Recent Budget Threads and SAHMs

[RadioFanatic]

I remember one of the threads DVC Liz was talking about - the one I'm thinking of, the girl was SAH but not a mom - they recently moved and they were in dire straits. I myself responded why she didn't get a job and she essentially refused - I'll try to find it. Those are the ones that drive me crazy - I appreciate SAHM's (my mom was one) but know it will not be something I will do.

 

[DiznEeyore]

In defense of The Disney Bunch, some of these threads have referenced not allowing other people to raise your children, missing all the firsts, being proud your children never had to go to daycare etc. If you don't think that is a slam against working moms, then you are not thinking from a working mom's point of view.

If they've referenced those things, it's because those are the REASONS the moms are choosing to stay at home!! You shouldn't feel "slammed" if you don't agree ... just live your life and don't worry about what other people think. Why does it matter to you?

Now, doubtless I will be FLAMED again (as I have been multiple times in the past on this board) for my opinion, but I'm going to share it because the OP asked WHY those of us feeling the pinch "don't just get a job."

I have been a daycare worker, a stay-at-home mom, and have worked both part-time and full-time as a mom so I feel I am uniquely qualified to weigh in on the topic. I saw what the little ones left in daycare for 10 hours a day went through missing their parents. I had parents bring obviously sick kids into school, only to have them throw up a few minutes later and then proceed to get everyone else in the center sick, just so the parent wouldn't have to miss work (uh -- they had to miss ANYWAY when we called them to come pick up their child!). I was there when babies took their first steps or said their first words -- things their parents missed. I could see how sad some of the moms were when they heard us tell them about these milestones.

After I got married and became a mom, I had another job in daycare, only in the corporate office of a multi-state chain. I was the assistant to the president. I worked part-time, and he offered me free daycare if I'd go full-time. I said no way, and left so he could hire someone full-time. I've had other jobs since then, but have always had a family member (or my dh if he was home) watch our son.

That is why I PERSONALLY chose not to work and put my son in daycare. I'm sorry if it offends anyone, but that's the way it is. My choice. Maybe not yours, but MINE.

Now, I am again a SAHM. My dh was laid off last year from his full-time job. He has only had part-time and temporary full-time jobs since then. I have worked two full-time temporary jobs since then, but one was from home, and the other I could bring my ds to. I homeschool our son, and while we have carefully weighed the idea of my returning to work and putting our son back in public school, we believe that that is NOT what God wants us to do at this time.

Also, studies have shown that it's even more important for pre-teens and teens to have the guidance and supervision of at least one parent than it is for little ones! If I was working, he'd been left to his own devices after school each day ... that's when kids get into the most trouble.

My dh loves having me home to accommodate his schedule (he literally works all hours of the day and night and never knows when he will be called out on a job), plus, realistically, there's no way I could get a job with any kind of set schedule. Also, he makes a lot more at his various jobs than I would at even a full-time gig.

So, OP, THAT'S why I don't just "get a job". We're definitely pinched, but we're doing okay, not paycheck to paycheck, and this is my only child. My life isn't centered around him, but I do feel it's my responsibility to be here for him 'til he's grown (I'll only be 42 when he's 18). God willing, there'll be plenty of time for me to work then.

 

[bevtoy]

In defense of The Disney Bunch, some of these threads have referenced not allowing other people to raise your children, missing all the firsts, being proud your children never had to go to daycare etc. If you don't think that is a slam against working moms, then you are not thinking from a working mom's point of view. I work with two children. My husband was married before and pays a lot of child support. I also have a Masters Degree and make a great income. I am proud of the fact that my children are in private school and already have their entire college needs funded. They are both gifted and excel in school. I have seen every one of their firsts (maybe later in the day) but it was still the first time I saw them. They have been in top notch daycares. But I can understand that if you didn't have a high paying job it might not be worth it financially to work. If your family is in dire straits, you need to do something though. Being a SAHM is not more important than putting food on the table or paying your bills.

I see how you view some things as slam against working Moms, then you go on to state how your children have private schools, college funds, excel at day cares, etc... a SAHM could feel that you are slamming her because her children may not have all those things.

I think its a simple matter of preference.

We as women are over sensitive and have gotten the big egos we accuse men of having! We tend to compete over who is the better mother, one who works or one who doesn't.
The truth is we are all awsome, because we each have the courage and freedom to do what we feel is best for our own family. <waving a "Thank God I am an American" sign>

For some it is more important to be home than it is to put food on the table or to pay bills. Some folks have children at risk and being there for those children, even if it means being on aid is more important.

Sometimes having a college fund all tied up in a neat packedge ruins young people, sometimes it helps, depends on the attitude of the person who is being educated. I wish I could do that for my children but I can not, my DB and his wife did that for their daughter and she (a whole other story) all but spit on it! (A heartach after working so hard to give her an education)

Women need to support each others lifestyle decisions and not feel competitive or threatened by the others choice whether it is to work or to be a SAHM.

I have been both, I worked in a fairly good job (civil service which I loved) till I was injured and retired on Federal Disability. I still work 2 days a weekend part time with persons with disabilities supervising their daily activities. I am also a part time college student.

I am home when my children leave for school, I am there when they walk in the door and I love it. I would never have willingly chosen to saty home, but being thrust in this situation has opened my eyes to the rewards of being a SAHM.
If I recover from my injuries I want to be able to work again in gainfull employment, but I am conflicted because I want to be there for my kids till they go to college. One day at a time is my motto.

P.S. I admire what you have accomplished!

 

[DVCLiz]

Sorry to miss this part of the discussion!!! I had to go to slepp...

I wasn't referencing any particular poster in my OP, but I did seem to pick up on several recent threads where posters had financial difficulties that seemed to slip over the edge of "belt tightening so I can stay home" and into real "we don't have anything to fall back on and we're losing ground fast" territory. If that's the case, I wondered why there seemed to be such a disconnect with their SAHM status.

It would make basic sense to me that if your family was that close to the edge - which I would loosely define as no savings, no retirement, overextended with personal debt on credit cards and car payments, no room in the budget for medical expenses, etc. (didn't someone recently say she hadn't had dental care in several years? Anyone remember if she worked or not??) then it would be time to realize that being a SAHM was an expensive luxury the family could no longer afford.

So I was just curious about where your "personal line" was drawn, I guess. How much sacrifice is worth it? Are any of you worried about retirement - those of you who are having to forgo retirement savings to be able to stay home?? I guess that's the main issue with me - retirement and future financial stability. Most of us can see that logically you can give up many of the material goods pretty easily.

 

[LBelle]

If they've referenced those things, it's because those are the REASONS the moms are choosing to stay at home!! You shouldn't feel "slammed" if you don't agree ... just live your life and don't worry about what other people think. Why does it matter to you?

Now, doubtless I will be FLAMED again (as I have been multiple times in the past on this board) for my opinion, but I'm going to share it because the OP asked WHY those of us feeling the pinch "don't just get a job."

I have been a daycare worker, a stay-at-home mom, and have worked both part-time and full-time as a mom so I feel I am uniquely qualified to weigh in on the topic. I saw what the little ones left in daycare for 10 hours a day went through missing their parents. I had parents bring obviously sick kids into school, only to have them throw up a few minutes later and then proceed to get everyone else in the center sick, just so the parent wouldn't have to miss work (uh -- they had to miss ANYWAY when we called them to come pick up their child!). I was there when babies took their first steps or said their first words -- things their parents missed. I could see how sad some of the moms were when they heard us tell them about these milestones.

After I got married and became a mom, I had another job in daycare, only in the corporate office of a multi-state chain. I was the assistant to the president. I worked part-time, and he offered me free daycare if I'd go full-time. I said no way, and left so he could hire someone full-time. I've had other jobs since then, but have always had a family member (or my dh if he was home) watch our son.

That is why I PERSONALLY chose not to work and put my son in daycare. I'm sorry if it offends anyone, but that's the way it is. My choice. Maybe not yours, but MINE.

Now, I am again a SAHM. My dh was laid off last year from his full-time job. He has only had part-time and temporary full-time jobs since then. I have worked two full-time temporary jobs since then, but one was from home, and the other I could bring my ds to. I homeschool our son, and while we have carefully weighed the idea of my returning to work and putting our son back in public school, we believe that that is NOT what God wants us to do at this time.

Also, studies have shown that it's even more important for pre-teens and teens to have the guidance and supervision of at least one parent than it is for little ones! If I was working, he'd been left to his own devices after school each day ... that's when kids get into the most trouble.

My dh loves having me home to accommodate his schedule (he literally works all hours of the day and night and never knows when he will be called out on a job), plus, realistically, there's no way I could get a job with any kind of set schedule. Also, he makes a lot more at his various jobs than I would at even a full-time gig.

So, OP, THAT'S why I don't just "get a job". We're definitely pinched, but we're doing okay, not paycheck to paycheck, and this is my only child. My life isn't centered around him, but I do feel it's my responsibility to be here for him 'til he's grown (I'll only be 42 when he's 18). God willing, there'll be plenty of time for me to work then.

 

[KristinU]

I am very close to one of the situations the OP is asking about (family member) and I think there is a really deep psychology to it...at least that's what I've decided after trying to figure it out for many years. My family member was a SAHM and never went back to work (children are now grown and in their 30's and 40's)...yet when they as a couple fall on hard times financially (which is pretty frequent) she just gets upset and complains about what "someone else" is doing to them (like the mortgage lender, or the insurance company, or the utility companies) then they go to their children for money. I would scrub floors with a toothbrush before going to my children for money because we're in danger of no power, no food, or forclosure, but that's me and not her. In my miscellaneous arm-chair psychological asessments of her I've thought it might have something to do with what their social status had been when the kids were young, or possibly that her mother worked back when it wasn't as common and maybe that was an embarassment, or that she believes that she has no skills or abilities that anyone would want to hire her for.

I grew up with a working mom who, in my adult life, carried herself and my dad through a wicked layoff and supported them while he started and ran his own business (that did well for a while then fell off), then put him through school so he could do a late-life career change...did she love every minute of that - not at all...but I totally respect and admire her for all that she has done. So I have a really tough time seeing this other family member be so completely opposite of what I've seen in my mom (who is roughly the same age).

 

[KirstenB]

Sorry to miss this part of the discussion!!! I had to go to slepp...

I wasn't referencing any particular poster in my OP, but I did seem to pick up on several recent threads where posters had financial difficulties that seemed to slip over the edge of "belt tightening so I can stay home" and into real "we don't have anything to fall back on and we're losing ground fast" territory. If that's the case, I wondered why there seemed to be such a disconnect with their SAHM status.

It would make basic sense to me that if your family was that close to the edge - which I would loosely define as no savings, no retirement, overextended with personal debt on credit cards and car payments, no room in the budget for medical expenses, etc. (didn't someone recently say she hadn't had dental care in several years? Anyone remember if she worked or not??) then it would be time to realize that being a SAHM was an expensive luxury the family could no longer afford.

So I was just curious about where your "personal line" was drawn, I guess. How much sacrifice is worth it? Are any of you worried about retirement - those of you who are having to forgo retirement savings to be able to stay home?? I guess that's the main issue with me - retirement and future financial stability. Most of us can see that logically you can give up many of the material goods pretty easily.

Good question Liz. I'd be the first to say I hate details, especially financial details. I've been a SAHM for 3 years. We are comfortable financially. I do think about retirement and college for both daughters, and 2 weddings, etc. Right now I'm thinking about going back to work full time when dd2 starts school in 4 years. We have no family close by, so both dds will be in daycare. This is fine. DD1 was in daycare for 5 years.

Actually what concerns me more than I can say is the middle and high school years. Kids are still young, and I worry about predators, etc. Around here daycare ends when you turn 13. This is a small rural county, so many families have grandparents, etc to watch the kids. I'm hopeful I can find someone willing to keep an eye on dd1 when she ages out of daycare. Maybe my job will be to watch middle schoolers at my house, eek!

I have an IRA acct from when I was working, and DH has a 401k that he contributes to. I'm not looking to be "rich" in retirement, but none of us has a crystal ball, and I just want to make sure we don't outlive our savings.

P.S. Mrs Pete, my winter coat is 10 years old, and we rarely eat out. Thank God we haven't had to worry about anything else on your list!

 

[mickeyfan2]

If you are a SAHP and pay your bills, save for retirement and do some extras then it is a great decision for you.

But is you are not paying your bills and always stressed over money then a job is what is needed.

To live paycheck to paycheck for a short time is fine, but not for 20+ years.

 

[Robinrs]

 

[lovemygoofy]

Single Mom (involuntary btw, my ex was diagnosed with schizophrenia when my son was a baby) chiming in saying thank whoever you have to pray to that you HAVE A CHOICE....

And while you're on your knees hope you kept up with the world in case you do have to walk a mile in my shoes.

Robin, my mom was also a single mom and she may have had to *gasp* put me in public school, miss some of my school events, probably missed my first word and step. She managed to keep us clothed, fed and housed. I even turned out to not be a serial killer. Wonders never cease

 

[disneyjunkie]

If they've referenced those things, it's because those are the REASONS the moms are choosing to stay at home!! You shouldn't feel "slammed" if you don't agree ... just live your life and don't worry about what other people think. Why does it matter to you?

Now, doubtless I will be FLAMED again (as I have been multiple times in the past on this board) for my opinion, but I'm going to share it because the OP asked WHY those of us feeling the pinch "don't just get a job."

I have been a daycare worker, a stay-at-home mom, and have worked both part-time and full-time as a mom so I feel I am uniquely qualified to weigh in on the topic. I saw what the little ones left in daycare for 10 hours a day went through missing their parents. I had parents bring obviously sick kids into school, only to have them throw up a few minutes later and then proceed to get everyone else in the center sick, just so the parent wouldn't have to miss work (uh -- they had to miss ANYWAY when we called them to come pick up their child!). I was there when babies took their first steps or said their first words -- things their parents missed. I could see how sad some of the moms were when they heard us tell them about these milestones.

After I got married and became a mom, I had another job in daycare, only in the corporate office of a multi-state chain. I was the assistant to the president. I worked part-time, and he offered me free daycare if I'd go full-time. I said no way, and left so he could hire someone full-time. I've had other jobs since then, but have always had a family member (or my dh if he was home) watch our son.

That is why I PERSONALLY chose not to work and put my son in daycare. I'm sorry if it offends anyone, but that's the way it is. My choice. Maybe not yours, but MINE.

Now, I am again a SAHM. My dh was laid off last year from his full-time job. He has only had part-time and temporary full-time jobs since then. I have worked two full-time temporary jobs since then, but one was from home, and the other I could bring my ds to. I homeschool our son, and while we have carefully weighed the idea of my returning to work and putting our son back in public school, we believe that that is NOT what God wants us to do at this time.

Also, studies have shown that it's even more important for pre-teens and teens to have the guidance and supervision of at least one parent than it is for little ones! If I was working, he'd been left to his own devices after school each day ... that's when kids get into the most trouble.

My dh loves having me home to accommodate his schedule (he literally works all hours of the day and night and never knows when he will be called out on a job), plus, realistically, there's no way I could get a job with any kind of set schedule. Also, he makes a lot more at his various jobs than I would at even a full-time gig.

So, OP, THAT'S why I don't just "get a job". We're definitely pinched, but we're doing okay, not paycheck to paycheck, and this is my only child. My life isn't centered around him, but I do feel it's my responsibility to be here for him 'til he's grown (I'll only be 42 when he's 18). God willing, there'll be plenty of time for me to work then.

I've taught in day care centers, private schools and public schools for the last 14 years.

Over the years I've had both working parents and stay at home parents bring in sick children. They all have excuses why they can't keep the child home. Some are valid, but some are simply silly.

I've seen plenty of stay at home moms, who really need to get over themselves and get a job. If you have to go on welfare or apply for WIC in order to stay home, then your family can't afford for you not to work.

I don't understand the "I don't want anyone else to raise my kids" line. I've worked with hundreds of children, but I've only raised one, my son.

 

[pixiepower1971]

Please don't assume that just because I am a SAHM that I am uneducated. I have made a choice to be home with my children. My husband is active duty military. We move, sometimes every year. He is deployed quite often. The only constant in my childrens life is ME. We are doing what is best for them.

The other point I would like to address is to please not assume that because we are living on one income that we can not offer our children quality lives. They want for NOTHING! They have attended excellent private preschools and elementary schools. We our homeschooling them now, because it is what is right for us at the moment. My girls are involved in numerous activities, including competitive dance and gymnastics. They have college funds. They have new clothes and we drive nice cars. We vacation often.

If I choose to spend less by pinching in some areas, it is because those areas are not as important to me. I am frugal in order to allow for the things we want!

Not everyone is in the same situation. I feel for those that have to pinch more then we do. We were there when they were babies. But with no family nearby and constant moves, it was extremely hard to work and actually make any money after all the work related expenses were paid. We survived by being frugal and doing without some wants. That season of our lives is behind us.

Everyones situation is unique. If more women would support each others decisions instead of trying to put others down in order to make themselves feel better about their own situation(it goes both ways) the world would be a much more pleasant place.

 

[lovemygoofy]

I'm sure I shouldn't even be chiming in on this thread but here goes. I don't think its as easy as saying go get a job. Although the majority that have posted on here so far are educated and had great careers, its true many SAHMs don't have that back ground. She maybe able to get a job at wal-mart or even a secretary in an office. It's not just about factoring how much money that could be brought in, you have to factor in the money that would be going out:

Daycare is so expensive in some areas especially if you have more than one child or you have a special needs child and yes sometimes you just don't know everything about the person you are leaving your child with.

The cost of going back and forth to work whethe via private or public transportation including the actual time it takes to get to work and from work to home or daycare.

Appropriate clothing for work and then food for work(yes you can carry from home) but still factor in maybe $10/week just as a treat. Many SAHMs may not have the appropriate clothing anymore to work in an office setting and yes it can be found in second hand stores but still money going out at first when none brought in.

This is just not a black or white issue about getting a job. Some jobs just do not pay enough to be the miracle worker that some are expecting. Others on here are going to say go further ones education to make better money. Of course that's an option but then goes back to the money going out and not coming in. I think some people(not directed at anyone in particular) need to really think about this issue and yes the toes that could be stepped on before posting just off the top of their head.

 

[robinb]

Your little girl is sooooo BEAUTIFUL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you . I have to admit that she a devil in disguise .... she's quite a handful!

 

[MrsPete]

P.S. Mrs Pete, my winter coat is 10 years old, and we rarely eat out. Thank God we haven't had to worry about anything else on your list!

Actually, my winter coat isn't 10 years old, but it was bought from ebay; not that it matters much here where coats spend more time in the closet than on our backs. My list was not meant to be a check-list so much as an example of things that might cause people to decide it's time to make a change. I think everyone has a certain "I'm comfortable here" line.

 

[barbarabini]

I had one child and returned to work eight weeks later as an atty for a Ny firm. After 3 long months, I knew I wanted to be a SAHM. Dropping the baby off at 7 am and then rushing like crazy just to get home by 7 pm was too much. So were the nights I had to stay late and then the baby wouldn't sleep. My husband, also an attorney, held worse hours, so was not much help.

The only way i would have been able to carry on like that was with a live in full time nanny. I didnt really like the idea of someone taking care of the baby during the day AND overnight, it seemed to me to defeat the purpose of being a mother.

So, I quit. People said are you crazy? You went through all this school. You make alot of money, you have XYZ. But I stopped buying expensive bags, staying at super expensive hotels and dining at expensive restaraunts alot. I look for the best deal, where before, I didn't have time to. I clip coupons, I audit my bills, I even sell stuff on ebay.

Now, some women do not have the choice to quit, and they honestly need to work for their families. It is a shame that other women, judge that choice...you haven't walked a mile in their shoes. Other women so value the childrearing eperience, that they would eat rice and beans every day to be home with their children. It is their life and their choice. This board is about budgeting and these are the women who need the advice most. Different people have different priorities.

God knows that after the baby has spit up on my for the 4th time and my toddler doesn't want to eat the 3rd lunch I have made for her, I wish I was back in court. But usually, I am happy and satisfied with the choice.
Now, if I could get m husband to pay for a nanny to stay home with me and my kids. That would be ideal

 

[MrsPete]

Single Mom (involuntary btw, my ex was diagnosed with schizophrenia when my son was a baby) chiming in saying thank whoever you have to pray to that you HAVE A CHOICE....

And while you're on your knees hope you kept up with the world in case you do have to walk a mile in my shoes.

Having grown up as a child in a similar situation, I know it's no picnic, but you sound like you have your act together. Kids will grow up right if their parents are involved with their lives -- regardless of whether they work or not.

 

[MrsPete]

I don't understand the "I don't want anyone else to raise my kids" line. I've worked with hundreds of children, but I've only raised one, my son.

Yeah, I find that oft-repeated phrase offensive. If we accept this phrase as truth, then we'd also have to accept that the great majority of us STOP raising our children once they begin school -- and that's obviously not true. I may not have changed every diaper, but my husband and I are definitely the ones raising our children.

 

[va32h]

I have both worked and stayed at home, currently working from home.

I have three children - childcare for three kids took up 60% of my take home pay. Gas, working wardrobe, the convenience foods I ended up buying because I got home too late to cook - took up a significant portion of the remainder. And my income on paper bumped us up to the next tax bracket, so I paid more in taxes, too.

I could have found cheaper childcare, I suppose, but I didn't think that was an area I should skimp on, quite frankly.

Until my kids are all old enough to not require childcare, there is no point to my working outside the home.

I have complained about finances from time to time - most of us do not have excess piles of cash lying around, so it is only natural that we do fuss about the lack of it. Sometimes, when I say (or think) "we can't afford that" it isn't because I am completely broke, but because that money is earmarked for something else. When we are planning a trip to Disney, we "can't afford" movies or dinners out, because we'd rather put those funds in our Disney account. It doesn't mean we are living paycheck to paycheck.

Quite honestly, I don't think anyone who posts on a message board can be in that bad of shape financially, because they still have a computer and internet service. Either they are exaggerating their poverty, or they haven't come to grips with the seriousness of the problem. If I were truly "destitute" I would have canceled the internet service and sold the computer ages ago.

 

[RockyMtnMaria]

You don't think you are qualified to get a job?

You feel so strongly about staying home with your children that you'll endure any amount of financial hardship to do it?

Your childcare costs would eat up any paycheck you could earn?

Other reasons??

This IS my career. It was always my goal. I went to college but finally decided it was a waste of money for me, since my career choice was to be a mother, be it biologically, or through adoption.

I also chose my husband wisely. He was very supportive of my goals, and showed a gift that we knew would provide well for our future. We live very comfortably, but without the newest and best. His career is showing lots of promise and advancement even from where his is right now.