Monorails to no longer operate during Evening Extra Magic Hours

[disney_bob]

But honestly....... if they're 20 plus years old.......... and if they replaced the last ones after 20 years...... don't you think they should have seen this one coming?

Absolutely. When I was there in April and heard the spiel over the intercom reminding me of the "updates" they did about twenty years ago I thought then that it seemed a bit odd to be touting a twenty year old upgrade.

If the cost is an issue..... on a key piece of their business they KNEW was aging...... doesn't it seem strange to see all those cranes hard at work inside the park ......... when there is apparently a big need right outside the front gates?

And isn't that capital expenditure INSIDE the park designed to bring EVEN MORE bodies into the parks....... via a monorail system they claim needs more rest?

As loved as it is, I'd debate whether the monorail is a "key piece of the business". But honestly all we can do is speculate. Neither of us is close enough to the situation to be able to tell exactly what the execs are thinking. But like I said its their job and I'm sure they've thought of the possibilities and are doing what is best for Disney. Heck, maybe they're doing this in preparation for a big monorail replacement. We simply don't know.

I don't like to assume the worst, do you?

 

[mom2rtk]

Absolutely. When I was there in April and heard the spiel over the intercom reminding me of the "updates" they did about twenty years ago I thought then that it seemed a bit odd to be touting a twenty year old upgrade.


As loved as it is, I'd debate whether the monorail is a "key piece of the business". But honestly all we can do is speculate. Neither of us is close enough to the situation to be able to tell exactly what the execs are thinking. But like I said its their job and I'm sure they've thought of the possibilities and are doing what is best for Disney. Heck, maybe they're doing this in preparation for a big monorail replacement. We simply don't know.

I don't like to assume the worst, do you?

Of course I don't want to assume the worst. Nor do I assume they can do no wrong. I just want to try and make sense of it. No more, no less.

 

[MoonFaerie]

Ok, Just called both the GF concierge and guest services. Concierge assured me the monorail would be open until after the close of special events. She did put me on hold for quite a while and I'm sure she tried to get a correct answer for me.

Not completely satisfied, I called Guest Services and after being transferred to the woman who sent us the "generic" responses, she told me that she thinks it will shut down at the earlier time, not staying up and running for any special events or parties, BUT, she is trying to get an answer from her superiors to verify. She is supposed to call me when she gets that answer.

BTW, I did explain why I was so concerned as this effects my family so much during our stay. I told them I hoped Disney has thought this out and to expect a lot of complaints, because with shorter hours at ALL the parks (in the fall), it will definitely effect many!

I'll let you know when I recieve an answer. If not today, it won't be until at least Sunday (according to her) and I will try to get on here ASAP and let you all know, as I am having surgery tomorrow and not sure how I will be feeling. (that is, if no answer is given today)

Best wishes for your surgery.

I'll be watching for your updates. 6 of our 8 nights in Dec will be affected, but if they keep it open later on party nights, it'll only 1 of 8 nights. If it's not going to stay open on party nights, we'll be looking at our resort choices again (Poly is more convenient, but w/o the monorail, we'll prob be at BWI) and our dining choices (with no monorail, I'm not keeping 4-5 late dinners at monorail resorts).

 

[mom2rtk]

Best wishes for your surgery.

I absolutely ditto that. I hope all goes well and you recover quickly.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Well, called this afternoon.. to get the skinny. I was assured, the monorails will run on party nights. (still not convinced). So, if it's true, I'm loosing sight of why the monorail, is shutting down,for extra magic hours

 

[CR Resort Fan 4 Life]

That's a slippery slope. There are certainly things you use which are paid for (at least in part) by others who do not use it.

Well the only thing we use that other guests don't is the Club Level service when staying at the Deluxe Resorts. However those rooms are more expensive then the Standard Rooms, so I can't think of anything else we use that others don't.

 

[Tink rules]

Well, called this afternoon.. to get the skinny. I was assured, the monorails will run on party nights. (still not convinced). So, if it's true, I'm loosing sight of why the monorail, is shutting down,for extra magic hours

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

[Traveliz]

I am a bit confused. The MK's park hours during the week of 8-20 to 8-27 (Next Disney vacation ) are 9AM-10PM. If this is in effect, won't the monorail already be closed when the MK closes, let alone when the MK stays open later for EMH? Gees, it is sure going to be fun fighting the mass hoards of other deluxe people to the first bus/ferry when the MK closes.

To put my two cents in, I do find this to be a pretty unfair. One of the reasons to book the CR, GF, or Poly instead of the other deluxe resorts on-property is for the monorail access that stays open during EMH, making transportation easier. It's like a expensive hotel chain advertising their rooms by saying they have a free full-buffet for breakfast, but when it is time to go down to that buffet, you find out that the only thing they offer there for the whole period the buffet is open is burnt toast. Yes, you have something, but it really isn't what they promised. If you are paying that much for a room on the monorail line, Disney should be the ones treating you better than they do for the moderate and value resorts (ex: The All Star Resorts), like each hotel having their own bus to each park instead of the GF and Poly sharing a bus to the MK and Epcot, just to ensure that they return to that hotel in the future.

The MK monorail would shut down at 11 on a night that MK is open until 10. The Epcot monorail (should you need to get over there) would be shutting down at 10 (since they will be closing at 9). It appears that for EMH all transportation from the parks (after the first hour the park is closed) will be by bus or boat.

Liz

 

[racefanof88]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Absolutely!!! They are not going to cut their own throats right now. People are buying after hour party tickets now. Both of these events are going to be effected by the monorail shutting down and I for one, will not be buying MVMCP tickets this year. We have been to MNSSHP twice and MVMCP once and all three were VERY crowded so I can't even imagine trying to get out of the park after one of the parties.

 

[hakepb]

About Disney knowing this is coming (26 year monorails when previous monorails ran 20 years)
I wonder how the budget process works for the monorail?

I know DVC members have a "transportation" line item in their dues.
I would imagine that Transportation has been under a great deal of cost pressure from the Resorts, and probably Parks. Rising fuel prices and the economy since 9/11 have probably made a replacement monorail near impossible to add to the budget (or those increased fuel costs ate up the expected monorail capital)

 

[rie'smom]

......

I'll let you know when I recieve an answer. If not today, it won't be until at least Sunday (according to her) and I will try to get on here ASAP and let you all know, as I am having surgery tomorrow and not sure how I will be feeling. (that is, if no answer is given today)

Good luck with your surgery.
Looking forward to the responses- wonder if they will even give the same answer.

Can anyone point me to the report about the parts falling off the monorails? I have looked everywhere and can not seem to find it.

Apparently not

 

[asta]

Can anyone point me to the report about the parts falling off the monorails? I have looked everywhere and can not seem to find it.

This was posted by Firedancer in post 581 on page 39. I don't think he ever referenced a report. It was just something he knew about.

 

[racefanof88]

Good luck with your surgery.
Looking forward to the responses- wonder if they will even give the same answer.



Apparently not

Apparently.............

This was posted by Firedancer in post 581 on page 39. I don't think he ever referenced a report. It was just something he knew about.

I was wanting something more reliable...... I have searched news papers and TV news stations from the area and couldn't find anything about it, so I am wondering if it was just something a bus driver told a housekeeper, who told a server, that told a ride operator, who told a street sweeper, that told the cousin of his best friend's neighbor.................... When these type things happen at Disney the news is usually all over it.

 

[Zeora]

This was posted by Firedancer in post 581 on page 39. I don't think he ever referenced a report. It was just something he knew about.

Firstly, apologies in general for being snappish in my previous post. It's been a rough day for me and I'm extremely tired. So instead of trying to look this up, I'll just assume a scenario where it is not in fact true, and pieces are not falling off the rails...

And honestly, though, it doesn't really change my main point. The rails will still need maintenance just as much as the trains, and they're harder to repair because they can't be easily switched out like the trains, moved to a maintenance bay like the trains, or even in some places easily accessed at all - some of those tracks do go over water. Unlike the trains, they have to withstand wind, weather, and the weight of trains dozens of times a day, every single day. Any repairs that can be made can only be done while the trains are not running, so patch jobs can only be done overnight and the rails must be in useable shape again by morning. You can't just take a piece out, give it whatever repairs it needs, and put it back. And have those same rails been there since the system was first built? Just because the trains were replaced doesn't mean the rails were... and even if the rails are "only" as old as the new trains, those bridges I mentioned that I grew up with would never have been left unmaintained for so long. Every five years or so, they're closed at least part of the day for repair work. It just needs to happen on any structure ever built - nothing is so durable that it never ever takes any damage.

I'm not a Disney employee, I don't have psychic powers, and I know nothing for sure. But I still think maintenance really is a major issue, and if it comes down to a choice between having definitely angry and inconvenienced guests and risking possibly injured ones, that isn't really a choice at all. I'm not saying no one has a right to be upset by this - it is indeed a huge inconvenience and/or disappointment to many people. I would just prefer people to understand some of the engineering challenges that Disney is facing in trying to keep the monorail running safely (even if they really should have done something about the situation sooner, as far as I'm concerned. Well, they're stuck with it now...)

 

[racefanof88]

Firstly, apologies in general for being snappish in my previous post. It's been a rough day for me and I'm extremely tired. So instead of trying to look this up, I'll just assume a scenario where it is not in fact true, and pieces are not falling off the rails...

And honestly, though, it doesn't really change my main point. The rails will still need maintenance just as much as the trains, and they're harder to repair because they can't be easily switched out like the trains, moved to a maintenance bay like the trains, or even in some places easily accessed at all - some of those tracks do go over water. Unlike the trains, they have to withstand wind, weather, and the weight of trains dozens of times a day, every single day. Any repairs that can be made can only be done while the trains are not running, so patch jobs can only be done overnight and the rails must be in useable shape again by morning. You can't just take a piece out, give it whatever repairs it needs, and put it back. And have those same rails been there since the system was first built? Just because the trains were replaced doesn't mean the rails were... and even if the rails are "only" as old as the new trains, those bridges I mentioned that I grew up with would never have been left unmaintained for so long. Every five years or so, they're closed at least part of the day for repair work. It just needs to happen on any structure ever built - nothing is so durable that it never ever takes any damage.

I'm not a Disney employee, I don't have psychic powers, and I know nothing for sure. But I still think maintenance really is a major issue, and if it comes down to a choice between having definitely angry and inconvenienced guests and risking possibly injured ones, that isn't really a choice at all. I'm not saying no one has a right to be upset by this - it is indeed a huge inconvenience and/or disappointment to many people. I would just prefer people to understand some of the engineering challenges that Disney is facing in trying to keep the monorail running safely (even if they really should have done something about the situation sooner, as far as I'm concerned. Well, they're stuck with it now...)

And as I have said previously, if the trains, or concrete rails, are in such desperate shape that parts are falling off, it is unsafe to run the monorail during regular business hours, when they would be transporting more guests and have more guests in the parks, walking under the rails. Unsafe knows no time. IF, and I say IF emphatically because I have searched every news paper, TV station, and Disney report and have found NOTHING to support the "parts are falling off" story, a part fell off and hit someone on the ground it would be a NIGHTMARE for Disney. The NTSB would also be involved if a transportation system had parts falling off during normal operations. Disney would not chance the massive lawsuit that would surely ensue when someone on the ground is injured or killed. While I can understand the monorail needs to be maintained, I just don't buy it. A company as big as Disney would not wait until the system was in such bad shape before they started maintenance, they, better than anyone else, would know how old and safe/unsafe the monorails would be. If they have waited till the rails or trains are literally falling apart, it would be like an airline waiting until planes started falling out of the sky.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I am a bit confused. The MK's park hours during the week of 8-20 to 8-27 (Next Disney vacation ) are 9AM-10PM. If this is in effect, won't the monorail already be closed when the MK closes, let alone when the MK stays open later for EMH? Gees, it is sure going to be fun fighting the mass hoards of other deluxe people to the first bus/ferry when the MK closes.

To put my two cents in, I do find this to be a pretty unfair. One of the reasons to book the CR, GF, or Poly instead of the other deluxe resorts on-property is for the monorail access that stays open during EMH, making transportation easier. It's like a expensive hotel chain advertising their rooms by saying they have a free full-buffet for breakfast, but when it is time to go down to that buffet, you find out that the only thing they offer there for the whole period the buffet is open is burnt toast. Yes, you have something, but it really isn't what they promised. If you are paying that much for a room on the monorail line, Disney should be the ones treating you better than they do for the moderate and value resorts (ex: The All Star Resorts), like each hotel having their own bus to each park instead of the GF and Poly sharing a bus to the MK and Epcot, just to ensure that they return to that hotel in the future.

I think it's a bit disingenuous to compare bus transportation to burnt toast; and most likely, shared buses are being used/planned because not enough guests from any one monorail resort utilize EMH to make individual buses feasible.

 

[angelmav]

And as I have said previously, if the trains, or concrete rails, are in such desperate shape that parts are falling off, it is unsafe to run the monorail during regular business hours, when they would be transporting more guests and have more guests in the parks, walking under the rails. Unsafe knows no time. IF, and I say IF emphatically because I have searched every news paper, TV station, and Disney report and have found NOTHING to support the "parts are falling off" story, a part fell off and hit someone on the ground it would be a NIGHTMARE for Disney. The NTSB would also be involved if a transportation system had parts falling off during normal operations. Disney would not chance the massive lawsuit that would surely ensue when someone on the ground is injured or killed. While I can understand the monorail needs to be maintained, I just don't buy it. A company as big as Disney would not wait until the system was in such bad shape before they started maintenance, they, better than anyone else, would know how old and safe/unsafe the monorails would be. If they have waited till the rails or trains are literally falling apart, it would be like an airline waiting until planes started falling out of the sky.

This. A certain vocal segment keep inventing reasons (Other than a Disney money grab) for another reason they could be doing this. The track (not the pushed beyond their expected age and refusal to replace them trains) is now supposedly the reason. This though doesnt even come close to passing the sniff test.

Track repair requires an extensive period where nothing is running on them (assuming that the track is in such dire shape). If this were the reason, the system would have to go offline, it would be unsafe to continue to operate for any period until the track was brought back up to code. I just dont see any way this could be the explanation.

I think we are back to 2 things really, 1. The monorail is likely the most expensive mode of transport they operate and any reduction in said operation will result in a savings for Disney (I think this is the most likely) and 2. They have equipment needing to be replaced that they are hoping to limp along with for awhile longer (While probably true, I imagine replacement cost is secondary to saving operations costs, replacement had to be budget into the operations budget over the years one would assume).

 

[kaytieeldr]

This. A certain vocal segment keep inventing reasons (Other than a Disney money grab) for another reason they could be doing this. The track (not the pushed beyond their expected age and refusal to replace them trains) is now supposedly the reason. This though doesnt even come close to passing the sniff test.

Track repair requires an extensive period where nothing is running on them (assuming that the track is in such dire shape). If this were the reason, the system would have to go offline, it would be unsafe to continue to operate for any period until the track was brought back up to code. I just dont see any way this could be the explanation.

We don't 'keep inventing reasons'. We guess at possible alternative explanations why this is being done, but without the same sky is falling, doom & gloom attitude, cup half empty presented in the majority of these posts.

I will say up front I know little about monorail infrastructure, operations, and financing except what I've read over the years about both this one and the one in Las Vegas. However, if track/infrastructure replacement (nut repair or patching) were necessary, it might be possible to do it as quickly as overnight. No, I'm not hyperbolizing or exaggerating. This summer, just outside Boston, EACH WEEKEND they're replacing one entire six to eight lane highway bridge strucure. Instead of four years, it's taking fourteen weeks. It's entirely conceivable with the involvement of outside companies - Massachusetts didn't build the replacement bridges - that parts of the track could be replaced overnight. Safely.

Regarding operating cost: the monorails run on electric induction, don't they? Wouldn't diesel fuel for 430 or so buses cost more than the electricity each day?

 

[tardin1964]

Where will they get them?
They are already in service to Ft.W and WL.

(Do they have more of them available at the Bay Lake facility?)

I just meant that if this is a permanent change they should offer more and better boat service. Spending money buying the freindship boats I'm sure is a lot less expensive than buying a new monorail.

 

[GadgetRick]

Define the "fraction of the available cars".

They have 10 trains currently available (we all know about one of them, and Coral is being de-Tron-ified and repainted for the next month or so). What is the number on each beam that they're running daily to arrive at this "a fraction of"?

Typically, this expression is used to denote a minor fraction, so you're insisting that the greater majority of the trains are sitting idle for the entire day, every day. (Which would be rather difficult, since even the shed only holds about 4-5 trains at once from what I've read, which is why they park them overnight in the stations). Just curious as to your perception on how many trains they run, since you claim it only to be a small portion (which is what the expression "a fraction of" is a connotation of).

For the rest of the discussion, I'll leave everyone else to it.

A fraction as in, less than all of them. From what I understand they have 11 trains (10 or 11 makes little difference). They only run 4 or 5 at any given time. So, 1/2 of the trains (or more) are not in use and can certainly be worked on.