Rental Activity on R/T Board After Feb. 1 Changes

[jcf]

By the same line of thought, a person who never posts, except to rent their points on the Rent/Trade board, really isn't contributing to the overall health of the discussion board community, the same community to whom they wish to rent.

Again, there are other fansites to which you do not need to post if you find it difficult to do so, but there are also sites that would require a financial contribution in other ways...like pay a percentage of the rental (ebay), or a membership fee for access to advanced services. We ask for neither, only participation.

But, let me repeat what I've stated in other threads to be perfectly clear. The current requirements are NOT being reconsidered at this time.

As I said before it's good to be king

 

[jcf]

I think this new policy will help him = less competition

 

[RobDoc]

The DISboards in general and the DVC forums in particular have undergone a lot changes since 1997 and many of those changes have come with predictions of the demise of the site. The DISboards have seen numerous suggestions that the site will decline due to such changes in policies, some coming from websites created to meet a perceived weakness.

Those suggesting any collaboration between DIS moderators and any advertiser are waaaay off base and entirely incorrect. Our advertisers are valued partners, but none have any influence on board policies or in any websites filtered by the DIS.

At this time the Rent/Trade Board appears to be a seller's market for those who have chosen to meet the posting requirements in place at this time. Whether that continues to be the case will be seen in the coming months.

Currently the DIS averages 180,000 visitors a day with 50-100 new member accounts each day and as I write this post there are 2,839 Users online right now (1,049 members and 1,790 guests). At busier times of the day, we are well over 3500 Users online at the same time.

 

[WDWBlue]

Hello Everyone,

As any economist will tell you, any attempt to influence a free market will result in unintended consequences. Up to this point, the Rent/Trade board has been a relatively free market, with sellers offering rents or trades from 10 points to 500 points to a large amount of buyers.

As of February 1, though, the Rent/Trade board has created a barrier to entry in this formerly free market. There is now a toll to pay if you want to post. One must have an evenly-spread 6-month history of posts on DISboards if one wants to post to the Rent/Trade board.

First, I’ll comment on the changes that you can already see. One, the volume of posts on the site has dropped precipitously. Before Feburary 1 you could find twenty-five people offering points for any given resort, now you will find five. Two, the number of individuals making posts on the site has dropped as members lacking the requisite posting history have been weeded out of the eligible posting pool. Three, the prices of points has gone up because the number of sellers has decreased as the numbers of buyers has stayed the same. Supply has shrunk while demand has stayed constant, creating a seller’s market.

These are the effects that are immediately observed. In addition to those changes, you will see the two following changes in the near future:

Consequence # 1: Post increases: More Quantity, Less Quality

As a result of creating a “50 posts in 6 months” tariff for the privilege of posting on the Rent/Trade board, the number of inane, useless, repetitive, and inaccurate posts sitewide will rise exponentially. So as not to be insulting, I will use myself as an example. In the past, I have not done a lot of posting. Socially, I am the type of person who does not speak unless I have something beneficial, helpful, or unique to say. As I have perused the HUGE volume of information on DISboards, I have almost always found information to answer my Disney-related questions, and thus have not posted questions that I could answer through a simple search.

My posting habits changed once I realized the Rent/Trade board’s mandate to post over 50 times within six months. I want to sell points for the first time since I joined DISboards in 2009, and I need to have 50 posts to do so! The change to the posting rules increased my posting activity on DISboards, and I stopped searching for information before posting. Now, my posts might repeat another person’s question or information, reducing the value of both duplicate posts to the membership and creating a glut of information to choke up DISboard’s already taxed search engine.

Consquence # 2: Restricted Marketplace: The fat cats take over

As low-point-number sellers are thinned out of the Rent/Trade board, it will become increasingly dominated by members who trade large volumes of points on a regular basis. These members are profiting from their relationship with DISboards, and thus will do what they need to do in order to keep their posting privileges live. (Is it possible that some members got advance notice of these changes?) This takes away a benefit from members who are infrequent point traders and drives down competition.

This change benefits two groups of people, though. The members who are still able to post are benefitted as prices rise and competition drops. Also, the sponsors and advertisers on DISboards benefit as frustrated buyers turn to other markets in their search for points. This is the most insidious part of this rules change, as the benefits to the advertisers suggest a deliberate collaboration between the advertisers and the moderators of the Rent/Trade board.

This means that the board is not truly serving the needs of the members.

Please reply to this post and share your thoughts with the community. Personally, I LOVE all of the user-generated information on DISboards, and I valued the option of trading DVC points as a side benefit. Hopefully we can restore the fair and equitable market that the Rent/Trade board used to be.

Rhett

Outstanding Post! Nothing inane here!

 

[Chuck S]

Let me reiterate what WebmasterDoc said, "Our advertisers are valued partners, but none have any influence on board policies or in any websites filtered by the DIS."

 

[WDWBlue]

By the same line of thought, a person who never posts, except to rent their points on the Rent/Trade board, really isn't contributing to the overall health of the discussion board community, the same community to whom they wish to rent.

But weren't they providing a service to other Disboards members by offering a greater varieity at a lower cost and smaller amount of points for rent?

It seems that this is the point some are trying to make, the open market made for more reservations at lower costs to Disboards members.

 

[Chuck S]

But weren't they providing a service to other Disboards members by offering a greater varieity at a lower cost and smaller amount of points for rent?

It seems that this is the point some are trying to make, the open market made for more reservations at lower costs to Disboards members.

They are welcome to continue offering their points, all they need to do is post regularly on boards other than the rent/Trade board.

We are no more "restricting the market" by requiring a minimum number of posts than ebay is by requiring payment for providing the webspace for their sellers. We have not forbidden anyone to post, as long they meet our minimum non-Rent/Trade posting requirement.

If an owner finds our requirements too restrictive, they are free to explore other venues.

 

[WDWBlue]

They are welcome to continue offering their points, all they need to do is post regularly on boards other than the rent/Trade board.

We are no more "restricting the market" by requiring a minimum number of posts than ebay is by requiring payment for providing the webspace for their sellers. We have not forbidden anyone to post, as long they meet our minimum non-Rent/Trade posting requirement.

If an owner finds our requirement too restrictive, they are free to explore other venues.

I'm not trying to be argumentative, I do appreciate the time you're taking here.

I think those comparing current rent/trade board activity to some point in the past (before these changes) makes it clear that the market has been restricted, whether that was the intention or not.

 

[RobDoc]

I'm not trying to be argumentative, I do appreciate the time you're taking here.

I think those comparing current rent/trade board activity to some point in the past (before these changes) makes it clear that the market has been restricted, whether that was the intention or not.

The "market" has never been a concern. The intent of the Rent/Trade Board is the only concern here and that intent was to provide an opportunity for active members of the DIS community to utlilize DVC points they would otherwise be unable to use. It was never intended to be a place to rent speculative reservations or otherwise take advantage of the generosity of the DIS. Some of those posting in this very thread have benefitted tremendously from that generosity in the past without participating in the community. The current policy addresses that very issue.

 

[jcf]

While there is LITTLE activity on the board now...new rule killed it...

 

[lilpooh108]

I like the new rule. Around this time last year, there were 2 instances of renters panicking due to either inexperienced owners screwing up their reservations or engaging in otherwise unscrupulous behavior. The new rules filter out: (1) owners who create new logins to use the DISboards for fraudulent purposes; and (2) inexperienced owners who might need to learn a bit more before renting/transferring to others. The new rule cuts down on the possibility that something will go wrong.

In any event, I'm not sure why people are complaining. The R/T boards is a "free" service. Consider the posting rules a "tax" for the privilege of renting/transferring your points which might otherwise go to waste. Like PPs have said, if you don't like the new rule, just use another service.

 

[DMKEDM]

I just checked the R/T board.

There are only 5 open threads on the first page!

I think that rather definitively answers the question about whether activity has decreased due to the rules changes!!

Whether this is a good or bad thing I don't know. But it certainly demonstrates that one service of the DIS is MUCH less available than it used to be.

 

[Mississippian]

I currently don't own any DVC points. We sold ours a couple of years ago because of the bad economy. We're looking to buy back in resale in the next year or so. I'd like to use the rent/trade board to shop for rentals in the meantime.

I understand the need to place restrictions on the rent/trade board to help ensure that those advertising will be legitimate owners. I do think the threshold has been set too high. There are essentially no points for rent. I've scanned the list, and the available points have dropped by about 90 percent or more.

I realize the 50-post-per-6-months rule might not seem like much to moderators who post all the time, but I have been a member of this forum for 10 years and have posted about 700 times. That's an average of 70 posts per year. That obviously makes me a member of long standing and a regular user. It's actually pretty heavy usage.

Please understand that my complaint is not that I have points that I want to rent and that I can't offer them. Rather, that I want to shop and the shelves are empty. I'm not suggesting that you get rid of all the rules, just relax them a little so more active forum members who don't stay glued to their computers can offer their points.

 

[Laurabearz]

I am very amused that so many of the professional renters couldnt find it in themselves to post 8-10 times a month... acting like they were being asked to climb Mt Everest or something... stomping their feet... pouting.... (maybe the DIS needs to allow political posts again hahaha)

I find it amusing.

With that said, under the new guidelines I dont think even I qualify to post on the rent/trade board, even with my 13,000 plus posts... since I have been mostly lurking the past year.... Luckily I have no plans to rent any points at the moment so I have time to work up my posting...

 

[RobDoc]

I am very amused that so many of the professional renters couldnt find it in themselves to post 8-10 times a month... acting like they were being asked to climb Mt Everest or something... stomping their feet... pouting.... (maybe the DIS needs to allow political posts again hahaha)

I find it amusing.

With that said, under the new guidelines I dont think even I qualify to post on the rent/trade board, even with my 13,000 plus posts... since I have been mostly lurking the past year.... Luckily I have no plans to rent any points at the moment so I have time to work up my posting...

LOL! - I wish more would have been "lurking" like you! I just looked at your past 6 months of "lurking" and you have also contributed about 150 posts!

 

[CarolAnnC]

I like the new rule. Around this time last year, there were 2 instances of renters panicking due to either inexperienced owners screwing up their reservations or engaging in otherwise unscrupulous behavior. The new rules filter out: (1) owners who create new logins to use the DISboards for fraudulent purposes; and (2) inexperienced owners who might need to learn a bit more before renting/transferring to others. The new rule cuts down on the possibility that something will go wrong.

In any event, I'm not sure why people are complaining. The R/T boards is a "free" service. Consider the posting rules a "tax" for the privilege of renting/transferring your points which might otherwise go to waste. Like PPs have said, if you don't like the new rule, just use another service.

You bring up some very good points.

I do not moderate on the DVC Rent/Trade Board, but I am well aware of the extensive time spent by the (volunteer) moderators of that board. Without them, there would be no Rent/Trade Board, and I for one appreciate all the time and effort they put into making that board available for the regular posters of the DIS.

Personally, I have never rented out points, nor rented or transferred any myself. But, if I were to consider such, I appreciate the Rent/Trade board being there as an option.

Why do people feel "entitled" to have this "free service" at their own discretion, and according to what they feel the "rules" should be? If their neighbor were having a yard or garage sale, would they just show up even if they were not speaking with them socially and expect to put their stuff in the neighbor's yard and sell it for their own profit? Even if the neighbor said, you don't have to pay me cash for the use of my yard, for the advertising for clients, etc.; you just have to come speak to me socially a couple of times a week? Would people stomp around the yard and complain to everyone that they should be entitled to sell their items, yet refuse to talk to the neighbor?

That seems to be what is happening here, and I think it is disgraceful.

 

[RobDoc]

Just b/c some people contribute less doesn't mean their contribution should be discounted...or they should be penalized...most people who think it's a "great" idea probably never rented...

In reviewing your own last 6 months of posts - you have made about 100 and they were farily evenly distrubuted except that almost half were on the Rent/Trade Board where you had 6 different rental threads between September 6, 2010 and January 5, 2011. During the time those 6 threads were posted you had a total of 6 posts on other forums. No posts were made after January 5 for over a month. Going back to June, 2010 you also had 2 more rental threads.

Since February 7 you have now added about 50 posts. It would seem that 50 posts evenly distributed could have easily been met over the past 6 months. No one has been penalized. Meeting the posting requirement is a choice. If anyone finds value from the Rent/Trade Board (with 8 different rental threads over a 9 month period, it sounds as though you must have found at least some value), they have the option/choice to meet the posting requirement in order to benefit from the service offered by the site.

Since June, 2005 almost 50% of your total posts have been on the Rent/Trade Board.

 

[jcf]

I contribute when I can...never kept track where or when...I am busy at times.

At end of last year I was super busy and no rooms were available on points within my small travel window...so I did need to rent points and was looking at Feb vacation on cash...but had to cancel as my schedule picked up again.

I do think the new policy could expose renters to DVC people who have little or no renting experience which could cause more problems but only time will tell. I do know from the people I have rented to that they would never rent from someone with 50 posts. Prior renters contact me every year, at times I have more requests than points.

Clearly, I have too many points and not enough time...so I am selling down my membership. Again, didn't intend to attack anyone...

 

[lakohls]

As a relative "newcomer" to disboards and the threads here is my experience/perspective for what it is worth.

We joined DVC in 2009 and had a great vacation April 2010. Fall 2010 I started planning for Fall 2011 and realized there had to be a better way to research etc. I read the Mom's Panel & found out about Disboards and joined last fall.

I only had 1 post in the first 3 months as I was primarily researching & was not as knowledgeable as many (both about posting etiquette and Disney in general). I had scanned the renters thread as well last fall & was amazed at how easy it seemed it would be to add-on to a vacation with all the help available if I needed it. At the time it was not necessary as we had adequate points for our Nov 2011 trip.

In Jan/Feb my parents decided to join us, but wanted their own unit. So I went back to the renters board thinking perfect - should be no problem to work this out. I can post a thread looking to transfer or rent someone else's extras!

I quickly realized that there were more rules to this board than the others. As a result I have spent much more time the last few months looking for threads I could contribute to in a positive manner (instead of just throwing stuff out there to meet the qualifications). The intent was that by the 7 month window I would qualify to post my request. I'm still not sure that I will/would as I may not have enough of an even spread.

Now I do have a happy ending - by watching the rent board & posting a couple of responses to posts that had extra points I have secured what I need point wise & have a reservation for my parents at OWK, that I will hopefully move in April to Kidani.

And while I am sure that I will still be "lurking" around on the boards leading up to Nov researching etc, I will almost certainly have fewer posts. And I will have to remember to begin posting more aggressively at least a year ahead of any future trips to ensure that I meet the 6 month posting guidleline at least 6 months prior to any planned trip (in the event that I again could use some extras).

Thanks to all for your help on the various boards - there is a lot of great info out here.

 

[vicki_c]

lakohls - just to be clear, you don't have to meet any kind of minimum to respond to an owner's offer on the R/T boards, you only need that if you want to post your own points for rent.

No one can originate a "points wanted" thread anymore, if I'm recalling the rules correctly, only respond to offers posted.