PM EMH drops from THREE Hours to TWO Hours

[Phatoomch]

Yes, in comparison to the early-listed hours on the calendar.

Virtually very month for years.

So, one hour has been dropped from EMH but general public hours are now longer?

 

[stitchrulz]

Many run only until 11PM or Midnight.

The parks are not "empty" and running an "average of 5 guests average per hour" by Midnight.

Someone mentioned that EMH's didn't always exist. That's true, but neither did "free" dining, and if they did away with that, I can only imagine the outcry that would commence. But, hey, I wouldn't care if they did away with FD. We don't participate in that.

Before EMH's waaaaay back in the day, at least during the off-season, the park attendance was such that EMH's weren't "necessary." With very little planning, you could do pretty much everything you wanted, even with MK closing early (7:00 or 8:00 - no fireworks). Now, thanks to aggressive promos like FD, big tour groups, etc., the parks are much busier, and the EMH's more important.

Everyone's entitled to his or her own opinion, of course. I don't think anyone's arguing that, speaking strictly from a black and white business perspective on paper, it doesn't makes sense because of course it does. I think part of the frustration is that some folks can't seem to quite grasp the sweet irony of Disney using the very purpose of the EMH as reasoning to do away with it. That's all.

BTW, I wouldn't be surprised if they do away with all EMH's if and when they get the other --Pass systems up and running.

 

[Robo]

So, one hour has been dropped from EMH but general public hours are now longer?

Nope.

 

[KellyNY]

You seem to want me to say something about data, but you've not been inclined towards any that I supplied.

Disney has been operating PM EMH for years with the last hour being the least-attended.
My data there seems to show that's what they must have intended to do for at least the last 9 years.
This year on "Leap Day," they even operated MK and DL 24 hours straight, with the wee small hours being the least attended.

I'm not saying that there are not fewer guests during the last hour of PM EM,
I'm saying that PM EMH is designed with that in mind.

Actually you not showing any data, only speculation that this change not worth it since more people will be unhappy then they save money.
The whole idea of EMH is "like having park to yourself", that is in their video and they speak of all EMH, not just the 3rd hour. Idea is to provide park for onsite vs. offsite, not to provide it for 5 people and if not enough people use something, there is no need for that and according to reports this is exactly what it is.

 

[culli]

This one single change? No. But this, in addition to the other changes coupled with the continuing price increases was the deciding factor for skipping our annual trip to the food and wine festival for the first time this year and extending our stay at Universal.

This is a site of well informed Disney connoisseurs and you are the only one who said they canceled a trip to Disney. They are weighing the cost saving against people who will actually not come. How much do you think the new fantasy land and the area that use to be toon town is costing? We are coming back for these types of enhancements not an extra 3rd hour at night. What about Toy Story Mania, updates to Winnie the Pooh and Test Track to name a few? This stuff isn't free and I for one prefer them to spend their money wisely. Plus this had possible upside work little downside that can easily be changed which would result in good publicity.

 

[Rip]

This is a site of well informed Disney connoisseurs and you are the only one who said they canceled a trip to Disney. They are weighing the cost saving against people who will actually not come. How much do you think the new fantasy land and the area that use to be toon town is costing? We are coming back for these types of enhancements not an extra 3rd hour at night. What about Toy Story Mania, updates to Winnie the Pooh and Test Track to name a few? This stuff isn't free and I for one prefer them to spend their money wisely. Plus this had possible upside work little downside that can easily be changed which would result in good publicity.

Actually, there are a number of posters on here that have cancelled plans to take a trip, decided against renewing their APs, etc. Also, there are a number of people that wouldn't cancel a trip if Mickey Mouse sacrificed a virgin at the end of Wishes on the steps of Cinderella's Castle every night. I know full well why Disney is cutting back, and they will continue to do so while raising prices every year until they see a drop in attendance revenue.

As far as the things you listed, I really have no interest in a few more meet and greets and a double Dumbo. TSM is ok, but it's basically a video game that moves you around.

At any rate, you asked if someone would cancel a trip due to this. I said not only because of this, but this is just one more thing that makes Disney less appealing to me and my family and combined with all of the other cutbacks and price hikes we decided it's not worth it every year anymore. We will visit again, but where we used to go twice a year, then once a year, now it will be every 3 or 4 years at most. We get a better value for our money from their competitor.

 

[Colleen27]

Actually, there are a number of posters on here that have cancelled plans to take a trip, decided against renewing their APs, etc.

And quite a few others who have said that this is the tipping point towards off-site resorts. I'm among them - I'm not going to quit going to WDW because I do enjoy it, but one by one Disney is doing away with the things that kept us paying the high premium for on-site lodging. We've stayed on site for all of our trips for two main reasons - the savings/convenience of the dining plan and access to late EMH. Now saving anything on the DDP requires constant thought/planning because a single low-cost choice can send it into the red and the shorter EMH offers little/no crowd advantage.

I have 4, maybe 5, trips planned for the next couple years and right now I'm only planning on staying at a Disney-owned resort for one of them. Great discounts might change my mind, though I don't think those are especially likely, but I'm just not willing to pay premium prices for what I see as declining quality and less-than-premium perks.

 

[Phatoomch]

Nope.

Sorry, I misunderstood your post to me.

I was just wondering if by dropping an hour, they may lengthen the park hours to the general public.

 

[bcrook]

Someone mentioned that EMH's didn't always exist. That's true, but neither did "free" dining, and if they did away with that, I can only imagine the outcry that would commence. But, hey, I wouldn't care if they did away with FD. We don't participate in that.

Before EMH's waaaaay back in the day, at least during the off-season, the park attendance was such that EMH's weren't "necessary." With very little planning, you could do pretty much everything you wanted, even with MK closing early (7:00 or 8:00 - no fireworks). Now, thanks to aggressive promos like FD, big tour groups, etc., the parks are much busier, and the EMH's more important.

Everyone's entitled to his or her own opinion, of course. I don't think anyone's arguing that, speaking strictly from a black and white business perspective on paper, it doesn't makes sense because of course it does. I think part of the frustration is that some folks can't seem to quite grasp the sweet irony of Disney using the very purpose of the EMH as reasoning to do away with it. That's all.

BTW, I wouldn't be surprised if they do away with all EMH's if and when they get the other --Pass systems up and running.

The bold is really the problem! I agree with those who cherish the third hour of EMH. Robo's argument is valid about losing 30% of our EMH time. That is significant!

 

[TLSnell1981]

I think this is hugely significant and fans should be slightly worried to be honest. Management can only cut away at the flesh so far before they start hitting bone.

Not diminishing, just changing. Look at the parks today verses the past. Improvements have been made overall, things added that most people enjoy and things taken away that most people don't value.

It's not just the "perks", but the meat and potatoes..literally.

You can not like a cut, but still be able to understand and defend it, coming at it from a business standpoint. If they truly average only 5 guests an hour on rides that last hour, it would be a horrible business decision to continue to stay open for that hour. No use having a perk that hardly anyone wants or uses.

I also don't agree the Magic is diminishing. The parks can't stay always the same. And Disney adds as much to the parks as they cut, if not more.

No, I can't understand or defend, diminishing a brand. The quality has suffered on many fronts...the food, souvenirs, attractions, events, etc. We are paying more for less...a watered down, "cheaper" version.

I see, Iger as the "Jack Frost" of Disney. Remember, what Santa/Frost did to the North Pole?

 

[KellyNY]

It's not just the "perks", but the meat and potatoes..literally.

No, I can't understand or defend, diminishing a brand. The quality has suffered on many fronts...the food, souvenirs, attractions, events, etc. We are paying more for less...a watered down, "cheaper" version.

I see, Iger as the "Jack Frost" of Disney. Remember, what Santa/Frost did to the North Pole?

Interesting, few months ago you claimed you are done with Disney, that it was your last trip, and here we go, new trip is planned. So what brings you back if everything is so bad?

 

[Scrooge Jr]

BTW, I wouldn't be surprised if they do away with all EMH's if and when they get the other --Pass systems up and running.

What other pass system?

 

[Robo]

What other pass system?

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?p=45551638#post45551638

 

[DRDISNEYMD]

What other pass system?

~Click --->Here! Make sure to check out the fabulous pics at the bottom!

 

[maxiesmom]

No, I can't understand or defend, diminishing a brand. The quality has suffered on many fronts...the food, souvenirs, attractions, events, etc. We are paying more for less...a watered down, "cheaper" version.

I don't agree. Disney has added or freshened up more than they have taken away. Way more. No business stays completely the same year after year, they all (if they are smart) make adjustments. It is just that at WDW we get emotionally attached to rides and food and events, so when they are cut it hurts a bit.

People are running around saying the sky if falling, when it is not. New Fantasyland anyone? Almost every resort redone? Ride queues expanded and made more interactive? Yep, Disney adds nothing.

 

[vacationer1954]

In the end, all anyone needs to do is visit the parks or booking hotel rooms. It is easy to see that there are as many or more people visiting the parks and booking hotel rooms as ever. Old guests stop visiting and new guests start visiting. It's its own little Circle of Life. We'll know that things are really getting worse when we start walking onto even the premiere attractions midday, and when we start seeing really big discounts on hotel rooms compared to comparable resorts elsewhere. When Disney really becomes the bargain vacation spot, then we'll know that things are getting bad.

 

[bcrook]

In the end, all anyone needs to do is visit the parks or booking hotel rooms. It is easy to see that there are as many or more people visiting the parks and booking hotel rooms as ever. Old guests stop visiting and new guests start visiting. It's its own little Circle of Life. We'll know that things are really getting worse when we start walking onto even the premiere attractions midday, and when we start seeing really big discounts on hotel rooms compared to comparable resorts elsewhere. When Disney really becomes the bargain vacation spot, then we'll know that things are getting bad.

This isn't really about whether other people will still come or not, it is about how it will affect the thousands of people who rely or count on evening EMH. This type of thread provides me new information. Thanks Robo for posting and bumping.

I usually travel with large groups. The main selling point for getting all my friends to shell out the crazy high prices for staying on site was the evening EMH. Now that it has been significantly cutback, it changes the way I plan. For my 2013 Food and Wine trip, I am now checking into a Hilton Property or maybe even staying at Bonnet Creek (I have Wyndham points). This isn't about sticking it to Disney, it is simply about justifying the extra expense of staying on site versus staying just off site.

The "sky is not falling" but for me the benefits have been cut - plain and simple. And the positives that everyone mention (FL and better queues, and Test Track etc) - can be enjoyed by everyone staying off site.

 

[Robo]

Sorry, I misunderstood your post to me.

I was just wondering if by dropping an hour, they may lengthen the park hours to the general public.

They made a blatant attempt at the opposite idea a couple of years ago.

They cut Epcot's regular closing time from 9PM to 8PM only on Epcot's PM EMH night.
That meant that IllumiNations ran at 9PM every night (as it still does)
EXCEPT on PM EMH night at Epcot, on which the IllumiNations show ran at 8PM.

And, on that night PM EMH at Epcot ran until 11PM for resort guests.
Not exactly a "late event."

That plan didn't last very long.
Just a few months.

 

[Rip]

And quite a few others who have said that this is the tipping point towards off-site resorts. I'm among them - I'm not going to quit going to WDW because I do enjoy it, but one by one Disney is doing away with the things that kept us paying the high premium for on-site lodging. We've stayed on site for all of our trips for two main reasons - the savings/convenience of the dining plan and access to late EMH. Now saving anything on the DDP requires constant thought/planning because a single low-cost choice can send it into the red and the shorter EMH offers little/no crowd advantage.

I have 4, maybe 5, trips planned for the next couple years and right now I'm only planning on staying at a Disney-owned resort for one of them. Great discounts might change my mind, though I don't think those are especially likely, but I'm just not willing to pay premium prices for what I see as declining quality and less-than-premium perks.

Excellent point.

 

[Cinderumbrella]

The "sky is not falling" but for me the benefits have been cut - plain and simple. And the positives that everyone mention (FL and better queues, and Test Track etc) - can be enjoyed by everyone staying off site.