MDE & FP+ are NOT failures

[ChipnDale79]

Why is it that whenever someone criticizes FP+, someone has to say: "The only people who hate it are the few hundred complainers on this board"? The implication is that the remaining millions of Disney guests love it or will love it. Isn't the converse equally possible? That the only people who love it are the few dozen people praising it on this board and the rest of the millions of Disney guests hate it? Both positions are equally flawed. Can we strike a deal? I won't jump to the conclusion that only a handful of people love it due to the fact that the praise keeps coming from the same few dozen people if you don't jump to the conclusion that only a few hundred people hate it because the complaints keep coming from that subset of people. Deal?

I want to sort of add on to this, I have spoken to a handful of people that are not members of this board and have been to disney utilizing FP+. For everyone that likes it, there was someone that I spoke to that hated it. In fact, 2 or 3 people even stated they hated it so much that they wont go back.

 

[Planogirl]

It's is easy to praise FP+.

I made my reservations yesterday for my trip in 59 days.

No longer must my family wake up and feel rushed to gather FP-.

Matter of fact, we plan on going to EPCOT one morning for Akershus breakfast and enjoying the Flower & Garden show.....but have FP+ to be on Magic Kingdom attractions later that same evening before the fireworks. With a 5 y.o. in tow, I cannot praise FP+ enough for allowing us the opportunity to Park Hop without having to wait Stand-by for Enchanted...Belle, Big Thunder Railroad, and Buzz Lightyear.

Also, our departure time to the airport is at 1pm. With FP+, we can have a more leisurely morning before heading to a Park to enjoy three more attractions of our choice without having any worries.

I cannot praise FP+ enough......but I would still prefer no Tiering.....

And I am willing to suggest that by eliminating FP-, stand-by lines will now be shorter.

Why?

Because those people who 'tested' FP+ were also more likely to pull FP- as well. So while these people were riding an attraction multiple times, the stand-by line was growing. By eliminating FP-, the loss of double- and triple-dipping will open up stand-by lines by distributing FP+ more equally.

Moreover, there will be less stand-by line build-up immediately following rope drop because FP+ return times will more evenly distribute riders who have an attraction as a 'must-do'. This too should shorten stand-by lines throughout the day.

I don't doubt that many people like FP+. That wasn't my point.

I just believe that it's way too early to judge FP+ itself overall. Some are assuming that a good report means that FP+ is somehow at least partially responsible. WDW just switched to the system plus it is still evolving. There is no way that FP+ can be judged yet for good or bad.

 

[redrosesix]

When I saw that 3000 number, I interpreted it this way.

Disney has capacity numbers that I understand are based in part of fire/safety laws. I don't care to repeat the various levels of closure here but, during the Christmas holiday, it is common for the MK to close to at least some guests, usually during the late morning or early afternoon, and then reopen later in the day, frequently as guests who arrived earlier in the day leave after the afternoon parade.

I read Disney's statement as saying that they had higher attendance at the MK this year than in previous years during the Christmas holiday season. I'm not sure how they could say conclusively that FP+ was the cause of this, but one possibility is that their data is telling them that more guests spent less time in the park because they were able to use their FP+ reservations to enjoy their favorite attractions in less park time than they would have otherwise. Guests with early FP+ reservations may have been more likely to leave the park after using their FP+ reservations, and guests with afternoon or evening reservations may have arrived later than they would have otherwise, secure in the knowledge that they could enjoy 3 of their favorite attractions with short waits, something that would not have been possible with paper FP.

Essentially, Disney may be saying that FP+ enabled them to spread out the distribution of the crowd and increase "turnover" in the park, something that is really only important to them when the park is near capacity.

Just my interpretation.

They actually didn't attribute it to FP+, it was MM+. Which is getting confusing now that they also have Memory Maker (they should have just named that PP++)

But yes!!, because of fire codes etc and the limits on the number of people in the parks. With MM+ they can see when people are in different areas and when they leave... so they can let more guests in. Yes, it's helpful to them but isn't really a for us.

 

[Planogirl]

Why is it that whenever someone criticizes FP+, someone has to say: "The only people who hate it are the few hundred complainers on this board"? The implication is that the remaining millions of Disney guests love it or will love it. Isn't the converse equally possible? That the only people who love it are the few dozen people praising it on this board and the rest of the millions of Disney guests hate it? Both positions are equally flawed. Can we strike a deal? I won't jump to the conclusion that only a handful of people love it due to the fact that the praise keeps coming from the same few dozen people if you don't jump to the conclusion that only a few hundred people hate it because the complaints keep coming from that subset of people. Deal?

Good luck with that.

 

[redrosesix]

Why is it that whenever someone criticizes FP+, someone has to say: "The only people who hate it are the few hundred complainers on this board"? The implication is that the remaining millions of Disney guests love it or will love it. Isn't the converse equally possible? That the only people who love it are the few dozen people praising it on this board and the rest of the millions of Disney guests hate it? Both positions are equally flawed. Can we strike a deal? I won't jump to the conclusion that only a handful of people love it due to the fact that the praise keeps coming from the same few dozen people if you don't jump to the conclusion that only a few hundred people hate it because the complaints keep coming from that subset of people. Deal?

I'm in. But let me know how that works out for you...

It would be easier to get agreement on "I don't really like the burgers at Pecos Bills but the toppings bar is great" What is it about FP+?

 

[mulan1123]

What I want to know is what people did before any kind of FP?? Did they not stand in line like everyone did in the SB??

I liked the FP+, so I didn't have to wait in line in the SB and wait an hour for a 2 minute ride.

I just remember being a kid and going to Disneyland and there were no fastpasses and waiting in the SB line for a good chunk of time, which no complaints....some FP are better then none!

 

[sonofanarchy]

This headline is like saying the Titanic wasn't a failure because the ship was packed.

 

[poppinspenguins]

What I want to know is what people did before any kind of FP?? Did they not stand in line like everyone did in the SB??

I liked the FP+, so I didn't have to wait in line in the SB and wait an hour for a 2 minute ride.

I just remember being a kid and going to Disneyland and there were no fastpasses and waiting in the SB line for a good chunk of time, which no complaints....some FP are better then none!

Im sorry, but this is the mentality that I can not grasp. Basically, "its better than nothing...be grateful"

As i said in my previous posts...i am a offsiter that visits about once a year for one day visits with non expiring tickets with a now useless park hopper i paid for. I am still waiting for someone, anyone, to tell me how Mymagic is an improvement for me personally. I am open to suggestions. Maybe i am missing something. I can see how it is great by certain segments.

I have no problem with doing standby, but I am currently at a big disadvantage when compared to others in the park. Someone mentioned the Titanic...I feel as a offsite day guest that I am in steerage

 

[ChipnDale79]

What I want to know is what people did before any kind of FP?? Did they not stand in line like everyone did in the SB??

I liked the FP+, so I didn't have to wait in line in the SB and wait an hour for a 2 minute ride.

I just remember being a kid and going to Disneyland and there were no fastpasses and waiting in the SB line for a good chunk of time, which no complaints....some FP are better then none!

Disney is also much more expensive then it was way back then as well. More so than inflation.

 

[jctwizzer]

Well, for a change of pace.....we're annual passholders...and have been going to WDW four to six times a year for 20 years....first visit was 1972.

We stayed on site in Dec. 2013 and used the magic bands and fp+.
FP worked fine but we skipped a couple for secondary rides because it didn't fit our schedule. The bands worked fine for room entry and charging.
Hers worked fine for park entrance but mine took 3 or 4 tries at each park.

In January we stayed off site and couldn't do fast pass. The bands still worked for charging; and like before hers worked fine and mine took 3 or 4 times, each time I tried to enter a park

My park admission experience I would chalk up to being in an intro period. In discussions with a Guest Relations CM we know, we were told Disney told them no training was necessary for the new system. So when problems led to inquiries from park guests they were in no position to help the guests resolve the problem; which led to unhappy guests.......some of which evidently post on these boards.;

In January, fp+ for on site guests only led to a lot of negative comments. And fp for major rides were regularly out of stock by mid day...which also led to many negative comments. And reinforced my conclustion that the whole system is elitist...which is contrary to long standing Walt Disney practices.
And is something they avoided even tho other theme parks instituted them.

Peraonally, I think Disney has a major investment in the new system and it will be implemented in a form close to the current practices. Which has led us to stop going four to six times a year and now make one visit annually.
I see recent changes as being similar to the type of things that led General Motors from having close to 50% of the US market to having 10%. Time will tell at what point Disney has ruined their own market. The crowds in Dec and Jan were large; and a significant part of them spoke something other than English. This will initially help Disney make up for any US customers they may lose, like us. We'll see how it works in the long run....

 

[MichiganDVC]

Well, for a change of pace.....we're annual passholders...and have been going to WDW four to six times a year for 20 years....first visit was 1972.

We stayed on site in Dec. 2013 and used the magic bands and fp+.
FP worked fine but we skipped a couple for secondary rides because it didn't fit our schedule. The bands worked fine for room entry and charging.
Hers worked fine for park entrance but mine took 3 or 4 tries at each park.

In January we stayed off site and couldn't do fast pass. The bands still worked for charging; and like before hers worked fine and mine took 3 or 4 times, each time I tried to enter a park

If you're an AP holder and had Magic Bands, you should have been able to make FP+ reservations in advance.

Furthermore, I think that advance FP+ reservations are coming for offsiters, however I would be okay if it does not. I stay onsite and paid a hefty premium to do so (DVC + Cash reservations sometimes.) Why wouldn't Disney reward those who spend their lodging and dining dollars with them instead of elsewhere?

 

[mulan1123]

If you're an AP holder and had Magic Bands, you should have been able to make FP+ reservations in advance.

Furthermore, I think that advance FP+ reservations are coming for offsiters, however I would be okay if it does not. I stay onsite and paid a hefty premium to do so (DVC + Cash reservations sometimes.) Why wouldn't Disney reward those who spend their lodging and dining dollars with them instead of elsewhere?

I agree. I think Disney would want to give people an incentive to stay onsite.

 

[Planogirl]

Furthermore, I think that advance FP+ reservations are coming for offsiters, however I would be okay if it does not. I stay onsite and paid a hefty premium to do so (DVC + Cash reservations sometimes.) Why wouldn't Disney reward those who spend their lodging and dining dollars with them instead of elsewhere?

They didn't reward onsite visitors with extra fastpasses before and I can't see them changing that policy. However only time will tell.

 

[poppinspenguins]

I agree. I think Disney would want to give people an incentive to stay onsite.

I agree, there is nothing wrong with giving incentives to stay onsite.

But, there is a difference between incentives and actually worsening the experience for off site guest. Which I feel this system in its current state is doing.

Universal is able to do it because its on site guests are a small portion compared to the off siters. Offering a huge perk to a small segment doesnt really affect the other regular visitors that much. Universal has already had to tweak its policy. their new "moderate" does not come with front of the line access.

It is a very slippery slope to make a huge portion of guest feel slighted. It really is a risky predicament for Disney.

To get back to the original post. The earnings are good this last quarter. The true test will be the repeat customer. The slighted offsiter may say I felt like a second class citizen and may not rebook. Whereas before, an offsiter may have said that was an amazing trip, next time i want to stay on site.

Time will tell but the results at this time in 2015 or 2016 are really the ones that matter regarding MM+

 

[mom2rtk]

Furthermore, I think that advance FP+ reservations are coming for offsiters, however I would be okay if it does not. I stay onsite and paid a hefty premium to do so (DVC + Cash reservations sometimes.) Why wouldn't Disney reward those who spend their lodging and dining dollars with them instead of elsewhere?

Because there are too many of you?

And because they already have you committed?

 

[JZCubed]

The rule for non-site guests with AP's (after at least one on-site stay) is "up to 7-days of FP+ in advance."
BUT, after you USE the first day of FP+, another day becomes available.
So it is a "rolling 7 days."

Thanx all.

Enlightened yet again.

 

[JZCubed]

You still haven't answered the question that PPs have posed. How is packing an additional 3,000 visitors (or a 6% increase as you pointed out) and striving to pack even more than that into the already overcrowded parks using MM+ as a crutch for insufficient infrastructure a "success" for the average visitor?

I understand if you want to argue that such numbers are successful to corporate (although I explained in my PP why I personally feel that such a strategy can't possibly win in the long run), but how is this a good thing for the actual vacationers? I would really like to try to understand this logic.

There is little or no benefit for vacationers when the Parks are more crowded.

For better or worse, some families can only travel at what are going to be the most crowded times.

But that was not my point about 3,000 additional people. 3,000 additional people are the result, according to Mr. Iger, in part, because of the new technology. So from Disney's perspective, the new technology is working. If something is working as planned, then by definition, it cannot be a failure.

As to whether people like, hate, or are indifferent to FP+ - thus far, record attendance would indicate that people are not being discouraged from going to Disney based on the negative comments on social media.

I can agree that results from one fiscal quarter and one comment from the CEO are not conclusive of anything.

However, a great many people are thus far satisfied that they can sleep in and/or make morning plans that do not include rushing to obtain FP-. There are plenty of people, myself included, who prefer FP+ to FP-.

 

[MichiganDVC]

They didn't reward onsite visitors with extra fastpasses before and I can't see them changing that policy. However only time will tell.

Making FP+ reservations in advance doesn't mean onsite guests get "more"...they just get them "earlier. And yes, Disney HAS done something like that before....its called Extra Magic Hours.

Because there are too many of you?

And because they already have you committed?

I'm talking long-term. Disney doesn't "already have your committed" if you haven't booked your resort yet. But if getting FP+ early is an incentive to stay on site (and then spend a ton of money on room and food that would otherwise have been spent outside), then Disney will dangle that incentive.

 

[MichiganDVC]

As to whether people like, hate, or are indifferent to FP+ - thus far, record attendance would indicate that people are not being discouraged from going to Disney based on the negative comments on social media..

I think people like to complain because they think Bob Iger is reading these message boards. And because people think that their version of events is THE version of events for everyone (guilty as charged.) So they think Disney will change what they're doing to suit the needs of a vocal minority. Truth is, that friggin theme park is packed to the gills year round. Disney stock is only rising. The only people making a mistake are the people who are letting a ride reservation system ruin their vacation, their love of DisneyWorld, and apparently their daily lives.

 

[lugnut33]

The addition of more guests in the park will clearly have an impact on the bottom line of the company in the future, Iger said,

Look, I'll deal with the FP+ and will complain about it because it took tangible benefits away from my family. Things change and I just have to suck it up, but I don't have to be over the top happy about it.

That said, what Iger said disturbs me even more. So, they are looking to increase park capacity by not increasing ride capacity. I see a disconnect there. The parks are already over the top crowded unless it's one of the rare slow times of the year.