Plan Ahead with Lightning Lane Entry at Walt Disney World Starting July 24

[spewey]

I guess I was not using Genie+ correctly. This is a serious question. How are people walking in with 7 G+ LL stacked?
DHS opens at 9
1st LL at 7 -Slinky
2nd LL at 11 (2 hours after park opens) - RNRC
3rd at 1 - Smugglers Run
4th at 3 - TOT
5th at 5 - TSM
6th at 7 - Star Tours
7th at 9 Alien

How are people walking in with 7 G+ LL stacked -- if you walked in at 9pm, the park would either be closed or you'd have at best an hour to finish all 7 of those rides that you somehow managed to stack in the same hour timeframe.

I was just about to post the same thing. This doesn't make sense. Sure, you could have seven Genie+s in your pocket when you arrive, but by then you wouldn't have enough time to use them.

I said it before, and I'll say it again - maybe I'm Pollyanna, but I ain't worried. We'll walk into HS at 2PM with 3 pre-booked LLMPs (plus one LLSP) - as many as we could have had with Genie+ - and then start tapping and picking. UNLESS there's something we don't know - like they really really reduce LL capacity from Genie+ - we'll have access to as many more LLs throughout the evening as before (with the exception of no re-rides, which is a thing).

 

[Karalee402]

Not sure if anyone would know this since the new system hasn't started yet, but do we know how this impacts split stays? We booked using DVC point rental and have a split stay with 1 night at Saratoga, 5 nights at Riviera, and 1 night at Boardwalk. Does anyone happen to know if I will be able to book our 3 LL reservations for the entirety of our stay despite it being a split stay? I know ADRs will be 3 different dates, but I'm really hoping we will be able to use the onsite LL reservations perk despite being a split stay. Thank you in advance for any insight you might have!

We're in the exact same boat - booked a split stay renting DVC points. I haven't read or heard anything with a solid answer on this other than people assume it'll follow the same rules as ADRs. I'm HOPING it may not since it's more ticket based, but we'll see.

 

[godfather927]

Whereas families who are visiting for the first time are probably more likely to be all-day guests, since everything is new to them and they want to make the most of their trip. But, they are less likely to know how to game the system to get maximum value out of it. They'll probably go on a ride, then pull up the app and book the next thing that looks good. That's a sucker's move with Genie+, but a good value with LLMP!

I think these changes, at least at the margins, shift value from that first group and to the second group. LLMP is a greater value for guests who will show up to the parks early and want to make more decisions as they go.

I actually think it would be the opposite, where advanced knowledge of the system is more critical with LLMP since we are now back to planning and booking rides 7 days in advance rather than on the day of. The first time visitor is more likely to experience a loss of value if they aren't familiar enough to know that the new system requires you to book your 3 rides at 7am a week before your trip. With G+, it was convoluted and confusing, but still allowed for first-timers to kinda figure it out as they went without hamstringing them too much. That's not really the case with LLMP. You need to have a game plan ready to go by 7am and then kinda plan your whole days around that first booked ride if you want to squeeze that 4th or 5th reservation in.

 

[DisneyFive]

I think the worry of not being able to stack is a bit premature/overblown and it's limited to guests that don't want to show up to the parks until a good portion of the day has passed. Plus, it's not like you can't "stack", it's just that you can't immediately stack multiple Tier 1's. You can still stack 3 MPLL's. Plus, as others have said, if you book a Tier 2 MPLL for say 9am-10am and let it expire, does that count as "Used" and now you can book another tier 1 in that spot for later, thereby stacking?

The number of tier 1 attractions as MK doesn't phase me at all. You can still sleep in and get to the parks, say, around 10:30am. After using that first MPLL at 10:30, then book another tier 1 and keep rolling for the rest of the day. If you want to leave for an afternoon break, go ahead. By that time you'll be able stack multiple tier 1's because you'll most likely have already used a few MPLL's in the morning or early afternoon (allowing you to replace them with tier 1's)

Plus with the new system, you'll be able to choose those timeslots. I was frustrated with G+, if I wanted a later timeslot for an attraction but having to wait for enough people to pull G+'s for that attraction to get it to the later timeslots that I wanted. This happened pretty often when heading out for our afternoon break, but something like Pirate's or BTMRR was only for like a hour later.

 

[godfather927]

I was just about to post the same thing. This doesn't make sense. Sure, you could have seven Genie+s in your pocket when you arrive, but by then you wouldn't have enough time to use them.

I said it before, and I'll say it again - maybe I'm Pollyanna, but I ain't worried. We'll walk into HS at 2PM with 3 pre-booked LLMPs (plus one LLSP) - as many as we could have had with Genie+ - and then start tapping and picking. UNLESS there's something we don't know - like they really really reduce LL capacity from Genie+ - we'll have access to as many more LLs throughout the evening as before (with the exception of no re-rides, which is a thing).

For parks like HS, this isn't as big of a change because that was a smaller park with a limited number of rides anyhow which meant G+ return times dried up super quick regardless. You were often having to pick between the top tier attractions even with G+ and more so if any of them went down.

That's a different case with MK which is much larger, and has a ton more rides, which meant G+ return times were usually plentiful even late into the afternoon.

 

[Cabius]

I guess I was not using Genie+ correctly. This is a serious question. How are people walking in with 7 G+ LL stacked?
DHS opens at 9
1st LL at 7 -Slinky
2nd LL at 11 (2 hours after park opens) - RNRC
3rd at 1 - Smugglers Run
4th at 3 - TOT
5th at 5 - TSM
6th at 7 - Star Tours
7th at 9 Alien

How are people walking in with 7 G+ LL stacked -- if you walked in at 9pm, the park would either be closed or you'd have at best an hour to finish all 7 of those rides that you somehow managed to stack in the same hour timeframe.

Fair -- lots of people talk (brag?) about actually using 6-7 LLs, but walking in with 7 booked isn't realistic given normal park operating hours.

 

[spewey]

For parks like HS, this isn't as big of a change because that was a smaller park with a limited number of rides anyhow which meant G+ return times dried up super quick regardless. You were often having to pick between the top tier attractions even with G+ and more so if any of them went down.

That's a different case with MK which is much larger, and has a ton more rides, which meant G+ return times were usually plentiful even late into the afternoon.

Now, this may be a reflection of when we went - last week of August - back in 2022, but this was not at all our experience. When we stacked for afternoon HS, we arrived (around 2) with three Genie+s, and just rolled through the evening with IIRC available slots for every attraction except (of course) SDD. We didn't wait in a single standby line, and snagged at least another eight or nine spots - with the caveat some were re-rides, especially TSMM, which we rode three times in under 30 minutes.

Theoretically, there will be MORE availability with this new system, unless they reduce capacity, which with the changes to DAS I find unlikely. But ya never know.

On another topic - this may be treading on thin ice, but does anyone else worry that booking a "throwaway" LL, one for open that you know you won't use in the hope of when it expires you can swap it out for a later time Tier 1, might be perceived as "cheating"? It's at least gaming the system, which is a grey area, but isn't this (at least in theory) taking a possible spot away from someone else? Or is the thought if you book the right ride, that is a very unpopular one, right at open, there's no way it could sell out anyway?

 

[DisneyFive]

Now, this may be a reflection of when we went - last week of August - back in 2022, but this was not at all our experience. When we stacked for afternoon HS, we arrived (around 2) with three Genie+s, and just rolled through the evening with IIRC available slots for every attraction except (of course) SDD. We didn't wait in a single standby line, and snagged at least another eight or nine spots - with the caveat some were re-rides, especially TSMM, which we rode three times in under 30 minutes.

Theoretically, there will be MORE availability with this new system, unless they reduce capacity, which with the changes to DAS I find unlikely. But ya never know.

On another topic - this may be treading on thin ice, but does anyone else worry that booking a "throwaway" LL, one for open that you know you won't use in the hope of when it expires you can swap it out for a later time Tier 1, might be perceived as "cheating"? It's at least gaming the system, which is a grey area, but isn't this (at least in theory) taking a possible spot away from someone else? Or is the thought if you book the right ride, that is a very unpopular one, right at open, there's no way it could sell out anyway?

I have never considered something like that cheating, especially now that we are paying to use the system. It is just using the system most effectively for how you want to tour.

That’s kind of like when people wanted to say “refreshing” with the old FP+ was cheating. Nonsense. It was just looking for times slots that others had dropped and picking them up for your use instead.

 

[greeneyedchick]

HUH?

Just totally confused me, I can only imagine how your explanation of G+ went with recent guests.

Sorry didn't mean to be confusing. On Disney's website, it says you can purchase a Single Pass or Multi-pass. If you're someone unfamiliar with Disney, you may think a multi-pass means that you get 3 single passes. It's not super clear from their website that the single pass and multi-pass apply to different rides. For example, the old FP+ included FoP. Now FoP is only available for a single pass. I didn't think their marketing was super clear that the Single Pass would only be for FoP at Animal Kingdom and that the multi-pass does not include FoP. If I knew nothing about it the current system and went onto their website, I would assume that the single pass gets you into the Lightening Lane for 1 ride and that the multi-pass allows you to do that multiple times. It was a comment on Disney's marketing on their website.

 

[Disturbia]

The new system is being viewed as the End of Stacking, which was initially my fear as well. I've mentioned in a previous post that while Genie+ was flexible, and allowed for in some cases immediate re-rides, which this won't, I still plan on stacking on some days, mostly for HS.

For instance - our first day I plan to use LLMP for three rides at HS (say, SDD, ToT, and TSMM), plus a LLSP for RotR, all in the afternoon. Then we rope drop MK, with a LLSP for Tron and maybe a VQ for Tron or Tianna. That's potentially SIX rides booked before we leave the room.

Now, I get we can't add any LLs until we tap in to our first one at HS, but there's still three in hand when we park hop after lunch. Under Genie+, assuming a 3PM arrival, how many could we have had? The first at 7AM, and then another at 11, 1PM, and 3? So down maybe one?

The feeling is for some reason that with this system "by the time you get there" for the evening stacking strategy "there won't be any other rides left". Why would that be? Just because people get to book in advance doesn't mean MORE people will be taking spots; in fact, they're should be quite a few less, as it's now a paid service. So I fully expect plenty of options to be available - maybe not SDD, but MMRR was usually there late in the day, as were most of the "second tier" rides.

To me, the downside is no re-rides (we basically marathoned TSMM one after another one night) and a longer booking window - I've heard maybe a 45 minute gap between rides, as opposed to Genie+s, which could have been right after, IIRC.

Of course, much of this remains to be seen ...

Is it really the end of stacking? I would think you can stack earlier if anything since the 2 hour rule won’t apply (you can overlap your preselects) and you can park hop anytime now. You would want a ride that’s closer to the entrance of the park and fast loading so you can use up the second overlapping pass.

So imagine this:

AK preselects

Safari 8 am-9am
Everest 8:45 am-9:45 am
Dinosaur 10 am-11 am

1. use early entry to knock down FOP
2. ride 8 am safari-book 1 pm MMRR, takes 20+ mins to ride safari, walk to Everest
Grab a Dole whip from Tami Tamu (opens 8 am); Mr Kamal’s opens 10:30 am (fries)
3. ride Everest 8:45 book 1:45 TOT (check mobile order times near next ride)
4. ride Dinosaur 9:30 am and book SDD 3 pm
5. Grab mobile order near Dinosaur ride, eat and head to HS

 

[Dave006]

I haven't read or heard anything with a solid answer on this other than people assume it'll follow the same rules as ADRs. I'm HOPING it may not since it's more ticket based, but we'll see.

Yes a split stay will impact your ability to book all your LLMP and/or LLSPs for your entire stay at one time. It is not ticket based the advance window is related to each of your resort stays.

It will be exactly like ADR selection windows you have experience using today. You have split stays and each will have it's own booking window for pre-scheduled LLMP and LLSP bookings.

Dave

 

[Mouse Tracker]

It's not super clear from their website

I disagree, it has been previously discussed here about Tier 1 and Tier 2 selections as it applies to the new Lightening Lane MP and how Lightening Lane SP is somewhat the same version of $LL. I believe it is clear, what is not is the availability of LLs with the MP version.
It might help to quit referencing FP+ and use the more recent G+ when comparing the new changes.

If you're someone unfamiliar with Disney

Heck those folks don't know anything about FP+ or G+. There's a huge learning curve for 'newbies'.

 

[princesswahooey]

Am I the only one who feels that Disney does not make it clear that a multi-pass does not mean multiple single-passes for rides? I feel like the casual guest may think that the multi-pass includes the single-pass rides (the name kinda implies that). People keep saying it's like the old FP+, but FP+ Tier-1 rides included the top rides in the park. The multi-pass does not. I feel like people may be in for a surprise if they choose to buy the multi-pass thinking that it includes all of the rides. It bugs me because they are re-vamping/ re-naming their express pass system and I still feel like their names are confusing.

I realize that people need to do their homework, but many don't. I live near Orlando and when I had some guests stay with me last year while going to the parks, they were completely oblivious to Genie+ and Lightening Lanes. I tried to explain it to them, but their eyes glazed over and they laughed and said they'd figure it out when they go to the parks. Well, they did pay for Genie+, got 1 or 2 rides at most at Animal Kingdom and Hollywood Studios (the only 2 parks they went too). They were so disgusted by spending the extra money and not getting onto most rides that they swore they'd never go to Disney again.

Yes, the naming system is ridiculous, but it's my understanding that you will select your ride choices BEFORE paying for the LLMP, so people will be aware during the booking process of what rides they're able to get. This should eliminate that and was probably implemented this way because of complaints over the exact experience your friends suffered.

 

[Mouse Tracker]

So imagine this:

That's how potentially I see this as working but the unknown is "are those HS afternoon LLs going to be available or that easy to arrange?"

 

[Dave006]

Is it really the end of stacking? I would think you can stack earlier if anything since the 2 hour rule won’t apply (you can overlap your preselects) and you can park hop anytime now.

Yes it is the end of stacking Guests were able to use in Genie+. The simple term is rolling 3 LLMP reservations. You can't have more than 3 as Guests were able to manage with Genie+ and the 120 minute rule. I don't count the 2 LLSP reservations as they remain the same no stacking discussion involved.

Dave

 

[DisneyFive]

That's how potentially I see this as working but the unknown is "are those HS afternoon LLs going to be available or that easy to arrange?"

I imagine that a bit of refreshing will be required just like with G+ and FP+.

 

[disneyseniors]

These Disney Execs are absolutely clueless. Do they really believe that this level of complexity and up-charging (nickel and diming) is going to generally appeal to customers? For every extra bit added, I actively seek to reduce the money Disney extracts from me.

Just think. They could eliminate countless jobs, execs, infrastructure, software, complexity and anxiety by removing all skip the line features. I would accept a park reservation system to manage capacity on the days it may be an issue. I would even accept a slightly higher ticket price. Then just give all guests the same opportunity to ride the rides they have paid to access through the park ticket.

That's the way it used to be when WDW first started. We all paid for our tickets and then waited in line for attractions. The lines, amazingly, moved quickly in most cases. All this without LLL or paid FP, or paid Genie.
Everyone was treated the same and we all waited in the lines.
I imagine that can't be done this way now because of the huge numbers of people visiting, or can it?
I'm just glad we got to experience Disney when it was a simpler time without all the high tech changes and up charges for what you paid for when you paid for your ticket.

 

[princesswahooey]

I absolutely agree with some of the points you laid out here. One of the biggest adjustments some folks will need to make is the ability to sit in a lounge by the pool in the morning/afternoon, stacking attractions every 2 hours for later in the day, has practically gone away. But the one question I've not seen answered specifically (and I might've missed it) is the one some folks have asked - if my LLMP window expires without me riding the attraction, can I book another? I'm wondering if you book at T2 attraction 9AM-10AM, and don't show, can you then book another at 10AM when that expires?! If so, the lounge chair folks will book unwanted LL, just like we did with FP+ (I know we did), just to get to the attractions stacked later they want.

But to me, other than the 2-hr window being taken away, G+ booking and LLMP booking will be similar. LLMP just allows pre-scheduling of a T1 attraction before moving on to other attractions later in the day. With G+, when I got up at 7AM to book, I was only getting one of the better attractions there, too! But the 2-hr window will impact some planners. Even with that, though, you couldn't book another G+LL until 10:30/11. And I'll spend way less time hitting modify to move my times later in the day - I like selecting the time range up front - much, much simpler.

Pros and cons - just like there were for FP, for FP+, and for Genie+.....

You just made me think of another question. So obviously, we're able to schedule our LL picks ahead of time and CHOOSE a specific (available) return time (like the old FP+) and I had assumed that on the day of, we'd also then pick from specific (available) return times on subsequent selections. But is there a chance that on the day of, they'd revert to feeding you the "next available" return time like they do with G+ ? It doesn't seem likely, but the wording is pretty vague on the subsequent selections. (Just "subject to availability.")

In that scenario, any sort of off-site stacking for later would be even harder.

 

[Cabius]

Is it really the end of stacking? I would think you can stack earlier if anything since the 2 hour rule won’t apply (you can overlap your preselects) and you can park hop anytime now. You would want a ride that’s closer to the entrance of the park and fast loading so you can use up the second overlapping pass.

So imagine this:

AK preselects

Safari 8 am-9am
Everest 8:45 am-9:45 am
Dinosaur 10 am-11 am

1. use early entry to knock down FOP
2. ride 8 am safari-book 1 pm MMRR, takes 20+ mins to ride safari, walk to Everest
Grab a Dole whip from Tami Tamu (opens 8 am); Mr Kamal’s opens 10:30 am (fries)
3. ride Everest 8:45 book 1:45 TOT (check mobile order times near next ride)
4. ride Dinosaur 9:30 am and book SDD 3 pm
5. Grab mobile order near Dinosaur ride, eat and head to HS

I think if you rope drop, it's a great, value-maximizing strategy. You can use three LLs early and replace them with three more later in the day, or else just keep churning through next-available passes throughout the day.

But I think that when people say "stacking" they mean "booking a bunch of attractions from the resort so they don't have to rope drop".

The new system impedes your ability to stack multiple LL passes for the afternoon/evening, relative to Genie+. At a minimum, you can only have three at a time. And even then, you're at a disadvantage to those actually in the park. (Presumably, a person outside the park with a 9:05-10:05 throwaway reservation has to wait until it expires to book a new T1 attraction, whereas if I'm in the park I can scan in at 9:05 and immediately book my next attraction, giving me a head-start on availability.)

 

[Tom_E_D]

You just made me think of another question. So obviously, we're able to schedule our LL picks ahead of time and CHOOSE a specific (available) return time (like the old FP+) and I had assumed that on the day of, we'd also then pick from specific (available) return times on subsequent selections. But is there a chance that on the day of, they'd revert to feeding you the "next available" return time like they do with G+ ? It doesn't seem likely, but the wording is pretty vague on the subsequent selections. (Just "subject to availability.")

In that scenario, any sort of off-site stacking for later would be even harder.

It might be more work than just picking your preferred time, but it wouldn't be harder than it is now with Genie+. You just take the next-available time and modify it when the later time you want becomes available. That's what Genie+ stackers have to do now.