Oh me, oh my-does baby Suri really exist???update now aka "The Suri Challenge"

Status
Not open for further replies.
I work at my g/f's salon on weekends and yesterday was slow and I say and read all the gossip mag's she had.

Seems Katie had an agreement with Tom, that she could shop for whatever and whenever she wanted.

And they showed her doing so. Plunking down piles and piles of items.

They had other stuff too, and I meant to post right away, but I forgot. :lmao:
 
I work at my g/f's salon on weekends and yesterday was slow and I say and read all the gossip mag's she had.

Seems Katie had an agreement with Tom, that she could shop for whatever and whenever she wanted.

And they showed her doing so. Plunking down piles and piles of items.

They had other stuff too, and I meant to post right away, but I forgot. :lmao:

Wasn't there a time maybe last year when he told her to "curb" her spending? I think it was after she dropped the $100,000.00 at Barneys (?).
 

Just caught up after a week away at WDW and all I can say is that after watching those videos, I'm gonna have some heavy duty nightmares tonight!!!! Freaky stuff, people!!!!

It's good to be back ... I've missed this thread and all of you!!!!

BTW -- I also think it's v. odd that Nicole is not close w/her adopted children. I have an adopted child and I would never move that far away from him at such a young age!!!!! I also wondered why she didn't seem to "care" about the kids. I've seen adoptive parents and non-adoptive parents not bond to their children ... it wasn't an insult to anyone. As an adoptive parent, I didn't take the comment about "they're adopted" to be an insult in any way, shape or form.
 
...BTW -- I also think it's v. odd that Nicole is not close w/her adopted children. I have an adopted child and I would never move that far away from him at such a young age!!!!! I also wondered why she didn't seem to "care" about the kids. I've seen adoptive parents and non-adoptive parents not bond to their children ... it wasn't an insult to anyone. As an adoptive parent, I didn't take the comment about "they're adopted" to be an insult in any way, shape or form.

It could be her way of protecting them. Who knows how they have threatened her or what her prenup stated regarding the children.
 
wow - he sounds just like the scientologists. where he's right and everyone else is wrong.

we can say anything we want about this cult because of the freedom of both our countries and as long as that is in place no one has the right to dictate what someone else can do. the differences is that if someone chooses to join that "religion" of their free will that thats their choice - however if they are forced through threats, abuse, brainwashing then and only then should it be stopped.

that said - as much as i hate that they are legal to run they are and so i'll defend their right to do so until our government shuts them down. and if someone like that guy says that if you are defending the right to choose you are a scientologist that's just as stupid as the guy on the video several posts back saying your a criminal because you're filming them - it's just stupid

personally i do think they need to be shut down - they are not a religion they are a cult - religions aren't based on aliens, space ships and lie detectors. they are not started by someone who wrote a scifi book and thought ok cool now lets start a religion based on this crappy book. but until they are shut down we'll continue to talk about them and they'll continue to brainwash those who aren't strong enough to resist them (sounds like the Borg LOL - you can not resists - you will be assimilated - wanna bet)





"15. Anyone on here who is actually defending Tom and Kate are really Scientologists. The earlier poster who says they are a "Christian" and just defending them both, YOU ARE A LIAR - Which in Scientology is a technique they actually teach - LYING!!!

Tom is the poster boy for a CULT! The cult is all about ruining people's lives and stealing their money. It is a bunch of BS written by a nutcase sci-fi writer who in his later years of life was fugitive from the law.

Scientology is finally unveiling itself to the public and the truth is coming out. I for one will NEVER EVER go to any movies or watch any TV shows that has Scientologists in them. I will never watch a Tom Cruise movie again. My friends and family feel the same way.

And if you need a more in depth idea of what Scientology is and the crazy lengths they will go just read the new Andrew Morton book about Tom Cruise. It is actually an amazing book. Also go to xenu.net - A website that is full of past scientology members who reveal their horrible experiences in the Scientology. Both the book and the website give you insights that will make you squirm. These people are CRAZY! Tom Cruise is going to lose his mind because he is now trapped in a corner that he can't get out of....It won't be long before Katie runs with her baby down the LA FREEWAY begging for help. Once Suri starts to become brainwashed, her mother will realize it and want OUT!!!! "
 
it's in response to that guy who posted on that link not anyone here
 
Just caught up after a week away at WDW and all I can say is that after watching those videos, I'm gonna have some heavy duty nightmares tonight!!!! Freaky stuff, people!!!!

It's good to be back ... I've missed this thread and all of you!!!!

.

You were there when I was there, too??? Where's you stay? I was at POP from the 26 - 30th. :thumbsup2


Check this out - a Readers Digest Article from 1980: ( I bolded a fine little quote from LRON himself )

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cach...+l+ron+hubbard+penny&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us


Reader's Digest, May 1980

Scientology: Anatomy of a Frightening Cult

by Eugene H. Methvin

In the late 1940s, pulp writer L. Ron Hubbard declared, "Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion."

Hubbard *did* start his own 'religion,' calling it the "Church of Scientology," and it has grown into an enterprise today grossing an estimated $100 million a year worldwide. His churches have paid him a percentage of their gross, usually ten percent, and stashed untold riches away in bank accounts in Switzerland and elsewhere under his and his wife's control. Surrounded by aides who cater to his every whim, he reportedly lives on church-owned property, formerly a resort, in Southern California.

Scientology is one of the oldest, wealthiest -- and most dangerous -- of the major "new religions" or cults operating in America today. Some of its fanatic operatives have engaged in burglary, espionage, kidnapping and smear campaigns to further their goals. Says Assistant U.S. Attorney Raymond Banoun, who directed a massive investigation that resulted in conspiracy or theft convictions of nine top Scientology officials in Washington, D.C., last October: "The evidence presented to the court shows brazen criminal campaigns against private and public organizations and individuals. The Scientology officials hid behind claims of religious liberty while inflicting injuries upon every element of society."

In 1950, Hubbard, then 39, published Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health. In 1954 he founded the first Church of Scientology in Washington, D.C. By 1978 the organization claimed 38 U.S. churches, with 41 more abroad, and 172 "missions" and 5,437,000 members worldwide. These claims are highly doubtful; critical observers have estimated a hard core of around 3,000 full-time staff and no more than 30,000 adherents in the United States.

Even so, Hubbard may live more regally than did the Maharajah of Jaipur, whose 30-room mansion and 57-acre estate in England Hubbard bought in the late 1950s as "world headquarters" for his growing movement. His retinue includes young women, known officially as "messengers," who light his ever-present cigarettes and catch the ashes. They record every word he says, including his frequent obscene outbursts of rage. They help him out of bed in the morning, run his shower, dress him. They scrub his office for a daily "white glove" inspection and rinse his laundry in 13 fresh waters. (Former members say he erupts volcanically if he sniffs soap on his clothes.)

Hubbard attracts and holds his worshipful followers by his amazing capacity to spin out an endless science-fiction fantasy in which he is the supreme leader of a chosen elite. He tells them he is a nuclear physicist who was severely wounded while serving with the U.S. Navy in World War II. "Taken crippled and blinded" to a Naval hospital, he claims to have "worked his way back to fitness and full perception in less than two years." In the process, he developed the "research" that led him to discover "Dianetics" and Scientology, the answers to most of mankind's ills.

The truth is something else. Hubbard did take a college course in molecular and atomic physics, which he flunked. He served in the Navy, but Navy records do not indicate he saw combat or was ever wounded. He was discharged and later given a 40-percent disability pension because of an ulcer, arthritis and other ailments. About this time he was petitioning the Veterans Administration for psychiatric care to treat "long periods of moroseness and suicidal inclinations." He was also arrested for petty theft in connection with checks. When he wrote to the FBI that communist spies were after him, an agent attached a note to one of his letters: "Make 'appears mental' card."

Since Dianetics, Hubbard's bizarre "philosophy" has expanded into a 25-million-word collection of books, articles and tape-recorded lectures. Hubbard claims to have traced human existence back 74 trillion years, suggesting it began on Venus. Today's earthlings are material manifestations of eternal spirits who are reincarnated time and again over the eons. But, Hubbard claims, our earthly troubles often result from ghostly mental images which he calls "engrams" -- painful experiences either in this life or in former incarnations.

Hubbard's original book created a sensation; he claimed to have "cleared" 270 cases of engrams, thus greatly increasing the subjects' I.Q.s and curing them of assorted ills from arthritis to heart troubles. Later Hubbard said that Scientology eradicated cancer and was the only specific cure for atomic-bomb burns.

To detect engrams, Hubbard adopted a battery-powered galvanometer with a needle dial wired to two empty tin cans. Charging $150 an hour, a Scientology "minister" audits a subject by having him grip the tin cans and answer detailed questions about his present or past lives. The needle's gyrations supposedly detect the engrams. By causing the subject to "confront" the engrams, the 'minister' claims to "clear his memory bin," thus raising both body and mind to a superhuman state of "total freedom."

The Scientology auditor also carefully records any intimate revelations, including sexual or criminal activities or marital or family troubles. According to the church's own documents and defectors' affidavits, such records are filed for blackmail purposes against any member (or member's family) who becomes a "potential trouble source" by threatening to defect, go to the authorities, or generate hostile publicity.

Of course, new prospects are never asked to swallow the whole ridiculous story at first gulp; they get it in timed-release capsules. The process transforms them into what one who went through it calls a "robot-like" state.

Typical was the experience of 17-year-old Julie Christofferson, a high-school honors graduate who was invited by an acquaintance -- actually a shill -- to take a "communications course." (The church advertises that these "field-staff members" get ten-percent commissions on all money their recruits pay.) Unknowingly, Julie hooked herself onto a mind-scrambling conveyor belt of hypnotic "training routines" developed by Hubbard. The recruit, cynically referred to as "raw meat," sits knee to knee with a "coach" for hours, her eyes closed. Next she sits, eyes open, for hours. Then the coach tries to find "emotional buttons." Hours of commands follow: "Lift that chair." "Move that chair." "Sit in that chair."

As Margaret Thaler Singer, a University of California psychologist who interviewed Julie and over 400 former members of cults, observes, "These routines can split the personality into a severe, dissociated state, and the recruits are hooked before they realize what is happening."

Julie found that the next step, auditing, continued to erase the boundary between reality and fantasy. In this phase, Julie exhausted all $3000 of her college savings. Then she was told she could take college-level courses while going "on staff" and working full time to recruit and process new raw meat. She ended up working 60 to 80 hours a week, at a maximum salary of $7.50 [per week]. She had now reached the "robot-like" state.

Julie felt superior, one of the chosen elite of this universe. She was one of the faithful who are promised they will "go with Ron to the next planet." Thus, they are conditioned to the "us against them" outlook that characterizes so much religious and political fanaticism.

Julie Christofferson was among the lucky, however. After nine months, her parents removed her from the cult and snapped her out of her zombie-like trance. Last August, a Portland, Ore., jury found the church's conduct so fraudulent and outrageous that it awarded her $2,067,000.20 in damages.

Less fortunate was Anne Rosenblum, who spent nearly six years in Scientology. During her last 15 months she was in the church's punishment unit, the "Rehabilitation Project Force." There, prisoners are guarded constantly, never left alone or allowed to speak to any outsider without permission. They eat leftovers, sleep on the floor, and fill their days with strenuous physical and menial labor, classroom study of Ron's works and grueling auditing to detect "crimes against Ron" in "this or past lives."

As defectors have attested, subjects become hysterical and psychotic in their auditing. Then they are locked in isolation. Not surprisingly, suicides occur. Last January in Clearwater, Fla., for example, a Scientology member hurled herself into the bay and drowned.

Through the years, Hubbard has continually added new grades and "levels" of belief. The "clearing course" costs $3812, but to get to the highest level, the devotee shells out $14,295. Hubbard has punctuated his policy letters to staff with exhortations to MAKE MONEY, MAKE MORE MONEY, MAKE OTHER PEOPLE PRODUCE SO AS TO MAKE MONEY. When numbers of recruits and receipts fall off, Hubbard orders staffers onto a diet of rice and beans.

But revenues appear to have been consistently high. In 1974 the church spent $1.1 million for an old Jesuit novitiate in Oregon. In 1976 the IRS turned up $2.86 million in cash aboard Hubbard's 320-foot flagship Apollo. Moving secretly, the church paid another $8 million for a hotel and other properties in Clearwater, Fla. A top Hubbard lieutenant who recently defected has attested that the Clearwater organization alone last year was grossing as high as $1 million per week.

In 1966 Hubbard created his own "intelligence" organization, called the "Guardian Office" (GO) [now called OSA]. He had convinced himself that a "central agency" was behind attacks against Scientology, and his suspicion focused on the World Federation for Mental Health. "Psychiatry and the KGB operate in direct collusion," he declared. He seemed to think they worked through the FBI, CIA, various newspapers and other groups. He named his third wife, Mary Sue Hubbard, to direct his own counterattack from the Los Angeles headquarters. She defined the GO's objective: "To sweep aside opposition sufficiently to create a vacuum into which Scientology can expand."

The GO training program included instructions in how to make an anonymous death threat to a journalist, smear an antagonistic clergyman, forge phony newspaper clips, plan and execute burglaries. Public-relations spokesmen were drilled on how to lie to the press -- "to outflow false data effectively." A favorite dirty trick: making anonymous phone calls to the IRS, accusing enemies of income-tax cheating and thereby inducing the IRS to audit them. Big targets were organizations that investigated Scientology or published unfavorable articles about it -- newspapers, Forbes magazine, the American Medical Association, Better Business Bureau and American Psychiatric Association.

Individuals were also targeted. In 1971 Paulette Cooper, a New York free-lance writer, published a book called The Scandal of Scientology. The church responded with an elaborate campaign of litigation, theft, defamation and malicious prosecution. She got death-threatening phone calls. According to church documents later revealed, this campaign was aimed at "getting P.C. incarcerated in a mental institution or in jail."

It came incredibly close. Miss Cooper and her publisher were sued in several U.S. cities and foreign countries. In order to call off the Scientology legal war, her publisher agreed to withdraw the book. "It just wasn't worth the legal expenses," he explained.

The worst thrust, Miss Cooper says, came after a Scientology agent stole some of her stationery, faked bomb-threat letters and framed her. She was indicted by a federal grand jury on a charge of making bomb threats [and purjury]. She went through two years of torment until she volunteered to take a Sodium Pentothal "truth" test. Only after she passed did the government drop the charges. Defending herself cost her $28,000.

In 1976 the FBI discovered that two Scientology agents were using forged credentials to rummage through a Justice Department office at night, and thereby uncovered the tip of a widespread espionage operation in Washington. One agent, Michael Meisner, after nearly a year as a fugitive, offered to cooperate with the government. Meisner said that in 1974 Scientology had mounted an all-out attack on U.S. government agencies the church thought were interfering with its operations ["opperation Snow White"]. He himself supervised Washington operations. With another agent, he broke into the IRS photographic-identification room and forged the credentials that they used to enter various government buildings, steal and copy keys left carelessly on desks, pick locks, and steal and copy government files.

With Meisner's testimony, the FBI obtained search warrants and, on July 8, 1977, raided Scientology headquarters in Washington and Los Angeles. Agents in Los Angeles seized 23,000 documents, many stolen from the U.S. government, plus burglar tools and electronic-surveillance equipment. The scope of the espionage operation was staggering. In a Justice Department agency, a Scientology employee-plant actually worked in a vault containing top-secret CIA and defense documents. Other Scientologists entered on nights and weekends and ransacked offices, including the Deputy Attorney General's, stealing highly secret papers and copying them on government copiers.

On October 26, 1979, nine high Scientology officials stood before a federal judge and were found guilty of theft or conspiracy charges arising from their plot against the government. Heading the list was Mary Sue Hubbard, 48, who had supervised the operation. Hubbard himself and 24 other Scientologists were named as unindicted co-conspirators.

Since the convictions, many former Scientologists have come forward to tell stories they had previously kept secret for fear of Hubbard's Guardians. In Boston, attorney Michael Flynn has filed a $200-million federal class-action suit for fraud, outrageous conduct and breach of contract on behalf of a former Scientologist and others who have been abused by the cult.

But Hubbard and his Scientologists have not been deterred. After last fall's convictions, they issued an appeal for volunteers for the Guardian counterattack, "to ferret out those who want to stop Scientology."

The lessons of Hubbard's Church of Scientology are many. As history demonstrates, when a fanatical individual employing powerful communication skills gathers an entourage of followers, infects them with his own delusion, persuades them that the outside world is hostile and they alone can save the world, and exacts blind obedience, the collective may break the fabric of civilized restraints and descend into terrifying crimes. Convictions, seized church documents, stipulated evidence and defectors' affidavits demonstrate that Scientologists have already indulged in burglary, espionage, blackmail, kidnapping, false imprisonment, and conspiracies to steal government documents and to obstruct justice; some have committed suicide. The parents of a teen-age girl, after following her into Hubbard's entourage for several weeks, issued an urgent appeal last January to help prevent "what we believe could be another mass murder or suicide."

Above all, the 20th-century record of leader-cults demonstrates that such collectives need watching. Nothing in our legal tradition requires us to shut our eyes to a racket religion simply because it masquerades and claims immunity under our First Amendment. As the late U.S. Supreme Court Justice Robert H. Jackson pointed out, the Constitution is not a suicide pact.
 
I wonder if Andre Morton has gotten any threats thus far ???

I feel with the internet - the alleged crimes, threats, lawsuits and harrasment they had done allegedly in the past is much more difficult to accomplish in this day and age. This is just my opinion, of course.

Here's another long article with many mentions of his wanting to start a religion to be a millionaire. The thought that anyone could blindly walk into one of these churches and say "Gee, this is DEFINATELY for me" completely baffles me. :confused3

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cach...+l+ron+hubbard+penny&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us

"The way to make a million dollars is to start a religion."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

L. Ron Hubbard is widely rumored to have said "The way to make a million dollars is to start a religion." There are also variant rumors. For some reason, this is often mentioned on Usenet. Evidence is discussed below, but the short answer is that it's almost certainly true.

The Church of Scientology has actually taken German publishers to court for printing this story. Stern won (see below).

One form of the rumor is that L. Ron Hubbard made a bar bet with Robert A. Heinlein. This is definitely not true. It's uncharacteristic of Heinlein, and there's no supporting evidence. There is, however, inconclusive evidence that Robert Heinlein suggested some parts of the original Dianetics.

Another variant is that Hubbard talked of starting a religion to avoid taxes. Jay Kay Klein reports that Hubbard said this in 1947.

The Church's media guide tells reporters that the rumor is confused, and that it was George Orwell who said it. In 1938, Orwell did write "But I have always thought there might be a lot of cash in starting a new religion...". However, Robert Vaughn Young, who was Scientology's spokesman for 20 years, says that Hubbard learned about the Orwell quote from him. Young further states that he met three people who could remember Hubbard saying more-or-less the famous quote. Nor did Hubbard write a rebuttal of the rumor -- Young claims to have ghost-written the rebuttal in the Rocky Mountain News interview.

I found the following in books about Hubbard and Scientology:

"Whenever he was talking about being hard up he often used to say that he thought the easiest way to make money would be to start a religion."
-- reporter Neison Himmel: quoted in Bare Faced Messiah p.117 from 1986 interview. Himmel shared a room with LRH, briefly, Pasadena, fall 1945.


"I always knew he was exceedingly anxious to hit big money - he used to say he thought the best way to do it would be to start a cult."
-- Sam Merwin, then the editor of the Thrilling SF magazines: quoted in Bare Faced Messiah p.133 from 1986 interview. Winter of 1946/47.

"Around this time he was invited to address a science fiction group in Newark hosted by the writer, Sam Moskowitz. `Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous,' he told the meeting. `If a man really wanted to make a million dollars, the best way to do it would be start his own religion.'
-- Bare Faced Messiah p.148. Reference given to LA Times, 27 Aug 78. Supposed to have happened in spring 1949.

"Science fiction editor and author Sam Moscowitz tells of the occasion when Hubbard spoke before the Eastern Science Fiction Association in Newark, New Jersey in 1947: `Hubbard spoke ... I don't recall his exact words; but in effect, he told us that writing science fiction for about a penny a word was no way to make a living. If you really want to make a million, he said, the quickest way is to start your own religion.'"
-- Messiah or Madman, p.45. No reference given. Yes, the spelling of Sam's name differs: this book got it wrong, it has a "k". I don't know why the two books disagree by two years.
(Oddly, the same misspelling occurs in Eisenberg. From this and other similarities, it seems likely that Corydon is quoting the Eisenberg article, rather than quoting Moskowitz directly.)


The Encyclopedia of Science Fiction lists Sam Moskowitz as the first good historian of science fiction [among other things]. In 1994 Moskowitz wrote an affidavit which states:

"After speaking for about an hour at the meeting, Mr. Hubbard answered questions from the audience. He made the following statement in response to a question about making money from writing: `You don't get rich writing science fiction. If you want to get rich, you start a religion.'"
The affidavit states that this was the 7 Nov 1948 meeting of the Eastern Science Fiction Association, of which Moskowitz was the director.

Now, there is a problem with the three Moskowitz reports. Specifically, the Church obtained affidavits in 1993 from David A. Kyle and Jay Kay Klein. Both names are well-known in science fiction, and both say that they went to the 7 Nov 1948 talk by Hubbard. Both say that they didn't hear any such statement. Puzzling.

I believe that these dueling affidavits have met in court. Stern, a German magazine, was sued by the Church, and the suit was thrown out of court after they obtained the Moskowitz affidavit.

On 9apr94, jittlov@gumby.cs.caltech.edu (Mike Jittlov) posted (about a conversation with Theodore Sturgeon):

Back in the 1940's, L. Ron Hubbard was a member of the Los Angeles Science Fantasy Society (when its old clubhouse was just north of Wilshire Blvd). Ted vividly recalled being a few yards from Hubbard, when he became testy with someone there and retorted, "Y'know, we're all wasting our time writing this hack science fiction! You wanta make _real_ money, you gotta start a _religion_!
Though I didn't ask, I think Ted would've mentioned it if the second person was Heinlein or another author of note. He had an extremely accurate memory, and I'd trust Sturgeon over anyone else's account.

Reportedly Sturgeon also told this story to others. Theodore Sturgeon was one of the truly great science fiction writers, and someone whose word and memories were trusted. (John W. Campbell commented that Sturgeon should have written the definitive history of SF fandom.) Mike Jittlov is a respected Hollywood filmmaker and stopmotion actor, and can be found on the net at "alt.fan.mike-jittlov".

Lloyd Arthur Eshbach was a science fiction writer and publisher between 1929 and 1957. His autobiography, says on pages 125 and 126 (about the events of 1948 and 1949):

I think of the time while in New York I took John W. Campbell, Marty Greenberg, and L. Ron Hubbard to lunch. Someone suggested a Swedish smorgasbord, and I had my first--and last--taste of kidney. Yuck! Afterward we wound up in my hotel room for related conversation.
The incident is stamped indelibly in my mind because of one statement that Ron Hubbard made. What led him to say what he did I can't recall--but in so many words Hubbard said:

"I'd like to start a religion. That's where the money is!"

Eshbach based his autobiography on detailed records and dated diary entries, and is therefore likely to be quite accurate on this point.

Harlan Ellison is a science fiction author and movie scriptwriter. In an interview, he has said such things as "I was there the night L. Ron Hubbard invented [Dianetics]". In a 1999 telephone interview, Mr. Ellison gave more details. In 1950, when he was 15, Ellison attended meetings of the Hydra Club. This was a New York club of science fiction writers, and he remembers Hubbard taking part in a discussion of how well a religion would pay. Ellison quoted the phrase as "what you need to do is start a religion", but did not claim to have remembered it word-for-word after 49 years.

Reportedly, a Vonnegut biography mentions the Hubbard quote. If anyone can find an exact reference, I would appreciate email. Randall Garrett also supposedly talked about this. Again, I would appreciate email.

To summarize: we have nine witnesses: Neison Himmel, Sam Merwin, Sam Moskowitz, Theodore Sturgeon, Lloyd Arthur Eshbach, Harlan Ellison, and the three unnamed witnesses of Robert Vaughn Young. There is some confusion and doubt about one of them (Sam Moskowitz). Two are reported via Russel Miller: one is reported via Mike Jittlov: one reported in his autobiography; one reported in an affidavit; and one reported to me in person. The reports describe different events, meaning that Hubbard said it perhaps six times, in six different venues - definitely not just once. And the Church's official disclaimer is now reportedly a flat lie.

Conclusion: He definitely said it more than once.


References:
Bare-Faced Messiah, The True Story of L. Ron Hubbard by Russell Miller (N.Y.: Henry Holt & Co., 1987) ISBN 0-8050-0654-0. $19.95 London: Michael Joeseph Penguin Book Ltd, 1987. See the Access FAQ for reviews.

L. Ron Hubbard: Messiah or Madman? by Bent Corydon and L. Ron Hubbard Jr. a.k.a. Ronald DeWolf.(Secaucus, NJ: Lyle Stuart, 1987) ISBN 0-8184-0444-2 In 1992, from Barricade Books, dist. by Publishers Group West, $12.95. See the Access FAQ for reviews.

The dangerous new cult of Scientology by Arlene and Howard Eisenberg, Parents Magazine, June 1969, pages 48-49 and 82-86.

Lloyd Arthur Eshbach autobiography: Over My Shoulder: Reflections of the Science Fiction Era, Oswald Train: Publisher, Phila. 1983, limited edition)

Ellison interview: The Saturday Evening Wings, Nov-Dec 1978, p.32. Reportedly Ellison also said similar things in _TIME OUT_, UK, no. 332. Ellison informed me in a 1999 interview that the Wings article is only a unverified transcript of a casual conversation, although it is broadly correct.
 
Oh wow - check out these "Top Ten" quotes of LRon. What an alleged freak-a-roo-ski!!


http://www.who-sucks.com/people/l-ron-hubbard-sucks-top-10-quotes-from-the-founder-of-scientology

(you know, I didnt read through these.... if it says anything naughty, please dont quote me...Ill go back and edit it)

The Church of Scientology is back in the news, with Germany denying a movie crew the right to film a Tom Cruise movie on government land because of Cruise’s outspoken support for Scientology, which is considered an illegal cult in Germany. Why would people think that Scientology is a crazy cult? You might want to take a look at these 10 quotes from the founder of Scientology, science fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard:

1. He followed his own advice in this case:

“Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion”


2. “Anti-Chinese Racism, from a 1928 diary entry:

[The Chinese] have neither the foresight or endurance to overrun any white country in any way except by intermarriage. One American marine could stand off a great many yellowmen without much effort.

A Chinaman can not live up to a thing, he always drags it down.

They smell of all the baths they didn’t take.
The trouble with China is, there are too many chinks here. “

3. On training black South Africans in the ways of Scientology:

“The South African native is probably the one impossible person to train in the entire world; he is probably impossible by any human standard.”

4. On Japanese people and their language:

“One of the reasons they [the Japanese] have bad eyesight is probably these microscopic characters [furigana] which have many lines and strokes to them.& We wonder why they went mad and bombed Pearl Harbor when they knew they couldn’t win. That [the Japanese language] would be a reason.”

5. On Arabs, from a 1958 lecture:

“He’s [the Arab] been going crazy steadily and gradually ever since he lost the early very fertile basins of the Middle East. He’s been going crazy ever since he failed to learn wheat farming and brought about the erosion of all of the fertile areas of the Middle East.

This race has been going for a very, very long time and has been eating death for a very long time and it is death.”

6. Apartheid Apologist:

“The problem of South Africa is different than the world thinks. There is no native problem. The native worker gets more than white workers do in England!

The South African government is not a police state. It’s easier on people than the United States government!”

7. On dealing with criticism:

“Never discuss Scientology with the critic. Just discuss his or her crimes, known and unknown.”

8. Threatening anyone who opposes Scientology:

“We are slowly and carefully teaching the unholy a lesson. It is as follows: We are not a law enforcement agency. BUT we will become interested in the crimes of people who seek to stop us. If you oppose scientology we promptly look up - and find and expose - your crimes. If you leave us alone we will leave you alone.

It’s very simple. Even a fool can grasp that.

And don’t underrate our ability to carry it out.”

9. Anti-Democratic:

“And I don’t see that popular measures, self-abnegation and democracy have done anything for Man but push him further into the mud. Currently, popularity endorses degraded novels, self-abnegation has filled the Southeast Asian jungles with stone idols and corpses, and democracy has given us inflation and income tax.”

10. Another look at his advice for life. Compare with number 1.

“Make money. Make more money. Make other people make money.”
 
From: philscott88@hotmail.com (Phil Scott)
Date: Sat, 05 Aug 2000 23:02:36 GMT
Message-ID: <398c9c1a.4973716@news.tdl.com>

FAIR USE QUOTE FOUND ON THE INTERNET L Ron Hubbard is quoted as saying:

"For those of you whose Christian toes I may have stepped on, let me take the opportunity to disabuse you of some lovely myths. For instance, the historic Jesus was not nearly the sainted figure (he) has been made out to be. In addition to being a lover of young boys and men, he was given to uncontrollable bursts of temper and hatred.... You have only to look at the history his teachings inspired to see where it all inevitably leads. It is historic fact and yet man still clings to the ideal, so deep and insidious is the biologic implanting.......

No doubt you are familiar with the Revelations section of the Bible where various events are predicted. Also mentioned is a brief period of time in which the arch-enemy of Christ, referred to as the anti-Christ, will reign and his opinions will have sway ... this anti-Christ represents the forces of Lucifer (literally, the "light-bearer" or "light-bringer"), Lucifer being a mythical representation of the forces of enlightenment.... My mission could be said to fulfill the Biblical promise represented by this brief anti-Christ period. "

-- L. Ron Hubbard, Student Briefing, OT VIII Series I


from: http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cach...+hubbard+antichrist&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=29&gl=us
 
ok - here's a question for anyone in the know.

is scientology a recognized religion in the u.s or canada?

if not why haven't the governments condomed them and stop giving them tax free exemptions?

if they are a legal religion - can they have that taken away and be shut down?

glad to see at least one country (germany) standing up to them.
 
interesting quote from that last link from CR

"In fact, there is no compatibility between Scientology and Christianity. As a belief system based on satanic principles, Scientology is diametrically opposed to Christianity. The truth is that you cannot be both a Christian and a Scientologist."

i've heard Tommy say many times that there are Christian Scientologists, Hyndu Scientologists, Muslim Scientologists but we are just Scientologists.

so very interesting that Katie, who is Catholic was lead astray so quickly (16 days according to the timelines) and her parents weren't able to snap her out of it.

aren't there people who specialize in deprogramming people who have been sucked in by cults?

maybe we should all pool our money to get them to snap tom and katie out of it
 
ok - here's a question for anyone in the know.

is scientology a recognized religion in the u.s or canada?

if not why haven't the governments condomed them and stop giving them tax free exemptions?

if they are a legal religion - can they have that taken away and be shut down?

glad to see at least one country (germany) standing up to them.

Yes - Bill Clinton gave them Tax Exempt status as a bonafide religion. Whether or not that canbe taken away - I dont know.

ANd it's not just Germany standing up to them. Theyre currently banned om Belgium, France, Germany and Greece. Germany taking the most avid stance against them.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.















Receive up to $1,000 in Onboard Credit and a Gift Basket!
That’s right — when you book your Disney Cruise with Dreams Unlimited Travel, you’ll receive incredible shipboard credits to spend during your vacation!
CLICK HERE













DIS Facebook DIS youtube DIS Instagram DIS Pinterest DIS Tiktok DIS Twitter

Back
Top