Marrieds choosing not to have kids

[maddhatir]

Again we are all free......

isnt that THE BEST feeling!

 

[Lizzy2]

I have a beautiful 4 daughter and she is the joy of my life and most of my career choices have involved childcare in some shape or form and I am here to tell you that the worst thing you can do is have a child that you don't really want. They need 200% of your love, energy, and attention and whats more they deserve it .
If you don't want kids just don't do it-
There is nothing worse than seeing a child who is just an "accessory" in their parents lives.
If your relatives won't respect your decision or say they "need" you to give them grandchildren just say "Ok, tell you what? I'll have the kid and give it to you because I'm not going to want it anymore then than I do now." and see if that shuts them up.

 

[maddhatir]

I have a beautiful 4 daughter and she is the joy of my life and most of my career choices have involved childcare in some shape or form and I am here to tell you that the worst thing you can do is have a child that you don't really want. They need 200% of your love, energy, and attention and whats more they deserve it .
If you don't want kids just don't do it-
There is nothing worse than seeing a child who is just an "accessory" in their parents lives.
If your relatives won't respect your decision or say they "need" you to give them grandchildren just say "Ok, tell you what? I'll have the kid and give it to you because I'm not going to want it anymore then than I do now." and see if that shuts them up.

thanks!

 

[kennancat]

i am SURE there are PLENTY of parents whether they are coming, going or IN disney that want to tell childless people they made the right choice!

I don't remember if I mentioned this in this thread or in the other one on the community board, but it always cracks me up when I'm driving east on the 528 towards the airport and pass the "Vasectomy.com" billboard. For those of you not familiar with it, it goes like this (yes, this is really how the fonts work):

Vasectomy.com
It's easier then you think
to find a doctor and get information

You KNOW they've positioned it right there to catch all the frazzled parents returning to the airport after their Disney or Universal vacation! Oh, and I especially love how they shrink the font on that last line.

 

[aclov]

I just wanted to comment on how people are rude, nosey, inconsiderate or whatever you want to call it - when they ask "WHY DON'T YOU HAVE CHILDREN?" questions. Maybe they are just naive. I guess it bothers me more because DH have been married for 6 years and trying to get pregnant for 5 years. I also get the feeling like people including my family and friends feel sorry for me, like having a child makes me less of a woman. My parents seem to bring up these stories of people they know that never had children. One of my coworkers once said to me about her friend that doesn't have children "Poor thing, she never had any children" I just couldn't believe that comment! And to say something to me of all people. Ugh! Just today, I spoke to a ex-coworker I hadn't talk to in a couple of years and he asked if I had any children. When I told him No, he asked "And how long have you been married?" DH gets fed up too, he said the next person that asks him he was going to reply "Because I hate kids!" This of course is not true but it gets frustrating and I cringe just to hear these questions. It's very insensitive because you don't know if it's by choice or because of infertility or medical problems. I worked with alot of DINKS in the past and never did I ask these type of questions, even before I was going through my own situation. Okay - I'm done.

 

[maddhatir]

I just wanted to comment on how people are rude, nosey, inconsiderate or whatever you want to call it - when they ask "WHY DON'T YOU HAVE CHILDREN?" questions. Maybe they are just naive. I guess it bothers me more because DH have been married for 6 years and trying to get pregnant for 5 years. I also get the feeling like people including my family and friends feel sorry for me, like having a child makes me less of a woman. My parents seem to bring up these stories of people they know that never had children. One of my coworkers once said to me about her friend that doesn't have children "Poor thing, she never had any children" I just couldn't believe that comment! And to say something to me of all people. Ugh! Just today, I spoke to a ex-coworker I hadn't talk to in a couple of years and he asked if I had any children. When I told him No, he asked "And how long have you been married?" DH gets fed up too, he said the next person that asks him he was going to reply "Because I hate kids!" This of course is not true but it gets frustrating and I cringe just to hear these questions. It's very insensitive because you don't know if it's by choice or because of infertility or medical problems. I worked with alot of DINKS in the past and never did I ask these type of questions, even before I was going through my own situation. Okay - I'm done.

I LOVE BEING A DINK!

actually the people i know - KNOW DH and i dont like kids- so they have given up asking!

 

[ForTheLoveofDisney]

I have a little different take on not having children.

DH and I have been married for 21 years. We do not have children. We did not choose to not have children. It is just the way it worked out. It was bad enough having everyone ask when we were going to have children. Most have given up on that now that I am 46. (Gee did I really give my real age)

My issue with stupid questions now deal with:
Why didn't you try everything humanly and medically possible to have a child?
Why didn't you adopt?
Is that why you have a dog since you didn't have children?

The really stupid questions come from people that do have children. Most seem to be jealous that we like to have a good time and travel. Like we should not be able to have a good time. We should stay home and pity ourselves. My goodness. One couple told us we have disposable income without children. Yes we do. I am sorry that bothers some.

Hearing the words "Mommy I love you" would have been great but I too am getting tired of some attitudes towards not having children. Planned or otherwise.

This is exactly our story. It's not like I set out to not have kids but it just isn't happening.

And, many people do not know the agony and devestation of many years of trying. I have poked, prodded, cut open and hooked up to machines like a guinea pig far too many times than I care to remember or share with the whole world. It's not like I broadcast it to the world. Perhaps I look selfish because we don't have children but perhaps you don't have all the facts. For those many years of trying I had NO life. I lived from period to period, from treatment to treatment. We even tried to adopt but that went horribly wrong and I'm NOT ready to go back there!! Basically, I had stopped living and I had no control over my life! I had lost my control and power. And hearing things like

It is said you will never hear the words. "I love you mommy: sweetest words in the English language.

did not make the situation any easier. What, do I need you reminding me?

Then one day, something snapped (in a good way) and somehow I decided that my life is just fine without kids! That my DH and I were a complete family just as we were! I don't know, maybe I had hit the rock bottom of infertility and the only thing left to do was go up and climb out? Go in a different direction. Finally, I made the decision to be childfree and to finally get off the dizzying merry-go-round of infertility! Finally, something I could control. And slowly, I started getting my life back. You see when many medical professionals tell you that you won't have children you feel at a loss, out of control (at least I did) but when I made the decision that I would be childfree well, it was my decision.

I am really irritated and insulted by people like hollyb. People like her make my blood boil because they don't know the whole story but they are so free with their opinions and feel the whole world wants to hear it!! It should be suffice to say we choose not to have children and that's it and not have people like hollyb pass judgement. I shouldn't have to relay my whole infertility story to people like her so that maybe they will think differently of me. They should be the bigger person and just keep their opinions to themselves. For people like me, who although I started out wanting children, and for people who always knew they didn't want children it is OUR choice!!!! So back off!!

 

[LuluLovesDisney]

You're absolutely right.

Choices like married, single, kids, no kids, religion, politics, career choices, etc. are life changing. Doesn't everyone think that most people will try to do what they think is best for them? No one needs to be told what to think and what to choose.

I hope this is a reminder to those who make comments about having kids (or other personal topics) that it is very possible the person on the receving end:

a) is trying to have kids
b) was trying to have kids
c) doesn't want to have kids
d) may not be able to have kids
or e) may have lost a child

and doesn't need to be reminded of sadnesses or problems, or have their life choices questioned. Everyone deserves respect.

This is exactly our story. It's not like I set out to not have kids but it just isn't happening.

And, many people do not know the agony and devestation of many years of trying. I have poked, prodded, cut open and hooked up to machines like a guinea pig far too many times than I care to remember or share with the whole world. It's not like I broadcast it to the world. Perhaps I look selfish because we don't have children but perhaps you don't have all the facts. For those many years of trying I had NO life. I lived from period to period, from treatment to treatment. We even tried to adopt but that went horribly wrong and I'm NOT ready to go back there!! Basically, I had stopped living and I had no control over my life! I had lost my control and power. And hearing things likedid not make the situation any easier. What, do I need you reminding me?

Then one day, something snapped (in a good way) and somehow I decided that my life is just fine without kids! That my DH and I were a complete family just as we were! I don't know, maybe I had hit the rock bottom of infertility and the only thing left to do was go up and climb out? Go in a different direction. Finally, I made the decision to be childfree and to finally get off the dizzying merry-go-round of infertility! Finally, something I could control. And slowly, I started getting my life back. You see when many medical professionals tell you that you won't have children you feel at a loss, out of control (at least I did) but when I made the decision that I would be childfree well, it was my decision.

I am really irritated and insulted by people like hollyb. People like her make my blood boil because they don't know the whole story but they are so free with their opinions and feel the whole world wants to hear it!! It should be suffice to say we choose not to have children and that's it and not have people like hollyb pass judgement. I shouldn't have to relay my whole infertility story to people like her so that maybe they will think differently of me. They should be the bigger person and just keep their opinions to themselves. For people like me, who although I started out wanting children, and for people who always knew they didn't want children it is OUR choice!!!! So back off!!

 

[Hixski]

Hmmm, No comments from "You should have children at all costs" group.....

I think the above 2 posts say it all. Hope to see some of you child free Disers when we are there in September.

 

[maddhatir]

Hmmm, No comments from "You should have children at all costs" group.....

I think the above 2 posts say it all. Hope to see some of you child free Disers when we are there in September.

i think we just MIGHT miss each other in sept. (our dates 9/16-24th) i will have my green mickey head attached to something on my body!

 

[wrldpossibility]

I just stumbled upon this thread, and find it a very interesting topic. I have a few comments, and a few questions. First, DH and I have 3 kids, so we obviously fall onto the parent side of this lifestyle debate. Secondly, I don't think having kids is for everyone, and for those who are confident of their decision to not have any, I think that's great...I'd never try to "sell" the idea of having children to anyone who is set in their decision.

The only thing I've noticed in this thread from the "no children" camp that I disagree with is the continued use of the argument that they don't want kids because of the bad behavior, lack of visiting when they're older, etc. A few comments about having to hear "I hate you" etc bothered me, because it doesn't have to be that way. Yes, we've all heard kids acting like that, but I wouldn't use that as a reason not to have kids. You have control over how you raise them, and while all kids misbehave, certainly not to the point that it's a reason not to have kids. Same with adult children never visiting. Not always or even usually the case, I'd say. So I just wouldn't let that factor in.

And I will apologize (I learn on these boards), because I have on occasion THOUGHT (not said, at least) the comment that a friend could not be as tired as me because she doens't have kids (that she may think she's really tired, but does't KNOW tired, lol). I was wrong to think that. Of course I don't know exactly how my friend feels. Sometimes when you have kids, and you remember how things like sleep and travel were easier before you had them, it can be easy to compare and claim the childless person doesn't understand. FOR ME, having kids is worth every bit of tiredness/difficulty, but it is more difficult than being childless, nevertheless.

My question is: for those who are childless NOT by choice (or at least were at some point), how can I, with my three young kids, help a relative who is childless and wishes for children? We see her often (at her request...she says she enjoys the kids), and I know she has some really tough days when she wants children very badly. She is resigned to the fact that she never will, and I worry my children cause her pain. Is there anything I can do to be more sensitive to it?

Also, I have several friends who don't have children yet (are married) and I don't know if they ever will. Is it inappropriate to ask them about their plans? I never thought it was, but after reading this thread, maybe? Obviously if they told me no, I never want children, I'd never ask about it again. But they are vague. Is it rude to inquire, or rude not to, lol? Thanks!

See everyone, childless and with children, at Disney!

 

[PlutoLuvr]

Also, I have several friends who don't have children yet (are married) and I don't know if they ever will. Is it inappropriate to ask them about their plans? I never thought it was, but after reading this thread, maybe? Obviously if they told me no, I never want children, I'd never ask about it again. But they are vague. Is it rude to inquire, or rude not to, lol? Thanks!

See everyone, childless and with children, at Disney!

I'd say based on the number of responses in this thread alone, yeah, it's probably inappropriate. If they are being vague, they are probably doing so for a reason -- whatever that reason is -- and don't want to talk about it.

And thank you for not saying your childless friends don't know what it means to be tired. I wish my friends w/kids would stop saying such rude comments to me. I know what it's like to stay up all night. I raised my brother because our single mom worked 12-hour days to give us a good life. He's 15 years younger than me. My mother had him at home with myself and a midwife present. I also run my own business, and I average one all-nighter per month getting court transcripts out-- then go back to work the next day for eight to ten hours.

I, too, am tired of always having to be on the defensive about a very private decision that concerns no one but myself and my husband.

 

[NeverlandClub23]

I just stumbled upon this thread, and find it a very interesting topic. I have a few comments, and a few questions. First, DH and I have 3 kids, so we obviously fall onto the parent side of this lifestyle debate. Secondly, I don't think having kids is for everyone, and for those who are confident of their decision to not have any, I think that's great...I'd never try to "sell" the idea of having children to anyone who is set in their decision.

The only thing I've noticed in this thread from the "no children" camp that I disagree with is the continued use of the argument that they don't want kids because of the bad behavior, lack of visiting when they're older, etc. A few comments about having to hear "I hate you" etc bothered me, because it doesn't have to be that way. Yes, we've all heard kids acting like that, but I wouldn't use that as a reason not to have kids. You have control over how you raise them, and while all kids misbehave, certainly not to the point that it's a reason not to have kids. Same with adult children never visiting. Not always or even usually the case, I'd say. So I just wouldn't let that factor in.

And I will apologize (I learn on these boards), because I have on occasion THOUGHT (not said, at least) the comment that a friend could not be as tired as me because she doens't have kids (that she may think she's really tired, but does't KNOW tired, lol). I was wrong to think that. Of course I don't know exactly how my friend feels. Sometimes when you have kids, and you remember how things like sleep and travel were easier before you had them, it can be easy to compare and claim the childless person doesn't understand. FOR ME, having kids is worth every bit of tiredness/difficulty, but it is more difficult than being childless, nevertheless.

My question is: for those who are childless NOT by choice (or at least were at some point), how can I, with my three young kids, help a relative who is childless and wishes for children? We see her often (at her request...she says she enjoys the kids), and I know she has some really tough days when she wants children very badly. She is resigned to the fact that she never will, and I worry my children cause her pain. Is there anything I can do to be more sensitive to it?

Also, I have several friends who don't have children yet (are married) and I don't know if they ever will. Is it inappropriate to ask them about their plans? I never thought it was, but after reading this thread, maybe? Obviously if they told me no, I never want children, I'd never ask about it again. But they are vague. Is it rude to inquire, or rude not to, lol? Thanks!

See everyone, childless and with children, at Disney!

What a nice post!

 

[ForTheLoveofDisney]

And I will apologize (I learn on these boards), because I have on occasion THOUGHT (not said, at least) the comment that a friend could not be as tired as me because she doens't have kids (that she may think she's really tired, but does't KNOW tired, lol). I was wrong to think that. Of course I don't know exactly how my friend feels. Sometimes when you have kids, and you remember how things like sleep and travel were easier before you had them, it can be easy to compare and claim the childless person doesn't understand. FOR ME, having kids is worth every bit of tiredness/difficulty, but it is more difficult than being childless, nevertheless.

I'm going to take a stab at some of these but I can only speak for myself.

It's good that you have learned that just because someone doesn't have children that doesn't make them less tired. I have stage 3 endometriosis (this is the main reason I can't conceive) and even though you can't see my illness I do suffer and am many days way more tired than my friends with children but I keep going and hopefully you would never know it. Sure from the outside I can pretty up w/ doing my hair and makeup and wearing nice clothes but what you don't see is the war my body is raging on the inside against this hideous disease which at times really zaps my strength.

My question is: for those who are childless NOT by choice (or at least were at some point), how can I, with my three young kids, help a relative who is childless and wishes for children? We see her often (at her request...she says she enjoys the kids), and I know she has some really tough days when she wants children very badly. She is resigned to the fact that she never will, and I worry my children cause her pain. Is there anything I can do to be more sensitive to it?

I can only speak for me and from my experiences but just because I don't have kids (and choose not to) does not mean that I don't like kids. I have 18 nieces and nephews and one on the way and I love them all. I enjoy spending time with them because they are some really neat people. I love their outlook on life and the way they see things and interpret things. So believe your friend when she says she enjoys them. Some things that have helped me is when my friends make "dates" with just us and not the kids. When the focus is on the friendship and the kids aren't in tow. Sometimes it's nice to talk about how you're rearanging your livingroom furniture, or a special date that you and hubby are planning, or the great bag you saw at Macy's. Also, it helps when people just listen and don't (always) offer up advice. Like if she's feeling really down, don't offer adoption as an option i.e. "Well, you could always adopt.". I can pretty much bet my life on the fact that she's looked into it and knows that she "can always adopt" like people like to say. Adoption is not for the faint of heart. They delve into your past, your present, your home, your finances. You have background checks and your fingerprinted and you have to go to doctor's for physicals and have letters of recomendation. Talk about intrusion and it's not easy going through it once, twice and maybe have them fail. Don't remind her "not to give up". If she feels like giving up, she knows herself, let her. Sometimes well meaning offers of advice feel like pressure and when your friend is trying to explain how she's feeling she doesn't need to feel like she has to defend an already hard decision. I know many times I didn't even try with some friends, I just would say, "Yea, you're right. I know." just to shut them up because it's hard enough without having to summons up the energy to fight for your position on it. Sometimes we just have crummy days and we don't want to hear all of our options, we already know them! Most days we just want to hear, "Yea, that sucks!! It's not fair. It does suck!" Does this make sense?

Also, I have several friends who don't have children yet (are married) and I don't know if they ever will. Is it inappropriate to ask them about their plans? I never thought it was, but after reading this thread, maybe? Obviously if they told me no, I never want children, I'd never ask about it again. But they are vague. Is it rude to inquire, or rude not to, lol? Thanks!

See everyone, childless and with children, at Disney!

I'd say it's probably inappropriate. Especially if they are vague. They're probably being vague for a reason. If it comes up great but if it doesn't come up, I wouldn't ask.

ETA: Thanks for taking the time to find out. The world needs more people like you.

 

[mking624]

I just stumbled on this thread myself. My DH and I are in the camp that we are biologically unable to carry a child to term. We didn't find this out until last fall after several years of trying to conceive. We did get pregnant last summer, only to end in miscarriage a few weeks later. It devastated me. Now we are pursuing adoption.

For awhile we contemplated being child-free. We weren't sure that adoption was the right choice for us (obviously we know now). But ultimately we realized that we desired to have children in our lives...we wanted to "leave a legacy" so to speak and it felt so selfish (for us) to just have life be about me and DH. One thing that our infertility did teach us, however, is the importance of sensitivity regarding someone else's situation. We don't know if a person without children has chosen not to have a child, has chosen to wait, or is unable to have children. Every time I was asked why it was taking me so long to have children was a painful reminder of what my body was unable to do. I spent many days crying. I still cry sometimes...while I love the fact we're adopting, I know I'll never be able to experience what biological mothers get to experience and that's not easy to let go of.

I'm a born again Christian so I believe that children are a blessing of God and that having children shouldn't be prevented. But my infertility struggles have taught me that it's not my place to judge or critique someone else's situation because I don't know the full story. I'm not here to place any judgment on those who choose not to have a child...my beliefs aren't causing me to be judgmental. So please don't think that. : But I bring it up because while I believe children are precious, I also believe the Bible when it said God created Adam and Eve...and they were complete. It was such an awesome lesson for me to learn...that my DH and I were a complete family in God's eyes even without children in our lives. That was so comforting to me. I wish that I had the choice to say "I choose not to have [biological] children" instead of saying "I can't have children". But I wish none of us had to go through the invasion of privacy that judge our status or situation when they don't even know every last detail.

 

[apirateslifeforme]

I'm getting a divorce after 7 1/2 years of marriage. All through those years, we were constantly asked, "When are you going to have a baby?" I would just shrug and say we weren't ready yet. In my situation, I felt ashamed to tell the truth - that my husband was constantly getting into severe debt, which I would end up paying off, and he was abusive. Now that we're getting a divorce, I want a baby so badly, it hurts

 

[ForTheLoveofDisney]

You're absolutely right.

Choices like married, single, kids, no kids, religion, politics, career choices, etc. are life changing. Doesn't everyone think that most people will try to do what they think is best for them? No one needs to be told what to think and what to choose.
I hope this is a reminder to those who make comments about having kids (or other personal topics) that it is very possible the person on the receving end:

a) is trying to have kids
b) was trying to have kids
c) doesn't want to have kids
d) may not be able to have kids
or e) may have lost a child

and doesn't need to be reminded of sadnesses or problems, or have their life choices questioned. Everyone deserves respect.

Exactly. I agree whole heartedly with your entire post! Who are we to decide for someone else what is best for their lives?

Oh, and I love your tag! It's a great saying.

Hmmm, No comments from "You should have children at all costs" group.....

I think the above 2 posts say it all. Hope to see some of you child free Disers when we are there in September.

I am dying to go in September. DH and I have Annual Passes which are burning a hole in my pocket. We have our DVC. Alls I'd have to pay for is my airfare and food how can I afford NOT to go ? The trouble is trying to convince my DH . He's not so easily sold. I've often thought of just planning the whole thing and making him go. How wrong of me would that be?

 

[wrldpossibility]

I'm getting a divorce after 7 1/2 years of marriage. All through those years, we were constantly asked, "When are you going to have a baby?" I would just shrug and say we weren't ready yet. In my situation, I felt ashamed to tell the truth - that my husband was constantly getting into severe debt, which I would end up paying off, and he was abusive. Now that we're getting a divorce, I want a baby so badly, it hurts

Just want to say that I'm so sorry. I hope you are able to have a baby or adopt a baby when the time is right for you.

 

[kennancat]

Also, I have several friends who don't have children yet (are married) and I don't know if they ever will. Is it inappropriate to ask them about their plans? I never thought it was, but after reading this thread, maybe? Obviously if they told me no, I never want children, I'd never ask about it again. But they are vague. Is it rude to inquire, or rude not to, lol? Thanks!

If these are close friends then I personally don't see an issue with asking them directly. And by close friends, I mean people that you can have the serious, in-depth discussions about life, what you want out of it, etc. If these are people that you see every other month for dinner, then it's probably not a good idea to ask them directly, especially if their responses thus far have been vauge. I personally have no problem when our close or even our casual friends ask us if we're planning to have kids. I think the key if you want to ask them is to A) let the subject come up somewhat naturally and ask if, not when B) be prepared to back off and apologize if they seem uncomfortable or offended and C) don't let your mouth drop open, look horrified, and say, "wow, you really don't want kids at all" if that's what they end up saying The other thing I would add is don't keep asking them every so often if they've changed their minds. We do have one set of friends that do that every so often and that does get a bit annoying.

 

[Hixski]

I am dying to go in September. DH and I have Annual Passes which are burning a hole in my pocket. We have our DVC. Alls I'd have to pay for is my airfare and food how can I afford NOT to go ? The trouble is trying to convince my DH . He's not so easily sold. I've often thought of just planning the whole thing and making him go. How wrong of me would that be?

I am lucky in that my DH would go anywhere I want to go. He is one of those people that does not care where he goes as long as he goes. If I say vacation, he does not say where, he says when.....

Still waiting for comments from the "You should have children at all costs group". NO.......great, maybe a breakthrough for those folks.