LOST - Last Season (NO SPOILERS)

[N.Bailey]

Maybe the OMG moment will be that Jacob and the MIB are essentially the same person... Jacob represents the good side and MIB represents evil? But they are as one which is why MIB could never kill Jacob himself because the island won't you let kill yourself???

Wow, that's a great theory!!! At one point this season, didn't they say we all have a light side and we all have a dark side?

 

[N.Bailey]

Question for the Christains/New Testament scholars on this board. Did that page from St. Luke (when the priest took Ricardo's bible, it was open to a page from the book of St. Luke) have any significance?

That's definitely worth exploring.

 

[N.Bailey]

I posted this on the spoiler thread, too. It's certainly no spoiler, so I thought for those who don't read that thread, I'd post for feedback here too.

Remember, Widmore was banished from ever setting foot on the Island again. Yet, he's there. Ben also said he would never be able to return to the Island again after he moved it. Was he too banished? Yet, he too is back! So, what allowed them both to return?

Was Locke somehow the, "ONE?" I'm not sure he took Jacob's or the MIB's spot (at that point), but he was somehow clearly special. Was it his death off Island that allowed Widmore and Ben the ability to return to the Island? Did that somehow lift the banishment?

Richard was the one who told Locke that he'd have to die. Would that have some implication? Ben and Widmore both had contact with Locke off Island. Where they both using him to gain their ticket back?

 

[gometros]

I don't know much about the Bible, but the scripture that was being featured was Luke 4:24, I think.. which is: “And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country.”

It could have also been Luke 4:25, which is : "But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Elias, when the heaven was shut up three years and six months, when great famine was throughout all the land;"

So.. I don't know what significance those might have, but that's what was on the page.

ETA: I found this on the Lostpedia in reference to Luke, chapter 4:

"In Chapter 4, Jesus has returned from his time in the desert, where he thwarted the temptation of the Devil, and attends Temple in Nazareth where he cast out "a spirit of an unclean demon" from a possessed man and healed a woman with a great fever."

Hmmm, Sayid and Claire?

 

[N.Bailey]

Here is the NIV version of the verses surrounding Luke 4:25. I think temptation is key. While not as poet as the King James version, the NIV is so much easier to understand (and is always what I turn to unless I'm looking for the poetry - say of Psalms).

Luke 4:0-30 (New International Version)

Luke 4
The Temptation of Jesus
1Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert, 2where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry.

3The devil said to him, "If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread."

4Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone.'[a]"

5The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7So if you worship me, it will all be yours."

8Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.

9The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. 10For it is written:
" 'He will command his angels concerning you
to guard you carefully;
11they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'[c]"

12Jesus answered, "It says: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'[d]"

13When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time.
Jesus Rejected at Nazareth
14Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about him spread through the whole countryside. 15He taught in their synagogues, and everyone praised him.

16He went to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day he went into the synagogue, as was his custom. And he stood up to read. 17The scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written:
18"The Spirit of the Lord is on me,
because he has anointed me
to preach good news to the poor.
He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners
and recovery of sight for the blind,
to release the oppressed,
19to proclaim the year of the Lord's favor."[e]

20Then he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant and sat down. The eyes of everyone in the synagogue were fastened on him, 21and he began by saying to them, "Today this scripture is fulfilled in your hearing."

22All spoke well of him and were amazed at the gracious words that came from his lips. "Isn't this Joseph's son?" they asked.

23Jesus said to them, "Surely you will quote this proverb to me: 'Physician, heal yourself! Do here in your hometown what we have heard that you did in Capernaum.' "

24"I tell you the truth," he continued, "no prophet is accepted in his hometown. 25I assure you that there were many widows in Israel in Elijah's time, when the sky was shut for three and a half years and there was a severe famine throughout the land. 26Yet Elijah was not sent to any of them, but to a widow in Zarephath in the region of Sidon. 27And there were many in Israel with leprosy[f] in the time of Elisha the prophet, yet not one of them was cleansed—only Naaman the Syrian."

28All the people in the synagogue were furious when they heard this. 29They got up, drove him out of the town, and took him to the brow of the hill on which the town was built, in order to throw him down the cliff. 30But he walked right through the crowd and went on his way.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke 4:0-30&version=NIV

 

[N.Bailey]

The Devil promised Jesus anything he could possibly want. Yet, he chose God. Both the MIB and Jacob try to use the same approach with Richard. To offer him anything he wants. Richard chooses eternal life.

It's kind of ironic that he chose eternal life, when he does indeed have the time for pennance. Why would he not wish to repent, then go on into the afterlife with Isabella?

Jacob hires Richard, which makes Richard his prophet. He brings Jacob's word to the people of the Island. We also know that Richard is not accepted in his own country, because they sentenced him to death. This goes directly to scripture.

Another interesting point is, Heaven was closed for 3 1/2 years. Everyone was off Island for 3 years, I don't recall how many days make up seasons 1 thru 5, but is this some sort of countdown?

Oh, and don't forget, Jacob is renamed Israel in the Bible.

-----------------------------------------------------------

This has nothing to do with the passage from the Bible:

Isn't it ironic that wine is representative of the blood of Christ, yet in the metaphor being used here, the wine is representative of evil itself. The cork must plug the wine to keep evil from escaping.

 

[ibouncetoo]

It's kind of ironic that he chose eternal life, when he does indeed have the time for pennance. Why would he not wish to repent, then go on into the afterlife with Isabella?
.

At that point Richard chose 'not to die' because Jacob told him he could not give Richard absolution, so he chose eternal life to avoid going to hell. He believed that pennance was not an option.

.

 

[Amy]

IRichard was the one who told Locke that he'd have to die. Would that have some implication? Ben and Widmore both had contact with Locke off Island. Where they both using him to gain their ticket back?

I agree with your question about how were both Ben and Widmore able to come back to the island. The part I quoted here, though.......yes, Richard told Locke that he'd have to die. BUT the only reason Richard said that was because MIB/Locke/Smokey told him to say that to the "real" Locke. Remember after the Ajira flight crashed and MIB/Smokey took over Locke's body...MIB/Locke was leading Richard, Ben and the Others to see Jacob, and MIB/Locke too Ben and Richard on a side-trip thru the jungle to where that drug plane crashed. MIB/Locke has been around forever, so he knew about the time flashes and that at that moment they'd see the "real" Locke after he'd been shot by Ethan. So MIB/Locke sent Richard to Real Locke to pull the bullet out of his leg and to tell Real Locke that he'd have to die.

Did I explain that well? The way I see it, the only reason Real Locke thought he had to die to get everybody back was NOT because it was true, but it was because MIB wanted to use Real Locke's body himself, and MIB/Locke is the one who told Richard to tell Real Locke that he had to die.

 

[ChrisFL]

All I know is the subtitle of the last episode should be named, like the 2006 National Lampoon movie:

"The Beach Party at the Threshold of Hell"

 

[N.Bailey]

I agree with your question about how were both Ben and Widmore able to come back to the island. The part I quoted here, though.......yes, Richard told Locke that he'd have to die. BUT the only reason Richard said that was because MIB/Locke/Smokey told him to say that to the "real" Locke. Remember after the Ajira flight crashed and MIB/Smokey took over Locke's body...MIB/Locke was leading Richard, Ben and the Others to see Jacob, and MIB/Locke too Ben and Richard on a side-trip thru the jungle to where that drug plane crashed. MIB/Locke has been around forever, so he knew about the time flashes and that at that moment they'd see the "real" Locke after he'd been shot by Ethan. So MIB/Locke sent Richard to Real Locke to pull the bullet out of his leg and to tell Real Locke that he'd have to die.

Did I explain that well? The way I see it, the only reason Real Locke thought he had to die to get everybody back was NOT because it was true, but it was because MIB wanted to use Real Locke's body himself, and MIB/Locke is the one who told Richard to tell Real Locke that he had to die.

You did explain it quite nicely, but when I read this yesterday, I kept thinking, huh? What is she saying? Then as fate would have it I watched an episode yesterday (am working my way back thru the seasons again) and I miraculously was up to, season 5, episode 15 - titled, Follow the Leader. I couldn't believe I was on the exact episode you were describing. I definitely had an ah ha moment and instantly realized what you were saying. I had forgotten all about that.

 

[N.Bailey]

My next thought was, how was Ben able to kill Jacob? We know that Jacob spoke before Ben was able to kill him, so if that's the qualifier, then why was he able to kill him? Would the loophole involve bringing someone to the island who had been banished? If that's so (and it's a guess and nothing more), that would make Ben and Whitmore the only 2 who would have the ability to kill Jacob or Flocke (or whatever form they are in at the time). Or maybe someone killing them before they speak (which seems to be a general rule of thumb - Dogen used this line with Sayid, as did the MIB to Richard upon coming to the Island).

 

[bigmerle1966]

I was suprised a wooden ship could obliterate a giant stone statue

At this point we don't know what time the statue if from. It's been sitting there for who knows how many centuries or millenia on the beach in the salt air which corrodes things, a really strong wind could have knocked it down.

 

[WriteDisney]

As a side note: Does anyone else read Doc Jensen's column on Entertainment Weekly's website? I'm just now getting a chance to and is it seriously 12 pages???

 

[ryan840]

My next thought was, how was Ben able to kill Jacob? We know that Jacob spoke before Ben was able to kill him, so if that's the qualifier, then why was he able to kill him? Would the loophole involve bringing someone to the island who had been banished? If that's so (and it's a guess and nothing more), that would make Ben and Whitmore the only 2 who would have the ability to kill Jacob or Flocke (or whatever form they are in at the time). Or maybe someone killing them before they speak (which seems to be a general rule of thumb - Dogen used this line with Sayid, as did the MIB to Richard upon coming to the Island).

But Sayid did try to kill Flocke before he spoke, and it didn't work.

 

[beattyfamily]

But Sayid did try to kill Flocke before he spoke, and it didn't work.

No, he did speak. He said "Hi Sayid". Then he stabbed him.

 

[ryan840]

No, he did speak. He said "Hi Sayid". Then he stabbed him.

Wow, I totally missed that.

 

[bekkiz]

Just a quick question, do we know why Iliana is in some 3rd world hospital all bandaged up? I don't remember anything that might have caused it, but then again, maybe I just missed something.

 

[beattyfamily]

Just a quick question, do we know why Iliana is in some 3rd world hospital all bandaged up? I don't remember anything that might have caused it, but then again, maybe I just missed something.

No, we do not know why yet. I believe the producers said we will find that out though....hope that's ok to say. Never sure, in a spoiler thread, what is ok and what isn't ok to say.

 

[LuvBaloo]

When MIB sent Richard to kill Jacob, did anybody notice how similar that scene was to when the Samurai temple guy sent Sayid out to kill Locke? Was it the same knife? Is there any significance there?

I actually enjoyed the Richard episode and am looking forward to watching it again tomorrow with the extra info added as subtitles.

I also really enjoyed the Sawyer episode. I did think it was odd that as a cop he assisted Kate in escaping. Sawyer with Charlotte was odd . I did like Sawyer and Miles's interactions.

I really think Sawyer is going to end up doing something heroic. As much as he talks tough, he's always looking out for his friends.

 

[N.Bailey]

When MIB sent Richard to kill Jacob, did anybody notice how similar that scene was to when the Samurai temple guy sent Sayid out to kill Locke? Was it the same knife? Is there any significance there?

I actually enjoyed the Richard episode and am looking forward to watching it again tomorrow with the extra info added as subtitles.

I also really enjoyed the Sawyer episode. I did think it was odd that as a cop he assisted Kate in escaping. Sawyer with Charlotte was odd . I did like Sawyer and Miles's interactions.

I really think Sawyer is going to end up doing something heroic. As much as he talks tough, he's always looking out for his friends.

gometros stated in the spoiler thread that they weren't running the earlier show with commentary this week. I just jumped onto my Media Center to double check it, and it's not scheduled for 8:00 PM. It looks like Dancing with the Stars will be on (though I see it's on right now too).