Please Put Epcot Out Of Its Misery!

[KingK12]

They should have a Disney renovation reality show that goes around up dating the parks out dated parts!

 

[mousermerf]

A quick note on Soarin' and the film quality..

When WDW chose to build the attraction - they paid less for the installation than DCA did and did not go for upgraded air filtration and clean room stuff for the projection booths. This was a cost cutting measure.

The film is also replaced less frequently than it is at DCA as another cost cutting measure. Both of these are true-to-life cannot be disputed facts of the matter.

The DCA version of the attraction, while being several years older, has better overall film quality because of this. Remember this when discussing this topic in the future and perhaps when discussing the point with Disney in any feedback you may give them about the quality of the attraction.

 

[awoogala]

EPCOT is and always has been, our favorite park. The educational slant of Innoventions , and all the hands-on displays are incredible for kids. We loved the velcro show, the fire safety stuff, etc. I enjoy that it is a changing exhibit.
Soarin is just ok, but my son loves it.

I hate the new updates they have done in EPCOT.

Imagination had an incredible message, which is now watered down and cheesy. After the ride,there used to be fun and interesting technology to play with, now there's two dinky music toys and 100 photo computers. Sad.

Ellen's energy adventure is a "dumbed down" version of the original ride. It used to be far more educational. I love Judi Dench, but that ride, also, seems to have lost a lot of factual moments, and seems "dumbed down" from the original script. Spaceship Earth is a little light on history these days.

I don't mind Nemo added into the seas, but the diving tube either needs to be used or removed. It is so pathetic to see the mess left behind.
I think TT is stupid (again, my kids like it, though) I miss the ride that used to be there, which taught more ABout transportation through the ages.
I wish the body wars was open, wish they'd bring back the vegetable show, and get rid of circle of life, because it is dull!
We love the land, but that could use some updating as well!

 

[Bonniec]

Here's guessing that the tiny Imax museums don't shuttle through 1,044 people an hour 365 days a year, with no pauses between shows, for 8-12 hours a day, in a theater that also contains liquid special effects.

Universal had no problems updating Spiderman when it needed upgrading. There's no excuse for Soarin not being better quality.

I love Epcot, it's my favorite park. But I'm not so blinded by "Disney" that I can't see any of it's flaws. The OP made great points. Just because Epcot is my favorite park doesn't mean the placer badly needs updating.

 

[WizardLarz]

Watching that musical performance outside of Test Track was the last straw. Epcot needs help, STAT! The evidence is overwhelming:

- Soarin' is still good, but it's a shell of what it was. A grainy film on a dirty screen does not compel me to stand in line for an hour. In this age of HD and digital, there's no excuse why this film has to look like garbage

- The whole Test Track refurb fiasco, punctuated by the hastily thrown-together Test Track singers - somewhere Up With People is laughing hysterically

- Mission Space, while still cool, makes people vomit

- Ellen's Energy Adventure is now the best place to catch an air-conditioned nap in all of WDW

- Habit Heroes shut down in less than a month - wait, you mean mocking kids isn't what we do here at WDW?

- The Imagination Pavilion is a complete waste of space

- Body Wars Pavilion is still empty

- When you ask you kids what they enjoyed most at Future World, and they say Living With the Land, it's time to re-evaluate things


The ONLY thing that has been consistently interesting and worth-while at Epcot over the last few years has been the World Showcase. When your park has the name "Future World", you shouldn't ever be outdated.

Either Epcot needs a complete makeover, or it should be plowed under and become a giant World Showcase. Add in some countries like Russia, Australia, Brazil, etc. That's at least more interesting than watching Alex Trebek banter with Bill Nye the Science Guy.


Epcot - time to step up. Universal has Harry Potter. You have Figment and the Test Track Five. Think about it

OK, Lets start with the Fact that the Whole Park is called EPCOT, it is not 2 parks. I do agree that there are updates needed. But to bulldoze it would be going to far. They are Currently working on a Test Treck refurb. so there has been a start. Any changes take time and Money, & although Disney seems to make a Lot of it, finding the right way to use it is not that easy.

From what I've heard the Fantasy Land project was 3-5 years in planning before they even broke ground and even then changes have been made since they began work.

Previous Posters have said that EPCOT was meant to be a ever changing Worlds Fair, but Disney needs Partners for that to work. Chevy has taken the chance and a change is being made. Perhaps this is just the begining of years of changes to come!

 

[theSurlyMermaid]

I also agree that Hollywood Studios needs something to happen.....something in Pixar Place. It is such a no-brainer. Talk about a park that was once my favorite....back when there was an actual animation studio there.

 

[supersuperwendy]

I miss Horizons and World of Motion

I wish we could get them back

 

[RMulieri]

I miss Horizons and World of Motion

I wish we could get them back

Me too..That and Food Rocks or Kitchen Kabaret and return Imagination to the way it was and upgrade the movie.Both Captain EO and HISTA are old old old

 

[scion5220]

Personally I wouldn't cross the street to visit Harry Potter. Neither the books nor the park hold any interest for me. The movies, either.

 

[mousermerf]

Well, let's be honest...

Spaceship Earth's makeover - whether we like how it ended up or not - really opened in December of 2007 (Disney claim fervently it was Feb 2008, but no, it was December 2007 when all the major elements were in place and functional and it operated daily).

It's 2012. We're going on nearly 5 years now without any real additions in attraction lineup in Epcot since then. That was a big mistake on the part of Disney. They thoguht they could coast.

Worse, they thought they could control GM and force them to wait until an oportune time to close Test Track that didn't overlap the Fantasyland Expansion and Thunder Mountain refurbs. GM said "screw you" to Disney and pulled their trump card and had the building shut down - lest Disney lose them as a sponsor entirely.

So for the past 4 years there has been an opportunity to add something to Epcot - small attractions, somthing "worth doing" to help placare the crowds. Imagine if a small boat ride had been built in World Showcase. Imagine if a mini-land of some sort had been carved out with an education theme. We're used to Epcot having these big headliner attraction, but the park has always needed more balance with some smaller attractions as well.

Epcot would have been much better positioned for the problems it is experiencing right now if not for the direct apathy of the Walt Disney Company. They chose not to do anything for the last several years. They dug this hole, it's time to lay in it.

Also - folks espousing that "World Showcase is fine the way it is" - wouldn't it be better with a few more attractions though so that Future World was -able- to shut down whole pavilions at the same time to revamp them?

 

[marielynn724]

I agree with most of the comments of the OP - the one about M:S made me laugh out loud! Future World holds very little interest for me (as I neither have small children nor am I a big thrill-seeker) but I do really love World Showcase. I wish they would bring back the original Imagination ride, the new one is so pathetic! Last time we were in that area of Epcot the CMs were begging people to come in to the Imagination ride because there were literally NO PEOPLE on it.

 

[mousermerf]

A thought..

I really do hope all these concerns are being expressed directly to Disney, and not just here on the internet.

If you don't tell them directly, nothing's going to get better, it's not.

 

[blainekyle]

Personally I wouldn't cross the street to visit Harry Potter. Neither the books nor the park hold any interest for me. The movies, either.

I didn't read all the books, but I loved the movies. The theming that Universal pulled off is impressive--for Universal. Some have said it is Disney caliber, but I disagree. They retconned two of their pre-existing rides to fit the HP theme, and it shows when you get into the queues. I found the queue for the kid's coaster there to be reminiscent of a Six Flags queue, which is unimpressive. The Dueling Dragon's queue used to be awesome, but they discarded much of the theming because it didn't fit the new theme, and all they replaced it with was one movie prop, the Tri-Wizard Cup.

They did build one new ride, the one that is built into Hogwarts Castle, and it's not bad. If you haven't been, it's a combination motion sim/rollercoaster, with sideways facing seats. It's kind of like Spiderman, but with more coaster-like qualities. It's impressive. It made me nauseous, but I can't blame them for that. The thing is, the queue was actually fairly dull until you reach the corralling area, where they do have the Sorting Hat, and a little pseudo-hologram scene where Harry and the gang address the riders, or "students." But, the most un-Disney-like thing that maybe bugged me more than it should was that, while queueing for that ride, at points you could hear the Jurassic Park music. I mean, they almost sold the illusion, in a way that approaches Disney standards, but that just broke right through it. Then I realized that you could actually see through the "jungle" to the Jurassic Park area, right where the jeeps and dinosaurs were by the path.

I say all that to say this: It's a real shame that Disney didn't get the rights to that franchise. They would have done such a better job. Heck, they probably could have built it as it's own park. There's certainly enough content in the series to allow for it. It would be nice for the mostly lackluster HP area that Universal built to see some expansion, but there's really very little room for it on Universal's cramped real estate.

 

[blainekyle]

I wish they would bring back the original Imagination ride, the new one is so pathetic! Last time we were in that area of Epcot the CMs were begging people to come in to the Imagination ride because there were literally NO PEOPLE on it.

Hey, who doesn't love a walk-on?

 

[Edgehopper]

The reason no one can think of a good alternate name for "Future World" is because FW has lost its focus. It no longer knows what it is, so how can we be expected to know?

FW used to be all about learning. It was the world's first educational theme park. It cracks me up when people write, "Who wants to learn about X at Disney World?" or "No one wants to be taught lessons while on vacation!" Teaching lessons and learning used to be the whole point of FW.

Here are the FW attractions of the early 1990's and what we learned:

Spaceship Earth: we learned about how advancements in human communication have helped to create our world.

Innoventions: we learned all sorts of stuff on a wide variety of science and technology related subjects.

Horizons: we learned how technology might develop and what the future might be like.

Journey Into Imagination: we learned about the human imagination and how to use it.

The Living Seas: we learned about the ocean and undersea life and the future of ocean exploration by taking a trip to 'Sea Base Alpha'.

World of Motion: we learned about the history and achievements in transportation, from cavemen to the first automobiles.

The Land: we learned how we can use the land for our benefit, and how we might destroy it if we're not careful.

Universe of Energy: we learned about energy sources (without comedy), then took a ride through a primeval diorama with dinosaurs to learn about the origins of fossil fuels.

Wonders of Life: we learned about how the human body works, and sometimes doesn't work.

Back then every single attraction at FW was clearly all about education, teaching us about science and technology and the world around us.

Today? The two most popular attractions at FW today are Soarin’, in which we learn...umm...what parts of California look like from the air, and Test Track, in which we learn what it's like to ride in a car.

I, for one, wish Disney would stop being embarrassed by the idea of an educational theme park, and return FW to its roots.

A new name? How about "Discovery Land."

Agreed, but I don't think they're as far off as you seem to think:

Spaceship Earth, Living with the Land--unchanged

The Seas With Nemo--improved. The aquarium side is still there, but has been made interesting to a broader set of the public.

Ellen's Energy Adventure--improved. Sorry, the comedy improves education, which is why Bill Nye worked as a TV show. Much better than a droning lecture on fossil fuel development.

Test Track vs. World of Motion--Test Track is teaching about car testing, rather than the history of transportation, and it provides much needed thrills in a park that was boring to teens and young adults.

Horizons vs. Mission: Space--Horizons, at the time of demolishing, presented an outdated vision of the future. Mission: Space presents the only place outside of NASA training with a simulator that simulates the sustained G forces of space travel.

So really, the problem is in three places: the increasingly dull and child-oriented Innoventions, the atrocious current version of Imagination, and the nonexistent Wonders of Life Pavilion. In their late 90s incarnations, a family could spend hours in each. Now Innoventions is something most families quickly skip over, Imagination is a Kodak booth with a trippy dark ride attached, and Wonders of Life is closed.

What would I do if I were running Disney?

1. Find a new sponsor for Imagination from the inventive/tech world. Probably Apple, given Disney/Pixar's close ties with Apple already (Google would be better, but I don't think their corporate relations are as good). Redevelop the ride around Invention and Design rather than Imagination, keeping Figment. Invention is what you get when you put imagination into practice, so it's a worthy successor. Redo ImageWorks accordingly.

2. Reopen Wonders of Life. Very little would need to be updated in the way of ideas; refilm the Cranium Command films with current comedians, redo Body Wars similarly to Star Tours II, etc.

3. I'm not sure what to do with Innoventions, but I do note that it was a lot more lively when Sony was a sponsor. Maybe try to get Microsoft on board? The key is that it should be focused on near future technology, not "Here's a demo of a product from five years ago" and "Let's talk about fire safety!"

 

[Robo]

2. Reopen Wonders of Life. Very little would need to be updated in the way of ideas; refilm the Cranium Command films with current comedians,

Cranium Command is no less funny or interesting because the actors in the roles
are no longer seen in current TV shows.

All of the principle actors in The Wizard of Oz are no longer even among the living.
I still enjoy it.

Good creative can stand the test of time.

(BTW, I still laugh at the Marx Brothers. They're a bit past "prime time," too.)



.

 

[mesaboy2]

I didn't read all the books, but I loved the movies. The theming that Universal pulled off is impressive--for Universal. Some have said it is Disney caliber, but I disagree. They retconned two of their pre-existing rides to fit the HP theme, and it shows when you get into the queues. I found the queue for the kid's coaster there to be reminiscent of a Six Flags queue, which is unimpressive. The Dueling Dragon's queue used to be awesome, but they discarded much of the theming because it didn't fit the new theme, and all they replaced it with was one movie prop, the Tri-Wizard Cup.

They did build one new ride, the one that is built into Hogwarts Castle, and it's not bad. If you haven't been, it's a combination motion sim/rollercoaster, with sideways facing seats. It's kind of like Spiderman, but with more coaster-like qualities. It's impressive. It made me nauseous, but I can't blame them for that. The thing is, the queue was actually fairly dull until you reach the corralling area, where they do have the Sorting Hat, and a little pseudo-hologram scene where Harry and the gang address the riders, or "students." But, the most un-Disney-like thing that maybe bugged me more than it should was that, while queueing for that ride, at points you could hear the Jurassic Park music. I mean, they almost sold the illusion, in a way that approaches Disney standards, but that just broke right through it. Then I realized that you could actually see through the "jungle" to the Jurassic Park area, right where the jeeps and dinosaurs were by the path.

I say all that to say this: It's a real shame that Disney didn't get the rights to that franchise. They would have done such a better job. Heck, they probably could have built it as it's own park. There's certainly enough content in the series to allow for it. It would be nice for the mostly lackluster HP area that Universal built to see some expansion, but there's really very little room for it on Universal's cramped real estate.

Count me among them.

Not to go too far off topic, but I will generally disagree with this. I'm a Disney dude to the core, but Universal's WWoHP is easily on par with anything Disney has done in Florida.

And WWoHP expansion is coming--Universal has already announced it. What I know of the rumored plans is pretty impressive and will not lack for space, as the existing Phase I admittedly does.

 

[DemoBri1]

I don't think EPCOT as a whole is the question here I think it's Future World as a part of EPCOT. I tend to agree that Future World is not very "futuristic" any more. With Test Track going down and not reopening until probably after our trip this November, we'll probably spend all of 60 minutes in FW, and that will be waiting in line for Soarin'. Maybe we'll do SSE, but after that what is there really?

Maybe part of FW should be sacrificed to bring in a couple of more countries to WS. Do I hear Russia and Brazil?? JMHO.

 

[W.E.D.]

OP, we've had this debate on the DIS multiple times. How do you keep places like TomorrowLand and Future World cutting edge when technology is advancing at such a high rate of speed? I think they'd have to rehab both areas about every six months to keep pace, and we all know that isn't going to happen.

Another problem is sponsors. With our current financial environment, I don't think anyone is going to hand Disney millions of dollars to make a new ride or refurb an old one. Then you get tragic refurbs like Imagination.

Personally, I wish everything didn't have to involve a character tie-in. FW was supposed to be at least semi-educational. That concept is lacking in about everything now except maybe SE and LwtL.

All this being said, I wouldn't put EPCOT out to pasture yet. There is still a lot of fun to be had. We spend a majority of our visits there.

 

[mousermerf]

Points that need clarification since misinformation seem to be running rampant:

World Showcase has several full-size expansion plots inbetween the current pavilions. They can build entire new countries in the existing setup without having to touch anything in Future World or scale anything back in any of the current pavilions. There is a ton fo space that was -planned- but never utilized.

And second, the Disney company is more than capable of investing in their own parks and resorts without third party investments. They simply choose not to. They do not -need- third party investors to stay afloat and the parks are profitable - they generate copius amounts of profit in fact. Epcot only needs a minimum attendance of 10k guests a day to make a profit (and that's based on 1982 ticket prices - ticket pricing has gone up way beyond inflation since then) and the park actually sees 3x as many guests on a normal day.

And that's just in ticket sales - not merchandise and food. Epcot is an extremely lucrative park for Disney to operate. There is no finacial excuse to not invest in it other than penny-pinching and believing they can get away with the bare minimum. If you have ANY proof to present to the contrary - present it, otherwise, please stop restating this falsehood.

And finally - if Epcot had a project being worked in each of the major pavilions on a rolling basis then it would tie into the original contractual obligations as stipulated when the park was designed. The pavilions -were designed to be replaced- and Disney simply has tried to avoid that in being cheap. It is not a matter of 6 months, but rather, each pavilion was expected to have a lifespan of about 10 years.

If you take the pavilions out one at a time on a rolling basis you can spread this out and make it possible to be debuting a new attraction every other year or so. Thus the park seems "fresh" and none of the attractions are embarassingly stale. Instead, we have attractions from 1994 which were low-budget upgrades of 1982 versions in the first place which are now expected to be cornerstones of the park experience.

These are mistakes Disney has made in regards to Epcot. To talk about it as if it didn't happen or that everything is all happy-world-land is simply lying about the situation.