Pete addressing all the hate on the podcast

[Disturbia]

I was so disappointed with Disney throughout these Covid times, but I did realize it was coming from something deeper. I visit yearly and always saw Disney as this magical, larger-than-life, untouchable place where I could go and be immersed and safe and not have to worry about anything. When I saw Disney being affected by the pandemic, it made me realize how bad things really were in the world.

As the pandemic continued and Disney continued to change, I came to the sobering realization that Disney is not untouchable. That they are just a regular company who is vulnerable to a global pandemic just like any other company. They aren't above budget cuts and staffing problems and they can't magically run normally in times like these. As a result, the "magical bubble" in my mind was popped and I was upset. I really loved that bubble. It was my escape from the real world. Kind of like when you find out the truth about Santa and Christmas is never the same.

I now see Disney for what it is. A really cool theme park with so many different things to do and great theming. I don't feel the obsessive need to visit every year anymore. I am more interested in trying out some other types of vacations, but I'm not angry anymore. I get it. It sucks, but also my expectations were unrealistic.

I think this is true. We are regular out of state visitors and were used to a different level of customer service. However there is something to be said about CMs and lack of training (getting better now). We noticed hostile and defensive CMs last Nov vs happier and approachable CMs this June. Wait time in the parks were also bad June-Aug. Our 5 yr old just wanted to ride the carousel and go back to the pool. Hopeful Genie+ reduces waits and makes the parks more enjoyable for families with younger kids.

 

[Disturbia]

Right, Disneyland is doing parades for their PAID HALLOWEEN PARTY.

The lack of parades has absolutely nothing to do with "covid safety." We are WELL beyond that point, given that rides are back to loading fully, and fireworks are happening where people are crammed in for an hour+ every night before showtime. Not running parades is about saving M-O-N-E-Y.

Interestingly, there are talks about the Main Street Electrical Parade returning to Disneyland early next year. Disneyland management gets it when it comes to using nostalgia to draw people in. They know attendance is going to fall off a cliff once the holidays are over.

Yes. To add to your argument (and if Disney is listening): I was hoping for spring rolls and maybe some macaroons for the Enchantment Dessert party.... I mean if Oooey Gooey Toffee pudding and Smores stations are too much work

 

[Disturbia]

thats a perfect description of MMRR. I mean, the scenery is nicely painted and the effects are neat, but ultimately it’s all cardboard and screens, and I’m bitter about losing a GREAT animatronic ride with such depth and richness to THIS. Also, MMRR is spastic like the current kids’ cartoons, and is meant to capture the short attention span of kids, thus alienating the older folk. This, and the loss of the Streets of Hollywood Streetmosphere character actors means that there is literally nothing in this park that includes older members of the family, and the whole concept of the Disney parks was for the whole family to have something wholesome to enjoy, together. We need SOME slower dark ride experiences to absorb crowds and allow people to relax and beat the heat.

an example of a better done version of the screen type of ride, on the other hand, would be Remy’s Ratatouille Adventure, although I’d add that it is probably still too spastic for older members of the family. The design and artistry of that ride was really well done, because there were more practical elements to balance out the screens, and a classic slow animatronic ride didn't have to be gutted in order to include it.

On the other side we have the next generation (Disney's target market) my almost 2 year old loves MMRR (we stood in a 45-55 min line and rode at close) and I would pay for after hours just to ride FOP again and again and again...(Soarin is my second favorite ride).

I do think they lack creativity in making the queues more interactive and having say Banshee or Navi meet/greet (I'm looking at the baby Raptor at UO); maybe a Pandora play area for waiting kids (vs sitting at Satuli). IF Disney is worried we wont spend $$$, if our infant knew what Banshee's/Direhorses were we would be more likely to buy them.

 

[annekablam]

Respectfully, it is concerning to me how often people will reference a small child's enjoyment of something at Disney as proof of its artistic merit or creativity, or justification for the lack thereof. Children are not generally known for their discerning taste and are on the whole, pretty easily amused. Whether or not you agree with what Disney is doing right now, the fact is, Walt's vision was a place for all ages to enjoy.

It's like going to a restaurant that was once a Michelin star rated restaurant, having a horrible meal, but telling people it was still worth it because little Bobbi Sue liked her chicken fingers.

 

[Disturbia]

I agree, they could get a bit more creative. More rides like Tron, FOP etc. I’m just hopeful that they will, eventually.

If our little ones were miserable and just wanted pool time, our older child is a teen and now into thrill rides, we could take them locally to a six flags or a mall. The fact is they still do enjoy something rides/entertainment and we were extremely happy (and comfortable) with how indoor dining and indoor mask wearing was handled.

 

[Bella the Ball 360]

thats a perfect description of MMRR. I mean, the scenery is nicely painted and the effects are neat, but ultimately it’s all cardboard and screens, and I’m bitter about losing a GREAT animatronic ride with such depth and richness to THIS. Also, MMRR is spastic like the current kids’ cartoons, and is meant to capture the short attention span of kids, thus alienating the older folk. This, and the loss of the Streets of Hollywood Streetmosphere character actors means that there is literally nothing in this park that includes older members of the family, and the whole concept of the Disney parks was for the whole family to have something wholesome to enjoy, together. We need SOME slower dark ride experiences to absorb crowds and allow people to relax and beat the heat.

an example of a better done version of the screen type of ride, on the other hand, would be Remy’s Ratatouille Adventure, although I’d add that it is probably still too spastic for older members of the family. The design and artistry of that ride was really well done, because there were more practical elements to balance out the screens, and a classic slow animatronic ride didn't have to be gutted in order to include it.

I agree. Again it is just the smoke and mirrors lets get rid of a ride that is multi-dimensional replace it with 2 D and let the peasants think its something wonderful because they clearly think so little of those who visit. As I have reiterated over and over we may turn our heads and pretend this is not happening but eventually, everyone grows up and sees it for what it is. There was nothing wrong with GMR! There was nothing wrong with Journey Into imagination and the fact that they got rid of the Snow White Ride which was a classic to make the Mine Ride.....They could have had both. Enough with the meet and greets.

 

[CBMom01]

I was a huuuuuuge fan of the great movie ride but let’s be honest…..HS is 10x better than it was even 5 years ago

 

[Disturbia]

I was a huuuuuuge fan of the great movie ride but let’s be honest…..HS is 10x better than it was even 5 years ago

We skipped HS for several years as we found it boring as well. For this upcoming trip we only have Hs 1 of 7 days. We also liked sitting down and watching Fantasmic.

 

[Bruggok]

Yes more is coming but I disagree with that they did the best they could. It wouldn't cost them much to put on a special parade for the 50th. I look at Cedar Point, they just did their 150th. They had a special night time parade, brought back stuff from their history and had a museum in the park about the history of Cedar Point. That's the kind of stuff Disney should be doing. The 50th should be about the history of the parks not about the special merch.

Agreed re: not having done best they could. MK castle and SSE updates looks gorgeous. HarmoniUS visuals was a big advancement, but the songs needed improvement. I understand maybe MK could not have parades due to lack of employees. However, there is no reason why MK train is still offline instead of scrimming off Tron and running. Also no reason copying Tron from Shanghai is taking long as it does. If Walt had current management to build any of the WDW parks, each park would've taken 10 years and most of the stuff that doesn't make money would've been cancelled.

What I don't get is people's inability to love WDW and critique it too. Don't let people fool you into believing in false dichotomies, that if you love WDW you shouldn't say anything negative, or WDW is a business so that explains away all their decisions. WDW management are paid well enough such that I expect them to sell me 50th special merch AND honor the history of WDW. It's not that hard, people. Literally a sentence here and there would suffice, as opposed to nothing. Heck, people trash movies all the time and they only paid $10-20. Here I'm committing a week and half of my precious time off, thousands of dollars, and I should stay silent? If anything I'm super forgiving on non-profit operations like my local botanical garden, museums, school plays, etc that have so little resources, charge so little $, and try so hard to please the guests. WDW as a for-profit business is precisely why we all should expect good value for our money spent.

 

[vincep]

As somebody pointed out if you are in love with Disney you are in an abusive relationship. You will put up with a lot of mistreatment for those moments of happiness and bliss which are too intoxicating to give up. You get angry and upset but you keep coming back for more. Chapek says I'm going to rip you off but give in. And you do.

 

[bsmcneil]

As somebody pointed out if you are in love with Disney you are in an abusive relationship. You will put up with a lot of mistreatment for those moments of happiness and bliss which are too intoxicating to give up. You get angry and upset but you keep coming back for more. Chapek says I'm going to rip you off but give in. And you do.

You could, possibly, accurately call it toxic but it's not "abusive" and it's pretty crappy to use that sort of term about this.

 

[Punkrockbebop]

I was a huuuuuuge fan of the great movie ride but let’s be honest…..HS is 10x better than it was even 5 years ago

Why does the baby have to be thrown out with the bath water, though? The citizens of Hollywood and GMR MADE that park, for me. Feels like a shell without them.

 

[vincep]

Why? It's no secret that people constantly complain on how badly they are treated as fans. Look at the constant moaning about Harmonius and those monstrous things in the lagoon and Enchanted and and what's going on now with the new annual passes and attempting to make reservations. And this is the tip of the iceberg. I was not the first to compare it to an abusive relationship(but it clicked in my head and I thought right!) and the fact that Chapek wouldn't even make a public appearance on the 50th says an enormous amount. That was very very bad and tells you what he thinks of all of us. This is a corporation, a board that is doing all of this. And when it comes to money these people are not nice. You might want to realize it.

 

[bsmcneil]

Why? It's no secret that people constantly complain on how badly they are treated as fans. Look at the constant moaning about Harmonius and those monstrous things in the lagoon and Enchanted and and what's going on now with the new annual passes and attempting to make reservations. And this is the tip of the iceberg. I was not the first to compare it to an abusive relationship(but it clicked in my head and I thought right!) and the fact that Chapek wouldn't even make a public appearance on the 50th says an enormous amount. That was very very bad and tells you what he thinks of all of us. This is a corporation, a board that is doing all of this. And when it comes to money these people are not nice. You might want to realize it.

Because it's not abuse. Like, semantically - nothing about this constitutes abuse and it says a lot about anyone who would use that word to describe a corporate relationship. I mean, come on!

 

[Pooh's World]

I did find it interesting when Pete said Disney management " may be rolling their eyes" now
because of all the complaining. So basically tuning out.

That's the Mary Antionette approach.
"Let them eat cake"

 

[TheDailyMoo]

The answer to this and many of the other threads about Disney being too expensive...pricing out guests...lower quality...etc, can all be explained rather easily in my opinion and it all boils down to "they only care about Dis+".

Perhaps its because I've been a shareholder for a while and followed the stock for even longer and perhaps it's because most of my discussions on the internet about Disney revolve around their business and not the magic of the parks as is usually the topic of boards such as this, but I can say with utmost certainty that the growth of Dis+ is not only on the forefront of all the higher ups minds but is all they truly care about from a business perspective. (please don't mind the run on sentence)

In case you haven't noticed the streaming wars are very real. Disney is in an intense battle with the likes of Netflix and Apple and Viacom and many others. This is where the big money is. Do they not care about the parks at all? They care...a little. Do they only see them as a means of revenue to keep growing Dis+? Heck yeah. This is the Iger/Chapek regime's main goal. They don't care about your fireworks shows. They don't care that you want to ride that same ride that you rode every year for 15 years that made you feel those special feelings. They don't care that you looked forward to watching that poorly produced video on the magical express that the driver had a VHS tape of as you pulled into the various hotel stops and somehow yours was always the last darn hotel...but you didn't mind.

They. Don't. Care. I think once you understand that it's easier to say ok this is what I'm getting for my money and if I can live with it I'll keep paying it. If I think it stinks...I can keep paying for it and complain or just say I'll see ya when I see ya Mickey. The whole situation isn't ideal. But at least Dis+ will have hundreds of millions of subscribers...and that my friends is the new pixie dust.

 

[annekablam]

I dunno, I think if they cared that much about their streaming platform they'd use a little more common sense than to make the certain-travesty that is Home Sweet Home Alone. It's like the Rutles except it's not a joke.

 

[TheDailyMoo]

I dunno, I think if they cared that much about their streaming platform they'd use a little more common sense than to make the certain-travesty that is Home Sweet Home Alone. It's like the Rutles except it's not a joke.

Ha yeah they have some truly awful content on there. But that's also part of the problem. The other major players, Netflix, Amazon, Apple, they're all burning through cash like it's going out of style to make new content because that's all they can do to try to be number one. Disney has a huge library of IP that they own wholly. But they also know that in order to stay competitive they must create new content. Dis+ still isn't fully cash positive for them and now that they need to produce more content it will really become a money suck. So you have them coming out of a pandemic where they lost out on billions of revenue and the need to spend a ton of money on new shows. Where is this money coming from? Parks mostly. It's been said a million times in these threads. Why aren't parades back? It's not because of Covid let's be real. Why are they looking for every chance to grab a buck from customers and give back very little in return. They desperately need to fund their projects for Dis+. Shareholders...for better or worse...fall into two categories. The types like me that invest in Disney stock because we are super fans of the brand and the parks and we might be adults but have no problem wearing a shirt that has a mouse and a dog and a duck on it...and then the other kind...that look at it like any other company that has a bottom line and earnings reports and conference calls where Chapek gives future guidance while being asked questions by Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley analysts. The latter is the majority of shareholders and I can tell you they only care about Dis+. Before Disney plus was announced the stock was a laggard amongst all of its' blue chip peers. We may love Disney but Wall Street hated the stock. Dis+ is the only thing that has propelled it to all time highs. Subscription numbers are all that wall street cares about. I'm telling you guys this is their major overarching goal to win the streaming wars and be number one or as close to it as possible. All the top brass' money is pinned to it because they all have thousands and thousands of shares of the stock.
It pains me because I saw it happening and now it's absolutely vividly clear to me. They will do just enough to keep people coming to the parks and to make them think the magic still exists while making sure they fleece us all of our hard earned money. If you ever doubt it think about how all us fans can see what the right things to do for the parks are yet they don't...are we all smarter than the leadership running the company? Nope. They have their agenda that does not fit in with our narratives as pure fans that want a place where magic still exists.

PS Why would they care about us peons when they gave Kevin Mayer the shaft to the point he left the company even though he single handedly made Dis+ a success for them.

 

[DL1WDW2]

Well don’t just end it there…cause the story is ongoing and it is big.
If you’re following investment trends alone or just want to focus on Disney… Just how big is Genie and can Disney ever perfect the technology that will create Success . It will be fun to follow the future and need for more $$$$$$$$$&

 

[vincep]

What about Joe Rohde? Was this truly a 'retirement' or was he forced out? This is a creative genius that Disney needs desperately. And he goes straight to Virgin Galactic. That's not a retirement that's a I'm being pushed out of my job I've got to get another one quick.

I agree with a lot of what Pete says but I think D'Amaro is a real charmer so Pete got him wrong. He's a well paid company man who has to toe the line. Maybe things would be worse without him but as Chapek chips away at Walt's legacy Josh seems completely ineffectual and sure isn't fighting for the Disney lovers. Why didn't he give a rededication of the park on the 50th anniversary? Say something for goodness sake.
Or would it have shown up Chapek? And Chapek couldn't show his face to Disney fans. The tsunami of booing would have been a PR disaster.