Let's Debate Over-Protecting Our Kids

[babyrich]

I do not have any children; but I see the way my family and friends raise their kids and I laugh sometime.

I was 8 when I started walking to school by myself or with other kids in the neighborhood. School was over a mile away. We walked in rain and snow. We woke up at sunrise and grabbed our bikes and went exploring and showed up back home when we were hungry. We got dirty and tired and loved it. We dug for worms, picked up bugs, and got stung by bees. We fought with each other and made up with each. Our parents didnt get involved in our disputes. If we were wrong, we were told we were wrong. We got punished for being bad and we were not rewarded for doing our chores. I was 12 when I started spending summer days alone because everyone else in the house worked. We all ended up just fine.

Now many year later, my sisters daughter is 15, she is a cheerleader and she needed cupcakes for one of the boys on the football team. (they do this before every game) So my sister was complaining that she was up so late because she had to make cupcakes. I asked why my niece didnt make them herself, she said she doesnt know how!!!! But the directions are right on the box!!!! Oh she cant use the oven!!! Are you kidding me. I was making the family dinner at that age. Before microwaves!!!!! Oh and the kid gets a ride to and from school each day, she lives 3 blocks from the school (short blocks) so my sister says its too far; but the kid is also on the track team. So she can run distance for track; but not walk 3 blocks in a very suburban town.

Children are way too spoiled. What are their kids going to be like? I also think this is why kids now get sick all the time, they arent exposed to anything.

 

[Conservative Hippie]

My kids are small, so I have limited experience with my own. My DD will be 4 this week, and she has chores. She gets "time outs" with her nose in the corner, and spankings when warranted. She is underweight and a picky eater. My pediatrician told me to give her what she will eat, and higher calorie/fat choices - "If the choice is between a banana and a donut, give her the donut. Or both." But I only make one dinner, and if she doesn't want to eat it I will make her a peanut butter sandwich, that's it. I suspect she'll eat when she's hungry enough.

I have a friend who is IMO over-protective. Once she and I were out together when her 7 year old son needed to be picked up from school, and her husband was going to do it. He was late and her son was one of the last ones picked up. She cried and cried about scared her must of been that he was going to be left, and then got on the phone with her son and the two of them cried. She was so upset I had to drive her home (and we were out in her car). She now homeschools all of her kids, and her oldest son will be 9 in two months, and still rides in a stroller at WDW. Recently a teacher at church made him cry (according to him) and she is talking to people about getting this person removed from teaching. He complains about pretty much everything, and honestly it is pretty hard to be around him. This week another friend visited us with a 7 year old son (and three younger ones) and the difference between the two were striking. This boy walked the entire time at WDW, and only sat in a stroller one night on the way out of the park. He carried his mother's bags and didn't complain about it. He was very polite and offered to help his father carry trays whenever we would eat. This family also homeschools. My kids are small, but I know which mother I would like to emulate based on how the children act.

 

[kellyg403]

I think we need to work more on what they are going to do when they hit 18 and don't magically turn into responsible adults.

You NEED to give them independence so they can learn how to be an adult. I don't like taking chances anymore than anyone else, but at 12 years old my kid should be able to walk around the block with a friend or walk the dog or stay home for a couple hours while I food shop, or go to the doctors, whatever.

When I was 12 I was babysitting till 1AM. I wouldn't let my child do that. She's not prepared for it. So I'm setting her up with a babysitting course so she can learn. I learned hands on with my nephew, who lived with us when I was younger. She hasn't had that much experience.

I think fostering a sense of independence in the child is definitely to their benefit and something a lot of kids aren't getting these days.

I agree, fostering some independence goes a long way. The reality 18 is an age..its not a moment when we suddenly wake up and KNOW everything. The world views 18 as an adult. Very rarely are there moments when a lightbulb turns on your 18th birthday and you become this magical know it all, responsible adult. So, teaching or letting a child become independent in stages is really a good thing. It may be as another posted that we are so inclined to believe in the inherent 'evil' in the world because we are exposed to it more and more each day. Shoot, in my hometown, growing up 2 girls were abducted at the mall, never to be heard from again. But it was kept hush hush from us kids, so much so that years later when I had heard they reopened the case, I had to stop a minute and remember yes, I was a part of the community at that time. I worked at the very mall they were taken from right next to the store they were thought to be last seen. I walked everyday to that mall through neighborhoods to the job. Even after this happened, none of the adults immediately put the reins on us. They just pretended it didn't happen and/or didn't talk about it. Today, even in schools we teach our children stranger danger and try to expose them to that part of life. Or use it as why we have to protect them at all costs. I am not saying that is right or wrong, but having grown up in that time frame and with a bad thing happening, nothing really honestly changed and my mom never spoke to us about it. We have gone from one extreme to the next it seems.

I do worry about things, I really am strict about the kids driving with other teens. Especially now a days with texting..I live in fear of an accident due to texting. My teens are usually the first to roll their eyes and say 'but mom'. They are teens and nothing bad will ever happen to THEM. Not sure that is a good thing, but it is time honored teen tradition that nothing bad will ever affect them. Live dangerously. So I understand that concept. My mom probably would come on here and tell you some of the stories about me flirting with danger...or at least the ones she knows about!

Independence is one thing, overprotecting your children to the point they are scared to walk 5 houses is a totally other thing. It limits their possibilities and coping skills. What if their car breaks down and they have to walk 4 blocks? Will they be so anxiety ridden by the end contemplating all the bad stuff that happens? My dh is very much this way with his dd. The CC is about 5 blocks with sidewalks all the way. She is 18. She has not saved enough money to match his for a car. So every single day he picks her up to go to school and everyday he picks her up from school. When he can't, she practically goes into spasms because she might have to walk to the school and don't we know all that could happen or its hot or it might rain. Its almost a manipulation tool at this point to guilt her father into stopping whatever he is doing. What is she going to do if someday he is actually in a position to not get her, there is no ride available? At 18 five blocks on a sidewalk..even in the rain if there is no other way..won't hurt her. She has a hard time with grey areas and finding alternative solutions. If something does not go as planned she has a difficult time recovering and finding plan 2. That is my fear for her. Its not reality to not have an idea something may happen always figure out what the best course is without panicking. I think having cells and immediate access wherever a parent or child is has not helped. I am not one to drop everything for them. If they text me without prior knowledge on my part and say I had to stay after school, I tell them when I am coming. Its like sometimes I wonder if the kids are having a hard time understanding the world does not revolve around them. That is the difference in my parents upbringing and how parents raise kids now. Just a look at the 'radical' unschooling thread made me pause for a minute.

I don't know. I believe everyone, short of abuse or neglect, should parent as they feel is best for thier children. However, once they get to be adults with jobs, please don't expect the rest of us to do it your way. If its different start teaching them how to do things differently.


Kelly

 

[Minnesota!]

As far as your particular situation goes, I wonder if the other mom was NOT trying to slam you working at all, but was using that as a way to help you "save face" so she could offer to drive, and have a reason you were not able to drive which was not that you did not feel the kids needed a ride (since she obviously felt they did). Oh, and my kid would have walked home--it seems silly to me to drive that for that too

As to the larger issues, I agree that as Americans we have a weird dichotomy going on now where we push kids to grow up in ways I think are unhealthy (sexualizing attitudes and clothing, pushing them to give up toys at younger and younger ages, etc) while at the same time holding them back from the responsibilities and privileges they should be gaining as they grow.

Our family straddles two cultures. We are Americans living in Germany. My husband works for a German company and my children attend German schools. We still have contact with many Americans (mostly here through the military) who are living more "American" lifestyles (going to DoD schools, etc) through Girl Scouts and then branching off from there into other activities with the American community as well. So, we really see some difference in how the two cultures are treating children and teens these days.

My daughter notices even little things like, one day both her class and her scout troop were needing people to bring in food items for fundraisers. At school the kids said "I will make xyz" and at scouts they said "my mom can make xyz" subtle--but a HUGE indicator to me of what we are teaching our kids and expecting of them (note this was 7-9 graders last year). Essentially, I felt like OVERALL the culture was telling the American teens they were capable and the American teens they were not (even of something simple like baking cookies).

There are lots of more obvious things too. "Can you imagine the uproar in the US if . . ." is a standard line at our house
here are a few examples from the last 6 months or so (note, things may be different in the elementary schools which are grades 1-4, my youngest was in 5th grade when we moved here):
-schools let the kids leave early when teachers were sick--no subs (true of grade 5 and up, and no they do not call the parents)
-no paperwork was sent home about field trips, you only know about it because your child tells you they need money for it r special clothes or whatnot
-kids are released directly from the field trip location, or maybe the main train station, but not taken back to school after a field trip
-the school needs something from the store so they send a student over to buy it
-kids all carry their own meds on them and no one thinks a thing of it
-the teacher asks students to bring their pocket knives to school so they can whittle
-traditional end of the year sleep overs at school have one male chaperon who sleeps several rooms away from the kids (8th and 9th grade)
-the only reason I know when they cover sex ed or what they did is that my kid tells me. Otherwise, it is just part of the curriculum and no fuss is made about it with the kids or the parents

There is plenty more, but those are sticking in my head right now. Personally, I really love my kids getting the chance to be independent and spread their wings. I think, like you OP, that learning bit by bit like this is how they grow best.

I need to move to Germany.

I hate hate hate the coddling kids are given.

My kids are 4 and 7 and have rules, responsibilities, and I give them freedoms, too.

Last night DS7 ripped his 2nd pair of pants in 2 days...I just bought them on Friday. I marched his little butt inside, made him empty his piggy bank, and give me the $14 I spent on the pants. He will be buying them from here on out.

My kids will start walking to/from school in a few years. I started in 4th grade, I believe. Maybe 3rd? We live just over a 1/2 mile from the school - but it's really just up the street, down the busy road for one block. We live on a huge (long) block.

No picking eating allowed at my house - even for my kid with the sensory issues. Suck it up, cupcake. I have sensory issues too...but you have to push through. The real world doesn't stop to make time for all the idiosyncrasies of everyone - so I will not raise my kids to think that the world will spin for them.

 

[claudia]

Okay,

So I was having a discussion about the whole misconception around stay at home moms and working moms, but the discussion has evolved past that. So I will relate my story:

I have a 14 year old daughter, a freshman in high school. We live 5 houses away from the junior high (I counted them) you can literally see the gym door of the junior high from my front door. Over the summer the school sponsored a pep rally thing for the incoming freshman, to kind of welcome them to high school. It was held, on a Friday in the junior high gym from 6-8pm. My daughter went with her BFF. The plan was for them to go to the rally then come spend the night at our house. Strangely enough someone dropped them off after the rally. My daughter told me it was "Suzy's" mom. ummm... okay 5 houses...it's her gas. I later ran into Suzy's mom who made this comment to me, "I drove older daughter and BFF home from the rally. I know you work, so you probably weren't home, I'm sure you don't want your daughter walking around at night, and I know that BFF's mom wouldn't. I know you are busy, so let me know when the girls need a ride." Now, I took this as a not so subtle jab that because I work I neglect my kids, but when I posed this to someone else the answer I got was, "Oh she was just worried. It only takes a minute for something to happen, really 14 year olds should not be out at night alone and unsupervised." Ummm... I did mention there are 5 houses between my house and the school. It's a distance of about 50-75 yards.

So that started a discussion about how children are more babied now days. Around here, no kids walk to school, at any age, regardless of how short the walk is, or how nice the weather is. At the 1st sign of trouble the parent is at the school defending them "not my little Ralphie!" even if the evidence was indisputable that Ralphie did it. My friends 10 year old son, a month older than mine, has no jobs in the home. Another's 10 year old daughter says "My job is school and karate." On the DIS here I have even heard parents say they don't make their children do chores at home "because their activities take up too much time." ...don't even get me started on strollers in WDW for big kids.... head on over to the family board for that! I have a co-worker who told me how she follwed her 11 and 12 year olds in the car when they wanted to ride their bikes 3 blocks, in a very upscale suburban neighborhood with no major streets.

The thing is we hear so often about how kids "grow up so fast" but it seems to me that there has been a lot of backlash against this. It's a really strange dichotomy to me. I see a lot of kids who have parents who hover and try to keep them in a bubble, but also, strangely, have little rules, structure, or consequences for their kids. (the aforementioned co-worker with the 11 and 12 year old... her kids stole her credit card and charged something online, she thought an appropriate consequence was 1 day without playstation)

I think kids need to start with baby steps that help teach them independence and responsibility. If my 3 year old leaves her Barbie on the floor and the dog chews her head off (that happened LOL) then it's "Oh well, you should have picked up your toy." If my 14 year old doesn't do her math homework and gets a "D" (also happened) then it's her "D" and she will walk her very hot butt to summer school at 8am to improve the grade. I will not go to the teacher and beg her for make-up work.

Thoughts? Experiences?

I probably would have told Suzy's mom "Thanks for looking out for my daughter, but yes, I was home from work and that daughters BFF's mother and I had decided beforehand that the girls were to walk home together to my home. Oh and thanks for the ride offer but we have it under control."
Who cares if it was a subtle jab or not....your kids, your decisions...don't take on other peoples crap and be comfortable and confident in your choices.

 

[ZephyrHawk]

I have no experiences (or children) at this juncture, but both me and my DH are free-range thinkers. I remember appalling one of my friends (who doesn't plan to have kids) when I said that I hoped someday my children had at least one bad teacher, so that they would learn how to deal with annoying people in power positions. Also, it would teach them to appreciate all the other good teachers out there. When I look to move in the near future, I will be looking for a place within walking distance of schools, and I will not send my kids someplace where they don't allow walkers. My kids will have lessons and activities that I think are important for young developing minds, but they will also have chores. Mommy and Daddy don't get to forego their chores when they come home from work, why should the kids? Sure it's tiring and annoying, but best get used to it now because chores are never going away. Also, I'm not sticking around for their lessons; part of the reason I'll be paying for them is so I get a babysitter for a few hours. I certainly don't want my children to break bones or otherwise get hurt, but I recognize that this is a fact of growing up, and so I have insuance.

I think back to the experiences I had in my youth that taught me the most, and almost always, my parents were not around. They gave me lots of chances to experience things, and made sure I had a good base to work off of, then let me be. The one major change I would make is bike helmets...we just didn't have those when I was younger. On a social scale, the most important things I learned were from bullies, from mean girls, from not getting the part I wanted in the school play, from pretty much sucking at sports, from not having the designer clothes (though we could afford it) and from not always having an easy time getting a good grade. I benefitted from "hardships", and I hope I can give my children the same sort of benefits.

 

[pacrosby]

I am a mom who tends to be over protective and fight myself on it every day. I know I need to let up and I do try, and am successful a lot of the time, other times not so much.

As for walking 5 houses at 8pm with a friend. Sure, no problem.... unless my spidey senses go off and there is a weird vibe... or the kid that is supposed to be doing the walking feels a weird vibe... then they could call and I'd walk the 5 houses to meet them.

We lived overseas for over 5 years, in the middle east, and were exposed to many different cultures. So interesting. In general, the local kids, were in some ways given great freedom and some ways none...they were generally supervised by nannies or drivers, all the time. The nannies would come into the school and carry backpacks for the kids, even old kids! The American Principal would tell them to let the kid carry their own backpack

Several of my European friends let their kids be way more independent than I was comfortable with. Some 11 yr olds could call a taxi and go on their way. I let me kids ride in taxi's with drivers we pre-approved or private drivers, and never just one kid, and not as young as 11, but by 13 probably.

We moved back to America a year ago and my oldest was 15. I had a hard time letting him ride with other teenagers, but I did. I had a hard time letting him go to peoples houses, people that I had never met the parents, and sometimes I had never met the kids... but I did. I've taught him well and its time to trust him, but its still very hard for me.

This weekend at a Boy Scout event I watched as a 12 yr old picked on my 11 yr old. I so wanted to step in, but I didn't, I waited. Finally....my 11 yr old took care of it himself. But it was really, really hard watching and waiting. Im glad I did. And I'm still mad at the 12 yr old

I know my kids should be doing more chores and taking responsibility for more things, but I find it hard to keep up with it. I'm a SAHM home alone during the day, its pretty easy for me to take care of all the household needs. I know its time to make them do a majority of their own laundry, cleaning, etc, I want them to be self sufficient in a few years, I need to let them be now. They do help out, but they should be doing more.

I do not fight battles with teachers, never have, but I sometimes want to. I do coach them on what they need to do.

I have never been a short order cook. All 3 of my kids eat what is on the table, or don't eat. Usually there is something they will eat... bread if nothing else. All 3 can cook basic meals, even the 11 yr old, but they should be doing more, should be responsible for some of the cooking.

I do think its a balance and as parents we are probably strong in some areas and week in others. I KNOW my goal is to raise kiddos that can take care of themselves as adults, and I'm trying to remember that every day.

Personally I think you represent the majority so I'd suggest you stop beating yourself up, and start patting yourself on the back instead . Few parents are as perfect as they try to imply (except here on the DIS of course); and few are as pathetic as many would like to believe.

I don't cater to my children (6, 8, 9, 11). They eat what I make or they go without. They make their own food if they are hungry and it's between meals. They clean up after themselves and do general housework when asked. They play outside for hours and hours at a time, in our yard, in the neighbor's yard, in the woods. They set up lemonade and cookie stands at the street corner without adult supervision. If they break or lose something they pay for a new one (or contribute to the cost if it's too high). The older ones are 100% responsible for their schoolwork and for keeping me abreast of what's going on. I do not fight their battles for them. They will have a job as soon as they are legally allowed (dd actually worked as a mother's helper last summer)

But no, they are not allowed to roam the town without supervision. They don't ride their bikes outside the neighborhood street (very busy roadway with speeding cars and no sidewalks). I don't allow my 6th grader to walk down to the town center with friends after school to hang out. There will be strict curfews in high school and I will expect to know where they are, what they are doing, and who they are with. I won't be handing them my car keys (or buying them a car) when they are 16.

oh and BTW...when we go to WDW I'm one of those indulgent parents who still rents a stroller

Bottom line is that they are still kids, my kids. IMO it is my responsiblity as their parent to assess each individual situation on it's own merits and to enable the making of good decisions as opposed to just throwing them to the wolves and hoping for the best. My parents did that and, let's just say I'm lucky I lived to tell about it.

If letting one's kids walk the distance of 5 houses works for some....great. If another mom thinks otherwise...great. I do think the OP may have read malintent where there was none. She clearly has a few hot buttons and hot buttons often interfere with one's ability to be objective.


I love a debate as much as the next guy but all the over-reacting and overgeneralizing serves no purpose other than to incite arguing between people who really know nothing about one another's personal circumstances. Unfortunately there is rarely an attempt to try to understand another's point of view, just this strange desire to belittle and berate.

 

[HelenePA]

There is a very over protective mom a street down from me... I feel so bad for her kids.. she has a girl who is 16 almost 17 who is not allowed out much... maybe 3-4 days total during the summer... her boy is 10 almost 11 and is not allowed out at all with out her. He isn't even allowed in the yard alone. She drives them to the bus stop which you can see from her house (even the almost 17 yr old!) & picks them up. Its very sad. Other kids are now starting to ask why he can't come out to play.. my kids like him, they want to play with him. Mom has it drilled in the boys head now if our kids ask why he can't come out its "bullying" him One kid from our bus stop has been pulled in to the pricipals office already and its only a month into school... I'm sure sometime during the year my kids will be in there too... its just a matter of time. My 2yr old has more freedom than this 10 yr old... He's allowed in my yard alone where I can see him thru the kitchen window and even runs home from the park alone (before ya call CPS on me its out my back gate ) The other kids are allowed one street up one street down and if they are in a group they can go get ice cream about 1/2 mile away together.. but never alone.

 

[gator75]

Oh boy a juicy topic i can sink my teeth into.

First of all i'm going to be honest I'm not a coddeler of my son nor have i ever been nor will i start. My son is 14 will be 15 in dec he is quit capeble of going to a school function on his own even dare i say to the mall by himself. He has been there the whole day with friends. He dosen't walk to where he needs to go but thats because we live 10 miles from town so that would be asking alot of his feet i guess. As far as eating he isn't picky there are a few things he dosen't care for but luckily enough they are the same things i don't like so if his grandparents or dh want the same thing thats fine we will find something else. DS is capable of making a meal infact on his own free will he is taking a homeec class in school.

when it comes to school i will not jump to his rescue if he messes up on a test i refuse to beg a teacher to make things right when my son mede them wrong to begin with. He is well aware of the consquenses of not studying for a test and failing it.

i have made it known to him if he fails during the year he is the one that will be going to summer school and not on vacation. It's his choice.

I beleive that children need to have freedoms that come with age they also have to make mistakes learn how to fix and live with them. the children of today need to be able to function someday in the world. Learn how to fall and fail without someone or something always waiting to cathch you.

These are the things dh and i strive for everyday as parents to teach ds we are al;ready starting to see a very self confident young man in our midst ,and by no means is our child a prodigy nor do i want him to be , but i want him to be able to figure things out for himself as an adult , and protecting him from the cold cruel world won't do that.

I will jump off my soap box now so someone els can have a crack at it.

 

[Planogirl]

I was trying to remember if I ever got perturbed because DS had to walk somewhere and I think it was only when he started middle school. He was 11 and our schools don't allow anyone to ride a bus unless they live over two miles from the school. We were just a hair under two miles and even that wouldn't have bothered me except that he had to cross high speed roads without traffic lights or crossing guards or even sidewalks. He often had projects and tons of books plus his lunch to carry. Plus I know how these people drive around here!

That worried me and I paid for a popular kid transport service. Otherwise I was always fine with what he had to do. His elementary school is several blocks straight down our road and I had no problem with him walking there when he was 10.

 

[kellyg403]

I don't think I would allow the kids (15 17 and 18) to walk if there were busy intersections without crosswalks. That would be chancing fate a little too much for me.

Then again, like Hambirg, I grew up a military brat, spending quite a few years in Germany. It was then, and appears to still be, a vastly different universe. I can remember being all aghast when my German friends were thinking nothing of drinking beer with dinner or stopping at the Gasthaus for one. We went to different countries on our fieldtrips spending 2 or 3 days. Overseas they are definitely more lenient in some areas.

I firmly believe that each parent has to do what they feel is best for their kids and their family. It only crosses the line when they get older and expect everyone to accomodate their style of parenting. I have friends who still email the teacher for homework for their hs srs. Would I do it? Nah..at a certain point school has to be something they are committed to and have consequences too. The first one that went to college, I remember sitting at orientation listening over and over again to them telling all of us parents, their child was a grown up now, don't bother to call..failure or success at the university was on the kids. Yes, there is homesickness and yes, teaching styles were different, they will have to adjust etc. It was kind of eye opening to me. The parent sitting behind me was speaking to her seatmate who I assumed was the dad of child and she was very vocal that she wouldn't pay a cent if they refused to discuss her child with her..she was the parent and she is paying for them to go there. I understand the concept she was referring to, it is difficult to pay an enormous amount to send them to college only to hope they don't pretend they aren't failing, because the university isn't going to call you and tell you. But, that seems to be where you have to trust you have instilled in them enough to come to you with troubles, learn how to navigate the world a little at a time.

Kelly

 

[NotUrsula]

The first one that went to college, I remember sitting at orientation listening over and over again to them telling all of us parents, their child was a grown up now, don't bother to call..failure or success at the university was on the kids. Yes, there is homesickness and yes, teaching styles were different, they will have to adjust etc. It was kind of eye opening to me. The parent sitting behind me was speaking to her seatmate who I assumed was the dad of child and she was very vocal that she wouldn't pay a cent if they refused to discuss her child with her..she was the parent and she is paying for them to go there. I understand the concept she was referring to, it is difficult to pay an enormous amount to send them to college only to hope they don't pretend they aren't failing, because the university isn't going to call you and tell you

I personally think that it is bizarre that there is a parent orientation at a university. The first time my mother ever heard words spoken by any official at my university other than on the TV news, the words were "Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to Winter Commencement." Every document that involved my college education was addressed to me, not Mom.

My DS has an LD, and he just started HS. DH & I met with the LC before he started to brief her on his situation and give her some notes for his teachers about his various issues, but we told her that next year we expected that it would be DS sitting in her office rather than us. When it comes to college I intend to "hand him his checkbook" and drop him and his boxes outside his residence hall, and I'll only be doing that because most schools don't allow freshmen to bring their own vehicles. I firmly believe that if he cannot independently handle that responsibility, then he really isn't ready for college.

When I was in school parents didn't pay tuition for you; you walked up the bursar's office window and did it yourself on registration day, and I NEVER saw a parent present at registration. I know that the process is automated now, but AFAIC, he needs to be the one that makes sure that the bills get paid, not me. I'll make the funds available, but the details are going to be his row to hoe.

 

[babyrich]

I personally think that it is bizarre that there is a parent orientation at a university. The first time my mother ever heard words spoken by any official at my university other than on the TV news, the words were "Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to Winter Commencement." Every document that involved my college education was addressed to me, not Mom.

My DS has an LD, and he just started HS. DH & I met with the LC before he started to brief her on his situation and give her some notes for his teachers about his various issues, but we told her that next year we expected that it would be DS sitting in her office rather than us. When it comes to college I intend to "hand him his checkbook" and drop him and his boxes outside his residence hall, and I'll only be doing that because most schools don't allow freshmen to bring their own vehicles. I firmly believe that if he cannot independently handle that responsibility, then he really isn't ready for college.

When I was in school parents didn't pay tuition for you; you walked up the bursar's office window and did it yourself on registration day, and I NEVER saw a parent present at registration. I know that the process is automated now, but AFAIC, he needs to be the one that makes sure that the bills get paid, not me. I'll make the funds available, but the details are going to be his row to hoe.

I wanted to add to this... again I have no children but my sister just dropped her son off at school (5 hours away).

The family went with all his stuff, they set up his dorm room. They went to orientation where they just explained some stuff. Than they said, ok parents say goodbye. They gave them a few minutes than had the freshman go to their own orientation. Than the parents were expected to go home. She said she was a little annoyed at first; but she than said, it was the best thing to just make a quick getaway with no time for long goodbyes and tears.

4 weeks later, she tells me he says he is doing good in school. She cant confirm cause everything goes to him. He took the student loan, so he technically is paying for school. She said she has to trust him. If he fails, she will make him "pay" later.

 

[eliza61]

IMost German children go to and from school, most often on one or two trams, completely on their own by the age of 8. My brother and I spend an hour and a half each way going to and from school. We bike to the train station, take the train to the next city over, take the tram to school and at the end of day do it in reverse to get home. This is completely normal for kids who live in another city than their school as we do. Most of the Americans here get driven to school by parents regardless of age.

German children gain cooking skills regularly as they grow older. By 8 they can make most basic things on their own. For example grilled cheese, eggs, pasta, rice, cookies, pancakes, cupcakes, etc. As they grow older they gain yet more skills. On the other hand last year I went on a trip with my Girl Scout troop (then 7th through 9th grade). We did all the cooking ourselves. I was absolutely amazed at the lack of cooking knowledge my troop possessed. My group made tacos, Mexican rice, and tres leches cake. I found myself regularly informing girls things like vegetable have to be washed before you slice them and yes it is possible to make cake without cake mix. I was simply dumbfounded at how little they knew about cooking.

These are only a couple examples, however, there are truly countless examples of how over protected and lacking in skills Americans are compared to Germans and I believe the rest of the world and I fear for when this generation of children who simply cannot take care of themselves end up having to. Because contrary to it seems many Americans beliefs children do not magically gain the skills need to take care of themselves the day they turn 18. Those skills are meant to be learned over time.

My take has always been the more my kids know, the safer they are. Now I didn't have the luxury of driving my kids to school or school buses. they grew up in Manhattan so I needed to know without question that my kids can navigate the bus and trains by the time they were 8 and they could.

The past few years I've chaperoned my kids h.s. senior trips to wdw. I'm amazed at the number of parents that have to make sure SENIORS have necessary clothes packed, how to use atm cards and how to handle themselves in dtd at night.

we some times do do our kids a disservice.

 

[diznygirl]

I work part-time, so I'm home in the mornings. I drive the kids to school because I can, not because I'm coddling them. I hope people don't see it that way. Just trying to be helpful.

If I stayed home and made them walk I suppose people could assume I was lazy. There is no winning in these types of discussions.

I do what I do because I want to and I don't care what others are thinking.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I work part-time, so I'm home in the mornings. I drive the kids to school because I can, not because I'm coddling them. I hope people don't see it that way. Just trying to be helpful.

If I stayed home and made them walk I suppose people could assume I was lazy. There is no winning in these types of discussions.

I do what I do because I want to and I don't care what others are thinking.

Amen.

Now where I live walking anywhere is not an option. Heck I am almost killed turning out of my subdivision IN MY YUKON. We really need a turn lane.

 

[pacrosby]

When it comes to college I intend to "hand him his checkbook" and drop him and his boxes outside his residence hall, and I'll only be doing that because most schools don't allow freshmen to bring their own vehicles. I firmly believe that if he cannot independently handle that responsibility, then he really isn't ready for college.

Clearly you have a different set of expectations for yourself and your child. And I'm not implying that it's wrong. But it's not necessarily right either.

I went to college 31 years ago. When I was a freshman (and sophomore, and junior and senior) my parents drove me to school and accompanied me to my dorm room or apartment (as the case may have been) and spent the afternoon helping me to get settled. They then took me out to dinner before heading home. My parents were hardly the coddling overprotective type but, college aged or not, I was their daughter. They loved me. Dropping me off at the curb would never have been considered an appropriate way to say goodbye.

It's not always a matter of believing/not believing a kid can handle the responsibility. Sometimes it's just a desire to provide a little parental love and support. You're never too old for that

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Clearly you have a different set of expectations for yourself and your child. And I'm not implying that it's wrong. But it's not necessarily right either.

I went to college 31 years ago. When I was a freshman (and sophomore, and junior and senior) my parents drove me to school and accompanied me to my dorm room or apartment (as the case may have been) and spent the afternoon helping me to get settled. They then took me out to dinner before heading home. My parents were hardly the coddling overprotective type but, college aged or not, I was their daughter. They loved me. Dropping me off at the curb would never have been an appropriate way to say goodbye.

It's not always a matter of believing/not believing a kid can handle the responsibility. Sometimes it's just a desire to provide a little parental love and support. You're never too old for that

I know right? I would never dream of ditching my kid at the curb. That is so odd to me.

My dd is a JR this yr and she packed up her car with dad's help of course and moved herself in this yr. She learned minimalism.

 

[cornflake]

Hmm, I live less than 10 miles from NYC. Ds13 went to the dance on Friday, with friends, then they went out to eat, and then walked home. Dd15's curfew is 11 on the weekends. She usually hangs at a friend's house, and her boyfriend walks her home. My youngest are preparing to walk to school right now (after eating the breakfasts they made themselves). They will see a lot of walkers along the way. Ds13 had choir this morning before school, so dad gave him a ride. As usual, his friends showed up here, because everyone forgot about choir. Otherwise, ds would've walked with them. I assume dd15 is at school, made herself breakfast, and grabbed some lunch money.

I'm so glad I live here.

I reeeealy think a lot of this is city/non.

I know there are coddlers who live in a city and non-coddlers who do not, absolutely.

In a general sense though, in my experience both as a kid and adult, city kids tend toward much greater independence and suburban kids tend toward much less.

Among kids I know now, and kids in my own family, the suburban/more rural ones get driven everyplace, aren't allowed to go places alone, have curfews fairly early - and their parents manage their schedules. Like the kids don't know when they have stuff to do, it's always 'mom/dad can I go X, when can I do Y on Tuesday?'

The city kids go places themselves, most all take public transportation to and from school themselves, kids go out and take cabs themselves, etc., and they keep their own schedules. That's a big one I've noticed. In the 'burbs, the kids ask the parents about the schedule, in the city, the parents ask the kids.

Never met a city kid couldn't order dinner by him or her self, or walk whereever or take the train downtown to hang out with friends, or etc., etc., but have seen plenty of suburban kids who aren't allowed to go to the mall by themselves, they have to be dropped off, call at X time, be picked up at Y time - IF they're allowed to wander around the mall, ONLY in a group, for a couple of hours.

I think it's odd, especially as the suburban type parents tend to largely think of the city as more dangerous, but the city parents tend to obviously not see it that way.

Again, I know this isn't a universal, it's my experience, though among many, many families.

 

[NotUrsula]

Oh, please folks; I was being figurative. Of course I'll help him carry the boxes inside, etc. -- my point was that it will be his move to arrange, and I won't be pretending that it is MY college experience, too. I won't be lingering, walking around campus scoping out the library or the fitness facilities or going to any meetings, etc. (Some colleagues of mine who work in a university library recently found themselves expected to give library orientation to parents on move-in day. Why? Parents cannot use the library resources unless they are falsely using their child's university ID.)

FTR, DS spent a week in a college dorm this past summer, so we have already done the drop-off drill. I took him out for a meal first, then drove him to the dorm and helped him carry his bags to his room. I was in the building for about 10 minutes, I think. I gave him a hug and left him unpacking his bags before orientation. (Most boys don't decorate, you know -- they just plug in the electronics. )

PS: Re the city/suburbs thing, in MOST cases I think that suburban kids would be getting around more under their own power were it possible to do so within a realistic time frame. I live in a city, but I work 11 miles away in the suburbs, and if I wanted to take the bus to work it would take me three hours to get there. Yes, there is transit out there, but nothing direct; I'd have to go about 20 miles out of my way and transfer 3 times. I could ride a bike to work faster than I could take a bus. Cabs are not particularly efficient, either. On occasions when I've attempted to call a cab to pick me up from work and take me somewhere I'm usually told that the cab will arrive in an hour; we have to pre-book cabs for folks visiting our offices who will need to get to the airport. My DS goes most places that he needs to go under his own power, because our home in the city does have good local transit options, and there are a lot of activities within walking distance. Going to a mall is pretty much out, though; the malls here mostly ban younger teenagers who are not accompanied by an adult.