News Round Up

[leholcomb]

Do they market Disneyland outside of the US? I'm fairly positive they do WDW but I'm not so sure Disneyland is marketed.

From what I've read, DLR is heavily marketed in Canada and Australia/New Zealand. There are special ticket packages available only to these residents.

 

[luisov]

Do they market Disneyland outside of the US? I'm fairly positive they do WDW but I'm not so sure Disneyland is marketed.

I guess it really depends on the country. I would say Mexico and some parts of Canada tend to favor DL over WDW, whereas WDW is marketed more in Brazil, Argentina or England , just to name a few. As Pete says, though, there are different campaigns that feature a mix of DL/WDW images with a broad ''Visit Disney parks'' phrase on them.

 

[rteetz]

Catalina Eddies closed for refurb

http://www.wdwmagic.com/dining/cata...ll-american-cafe-closed-for-refurbishment.htm

 

[skier_pete]

I also think a third gate will eventually happen probably decades from now but it will eventually happen if they really want a world destination in anaheim.

Do they market Disneyland outside of the US? I'm fairly positive they do WDW but I'm not so sure Disneyland is marketed.

The third gate in Anaheim is interesting to even think about because...where do they put it? The rumors I've heard is it would be away from the other two parks, but if you do that, now you've thrown away the advantage of the compact size that DLR has over WDW - but you still wouldn't have the immersiveness of WDW.

Do they market Disneyland outside of the US? I'm fairly positive they do WDW but I'm not so sure Disneyland is marketed.

As others have said - WDW is a 5-6 hour flight from Europe, but DLR is a 10 hour flight. And the other side of the globe - Japan / China / Asia - have there own Disney Parks with a 3rd one on the way..Basically - I don't think Disneyland has as much of an international market as WDW. But - I am really, really not sure they covet it that much.

Here's the argument why I totally disagree that they are trying to HALVE the number of annual passholder. Yes, they would like to reduce it, but not HALVE it:
In 2014, Disneyland Resort had about 25.6 million day guests.

So - while there are no official numbers - most of what's out there says that there are one million passholders at DLR.

Now - here's the tricky part of my proposition - what would most people think is the "average" number of visits per year for an annual passholder. Certainly there are some that barely use it, and others that go a hundred days a year. What I would say is that a minimum number is at least 10 - would many people renew passes if there were only going a couple days a year? 10 as a minimum would likely make the average somewhere between 15 and 20. Does anyone disagree that that's a reasonable average?

So - if we agree with that - of the 25 million visitors per year - that means 15 to 20 million are AP holders, or somewhere between 60% and 80% of all visitors.

And then if you say they want to reduce the AP holders by 50%, that means they are looking to reduce the number of people in the park by 7.5 to 10 million visitors. I'm afraid I simply don't buy that they are looking to do that. Unless you argue that they want to replace those AP attendees with out of town guests. But to do this - they would need to increase outside visitors by 75 - 200 % over current levels. No-one would consider that possible, even over a 20 year period.

So - i continue to say I think the folks that talk about this massive reduction in AP holders are wrong - and just repeating rumors. DLR/TDA are willing to take less AP holders certainly, and if they can increase prices to make up for the losses that's perfect. But what they really want to do as much as anything is distribute the crowds. The idea is to force more passholders to the less busy times of year. These less busy times of year and the more tourist times of year. (Summer / Christmas / Easter) This makes the experience of the out-of-towners better because the parks aren't as crowded, and you can get some increase from those people, but still if you increase that 10% over the next 5 years that's huge.

The risk Disney is making is if they DO manage to drive away the locals, and then can't increase the out-of-towners to make up for it. Which is why I don't think they want it to go THAT quickly. Actual attendance drops would be near-disastrous for the business, unless they were able to also significantly increase individual guest inpark spending. (A difficult feat.)

 

[rteetz]

The third gate in Anaheim is interesting to even think about because...where do they put it? The rumors I've heard is it would be away from the other two parks, but if you do that, now you've thrown away the advantage of the compact size that DLR has over WDW - but you still wouldn't have the immersiveness of WDW

Some rumors say Mickey and friends lot. The parking structures would then make up for that lost lot.

 

[TexasErin]

I just wish that DL would get 10-day tickets, like WDW. I know many say that is too long to spend at DL, but my family disagrees. We ended up buying APs, just because that was the cheapest way to have ten days worth of admission- sure we were blocked out on Saturday, but we used that day to swim and catch a movie at Downtown Disney.

 

[Irish_Mike]

I imagine they'll introduce 10-day tickets once they expand with Star Wars land.

 

[DizFanFamily]

Certainly not to Europe. WDW has two major advantages over DL for European tourists.

I was recently at Disneyland for the 1/2 marathon weekend and there were numerous participants from Asia and Australia. I suspect they advertise Disneyland to the Pacific markets.

 

[rteetz]

I just wish that DL would get 10-day tickets, like WDW. I know many say that is too long to spend at DL, but my family disagrees. We ended up buying APs, just because that was the cheapest way to have ten days worth of admission- sure we were blocked out on Saturday, but we used that day to swim and catch a movie at Downtown Disney.

People just don't spend that much time there. The demand for a 10 day ticket in Disneyland is very small compared to WDW.

 

[mom2rtk]

People just don't spend that much time there. The demand for a 10 day ticket in Disneyland is very small compared to WDW.

Then why not offer them to the ones who do want them? Or at least a 6 or 7 day ticket?

 

[rteetz]

Then why not offer them to the ones who do want them? Or at least a 6 or 7 day ticket?

Disneyland is quite different in demographics compared to WDW. Most people who go to Disneyland are there for short periods of time or are locals. Those who go to WDW often stay for a week or more.

 

[skier_pete]

People just don't spend that much time there. The demand for a 10 day ticket in Disneyland is very small compared to WDW.

Then why not offer them to the ones who do want them? Or at least a 6 or 7 day ticket?

I agree with rteetz - there's VERY little demand for a 10-day ticket. (I realize a PP said they spend 10 days there, but gosh we love Disney and we've been there before and are waffling between 3 days and 4 days. I couldn't possibly imagine spending more than 5 days there.

However, I would agree they should probably put out a longer than a 5 day pass...even if demand is small why not have something like a 7 day pass for those that want to go for a full week. More proof that they really aren't that interested in making it a destination resort.

 

[leholcomb]

I agree with rteetz - there's VERY little demand for a 10-day ticket. (I realize a PP said they spend 10 days there, but gosh we love Disney and we've been there before and are waffling between 3 days and 4 days. I couldn't possibly imagine spending more than 5 days there.

However, I would agree they should probably put out a longer than a 5 day pass...even if demand is small why not have something like a 7 day pass for those that want to go for a full week. More proof that they really aren't that interested in making it a destination resort.

The Canadian/Australia/New Zealand tickets I mentioned earlier are 10 day tickets. They do offer them to clientele that will actually use them. It is rare for the DLR market to want to stay longer than 5 days. I am taking my first trip next month and have already backed down from a 5 day to a 4 day and we aren't going anywhere but DLR.

 

[mom2rtk]

I agree a 10 day ticket isn't needed. But I still think this is about more than "we don't sell enough 6 or 7 day tickets to even offer them."

Initially they stopped selling them because there was so much fraud with the longer tickets, which I understood. But now that they have added photos to every multiday ticket that's no longer a valid excuse.

 

[DDLand]

The third gate in Anaheim is interesting to even think about because...where do they put it? The rumors I've heard is it would be away from the other two parks, but if you do that, now you've thrown away the advantage of the compact size that DLR has over WDW - but you still wouldn't have the immersiveness of WDW.

Agreed, there's so much in the air on that front. I've heard of plans to maybe do the Anaheim stadium or Toy Story as options for gate 3. They also have that large parking lot behind paradise pier. Additionally, what IPs would they use? SW? Done. Marvel? Coming soon. Frozen? Good chance it's going into New Fantasyland. More Pixar? There's already a huge presence. Nothing pops out at me. They could do something more cultural like a Animal Kingdom/World Showcase fusion that is really immersive and would allow for extensive IP tie ins and merchandising. Nothing super obvious though.

As others have said - WDW is a 5-6 hour flight from Europe, but DLR is a 10 hour flight. And the other side of the globe - Japan / China / Asia - have there own Disney Parks with a 3rd one on the way..Basically - I don't think Disneyland has as much of an international market as WDW. But - I am really, really not sure they covet it that much.

Indeed, that's really what was going through my mind too. Besides some of the mentioned Canada, Mexico, and Pacific countries their markets are less far reaching. Hong Kong Disneyland is improving and will continue to improve with Park two, more hotel space, and a full on shopping and dining district. That should further steal potential markets from Australia and New Zealand.

Here's the argument why I totally disagree that they are trying to HALVE the number of annual passholder. Yes, they would like to reduce it, but not HALVE it:
In 2014, Disneyland Resort had about 25.6 million day guests.

So - while there are no official numbers - most of what's out there says that there are one million passholders at DLR.

Now - here's the tricky part of my proposition - what would most people think is the "average" number of visits per year for an annual passholder. Certainly there are some that barely use it, and others that go a hundred days a year. What I would say is that a minimum number is at least 10 - would many people renew passes if there were only going a couple days a year? 10 as a minimum would likely make the average somewhere between 15 and 20. Does anyone disagree that that's a reasonable average?

So - if we agree with that - of the 25 million visitors per year - that means 15 to 20 million are AP holders, or somewhere between 60% and 80% of all visitors.

And then if you say they want to reduce the AP holders by 50%, that means they are looking to reduce the number of people in the park by 7.5 to 10 million visitors. I'm afraid I simply don't buy that they are looking to do that. Unless you argue that they want to replace those AP attendees with out of town guests. But to do this - they would need to increase outside visitors by 75 - 200 % over current levels. No-one would consider that possible, even over a 20 year period.

So - i continue to say I think the folks that talk about this massive reduction in AP holders are wrong - and just repeating rumors. DLR/TDA are willing to take less AP holders certainly, and if they can increase prices to make up for the losses that's perfect. But what they really want to do as much as anything is distribute the crowds. The idea is to force more passholders to the less busy times of year. These less busy times of year and the more tourist times of year. (Summer / Christmas / Easter) This makes the experience of the out-of-towners better because the parks aren't as crowded, and you can get some increase from those people, but still if you increase that 10% over the next 5 years that's huge.

The risk Disney is making is if they DO manage to drive away the locals, and then can't increase the out-of-towners to make up for it. Which is why I don't think they want it to go THAT quickly. Actual attendance drops would be near-disastrous for the business, unless they were able to also significantly increase individual guest inpark spending. (A difficult feat.)

You raise fair points all around. Keep in mind that the Disney of today might not be able to handle losing millions of guests and 100s of millions in revenue, but the Disney of tomorrow might very well be able to absorb that type of loss. Consider that from 2011 to now, attendance at Disney California Adventure has increased by over 2 million new guests. A significant portion of that is directly related to Cars Land. Consider also, that Disney is about to launch Star Wars Land, which has an even bigger potential draw than Cars Land. Millions of of Star Wars fans will converge on Disneyland for years to come. While Star Wars Land will certainly add capacity, I doubt it will be enough to handle the millions who will show up for the new land.

So at the same time they may lose something like 7 million, they'll also be gaining millions of new SW fans. SW fans who don't know all the tricks for saving money, love buying souvenirs, and will splurge because it's a once in a lifetime trip. They also won't tell Disney how it should run their theme parks, and they won't notice if a beloved offering is canned.

This whole equation doesn't even include the Marvel add ons and New Fantasyland which will bring new fans into the Resort.

Disney's strategy seems to be simple, replace the cheapskates (funny when we're talking about people who buy $600 passes) with higher spending once in a lifetime guests. I do agree with your sentiment that this isn't about to happen all at once, but it will be a progression.

This sounds strikingly similar to another resort...

I agree with rteetz - there's VERY little demand for a 10-day ticket. (I realize a PP said they spend 10 days there, but gosh we love Disney and we've been there before and are waffling between 3 days and 4 days. I couldn't possibly imagine spending more than 5 days there.

However, I would agree they should probably put out a longer than a 5 day pass...even if demand is small why not have something like a 7 day pass for those that want to go for a full week. More proof that they really aren't that interested in making it a destination resort.

Agreed here. Disneyland is beautiful and perhaps my favorite Resort, but I'd not spend ten days there. It's very compact and it takes considerably less time to move about and explore everything.

I do disagree with you saying this is a sign of disinterest. I think it's more just they wouldn't sell all that well. Even at WDW those ten day tickets have got to be pretty niche.

 

[Simba07]

On the rumored tiered tickets... do you think it is safe to but tickets now (from 3rd party or Disney) that are likely to be used during a peak time in 2+ years? Do you think we would have to upgrade them?

 

[rteetz]

On the rumored tiered tickets... do you think it is safe to but tickets now (from 3rd party or Disney) that are likely to be used during a peak time in 2+ years? Do you think we would have to upgrade them?

If you buy them now and don't use them until that trip they will have to be accepted they down expire before first use. However once you use the first day you have 14 days to use the entire length of the ticket. So yes you are safe to buy now.

 

[rteetz]

Some updates on Shanghai

http://www.**************.net/2015/...tion-enchanted-storybook-castle-taking-shape/

 

[rteetz]

Morimoto is starting Lunch on Wednesday!

http://www.wdwmagic.com/dining/mori...ings-to-open-for-lunch-starting-wednesday.htm

 

[rteetz]

Disney Springs Orange garage is getting its floors coated

http://www.orlandoparksnews.com/2015/10/orange-parking-garage-floor-coating-at.html