New Fast Pass + is a money grab

[lugnut33]

Did anybody else notice the thread started by Andyman8 in the rumors section? We all know Andyman8 has some good connections at WDW and he's a pretty good poster in regards to information. In the thread he states that by the end of 2014 Disney will be using extra FP+ as an incentive to move up a category or two at the resorts and that they will be allowing people to buy extra FP+ for 9.99 for tier 2 rides and 14.99 for tier 1. The kicker is you cannot buy two fastpasses for TSMM as an example. You only get one shot at the ride.

 

[WDSearcher]

Because what you get staying onsite at Universal compared to what you get staying onsite at Disney is like comparing a BMW to a Pinto.

The Express Pass for onsite guests at Universal is nothing at all like FP+ in that the only regulations on it are that there are a couple of rides that do not have Express Pass access. That's it. There is no limit to how many times you use it, or if you park hop. You want to ride Spiderman 10 times in a row? Go for it, just keep showing your room key and go right back in. No need to schedule or plan months in advance, just ride what you want to ride when you want to ride it without waiting in long lines.

With FP+...well, yeah, Express Pass it is not.

Now of course Universal has only three onsite resorts so it can offer this without mass chaos but considering their deluxe hotels are usually priced on par with a Disney moderate and you get unlimited Express Pass, not many are going to be "up in arms about it". It truly is a perk. Plus, they do offer the public not staying on site a chance to purchase a limited Express Pass or even the Unlimited Express Pass if they so desire, so no matter if you are staying off site, you still have the same option to have the exact same benefits if you want them.

Well ... kind of. When the new Cabana Bay Resort (value level) opens at Universal, there's no guarantee that the value level guests will get that same perk. It's not yet noted on the website. When you click on "On Site Benefits" for Cabana Bay, you get:

HOTEL GUESTS ENJOY EXCLUSIVE THEME PARK BENEFITS, INCLUDING:

• Early Park Admission to The Wizarding World of Harry Potter™, one hour before the theme park opens (valid theme park admission required)
• Complimentary shuttle buses and walking paths to both Universal Orlando® theme parks and Universal CityWalk
• And More!

Now, I suppose unlimited Express Pass could be part of the "and more!", but you'd think they'd note that, as it's a tremendous selling point. So ... jury is still out regarding whether staying at the value is getting you more at Universal than you get at Disney. The deluxe? Unlimited FOL is definitely a huge perk. But if they don't offer that at the value -- or if it's offered, but only for an additional cost or at a lower level (not "unlimited") -- then it's a little less of a slam-dunk.

Right now at WDW, you stay on property, you get the same benefits across the board, whether you're value or deluxe. If staying at a value at Universal means you have to pay more to have the same perk someone gets at a deluxe, then it's a little less of a "value" compared to the park up the street.

 

[JillianMarie]

And here all this time I thought Disney was a charity that didn't care about money. I am shocked, SHOCKED by this accusation that they're a for profit company. Of *course* it's a cash-grab. Every time they open a new restaurant, it's a cash grab. That 7 Dwarves Mine Ride? Cash grab. New DVC? Cash grab. Pirates League and BBB? Cash grab. Why be offended that Disney is offering services designed to separate you from your money?

 

[mom2rtk]

And here all this time I thought Disney was a charity that didn't care about money. I am shocked, SHOCKED by this accusation that they're a for profit company. Of *course* it's a cash-grab. Every time they open a new restaurant, it's a cash grab. That 7 Dwarves Mine Ride? Cash grab. New DVC? Cash grab. Pirates League and BBB? Cash grab. Why be offended that Disney is offering services designed to separate you from your money?

Because this is the first of those cash grabs where they had to take something away from some guests in order to sell it to others.

 

[JillianMarie]

Well, the 'selling it to others' is still a rumor so I refuse to get too upset about it at this point. Besides, I loved fp+ and didn't feel like anything was being taken away from me.

 

[minnie mum]

Well, the 'selling it to others' is still a rumor so I refuse to get too upset about it at this point. Besides, I loved fp+ and didn't feel like anything was being taken away from me.

I'm glad that FP+ worked for you. But you don't think anything was taken away from you? So you stayed on site and were able to pre-book your FPs?

You didn't have to wait until you arrived, stand in a long line at a kiosk and hope you could get a FP for the ride you wanted?

You didn't mind that you couldn't get FPs at 2 different parks if you wanted to park hop?

You didn't mind that you couldn't get FPs for both Soarin and TT on the same day?

You didn't mind that you couldn't get more than one FP for any headliner? When your kids really, really wanted to ride it multiple times?

You didn't mind that the parks were really crowded and most of the standby lines were long, but you could only get 3 FPs for the whole day?

And you actually experienced a WDW vacation where you weren't faced with computer glitches, disappearing and reappearing reservations, and an unreliable app that might or might not load when you were in the park and wanted to check or modify a reservation?

I'm so happy for you. Me- I have no plans to go near WDW until everything has been rolled out for EVERYONE and Disney has unveiled all of the secrets they seem to be holding back. And even then- alternate vacations are looking better and better all the time.

 

[MonkeyDishwasher]

Fast pass is a perk. How about we take it away from everyone and have everyone wait in very single line like they used to? Holy cow people, they don't owe you anything just because you're on vacation. They only owe you a safe place to visit and cast members that won't curse you out. Nothing past that. If you need more, feel free to go elsewhere and leave the parks less crowded for those of us who are still willing to go.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

I'm so happy for you.

Are you really? I mean, your post doesn't read that way at all.

 

[Laketravis]

Keep in mind there are two future models at play here:

DISNEY:

• 
  Is building more on-site rooms (DVC)

• With the exception of Avatar Land in AK which may turn out to be as (in)significant as the new Fantasy Land in MK, Disney has publicly stated they will not be making large investments in attractions in the near future

UNIVERSAL:

• Has publicly stated they feel they can add another 20,000 onsite guest rooms BUT:

• They have also stated they will increase the supply to meet the increased demand by opening a new, major attraction every year for the foreseeable future

Bonus points for anyone who can figure out which of the above has a higher probability of success.

 

[mummabear]

Did anybody else notice the thread started by Andyman8 in the rumors section? We all know Andyman8 has some good connections at WDW and he's a pretty good poster in regards to information. In the thread he states that by the end of 2014 Disney will be using extra FP+ as an incentive to move up a category or two at the resorts and that they will be allowing people to buy extra FP+ for 9.99 for tier 2 rides and 14.99 for tier 1. The kicker is you cannot buy two fastpasses for TSMM as an example. You only get one shot at the ride.

I will be really disappointed if deluxe receives more FP+ than value, what you are paying more for is the amenities at your hotel resort and the room itself, this should not extend to the park.
$14.99 is pretty steep, at Busch for about $19-$25 you can ride each of their headliners once plus one a 2nd time.
I hate that it looks to be going this way, everyone already pays such a premium to enter the park they don't need to tack on extra $$ and in the end many people will spend less because they aren't as happy with Disney

 

[johde]

I'm not saying the OP is wrong. But, at this point it's still too early to know if FP+ is a money grab or not. Disney is the only theme park chain though that is still attempting to provide a free line skipping service as part of the general admission.

Universal's system is built on money. To skip the lines you need to stay at one of their deluxe resorts or buy a special ticket.
FP- was a system built on knowledge, and the ability to take advantage of that knowledge. Knowing what FP's to pull, what machines were disconnected, that you could return after your return window.

FP+ the verdict is still out on it. The system need to start working smoothly before they can even start considering adding additional FP+ for a price. It could be a money grab, or it could be a way to limit the benefit of knowledge to skew the equation back towards the first time visitor a little bit.

 

[larryz]

I don't like having plan every aspect of my trip. I better schedule my bathroom breaks

And remember, each visit counts as one FP+ selection...

I'm not saying the OP is wrong. But, at this point it's still too early to know if FP+ is a money grab or not.

A US corporation doesn't spend a self-reported billion dollars plus on a system that ISN'T a targeted money grab...

 

[over50visits]

I'm not saying the OP is wrong. But, at this point it's still too early to know if FP+ is a money grab or not. Disney is the only theme park chain though that is still attempting to provide a free line skipping service as part of the general admission.

Universal's system is built on money. To skip the lines you need to stay at one of their deluxe resorts or buy a special ticket.

If I were a Disney planner, looking enviously at Universal charging for their fast pass system, I would try to figure out how to charge for Disney's while minimizing guest anger.

Ah! Repackage it, as a new product, and give some of it away free! Eveyone gets three FPs a day (well, 1 real one and 2 minor ones). FPs are still free! Now, if you want more, there is a small charge. I'm a management genius, I've gotten people to pay for my formerly free product, and thank me for offering "savings" on FP packages!

Just like the DDP, this is the perfect business plan to significantly increase revenue while making guests think they are gaining more vacation enjoyment.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

Keep in mind there are two future models at play here:

DISNEY:

• 
  Is building more on-site rooms (DVC)

• With the exception of Avatar Land in AK which may turn out to be as (in)significant as the new Fantasy Land in MK, Disney has publicly stated they will not be making large investments in attractions in the near future

UNIVERSAL:

• Has publicly stated they feel they can add another 20,000 onsite guest rooms BUT:

• They have also stated they will increase the supply to meet the increased demand by opening a new, major attraction every year for the foreseeable future

Bonus points for anyone who can figure out which of the above has a higher probability of success.

I agree with your point with regard the subset of individuals that happen to be within the target demographic of each company, but Universal Studios is after a much more narrow audience. Disney thinks that they can still win by investing in families with young children and the elderly, so they are spending their money accordingly. They seem happy to let Universal pull the 14-30 year old park goer, knowing that they will come back when they have children of their own.

Different strategies aimed at different audiences.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

A US corporation doesn't spend a self-reported billion dollars plus on a system that ISN'T a targeted money grab...

Absolutely correct, but FP+ isn't the system, it is just one feature of the new system. The system, in general, is clearly designed to help Disney make more money. Each feature will help them achieve that goal in a different way. But the real money comes in a few years when they begin to more directly market to guests in the parks and resorts. When attractions begin to "speak" to individual guests. When every CM is able to call every guest by name, and make every guest feel special.

Will it work? I have no idea, but they didn't invest nearly $2BB on a fast pass system. It is so much more than that.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Honestly, I'm OK with the perk and have long said that there needs to be more perks for those staying on-site now that EMH have been cut, eliminated, and now they're starting to pull major rides out of the EMH usage. The EMH were becoming less and less of an "OMG what a special perk!" bonus.

 

[Laketravis]

I agree with your point with regard the subset of individuals that happen to be within the target demographic of each company, but Universal Studios is after a much more narrow audience. Disney thinks that they can still win by investing in families with young children and the elderly, so they are spending their money accordingly. They seem happy to let Universal pull the 14-30 year old park goer, knowing that they will come back when they have children of their own.

Different strategies aimed at different audiences.

Admittedly anecdotal, but:

My DS got the collection of Harry Potter books for Christmas, and Disney Infinity for PS3.

He plays the Disney Infinity, but he's also started reading the first Harry Potter book. He was so excited when he got up to page 100 that he wanted to watch the first movie. He did last night. Then I told him about Universal, went online and we checked it out together.

He's been to WDW four times. I asked him where he wanted to go this year, WDW or Universal. He said Universal.

He's 8. And where he goes, so goes Mommy and Daddy.......

That's the kind of innate interest that happened throughout past decades when a kid would watch the Mickey Mouse Club or the Wonderful World of Disney or get home from seeing a Disney movie (that did NOT involve a princess).

I see Disney loosing a little bit of ground each year in that scenario, they are not currently producing the same strong hooks that instill a subliminal connection to the parks that build nostalgic value over time.

Other than the princess theme, of course, but that could be considered a niche market as well.

 

[kmarie99]

Honestly, I'm OK with the perk and have long said that there needs to be more perks for those staying on-site now that EMH have been cut, eliminated, and now they're starting to pull major rides out of the EMH usage. The EMH were becoming less and less of an "OMG what a special perk!" bonus.

I have not heard of this, what major rides have they pulled out of EMH?

 

[Tropical Wilds]

I have not heard of this, what major rides have they pulled out of EMH?

Splash has been pulled out of MK's EMH. Internal indications are that when the safari is added to AK's night EMH when they start this year, Kali will also be pulled.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

Admittedly anecdotal, but:

My DS got the collection of Harry Potter books for Christmas, and Disney Infinity for PS3.

He plays the Disney Infinity, but he's also started reading the first Harry Potter book. He was so excited when he got up to page 100 that he wanted to watch the first movie. He did last night. Then I told him about Universal, went online and we checked it out together.

He's been to WDW four times. I asked him where he wanted to go this year, WDW or Universal. He said Universal.

He's 8. And where he goes, so goes Mommy and Daddy.......

That's the kind of innate interest that happened throughout past decades when a kid would watch the Mickey Mouse Club or the Wonderful World of Disney or get home from seeing a Disney movie (that did NOT involve a princess).

I see Disney loosing a little bit of ground each year in that scenario, they are not currently producing the same strong hooks that build nostalgic value over time.

Other than the princess theme, of course, but that could be considered a niche market as well.

My boys are both huge HP fans, too. We read the books together, saw the films together, and we own all of the movies - they have watched them many times. But after one trip to US, they wanted to go back to WDW. I was surprised as they are in the target demographic for US, but they both said that they just prefer the atmosphere at WDW. That probably comes from the comfort level from the many, many trips there.

We all really loved the days that we spent at US, and I would gladly go again, but they have not wanted to return since that one trip after HP opened (and we have asked). They will probably ask again after the new HP section opens up (I am also looking forward to that trip).