Line Cutters!!!

[DMRick]

Just that said:

Once again, I said any disabilty, I did not put restrictions on them as to what kind.

Actually you did..you said:
Odds are if you don't have your own wheelchair you do not need one at WDW, exceptions being the elderly, broken bones, sprains, etc. You also said "I can understand that very obese people have difficulties walking for extended periods of time, however, I do not feel that they should get to cut the line simply because they are overweight.They should get a fastpass and come back at their time, which would require minimal walking, and allow truly disabled people to use the priviledge of getting on rides without waiting in line."

First of all..they do ask you to have a fastpass, if the ride has one available. How do you kow the woman didn't have a heart condition as well? Or even if she didn't, who the heck are you to decide if she is handicapped?

This was probably done as a result of the people who are not handicapped but just want to cheat,

What's with you and thinking people are out to cheat. They fixed the lines, because when MK was built, they didn't have the ADA, and now they do. They didn't fix it because people cheated..they fixed it to make it fair to disabled people..so they too can enjoy more things. You have some real problems. You have all these friends and relatives who are handicapped, and yet you have no compassion. You can name off a zillion people you know who deserve to have a wheelchair, but because one group in milions of people mistreat it (so say you, you still don't know if one of that group was ill), you just assume people all over are bad and cheaters. I can see no advantage to a wheelchair in Disney...there are very few rides you get to go ahead on without a fastpast, and the chair isn't free...and what a pain to roll it through crowds.

Peach:

How do you know that one of that group wouldn't need it sometime during the day. You said this makes others look suspect. Not to me..I assume people have a chair because they need it.

Just:

I'm pretty sure I said that people who are actually disabled should get that priviledge,

Next time I need a wheelchair, I'll try to blow up the doctor's note, so I can post it on the back of my chair.

Oh, and by the way, the special guest passes, are just for people you are talking about. People who you can't tell need special help, but because they look "normal" they need to get a special pass to prove they need it..in case they have to prove it to people who think they know it all.

We saw some people grab wheelchairs on their way out of the parks so that they'd be loaded onto a bus as soon as they got there and they could skip the line and not wait more than 30 minutes to get on bus

I must have had the wrong wheelchair rental. The only way I could take mine out of the park, was if I waited for a CM to go with me, so she could bring it back in. They not only wouldn't let us take it out of the park without the CM, we also had to wait in line for our turn on the bus once the CM went with us.

Yet when my fiancé asked the AKL bus driver to wait for his handicapped MIL, when we got there the bus driver proceeded to tell us that she was not handicapped. My mother said she considers cancer to be a handicap since she is able to do much less now than on previous trips before the cancer, but the bus driver said that as long as she is able to 'act normally' she isn't really handicapped.

I don't believe a DW bus driver said that to you...why would he make that judgement call? However, if the bus was suuppose to leave, and your mother was still some distance away, I do believe he would have been justified in leaving, and prob would have suggested another bus would be along shortly. I'm sure they can't hold up each bus for a person who isn't at the bus stop.. We have friends who drive for Disney, and I've never seen that kind of attitude. The fact that he did hold up the bus while waiting for someone not at the bus stop, tells me he was a kind person.

Those of you who posted should all be in agreement with me since you're the ones who will ultimately suffer the consequences of the cheaters.

I would never be in agreement with things you have said..they were plain nasty. Apparently you think that just your friends and relatives who don't look handicapped should be treated fairly, and not all people.

 

[lulu71]

Justhat-
I think many people were offended (including me) by your post because you seemed to make judgement calls about people abusing wheelchairs without really knowing why those people really needed them. And if you truly believe that not all disabilities are obvious just by looking at the person, I really don't understand why you would claim to have seen abuses in WDW in your original post. I really wish you'd be a little more sensitive and assume people are being honest before assuming the worst.

 

[Luv2Roam]

We have not seen much of this -- except in May 2002. Then it was the norm. It was bad and ridiculous.
I learned to grab whatever barrier was in the que areas and block the entire way. Otherwise it was guaranteed there would be cutters. And again, it wasn't just someone catching up with another in their group.
(And why is it people are always *catching up* with someone? Poor excuse in many cases, I think. More often than not I doubt it is legit.)
I told DH then that cutting seemed to be even in sport, to see how much they could get by with.
It didn't even matter when once I was the only person in line. Someone squeezed past me and cut. And to make matters worse, the CM Yelled (and I mean Yelled) at me when I explained I was next.

This was outside at guest services at DAK. I promptly went inside and explained what happened to the CM inside and made sure she knew who the CM was.
But the rest of the trips I may notice it one time at most. That week in May it was VERY common, to the point of being pushy and downright rude.

 

[justhat]

"I don't believe a DW bus driver said that to you...why would he make that judgement call? However, if the bus was suuppose to leave, and your mother was still some distance away, I do believe he would have been justified in leaving, and prob would have suggested another bus would be along shortly. I'm sure they can't hold up each bus for a person who isn't at the bus stop.. We have friends who drive for Disney, and I've never seen that kind of attitude. The fact that he did hold up the bus while waiting for someone not at the bus stop, tells me he was a kind person."

Yes, the bus driver did say that to my mother. Whether or not you believe that is up to you and I really could care less. She was a woman about age 45. We did not have her hold the bus, we just told her my mother was on her way, the bus was not pulling out and didn't leave for a few minutes after we got on, but since we did not know how long it had been there my fiancé ran ahead to be sure we didn't miss it. From the time he told the bus driver we were coming until we got there was about 40 seconds. I too have met many nice bus drivers, and this one was nice too, but she gave us her definition of handicapped. She was not yelling at us or calling us liars, simply stating she did not believe it was a true handicap.

"And if you truly believe that not all disabilities are obvious just by looking at the person, I really don't understand why you would claim to have seen abuses in WDW in your original post. I really wish you'd be a little more sensitive and assume people are being honest before assuming the worst."

I did not say all disabilities are obvious. This thread is about line cutters and I said that the worst people who cut lines are those who pretend to have a disability. I did not say I know who these people are, though it's pretty safe to assume that the group of teenagers we saw were not in fact handicapped at all. We happened to run into the same group quite a bit and literally at each ride a different kid was in the chair, with some of them faking an injury, either laughing and screaming about their 'hurt foot' or yelling about their 'neck injury'. Do I think it's fair for these kids to cut the line (and they were able to cut even rides with fastpasses) when there are true handicapped people out there? No I don't, and that's what most post referred to, not those of you with back, knee, foot problems.

 

[justhat]

"I would never be in agreement with things you have said..they were plain nasty. Apparently you think that just your friends and relatives who don't look handicapped should be treated fairly, and not all people."

First of all, what's nasty was the responses I got to a post not directed towards any of you. What I said was that I know people with unobvious disabilities and so if they want a wheelchair, like anyone with an unobvious disability, let them get one, heck, let 'em get 2 if they want them, I don't care. If you're disabled in anyway go ahead and get one. I did not say I run around policing people in wheelchairs and ask for proof of an illness. What I said was that people who unjustly get one, simply to cut lines, those people are wrong and worse than any line cutters in WDW. And yes, it happens everyday, I know you think it's ridiculous and so do I, but it happens, I have seen and also heard about it. My brother's friends all went to WDW in college and told him all about how they picked up a wheelchair someone had left at the stairs at the Boardwalk Inn and used it to cut lines at MK. This was about a month before fastpasses came out so all they did was go to the exit and get one rides. They told him it was the best thing they ever thought of and that he should do it when he went on our family trip in 3/01. Needless to say, none of us did this and thought it was horrible that anyone did. These are the people I am talking about, not any posters here who use wheelchairs at WDW.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We saw some people grab wheelchairs on their way out of the parks so that they'd be loaded onto a bus as soon as they got there and they could skip the line and not wait more than 30 minutes to get on bus
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"I must have had the wrong wheelchair rental. The only way I could take mine out of the park, was if I waited for a CM to go with me, so she could bring it back in. They not only wouldn't let us take it out of the park without the CM, we also had to wait in line for our turn on the bus once the CM went with us."


Yes, we saw this happen at MK last week in fact, and on previous trips as well. Many people didn't want to wait in the line to return them and get their dollar back so they just dropped them off and left, not always right by the return area either. Well on the way out at park closing several people we saw (3 that I can think of on one night) would jump in and they would get pushed out right through the gates. The wheelchair gates were open and you did not have to leave through a turnstile, all gates were open. So they wheeled themselves right out and right up to the front of the line for the bus. 2 people leaving MGM on 2/16 around 9:45pm (park closed at 8:30) grabbed a wheelchair outside of Brown Derby, walked right through the open gates, and right onto the All Star Music bus, along with my party and a bunch of kids with a twirling competition. We left Brown Derby withthe only other family in there and the wheelchair was not ours nor theirs. While putting on my poncho, a random couple walked up, saw the chair, asked if it was ours, then proceeded to sit in it and roll out. Were they disabled, maybe, but probably not. But as I said, I don't go around policing since I don't care that much, but I just think it's wrong for others to do this if they do not need the chair. Additionally, when my grandmother rented a wheelchair in Epcot, they let her take it to our bus and back to the hotel. We were staying at the Wyndham Palace so it wasn't even a Disney hotel. We went to return it but they said we wouldn't get our dollar back since the return shop was closed for the night so we might as well keep it and use it tomorrow. So we took it back to our hotel, but gave it in the next day to get a new one and get the dollar back. The CM was so surprised someone wouldn't just use it another day that he gave us a free rental day. So apparently you can take them out pretty easily.

 

[SueM in MN]

We told him and he laughed and said "nah, we'll just rent a wheelchair, after all, we have to pay either way but with the stroller we don't get to go to the front of any lines!" I was appalled by this comment, but realized plenty of people do it everyday for no reason other than to cheat on lines.

They may have thought this, but if they usea wheelchair in a few lines, they would find out differently pretty quickly. Again (see my post on page 2) I post, most lines at WDW are Mainstream access, which means that wheelchair users wait in the same line as everyone else.
This is directly from the WDW Guidebooks for Guests with Disabilities (which you can download if you like at http://disneyworld.disney.go.com/wa...qindex?id=WDWGuestswithDisabilitiesFAQGrping:
The following information is repeated in all the Guidebooks (there is one for each park)
" Some Guests may be concerned that they do not have the stamina to wait in our queues. We strongly suggest these Guests consider using a wheelchair or ECV, as the distance between our attractions is much greater than the length of our queues.
Some attractions have auxiliary entrances for Guests with disabilities.These are intended to offer Guests in wheelchairs or with service animals a more convenient entrance to the attraction.Auxiliary entrances are not intended to bypass waiting lines.Guests with disabilities and up to five members of their party may enter through these entrances.The rest of the party should use the main entrance.
Guests with any mobility or queue related assistance needs are recommended to use the Disney ’s FASTPASS ®option wherever possible.
Disney ’s FASTPASS ®service lets guests spend less time waiting in line and more time enjoying the Parks.This free service allows you to get a designated window of time to visit some of our most popular attractions.
During this process,you will be provided with a FASTPASS ®ticket for an attraction,enabling you to visit other locations and return to the queue at a later time.To help you make this decision,there will be a clock indicating
the window of time during which you can return to the attraction with no further wait if you choose the FASTPASS ® options,and another clock showing the current wait time for the stand-by line.
To utilize FASTPASS ®,just insert your Park entrance ticket into the FASTPASS ®turnstile at participating attractions and receive a FASTPASS ®ticket imprinted with a designated window of time during which you can return."

Each park has a list of Mainstream Access Attractions. For MK:
"Attractions that provide access through the main queue include:
• Pirates of the Caribbean
• The Enchanted Tiki Room
• Splash Mountain
• The Hall of Presidents
• The Haunted Mansion
• Legend of the Lion King
• The Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh
• Donald ’s Boat
• Mickey ’s Country House
• Minnie ’s Country House
• Toontown Hall of Fame
• The Barnstormer at Goofy ’s Wiseacre Farm
• Astro Orbiter
• Buzz Lightyear ’s Space Ranger Spin
• The ExtraTERRORestrial Alien Encounter
• Tomorrowland Indy Speedway
• Space Mountain
• The TimeKeeper
• Walt Disney ’s Carousel of Progress
• Splash Mountain
• Big Thunder Mountain
• The Haunted Mansion
• Space Mountain
• Buzz Lightyear ’s Space Ranger Spin

For Epcot:
Attractions that provide access through the main queue
include:
• FUTURE WORLD
– Wonders of Life – All Attractions
– Universe of Energy
– The Living Seas
– Test Track
– Imagination! – All Attractions
– Innoventions
• WORLD SHOWCASE
– Norway – Maelstrom
– FriendShip Boats
– France – Impressions de France
– China – Wonders of China
– The American Adventure – All Attractions

For MGM:
Attractions that provide access through the main queue include:
• The Great Movie Ride
• Star Tours
• Jim Henson’s Muppet*Vision 3D
• Disney-MGM Studios Backlot Tour
• BACKSTAGE PASS
• Who Wants to Be a Millionaire – Play It!
• Walt Disney: One Man’s Dream
• Voyage of The Little Mermaid
• The Magic of Disney Animation
• Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster Starring Aerosmith
• “The Twilight Zone Tower of Terror
TM
”
• FANTASMIC!

For AK:
Attractions that provide access through the main queue include:
• It’s Tough To Be a Bug
• Grandmother Willow’s Grove
• Lion King Theater
• DINOSAUR
• The Boneyard
• Theater in the Wild
• TriceraTop Spin
• Primeval Whirl
• Kilimanjaro Safaris
• Caravan Stage
• Kali River Rapids"

We saw this in effect last week on Buzz Lightyear Space Ranger Spin. People in wheelchairs were asked to get a fastpass and then enter the fastpass line. When they got up to the boarding area they were asked to go through a special entrance to the exit and they boarded there.

Yes, you do go to the exit if you have a wheelchair because that is where you have to board in order to have the wheelchair waiting for you when you get off. The "special entrance to the exit" cuts off about the last 20 feet of the line. And when you get to the exit, you wait. Usually while we are waiting there to board, we see the people who were just ahead of us in line, getting off the ride after they have finished riding. While we are still waiting to board. So, don't assume that going to the exit means the people with wheelchairs are boarding right away.
And even having a fastpass doesn't mean you get to enter a show when your fastpass time comes. We have returned for our fastpass time for ITTBAB and Little Mermaid only to find out that all the wheelchair slots are already filled for that show. So even though our fastpass time is passed, we have to wait for the next show.

 

[sha_lyn]

justthat... many of your comments are very rude and uncalled for. I know many people who have physical limits that would not allow them to walk all day over WDW but they do not have a wheel chair. My BIL and SGF who both have had knee replacment surgeries. My late grandmother and very good friend who had (have)sever foot problems. My other grandmother who had hip replacement (and before that severe arthritis in her knees and hips) . MY BIL and SIL who both have had back surgery and wear a brace all of the time. However by your own post, you feel they don't deserve the use of a wheelchair in WDW

 

[kevind65]

Just a short bit on the disabilities thing: my dw just turned 34, is attractive, lean and looks completely "normal" to most everybody at first glance. She also has MS. We have been to disney world about 10 times over the last 7 years and so far she hasn't had to use the wheelchair yet, but, it is becoming more and evident that she probably will have to in the very near future. I hope that when that time comes, people would look to her with some compassion. I think we have gotten to a really bad point as a society when we start complaining about waiting an extra minute for an amusement ride because a disabled person got to go ahead of us. I will tell you this; I know for sure that my dw would rather be at the back of the line than to have the MS that is increasingly raveging her body. nuff said.

On the original topic: we usually employ the width of the que strategy as well. it makes it much more difficult for the cutters. The one situation that gets me the most is when the one person darts in front of your family right before you enter the que and then once you're up in the line one after another of his or her friends keep running up in front of you as well, each saying"oh, I'm catching up with my group". sometimes 15 of them. that really bothers me. I've started saying to the first one: "hey, instead of your 14 friends cutting in front of everyone, why don't you go back with them?" that seems to work most of the time. some people are just rude and there's not much you can do about those people. Most of the time we don't let it bother us too much though.

 

[sha_lyn]

Oh I forgot about the preachers wife with Lupus. She can be very "normal" one day and unable to stand the next. When her disease is not acting up she is very active, however there have been times when she is wheelchair bound for months at a time.

With some conditions (such as lupus, some types of chemo etc) sun exposure is very dangerous and they are given the special needs passes.

 

[BibbidyBobbidyBoo]

(on the subject of wheelchairs/etc- let's just say that I totally agree with SueM, DMrick and several others that said about the same thing -more eloquently than I could... because I'm a little peeved right now at justthat's comments here. )

I will say though.....

Now as for handicpped lines, guests, etc. ... I take personal exception to the comments made by Justthat. I rent a scooter/ECV when I am at WDW. I do not use one at home, so I don't have my own to bring on vacation. I have a knee condition & as per my doctor I am not supposed to do stairs, knee bends, etc. I do not have a visible handicap, & some days are better than others. To you, I probably look "perfectly normal." Some days I park the ECV & walk around in a small area. I rarely take the scooter into a restaurant - I can walk from teh entrance to the table. This does not mean I do not have a legitimate need for the scooter.

Also just because a person may appear to be "normal", they too may have a handicap where a wheelchair or scooter might help.

Having rented & used a scooter now for the last 2-3 years at WDW, I can assure you many people who appear to be "perfectly normal" are not. I would gladly swap knees with someone with "good" knees.

Thank you. I also have a knee condition in both knees and while I did make it 4 days WDW, one off day doing other things, and then 2 days US/IOA... that last day at US/IOA I paid $40 (not no stinking $5... I wish! I couldn't get a wheelchair as my husband would have to push the stroller and therefore couldn't push me also! I got a wheelchair at first and didn't get 10 feet from the door before I changed it to a scooter -because that's how long it took for me to realize I couldn't "push" it myself!) for a scooter because at that point my knees were swollen (water in the knee- bad) and hurting.
Let me tell you... I did not get any "benefit" from this. It was awful... if I could have ripped off my legs at the knee and walked around with bloody stumps (hahaha) I would have. It's hard getting around with those things (let's not even add in the fact of keeping up with children also... I made them walk single file behind me because for SOME reason when I was in the scooter people would run over my children and knock them down- when they did NOT do that when I was standing next to them the days prior) and I never got to cut. There were also lines where you had to leave your wheelchair (and btw- I saw the same with others at WDW so it's not just a US/IOA issue) same as the strollers so I would just sit that ride out because if the line was long I didn't think I could handle standing and sometimes standing at an angle (you know- the lines going UP so it's inclined so you stand at an angle- kinda like Space Mountain does).
So I missed out. I did not get to cut, I got plenty of those "looks" like I shouldn't be in that scooter and WHY do people think you get special treatment??? I sure never saw anyone getting special treatment whether in a wheelchair or a scooter and didn't receive any when I was in one!
I saw people waiting in line just like everyone else and the ONLY special attention I saw was that they had to sit in a certain area- usually up front but sometimes in the back or side.. not the best seats in the house usually and only a few spaces for wheelchairs/scooters so I imagine that others had to wait LONGER than those not in wheelchairs because of the limited space available.

So your comments just don't wash with me. You need to seriously rethink them. Rent a wheelchair yourself next time and see if it's really worth it to try to 'cheat' anything. To put it bluntly- it sucks.

Btw- I'm not exactly thin and I look "normal". I'm sure if you had saw me in the scooter you would look upon me in disdain- not even realizing I was missing OUT.. not getting any 'benefits' from riding that darn thing. No one in their right mind would lug around a wheelchair or ride a scooter if they didn't have to. It's awful the way people judge you.

And by the way- you ARE judging obese people. You even stated as such (as DMrick pointed out) because you listed what you consider 'real' disabilities and then said but the ones that are just obese should have to get fast passes/etc.
You even made a comment about the "obese" person using the scooter to go back and forth from the buffet and the table. You didn't mention her CUTTING or getting any special treatment- so how did that fact concern you in ANY way?? Did she get to cut? You didn't mention that. Did she get any special treatment over you or any other person not in a wheelchair? You didn't mention that happening either.
The fact that she just used the scooter to go back and forth obviously bothered you. And the reason is clear- because she was obese and you obviously were appalled at someone becoming so "obese" as to need a wheelchair or scooter instead of walking such a short distance. But you don't know what else could be happening there. You have no idea what condition she has. That person COULD have been me... overweight yet having a knee condition unrelated to the weight condition (and pre-ceding it, thank you very much... due to athletics in highschool. My weight is due to pregnancies and so far unable to lose it all afterwards) and therefore needing a wheelchair or scooter. Maybe it HURT for her to walk to the buffet and the table- ever think of that??? What's it to you anyway?? I don't understand....

And PUHLEASE don't sit there and tell me that because you have a relative that is 100lbs or whatever and is sedentary from a disability that it means all or even MOST of the others are overweight because they eat too much or don't eat right. That is just so wrong.
How about you try being sedentary (pretend you have an disability- go ahead, I dare you) for a few months or a year and see how much weight you gain no matter how well you try to eat. My mother is a prime example of that. She eats PERFECT (she's anal about it now) and yet because she is paralyzed (quadraplegic) she is continually gaining weight year after year. She was always thin before. Don't sit there and act like it's only because she doesn't eat right or eats too much.
ugh

Oh and btw on my most recent trip I was SOLO... and I could take things easy or just sit on a bench or any restaurant I wanted at any given time. I never really felt the need for a wheelchair or scooter. If my knees started swelling and hurting- I'd just have a rest or go back to the resort. It's not that easy when you have a family with you -you tend to do more to stick with your family and not want to hold them back from enjoying their trip. We did go as a 'family' during a busy time of the year though so things were more hectic and not much time for 'relaxing'. So I'm sure that had something to do with why I ended up needing a scooter on the last day and basically missing out on everything but atleast there before/after/in between the rides with my kids and all. That is why I intend to try to go only at slower times during the year with my family from now on. So hopefully our next trip I will not need to use a wheelchair or scooter. Trust me... it is NOT an advantage. It really isn't.
And btw- if you feel the way you do about people taking advantage- then how about only ONE person going with the handicapped person? I mean really...the rest of their family shouldn't receive special treatment and go with the person in the wheelchair... just like YOU (justthat) mentioned YOU did on a trip to WDW... right???


Back on to the subject of cutting- I did notice a bit of cutting here and there and in most cases I would just politely make a comment about the end of the line is there- pretending like I honestly believed they just didn't know where the end of the line was. That way they didn't have to feel bad OR get angry at me/etc... they have an "out"- they can pretend they didn't now where the end was "oh! Thank you!" is usually the responce I got.

I did have a little annoyance with some teenagers trying to RUN by you in the qeues so I would sometimes put my arms out on the bars. One or two didn't bother me but I can't run like them and it's uncool for a ton of people to just run by me like that. I noticed that mostly at ToT for some reason. I guess because when they let you out you go into qeues that are pretty wide. I did not notice as much cutting in line when I was on the previous trip with my husband and 3 children. I guess we took up too much space for them to smoosh by then. LOL

As far as the trading off in lines for characters- I also think there is a fine line there. Meaning if it's mom and dad trading back and forth a couple of young kids and it really makes no difference to me because they are taking a family portrait and one/two autograph books-I'm cool with that. I do think (have not witnessed it personally though) that it would be uncool to hold lines for huge groups of people then take individual portraits and get a ton of autograph books signed. Because that DOES make a difference to me- it means I have to wait longer. KWIM?

Honestly though in some cases I would prefer people do that rather than stand in a huge long line with one/two very young children who are going to get testy and whiney/etc while waiting in line that entire time. I'd rather they be off with the other parent going to see another character and then just show up in front of me at the last minute. I have my own 3 probably whiney/crying/testy children in that line... than to have to listen to others also! LOL So by all means do the line pass thing.

To me it's really no different than the parent swap. Some might think THAT is unfair because if you have 2 older children that can ride it, 2 parents that can ride it- but one young child that can't- the parents get to ride with their older children and swap- then the other parent ride with the older kids. I mean really.. how horrible for the two children to get to ride TWICE without a wait in line the second time! Honestly they should just have to wait in line again if the other parent wants to ride, right justthat? No special treatment - even if you have young children. *rolling my eyes*

Oh and I also have no problem (and hope no one else does either because I'm gonna do it at times LOL) with say daddy waiting in line while I take my 3 to the bathroom for 2 to go potty and one to change a diaper and then store the stroller. I'm gone a long time- but please don't think I'm off enjoying myself while hubby holds the line for me. Trust me... bathroom time is not fun for me. LOL But by the same token- do you REALLY want to stand in line with my 3 kids that entire time? Trust me.. the trade off is in your favor. You should be thanking me for keeping them out of line part of the time you are standing there.

HAHAHAHAHA

HM is just a cutter's haven... "nuff said.

 

[peachgirl]

How do you know that one of that group wouldn't need it sometime during the day.

I know it because the woman who was trying to break up the fighting over the wheelchair was loudly complaining that the kid's behavior was going to end up getting them "caught" and they were going to end up getting the wheelchair taken away. The loud argument and the comments they were making left no doubt whatsoever. They were attracting some attention with their antics and I wasn't the only one who noticed. I would never assume someone who had a wheelchair didn't really need it, but there just wasn't any question about this group.

Is it an advantage to use a wheelchair at WDW? I suppose to some, when you're perfectly healthly, the idea of getting to ride around instead of walking sounds pretty good. I guess this group thought the reserved seating for shows was pretty nice too, they were certainly talking about it. For those who have to use a wheelchair, I seriously doubt they think so.

 

[DMRick]

Peach, did you even read what others wrote:

You said

I know it because the woman who was trying to break up the fighting over the wheelchair was loudly complaining that the kid's behavior was going to end up getting them "caught" and they were going to end up getting the wheelchair taken away.

Are you not getting the point? There is no advantage to having a wheelchair. Do you think the wheelchair "reserved" spots in shows are good ones (yeah, right..I loved being wayyy in the back..it was even more fun in the wheelchair reserved spots for the parades, You have to get there two hours ahead of time, since there is such limited space, and still people stand in front of you, as soon as the CM moves away, that is trying to stop the people from standing in front of the people sitting in chairs)? Do you think wheelchair bound people always get in faster, even though there are limited spots? Do you think it's fun touting that chair around, and trying to navigate around the masses of people? Did you ever think that maybe the mom needed that chair, and was afraid with the kids fooling around, Dis would suggest she return it, and SHE needed it? YOu have no way of knowing if one of the teens had cancer, and the chair was for her, but she and her buddies were fooling around...you can't judge on what part of the conversation you stood and listened to. If you had read above, you would see that most all of the rides take Fastpass..and people in wheelchairs need fastpass to go ahead, just like you would. Everyone with fastpass goes faster. You might go in a different way..but often that's not an advantage. And all of this aside..you saw one group you had a problem with..out of how many in the park with wheelchairs?

 

[Pirate Mickey]

WOW! I just got through all the posts and I was amazed at how quickly a thread can turn from a humorous rant on "cutting" to a discussion on the perceived need for a wheelchair as a way to get something extra. In this case, a pass to the front of a line.

Obviously there are some strong viewpoints here. I'm just sorry the "fun" was lost along the way.

GoofyDisney: I loved the story about the family moving up at SM. It's nice to see that you were able to turn a potential ugly incident into a chance to be entertained while waiting in line. No sense getting your blood pressure up on your vacation.

from Capt Jazbo
If the line cutters move right in front of me I just start coughing obnoxiously, without covering my mouth, and saying "I don't care what the doctor said, I'm not going to let a little strep throat stop me from going to Disney"

I laughed out loud when reading this one. Great line, I'll have to remember it.

 

[justhat]

So then I guess it's safe to assume from all of your posts that you all completely approve of people who aren't handicapped in anyway, whether it is an obvious disability or not, but simply not handicapped like the people I saw (and I highly doubt one had cancer as the rest would not have been amiking fun of injured people) and the family peachgirl saw (who also most likely were not handicapped as I'm sure they would not have been fighting over the wheelchair and bragging about their idea). And if you still think one of them were disabled, I know for a fact none of my brother's friends have any possible problem, they saw a free chair and took it, just like they said. That's what this post was about, so those of you who were offended should learn to read before you speak, I specificially said people who are not handicapped but want to use the privledges. Maybe to you the priviledges are small and do not justify paying for the chair, but to some others they do. Even if it means they can skip only 3 lines, maybe they do not know how many it will be or maybe 3 rides is enough to justify their $5. And yes, I have pushed people in wheelchairs there and I do not find it to be any more difficult than pushing a stroller. It never seemed inconvenient to me, apparently you all disagree. Since this doesn't apply to any of you then none of you needed to respond. This is only about people who get the chair to get to the front of attractions without having a disability, which apparently you all think is okay. Why not just use someone's partially used PHP then too!?!

 

[peachgirl]

Originally posted by DMRick
Peach, did you even read what others wrote:


Are you not getting the point? There is no advantage to having a wheelchair. Do you think the wheelchair "reserved" spots in shows are good ones (yeah, right..I loved being wayyy in the back..it was even more fun in the wheelchair reserved spots for the parades, You have to get there two hours ahead of time, since there is such limited space, and still people stand in front of you, as soon as the CM moves away, that is trying to stop the people from standing in front of the people sitting in chairs)? Do you think wheelchair bound people always get in faster, even though there are limited spots? Do you think it's fun touting that chair around, and trying to navigate around the masses of people? Did you ever think that maybe the mom needed that chair, and was afraid with the kids fooling around, Dis would suggest she return it, and SHE needed it? YOu have no way of knowing if one of the teens had cancer, and the chair was for her, but she and her buddies were fooling around...you can't judge on what part of the conversation you stood and listened to. If you had read above, you would see that most all of the rides take Fastpass..and people in wheelchairs need fastpass to go ahead, just like you would. Everyone with fastpass goes faster. You might go in a different way..but often that's not an advantage. And all of this aside..you saw one group you had a problem with..out of how many in the park with wheelchairs?

Did you even read mine? I never said there was an advantage to using a wheelchair. I don't need you telling me the dis-advantages of a wheelchair or how the system works at WDW, I know it all too well. I simply told of my experience.

When someone brags about getting away with using a wheelchair there's no doubt as to their "need". Anyone who is in a wheelchair knows they aren't getting away with anything.

At any rate, I'm not going to get into a shouting match with you. Direct your moral outrage somewhere else, perhaps at those who would engage in such disgusting behavior.

 

[JJS2K3]

I specificially said people who are not handicapped but want to use the privledges

You also 'specifically' said:

On our last 2 trips (last week and NYE) we saw so many perfectly normal people being pushed in a wheelchair when it was convenient for them, like walking around fine at other times

And I just wondered how you would know they were "perfectly normal". You didn't 'overhear' any conversation as the other poster did.

And

Odds are if you don't have your own wheelchair you do not need one at WDW, exceptions being the elderly, broken bones, sprains, etc.

Which is complete fiction

And

we akso saw many morbidly obese people rent those electric scooters and proceed to the front of the line.....and allow truly disabled people to use the priviledge of getting on rides without waiting in line.

Very insensitive so say the least

And

We saw some people grab wheelchairs on their way out of the parks so that they'd be loaded onto a bus as soon as they got there and they could skip the line

Which is quite impossible unless they somehow stole the chairs and then somehow snuck out of the park with them

You can later backtrack but it doesn't explain the statements you made above which were, at best, incorrect, fabrications, and insensitive.

You still haven't answered my original question.

 

[DMRick]

And if you still think one of them were disabled, I know for a fact none of my brother's friends have any possible problem, they saw a free chair and took it, just like they said

Well then the joke was on them, when they found out there are not benefits. So what were you upset about..it wasn't affecting you..unless it was one of those many many times you were pushing someone in a wheelchair and they cut before you.
Perhaps your brother might want to look into a new batch of friends. Of course you weren't there, so you don't even know if they were just joking. Hard to believe that these are people who worked at Disney while in college.

I specificially said people who are not handicapped but want to use the privledges.

Actually, the reason so many people were upset with what you said, was because you were making judgement calls. Since the rest of us who have had need for the chairs, even though we may not look like we need them, don't see benefits, we can't imagine that anyone would get a chair to "maybe" cut a line or two. And if a few people did..so what...the good people outweighs the bad.

It never seemed inconvenient to me, apparently you all disagree.

You weren't in the chair..although I assume now you'll have a story for the time you were. I can't imagine anyone, who has really pushed a chair through Magic Kingdom, not finding pushing a wheelchair in the middle of large crowds inconvenient and also trying to find a restaurant that the chair pushes through easily, trying ot get the person intro a bathroom, finding a store you can navigate in for souverniers, and then, if it's your own chair, getting on a bus, or if it's not, returning the chair at the end of the day amongst the crowd. I do find it interesting though, considering your take on "normal" people in a chair cutting in line, just how many times you have been with someone who looked normal and needed a chair.

 

[Matty_Disfan]

Ok, so Justhat had an opinion, and a good one, that people who fake handicaps are annoying!

So shut up about it!

I have never before read so much holier than thou comments on this board. You should all be ashamed of yourselves. The worst part is that Justhat comes back and explains his side of the story and you all jump on him...... for having an opinion that you all agree on. That people faking handicaps are bad. Instead of heeding this opinion you all start spouting off in a bragging war about who knows the most handicapped people and how you guys all feel that it is your duty to explain their situation.

Wake up! Justhat isn't getting mad at the handicapped, nor is he getting mad at those with non-visible handicaps, he's getting mad at those who fake it.

I know why you are all mad.

Those who are spouting off and accusing him of being 'nasty' and 'rude' and 'insensitive' all feel like you are the one under the microscope. You feel like people judge you or your loved ones for being overweight or for having disabilities that may not be visible. Don't punish justhat for having an opinion that makes you feel insecure.

Being overweight is a disease yes, just like drug addiction. Some in your country want to help those who are addicted, some want to lock them away. Some people in your country want to help the overweight, and some want to shun them. This puts you in a awkard situation: you are insecure and lash out at those who you perceive as discriminating against you or a loved one in a place where you usually feel comfortable about who you are.

I can't help you with that, all I can say is that this incessant ranting against someone with an opinion is mean and aggressive.

You should feel ashamed.

Please, if you want to argue with me then PM me, let this thread die. Your noise does more to polarize people against your opinion than to help them see it.

Thank you.

 

[justhat]

"Perhaps your brother might want to look into a new batch of friends. Of course you weren't there, so you don't even know if they were just joking. Hard to believe that these are people who worked at Disney while in college."

These friends did not work at Disney, they vacationed there like the rest of us do, as I originally said. They were not joking because really, who would take the time to make up something like that.

"And I just wondered how you would know they were "perfectly normal". You didn't 'overhear' any conversation as the other poster did."

Actually I did, as I posted. We had a family specificially say they might as well get a wheelchair for their child instead of a stroller since they had to pay either way.

"You weren't in the chair..although I assume now you'll have a story for the time you were. I can't imagine anyone, who has really pushed a chair through Magic Kingdom, not finding pushing a wheelchair in the middle of large crowds inconvenient..."

For the most part I have been only on the pushing end of a wheelchair, unless you include riding on my grandmother's lap when I was a child. On no occasion that I pushed it did I find it to be an inconvenience, no more so than manuevering a stroller. For parades we didn't go to the specific viewing areas as we did not even know they existed. We simply claimed our spot along the route right at a rope, like many people with strollers do, and didn't have any problems with people standing in front of us. maybe we were just lucky going by what others have said. I went to WDW alone with my grandmother when I was 16 and I pused her the entire trip myself. She weighed about 60 pounds more than me and at times the chair got heavy, but not once did I think 'wow, what an inconvenience'.

But most importantly, why are you all offended!?! If you have and use a wheelchair in WDW for a legitimate reason then nothing I said was directed towards you. I am referring to people who do not have any reason whatsoever to use a wheelchair, such as the people previously mentioned. Some of you said my wording offended you yet I did not use any derrogatory remarks. "Morbidly Obese" is a correct medical term for defining certain obesities:
"There are several medically accepted criteria for defining morbid obesity. You are likely morbidly obese if you are:
- more than 100 lbs. over your ideal body weight, or
- have a Body Mass Index (BMI) of over 40, or
- have a BMI of over 35 and are experiencing severe negative health effects, such as high blood pressure or diabetes, related to being severely overweight
- unable to achieve a healthy body weight for a sustained period of time, even through medically supervised dieting "

So please, if you use a wheelchair for a purpose, then once again I did not mention you. I am referring to people like those I have already mentioned who get one for the sole purpose of cheating. And I know you think it's too inconvenient, but they may not. After all, not everyone thinks the same, since we clearly do not since I think it's appalling for people to fake an injury yet you all seem to think that's fine. And like I said previously, and as peachgirl said, you should be angry with the people who are taking your place in the wheelchair areas of a show, not me, yet are doing it just to get in faster, not because they have an illness.

 

[nativetxn]

What began as a helpful and fun post has deteriorated into a debate, or worse, an argument.

I'm going to lock this now.