and can't work for awhile. And with the type of job he does, he may never go back to work. My mom died 6 yrs ago and the insurance money she left me is gone to pay my large debt at that time. Five years ago, I had to have a major operation or possibly either die or have cancer and die. That bill is still not paid off. Heck, my computer isn't even paid off and it's also 5 yrs old.
I have no employment problems other than office jobs pay crap in this city unless you're an office manager. And because all my money is going out to pay for the stuff I need to live, I sure as heck can't afford to move anywhere else. And as my life is stressfull enough, I will not go into management and/or take on a stressfull job.
Some of you people think that everyone has to want to go into management or move up.

Look at herself. If she wants more money, she has to make changes in her own life - she can't change society's values. I never said it was a bad reflection on her. Are you finding stuff between the lines that isn't there?

And what changes should I make?
Do the kind of job you thing I should?
I can't change the fact that with all my allergies, I have to buy fairly expensive soap and shampoo just to be clean. I can't just run to the dollar store and buy any soap they have on hand. I also have to carry my soap around with me everywhere I go. Which means I have to use more of it than you do of your own soap.
Due to my body shape and size, I have to spend more on my clothes and shoes than I can really afford. And that's only when I have to have clothes. I'm still wearing some shirts and pants I bought 5 yrs ago. As I am well developed, I also have to spend more on my undergarments. I have to have a 5EE shoe which is extremely hard to find. I recently had no choice (as my old shoes were falling apart) but to spend $330 for 3 pairs of shoes just to have for work. And that was finding them as cheap as I possibly could. And that's not all I have to worry about. I also have no health insurance through my job. And I sure as heck can't afford to buy it on my own.

I have been looking to find another job that I can do that pays more. It's just not there right now. At least, not anywhere that I can physically get to.
I have also sold stuff online for years just to try to make extra money. For a while, that worked really well. But it no longer does for me as I have nothing left of value to sell.

Gee. I can't change my body without money for major surgery. I cetainly can't change my body chemistry so that I'm no longer allergic to perfumes that are in almost everything. Gee, who the hell is going to give me a large loan to start whatever business you think I should start as I have extremely bad credit (due to all my problems).

So, you tell me. What the hell should I change?
You have no idea what people go thru and how their finances are, what their circumstances are or anything. So do not make assumptions about anyone.
So you really need to shut your mouth and stop insinuating that people are lazy or stupid.

 

[ashjohnson80]

If I could get a job at all I would be happy. I have a bachelor's degree and not a lot of work experience but I did own a furniture store for over 3 years. I've given up trying to get something that is even remotely close to what I majored in (history) and I've applied for many jobs that don't even require a college degree and I've even applied for retail in the mall. Nothing. I've had a couple of job interviews for teacher's assistant positions that don't require degrees or certifications and I can't even get that. I wish that doing the responsible thing and going to college, finishing college and all of that would ensure me a well paying job, or any job at all for that matter, but sometimes that's just not the case.

 

[BuckNaked]

Are you saying you move around allot?

Nope, I don't. But katerkat's husband does, or did you not read her post?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

So AGAIN you too were offered a HIGH PAYING job but said...NOOOOOOOOOOO Give me the Minimum wage job????
Lets be honest here...YOU TOOK THE MINIMUM WAGE JOB...BECAUSE THAT IS ALL WHAT WAS BEING OFFERED TO YOU!

Jeez!

Yeah--okay..you got me..that's why I took it...NOT!!!!!

Let's be honest. No one is forced to work at gun point for any wage at all.

Some of my jobs were NOT the only ones out there--but I chose them b/c they were fun! Can't beat free concerts in college!!! (Rollling Stones gig--minimum wage...got to see the concert for FREE. NOONE held me at gunpoint to take that job!) In fact there was competition to work for that place and not everyone got hired--a position that was in high demand to be filled. They did not want for employees.

 

[Charade]

Yeah. Real easy for you to say these kinds of things. First of all, I know I could never work in Nursing. Secondly, I don't have the money to pay for any kind of class. I can't even afford a car.
And as I have no car, I can't get to very many places. Especially since the public transportation in this city is crappy.
I have no one to loan money to me. I can't even pay it back if I did.
My dad can only let me live in his house. He was just recently had his pay cut in half by his job. And at his age (64) He can't get another job that pays as much as he already makes. To add to that, he just had a heart attack and can't work for awhile. And with the type of job he does, he may never go back to work. My mom died 6 yrs ago and the insurance money she left me is gone to pay my large debt at that time. Five years ago, I had to have a major operation or possibly either die or have cancer and die. That bill is still not paid off. Heck, my computer isn't even paid off and it's also 5 yrs old.
I have no employment problems other than office jobs pay crap in this city unless you're an office manager. And because all my money is going out to pay for the stuff I need to live, I sure as heck can't afford to move anywhere else. And as my life is stressfull enough, I will not go into management and/or take on a stressfull job.
Some of you people think that everyone has to want to go into management or move up.

And what changes should I make?
Do the kind of job you thing I should?
I can't change the fact that with all my allergies, I have to buy fairly expensive soap and shampoo just to be clean. I can't just run to the dollar store and buy any soap they have on hand. I also have to carry my soap around with me everywhere I go. Which means I have to use more of it than you do of your own soap.
Due to my body shape and size, I have to spend more on my clothes and shoes than I can really afford. And that's only when I have to have clothes. I'm still wearing some shirts and pants I bought 5 yrs ago. As I am well developed, I also have to spend more on my undergarments. I have to have a 5EE shoe which is extremely hard to find. I recently had no choice (as my old shoes were falling apart) but to spend $330 for 3 pairs of shoes just to have for work. And that was finding them as cheap as I possibly could. And that's not all I have to worry about. I also have no health insurance through my job. And I sure as heck can't afford to buy it on my own.

I have been looking to find another job that I can do that pays more. It's just not there right now. At least, not anywhere that I can physically get to.
I have also sold stuff online for years just to try to make extra money. For a while, that worked really well. But it no longer does for me as I have nothing left of value to sell.

Gee. I can't change my body without money for major surgery. I cetainly can't change my body chemistry so that I'm no longer allergic to perfumes that are in almost everything. Gee, who the hell is going to give me a large loan to start whatever business you think I should start as I have extremely bad credit (due to all my problems).

So, you tell me. What the hell should I change?
You have no idea what people go thru and how their finances are, what their circumstances are or anything. So do not make assumptions about anyone.
So you really need to shut your mouth and stop insinuating that people are lazy or stupid.

You can't do certain work because of A, B, C and D.

You won't do certain work because of X, Y and Z.

What do you think your pay should be for the type job you have now? Is that job in your area worth that much?

A better question is what type of job are you qualified to do?

Don't think of me as heartless (but remember, I'm an EVIL Republican) and I'm sorry that you've had so much misfortune and setbacks in your life but honestly, what would you like to see happen to make your life better?

 

[georgia4now]

Well, with any luck, it would be you that lost your job. Oops, capitalism sucks.

FWIW, it amazes me how companies still make record profits. Not really, they do it with greed and on the backs of low-level employees. Ever stop to realize that 10,000 less PROFIT could mean a considerable raise or bonus for employees? Yes, in a capitalist world, it's better to make the money for yourself and let others flounder. In a just world, that's reprehensible.

Wow, you hope I loose my job? And you are supposed to be the thoughtful one? I love it when you libs show your true, hateful colors.

My job is to manage a budget...THAT'S IT. When I go in to my Tuesday morning meeting, I have to show how my division (marketing) made money and supported other departments to do the same. And guess what - WHEN I DO THAT, I CAN GO HIRE MORE PEOPLE!!! WE ARE RECRUITING FOR 3 MORE RIGHT NOW - Your way of thinking is busted. I am NOT running a charity...I'm running a BUSINESS unit. When my company is successful, I am successful, and the team I manage is successful. I don't expect you to get that, but it works!

And as far as making money for myself - you're absolutely right. My mission is to make my family as comfortable as possible, send my kids to the best schools, take care of our ageing parents, etc. so that society does not have to do it for me. Your job is to tkae care of yourself. Personal responsibility is the name of the game!

I'll carry on helping the economy, you keep reminding people that they are slaves to big business. I'll give them opportunities (like pay for 80% college tuition) and you remind them they don't have a chance. I'll have quarterly meetings with them to help them plan their career paths, you give them a million reasons why it wont work.

You should be ashamed of yourself. And you EVERYBODY on my staff an apology.

Bay the way, the lowest paid person I have is making $11 per hour. She also goes to college part time on the company dime.

 

[DVC Sadie]

Wow, you hope I loose my job? And you are supposed to be the thoughtful one? I love it when you libs show your true, hateful colors.

My job is to manage a budget...THAT'S IT. When I go in to my Tuesday morning meeting, I have to show how my division (marketing) made money and supported other departments to do the same. And guess what - WHEN I DO THAT, I CAN GO HIRE MORE PEOPLE!!! WE ARE RECRUITING FOR 3 MORE RIGHT NOW - Your way of thinking is busted. I am NOT running a charity...I'm running a BUSINESS unit. When my company is successful, I am successful, and the team I manage is successful. I don't expect you to get that, but it works!

And as far as making money for myself - you're absolutely right. My mission is to make my family as comfortable as possible, send my kids to the best schools, take care of our ageing parents, etc. so that society does not have to do it for me. Your job is to tkae care of yourself. Personal responsibility is the name of the game!

I'll carry on helping the economy, you keep reminding people that they are slaves to big business. I'll give them opportunities (like pay for 80% college tuition) and you remind them they don't have a chance. I'll have quarterly meetings with them to help them plan their career paths, you give them a million reasons why it wont work.

You should be ashamed of yourself. And you EVERYBODY on my staff an apology.

Bay the way, the lowest paid person I have is making $11 per hour. She also goes to college part time on the company dime.

Great Post!

There will always be people who will find reasons why they can't succeed just as they will always be others that simply do what it takes so they do succeed.

 

[DISUNC]

Wow, I'll have to tell the people I beat out for my first newspaper job that I got it because I promised to work cheaper than them.

And yes, since my husband is military, we moved four times in five years. (Actually, four times in three years!)

And, since you seem to doubt me - yes, I chose, when we moved to Oklahoma and then to Washington, to take a retail job instead of a newspaper job. At minimum wage. Because I was pregnant and wanted a low-stress job that I could leave when the baby was born. But I honestly, truly, loved working at the bookstore. I'd do it again if I could afford the gas and daycare. Because the money wasn't important - being happy at my job was. Shocking, I know!!

(But heck - I chose to work at WDW as a CP at $5.65 an hour, so what does that say about me?)

"Because the money wasn't important". It says you are very Lucky!

It's really nice that you can CHOOSE jobs that you like, really it is! However you are CHOOSING those jobs, because you are NOT the sole support of yourself or your family! You are working for "fun" (lack of a better term)Employers know that your situation is not LONG TERM! Therefore, they hire you at minimum wage.
You even state "I'd do it again if I could afford the gas and daycare."...There are Thousands of people who are the SOLE support of their families or themselves and dont have the options you have....and YES they are saying the same as you! This is a blight on our country!