More Dining Info from AllEars

[Brian Noble]

You could hit 25%, if you maximize the plan, but you'd have to work pretty hard at it. Here's an example:

Consider a day at Epcot. Morning in Future World, with a lunch at Sunshine Seasons. Get the most expensive times: the beef flatbread plus a large drink plus a double scoop of ice cream (assuming you can put that on the plan).

Afternoon in World Showcase. Have dinner at Le Cellier. Again, order as expensively as you can: the mushroom filet, a frozen cappucino (again, assuming you can put it on the plan), and the whiskey cake.

One snack at $4.

Total damage, plus tax: about $65. You paid $39. But, it would be hard to make most days look like this.

I agree about the deluxe plan. It works especially well for those who enjoy the signature restaurants, dinner shows, etc. For example, someone who went to CRT for a late breakfast, and then had a three-course dinner at Tony's (ordering inexpensively: the salad, eggplant rotini, tiramisu, plus a coffee) would spend about $69 including tax, and the CRT breakfast is perhaps the least effective use of two TS credits I can think of.

 

[JDiva02]

For us the new "basic" DDP would at most save $3-$4 per day. While some have said they like the convenience of having meals pre-paid, I won't miss the inconvenience of having to "parse" the menus and keeping track of our dining credits.

There is no way I would do the deluxe DDP--too many TS credits (and ADR's) to juggle. I do wonder if enough people will take the deluxe DDP so they can do more signature restaurants --and if so how that may change the quality and service at those restuarants.

As far as pricing the DDP--I don't think we can ever really calculate the true cost/benefit of the DDP for Disney. Remember, it is part of a package only available to resort guests who purchased park tickets. Its goal was to increase resort and park attendance and make WDW all encompassing so those tourist dollars were spent at WDW and no where else in Orlando. I agree if it were sold as a "stand alone" deal it would be hard to see how WDW could make much, if any, profit.

LSL

 

[Nancyg56]

I think the deluxe plan could work for our family while the little one is under 10. We still plan quite a few meals, they are part of out vacation and we like the break. I would have to put the numbers to the test to see what we would really use and really save, and then determine if the amount saved, if any, is worth the commitment to prepay for our meals and commit to have those meals on site.

The "regular" DDP is not going to work for us. A decrease of $1 to remove the appetizer and then raise my total price another 18% is no incentive for me to stay on the property and have my meals there.

We are in Disney in October an then I think we could have one more trip planned that is mostly Disney so maybe a split stay with the Deluxe plan for a portion and then a move off site to visit area attractions. I doubt I would commit to over 6 or 7 days at $70 for food for my entire family.

 

[JimMIA]

Lewisc touched on this, but I think it deserves more consideration.

IMHO, evaluating DDP is a trickier exercise than most folks do. Most people compare the cost of DDP (now + tip) to the menu prices of the food offered by DDP. That's a bogus comparison if you are trying to determine whether DDP saves you money. (There are other reasons to get DDP than saving money.)

The better comparison is to calculate approximately where and what you would eat if you were paying cash and compare that to the TOTAL cost of DDP. If the number for the TOTAL cost of DDP is less, you save money. If the TOTAL cost of DDP is more than you would normally spend, but less than the menu prices, then you can decide whether you are getting good value...but you are not saving money compared to what you would normally spend.

Keep in mind that the TOTAL cost of DDP includes the DDP price, tips, park tickets you have to buy but don't need (not a factor for everyone, but certainly for AP holders), plus the discounts on lodging you have to give up in order to be eligible for DDP. If you have to pay $30-40 per night more for your room to qualify, that's a COST of DDP, but most people don't include those costs in their calculations.

For our family (2A/1C, DVC members), DDP formerly resulted in a total savings of only about $75-100 per trip. And we didn't pay any more for our room and didn't have to buy park tickets.

I think if people really want to get an accurate idea of whether DDP is for them, they need to take a much closer look than most do. Most just listen to the marketing hype and spend a lot more than they would have normally.

 

[Lewisc]

You could hit 25%, if you maximize the plan, but you'd have to work pretty hard at it. Here's an example:

A plan that I "have to work pretty hard at it" isn't a plan that's worth it. The old plan worked because I could get reasonable savings without having to work the plan. The new plan will be purchased by guests who want to pre-pay and/or don't know any better and guests that plan to work pretty hard at getting their monies worth.

At least one rumor has the list of covered snacks being reduced. I'm not sure we can assume a snack will be worth $4. The brochure lists a half dozen or so covered snacks and goes to to say anything with a DDP logo is also included. Disney really doesn't have to disclose,in advance, a reduction in the "extra" snacks.

 

[salmoneous]

The Disney Dining Plan has been underpriced since it was introduced. As much as people hate the idea, when something is underpriced, that's a problem for a business. Their job is to price things correctly, not underprice things. The removal of the gratuity and appetizer brings the plan back into the realm of appropriate pricing, and the dollar off per day keeps it still a decent deal for many guests.

Magic Express is vastly under priced. Yet it's been a good deal for both customers and Disney. Just because something appears to be under priced doesn't mean it's bad.

With the removal of the gratuity and appetizer, the price of the plan is about what I would pay OOP. A 0% savings. What's the point? Ir order to just break even I have to buy all the food on the plan - I can't take days or meals off and I have to eat those deserts they always push at me. As an adult, no thanks. The kids meals still seem to be a bargains. I suspect there will be threads on the DIS discussing how to get kids on the plan without getting Mom and Dad.

 

[Amyrlin]

The delux would work best for us, wanting breakfast as a sit down meal and then a 2TS in the evning ONly thing is it looks like we may be better off using the DDE.

 

[pilferk]

Remember, it is part of a package only available to resort guests who purchased park tickets.

Just to add to that:

...and DVC owners.

Because we're entitled to use the DDP and do NOT have to buy tickets or packages to do it.

 

[pilferk]

The delux would work best for us, wanting breakfast as a sit down meal and then a 2TS in the evning ONly thing is it looks like we may be better off using the DDE.

I think that's going to be our workup, mainly: DDDP vs DDE.

I'm not sure which will come out ahead, yet. I'll know better tonight when I can get arms deep in the numbers.

 

[pilferk]

Lewisc touched on this, but I think it deserves more consideration.

IMHO, evaluating DDP is a trickier exercise than most folks do. Most people compare the cost of DDP (now + tip) to the menu prices of the food offered by DDP. That's a bogus comparison if you are trying to determine whether DDP saves you money. (There are other reasons to get DDP than saving money.)

The better comparison is to calculate approximately where and what you would eat if you were paying cash and compare that to the TOTAL cost of DDP. If the number for the TOTAL cost of DDP is less, you save money. If the TOTAL cost of DDP is more than you would normally spend, but less than the menu prices, then you can decide whether you are getting good value...but you are not saving money compared to what you would normally spend.

Keep in mind that the TOTAL cost of DDP includes the DDP price, tips, park tickets you have to buy but don't need (not a factor for everyone, but certainly for AP holders), plus the discounts on lodging you have to give up in order to be eligible for DDP. If you have to pay $30-40 per night more for your room to qualify, that's a COST of DDP, but most people don't include those costs in their calculations.

For our family (2A/1C, DVC members), DDP formerly resulted in a total savings of only about $75-100 per trip. And we didn't pay any more for our room and didn't have to buy park tickets.

I think if people really want to get an accurate idea of whether DDP is for them, they need to take a much closer look than most do. Most just listen to the marketing hype and spend a lot more than they would have normally.

That's PRETTY close to what we do. I do tend to use the most expensive entree on the menu as my benchmark (because, while I'm willing to plan MONTHS in advance WHERE I want to eat, I'm not willing to actually pick out the exact entree and desert I'll want), but when we do our cost analysis, we've pretty much already picked out where we're going to eat.

Now, the DXDDP scenario throws a monkey into the wrench because there WERE some meals we skipped planning (Jiko's, for example) but strongly considered. We also had a few TS meals we had planned to pay for OOP. We will now likely return to that scenario using the DDDP and see what turns up when running comparisons.

 

[Cinderumbrella]

I guess I am in the minority, but I am thrilled with the addition of the Deluxe Dining Plan!!! We do not like CS meals. We have been to WDW plenty of times, so I do not feel that sitting down for 3 TS meals per day takes away from our time in the parks- we don't do every ride every trip.

DS will be 5 in 2008 for our Christmastime trip. Using this years prices we figured that paying OOP and using the DDE card for 9 days of dining (including 1 TS breakfast and 1 TS dinner per day plus 1 snack) would run us about $1300. This would be $1280 for the same time period but with 3 TS meals per day. Sure, we have to pay tip OOP on top of the $1280, but this is still a better deal for our family (Plus with 3 per day, I could care less about the appetizer omission). We love character breakfasts and would probably do one ever day. We would also probably do a couple of signature restaurants for dinner. As for all the lunch TS credits left over, we would finally get to go to some of the restaurants we always mean to try, but never get to (i.e. The Plaza, 50's Prime Time etc.)

 

[JimMIA]

The kids meals still seem to be a bargains. I suspect there will be threads on the DIS discussing how to get kids on the plan without getting Mom and Dad.

Yeah, actually I've already seen one post saying they are going to put the kids in one room and the parents in another and only get DDP for the adults. I think they may have it backwards!

I'm also waiting for questions about how to work the Deluxe plan for two adults in one room to feed a family of nine! (That would actually probably work, if you stop and think about it!)

 

[pilferk]

An Update from Debs site:

UPDATE INFO: 7/31/07
1) The Deluxe Dining plan still does NOT include gratuity. It DOES include the appetizer.
2) No word on DVC member pricing

If true....having the DXDDP include app DOES seem to tip the balance MUCH further in it's favor, from a $$ perspective.

The question is still: Is it too much food.

 

[Cinderumbrella]

An Update from Debs site:

UPDATE INFO: 7/31/07
1) The Deluxe Dining plan still does NOT include gratuity. It DOES include the appetizer.
2) No word on DVC member pricing

If true....having the DXDDP include app DOES seem to tip the balance MUCH further in it's favor, from a $$ perspective.

The question is still: Is it too much food.

I think too much is relative. For some- definitely, for others no.
The fact that the deluxe includes the appetizer just reinfornces my joy as all of our prechildren trips to WDW we were on a similar plan and we enjoyed it!! Will I order an appetizer at evey meal, probably not (especially at lunch time) but it is nice to have the option.

 

[kcminnie]

My family did the dining plan once during free dining. I have 2 children who are considered "adults" on the plan due to age but still eat off the childrens menus so had never purchased the dining plan because of that. However the biggest perk I found when on the dining plan was being able to order any entree off the menu regardless of the cost and being able to try different items we wouldn't if I was paying out of pocket for each item ordered. Under the new 2008 plan the price of items would come into consideration for us because now we would paying 20% tip on those items. It would no longer be based on the $37.99 per day price. Because of this we would stick with the DDE for our family. I think less people will be doing the DDP in 2008 & dining reservations will again be easier to obtain without booking them six months in advance.

 

[DancingBear]

The Disney Dining Plan has been underpriced since it was introduced. As much as people hate the idea, when something is underpriced, that's a problem for a business. Their job is to price things correctly, not underprice things. The removal of the gratuity and appetizer brings the plan back into the realm of appropriate pricing, and the dollar off per day keeps it still a decent deal for many guests.

Wow, then I assume Disney fired all of those managers who woefully underpriced the DDP and failed to make the necessary correction for years!

The DDP wasn't underpriced, it was "correctly" priced to serve as a driver for higher occupancy at higher rates at the resorts. As JimMIA pointed out, a valid comparison of the costs of the DDP vs. OoP should include any foregone cheaper room costs in connection with getting the package.

So apparently now Disney is scaling back because it thinks that resort revenue can be maintained/grown without the heavily-discounted DDP, particularly given the various costs (including the hit to guest satisfaction in many areas) involved in the current program.

 

[pilferk]

I think too much is relative. For some- definitely, for others no.

Agreed. I should have said "Is it too much food for us".

 

[Iluvthemouse]

DH will be pleased because we wont be going to Disney next September on the free dining plan. After going for the last 3 years and this upcoming September DH is "disneyed out".

Little does he know I have a Disney cruise booked for us next October.

 

[Colleen27]

My concern about the deluxe plan, and the reason we probably won't ever use it, is that it is a tremendous amount of food. I cannot imagine 2 TS per day.

But if the rumors on Allears are right, signature meals will still take 2 meal credits. That's what keeps it from being an overwhelming amount of food for me. We have 3 signature meals planned with the current dining plan & pricing. I'd add 2 or 3 more if we were on the deluxe plan. Assuming, in the absence of details at this point, that it works like the current DDP but with more credits and no differentation between CS & TS, a day for us might look like:

Room service breakfast
Snack lunch
Sit down dinner

Or:
Snack breakfast
Counter service lunch
Signature dinner

Either way, that's using up 3 meal credits for 2 meals.

Being the planner I am, I'm sure I'd be able to plan 2 TS per day on some days, and use up the meal credits in other ways on others. This plan sounds like a great fit for people like us, who don't want more than a couple CS meals through an entire week. I'm sure for some, it would be too much food, too much planning, or too much time spent eating. The last would be my concern on a short trip, but since our family trip will be 11 nights, I don't mind taking a couple hours out of each day to enjoy the variety of good food to be found at Disney. But food is a big part of all our vacations - coming from a small town where the best restaurant in town is the coney island, we tend to indulge when we're visiting destinations where good food is abundant and tempting!

 

[mickey2000]

123