just back...too many scooters!

[nemofanatic]

As I mentioned in the original post, I do not mind people who really need them driving them at the parks. I am grateful I don't need one. My real problem is that alot of these people don't seem to care that my children and I are wakling next to them and they think that they deserve my space. There was no remorse in either instance I mentioned earlier only glares from them as if they owned the sidewalk. These scooters need to be made to go at speeds equal to pedestrians and they need to yield. My 5 year old is not always as aware as the 45 yr driving the scooter.

These people are not all handicapped (visibly or not.) Some are just LAZY!

Yes, but people with the scooter have family to be with too. People just walk in front them which separates them from their family. Also, some people might not have a disability, but might not be able to stand for long periods of time or walk for a long period of time. It might seem to be lazy, but there may be things that are not visible.

 

[GrumpyC.Hook]

I sure would if I were driving on the sidewalk through hundreds of pedestrians the majority of which are small children.

But you don't when you drive on the road? I feel safe knowing your on the road with a license.

To the poster who mentioned that "fat" people are lazy and just them because of that just remember the average size of a person this day in age is 14. Not size 4. Somepeople are overweight due to a medical problem and are working hard to fix it. So if your so insecure that you have to belittle people like this what are you trying to mask?

Get over yourselves. No wonder this world is so intolerant. Look at what you all are teaching kids.

To those who have been kind to scooter users and who are scooter users themselves. Way to go! Rent with pride and make sure you look out for the insensitive ignorant clueless walkers. Who might not want to stop in the middle of a walkway to look at a map or take a picture!

Signed,
Going to go refill my POFQ mug at the Polynesian while watching wishes from their beach!

 

[TammyJ]

OK, I've been lurking...
Here's my take...
In our society it is true that there are a number of people who will take advantage of assistance meant for other people. But, the vast majority of people using that assistance need it. There is no way to tell unless you know someone well whether they need a scooter or not.

It seems it would be best to assume that anyone you see in a scooter needs that scooter. Why? Because odds are it is true and then you should not judge them. If it is not true, why get your blood pressure up and get angry...it's just going to put you in a bad mood. Enjoy your magical time at Disney.

I don't know how Disney issues the scooters. It does make common sense to me that they assist the renter in learning how to drive it properly. This would make their use safer for everyone...the renter and pedestrians. It does not have to be some real formal program but some basics like parking, turning radius, and how to stop.

Final thought, it seems some posters are prone to being run into. Many people posted they've had no problem, many have one or two anctedotes to share but others have claimed to be run into many times.This does leave me to wonder if it is just bad luck or are they not being aware enough of the scooter users around them and the space that they require to stop or manuever. Just a thought.

 

[go cowboys]

But you don't when you drive on the road? I feel safe knowing your on the road with a license.

Never said that! obviously you missed my point. One of the issue that I have brought up from the beginning is that there are unsafe scooter drivers sharing a sidewalk with pedestrians. These scooters have the potential to harm more than me or you walking into someone. They are made to go faster than people walk and as mentioned in many other posts, are hard to steer and stop.

 

[minnie61650]

......That being said, can someone answer the one question I've always had (and this is an honest question)? When you're waiting in line for a bus at park closing time and there are 2-3 bus loads of people waiting in line, why does a person in a scooter (and their whole troop) get to drive right past all the line and get on the first bus before the people that have been waiting in line ahead of them? We're all tired and want to get on a bus back to our resort and a person in a scooter at least has somewhere to sit while waiting for their turn on a bus. That just doesn't seem fair to me.

Yes, you do have a very honest question.I will try to answer as best I can.
The bus driver has to load a WC/EVC user before he is allowed to let other passengers onto the bus for safty reasons. Also the WC/EVC must wait where the bus driver can see them so there is anoter que where the back door of the bus would be when the bus pulls in. Each bus can only handle 2 WC/Evc's at a time so if there are more than two waiting in line the others must wait for another bus. Just remember that the WC/EVC person may be the first on the bus but they are the last to leave the bus.
Hope that answeres your question.

 

[go cowboys]

This does leave me to wonder if it is just bad luck or are they not being aware enough of the scooter users around them and the space that they require to stop or manuever. Just a thought.

Lets not forget that we are all taught to drive defensively. I watch out for you when I am behind the wheel, and you watch out for me when you are driving. I am sure that my five year old is not aware of the space involved in stopping or maneuvering a scooter. But frankly, she shouldn't have to know!

 

[In a hurry]

The other side of it is that maybe the scooter drivers are being careful, and the peds are stopping suddenly to look at maps, or pushing their strollers across traffic in mid stream, or just plain spacing out. Some people, peds and drivers are just plain rude.

I just love seeing intolerance and "Christ is my Savior" from the same poster. Let's see, WWJD, rag on the handicapped (or God forbid, those that are overweight!!)... uh, no, I doubt it.

 

[cara76]

bytheblood, your post makes me think of yet another group requiring doc notices would cut off. Those who were injured after being run down by people in ECV.

This is exactly what happened to us last week. DH twisted his knee so badly he couldn't walk trying to get DS (3) out the way of someone driving crazy on an ECV, she never once stopped to say sorry, just plowed her way through the crowd. We had already bought MVMCP tickets for the night , there was no way in heck I was wasting the money I spent on those tickets b/c of this. So we rented an EVC at MK. We started out with a wheelchair but there was no way we could do it, DS kept kicking DH's knee, DS walking while me pushing the wheelchair would of been unsafe b/c I couldnt' keep an eye on him, and DH is poohsized and I couldn't push him all night as I have a bad arm. So we went back up front and had to beg for an EVC, seems they had rented them all out that day and had none available for the party. They went somewhere and got some more for those people that needed them for the party.

Let me tell you, it was the biggest pain in the butt ever, People kept walking in front of us stopping on a dime. I tried to keep myself and the stroller in front of DH and the EVC so guess who kept getting run over (yep ME). Those things aren't easy to drive or easy to stop. And they don't get you any real perks. It took us forever to get anywhere trying to get through the crowds and not hit anyone, you just can't move your way through like you could on foot.

However it got us through the park and we were able to enjoy MVMCP as a family! However we could of enjoyed it more had DH been able to walk that night.

I think everyone needs to show some compassion for everyone else. EVC drivers need to watch out for small children and need to slow down and stop trying to plow through crowds. People walking need to realize when there are people with strollers, EVC's or wheelchairs around that we can't stop on dimes, and you will get hit if you walk in front of us and stop. It works both ways.

 

[Robindianne]

I'm not sure why I've been following this thread as I've never had a friend, family member, etc ride in or be hit by a scooter. My sole experience with them was watching the Seinfeld show where George Castanza (sp?) was trying to race one down the sidewalk, which was (she said hanging her head in shame and guilt) really pretty funny to watch.

We are probably all guilty of some type of harsh or subtle judgement of other people, whether it's over scooter use, parenting, or other item. I'm sure I am. Maybe that's the whole point of this thread: awareness of other pedestrians if we are in a scooter, awareness of scooter drivers if we are walking. Also to shoot for tolerance and assume most people don't set out to cut in line, drive or walk wrecklessly, or behave in otherwise unaware or even rude ways.

Oh, now I know why I'm reading all these! Cause I like GrumpyC.Hook's signature lines about pool hopping and multi trip cup using. GrumpyC.Hook you crack me up and make me smile. Can you come with us on our next trip?

Have a magical day all,
Robin

 

[Tigger_Magic]

I don't know how Disney issues the scooters. It does make common sense to me that they assist the renter in learning how to drive it properly. This would make their use safer for everyone...the renter and pedestrians. It does not have to be some real formal program but some basics like parking, turning radius, and how to stop.

This depends on the CM renting the ECV. My DW often uses one at Disney and our experience has been that CMs normally practice (sadly) "don't ask, don't tell". Occasionally, a CM will ask if DW knows how to operate the ECV, but usually she is just handed the "key" and told to grab whatever one is in front.

These are not difficult to operate, but Disney would do well to ask if the person renting one needs some basic guidelines in their operation.

Final thought, it seems some posters are prone to being run into. Many people posted they've had no problem, many have one or two anctedotes to share but others have claimed to be run into many times.This does leave me to wonder if it is just bad luck or are they not being aware enough of the scooter users around them and the space that they require to stop or manuever. Just a thought.

My DW and I often joke that we could easily become bank robbers if we just bought a couple of these. You would be amazed at how one becomes instantly invisible upon being seated on an ECV, especially at Disney. As many people as have claimed to have been run into or run over ( ), there are just as many who have literally walked into or directly in front of DW while she was moving or even stationary.

If the invisibility factor worked as well in the real world as it does at Disney, I could easily retire to a life of crime!

 

[go cowboys]

I just love seeing intolerance and "Christ is my Savior" from the same poster. Let's see, WWJD, rag on the handicapped (or God forbid, those that are overweight!!)... uh, no, I doubt it.

Unbeleivable! That is the most ridiculous comment I have seen in this whole thread.

No one is ragging on the handicapped. That statement just makes me furious. I have never posted anything that indicated I was complaiming about anyone needing a scooter or being handicapped. From the beginning my emphasis has been on the fact that there are too many scooters and that they are being abused by people that I do not think always need them! I even gave some examples. Actually I have posted that the abusers take the scooters from those that really need them. I have also said numerous times that I am concerned for pedestrians safety surrounded by "drivers" who do not know how.

As a Christian, I am taught to love all people, even you, but that does not preclude me from having opinions or voicing them.

Statements like yours tell more about you than they do me.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

Lets not forget that we are all taught to drive defensively. I watch out for you when I am behind the wheel, and you watch out for me when you are driving. I am sure that my five year old is not aware of the space involved in stopping or maneuvering a scooter. But frankly, she shouldn't have to know!

No, you're 5 y.o. shouldn't, but mom and dad should be watching out for her and teaching her these "facts of life."

 

[go cowboys]

No, you're 5 y.o. shouldn't, but mom and dad should be watching out for her and teaching her these "facts of life."

Of course we do that, my whole point continues to be that the responsibility of scooter safety ultimately lies on the scooter driver!

By the way, I like your Reagan quote.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

Unbeleivable! That is the most ridiculous comment I have seen in this whole thread.

No one is ragging on the handicapped. That statement just makes me furious. I have never posted anything that indicated I was complaiming about anyone needing a scooter or being handicapped. From the beginning my emphasis has been on the fact that there are too many scooters and that they are being abused by people that I do not think always need them! I even gave some examples. Actually I have posted that the abusers take the scooters from those that really need them. I have also said numerous times that I am concerned for pedestrians safety surrounded by "drivers" who do not know how.

As a Christian, I am taught to love all people, even you, but that does not preclude me from having opinions or voicing them.

Statements like yours tell more about you than they do me.

Pray tell how you know beyond all doubt that some people using ECVs do not need them. Certainly you are entitled to your opinions just as others are entitled to believe that your opinions as expressed on this thread reflect a certain degree of intolerance and prejudice toward some.

 

[go cowboys]

Pray tell how you know beyond all doubt that some people using ECVs do not need them. Certainly you are entitled to your opinions just as others are entitled to believe that your opinions as expressed on this thread reflect a certain degree of intolerance and prejudice toward some.

I never claimed to know beyond all doubt anything. Even in the quote you cited, I said that I did not "think" everyone who took them needed them. Even said that those people were taking them from someone who did indeed need them. But I do not know that beyond all doubt either.

Intolerant? OK. Prejudiced? No.

 

[mmcguire]

in order to rent a scooter there should be a "TEST TRACK"
no pun intended to see if the people that need them can use
them. If not they should use a wheel chair with someone pushing
them along !!!!!!!!!!

Dixie Landings 9/98 Honeymoon
All star sports 9/99
Off site 05/01
BWV 11/04
AKL 03/05
SSR 1st time "Home" 11/05

Not to be cruel, but that seems like a good idea for any place scooters are driven in public. Besides the obvious mobility problems, many elderly also have slower reaction times, difficulty in judging speed/distance, vision and/or hearing problems, and some may also suffer from mild dementia due to advanced age.

The OP mentioned the danger of harming innocent bystanders, but there's also the potential for property damage (like knocking over displays, running into walls, etc). Maybe there could be a scooter safety course & accompanying license that would be neededed to rent one (or drive a store loaner)? Seems it should be required to demonstrate the physical and mental capacity needed to safely operate a scooter.

I recently saw two elderly men cruising through a home improvement warehouse together, and it was apparent that one had limited experience with the scooter. They both stopped to look at something, and when one tried to move, it jerked forward and smashed into the front of his friend's scooter. They were both stuck in the aisle until someone helped push them apart.

 

[Amy&Dan]

I never claimed to know beyond all doubt anything. Even in the quote you cited, I said that I did not "think" everyone who took them needed them. Even said that those people were taking them from someone who did indeed need them. But I do not know that beyond all doubt either.

Intolerant? OK. Prejudiced? No.

Be careful there, it is a very fine line between intolerance and prejudiced. The dictionary defines intolerant as "not willing or able to tolerate" . Prejudice is defined as "a strong feeling formed unfairly or without knowing all the facts". You clearly don't, can't know all the facts of why people use scooters. I wouldn't advertise being intolerant and expect anybody to think that is way better than being prejudiced.

I am glad Christ is your savior. He is mine too. I feel that if He was in WDW and got bumped by a scooter He wouldn't rush to judgement and be intolerant of why that person was in one in the first place. He'd turn the other cheek, or heel and get on with it.

I am sorry you are beginning to feel attacked. You said in the beginning you might be callous and get flamed and now you are and its not fun. I know you were really just saying you had this experience and here is what you think about it. But you see, some of us have a whole different perspective and we get defensive and feel the need to tell you our experience, our feelings. Don't judge people in the ECCV's so harshly because it could be you one day, and then in between trying to navigate the thing in a crowded theme park you will have to remember your own intolerance and see it returned back to you.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

Not to be cruel, but that seems like a good idea for any place scooters are driven in public. Besides the obvious mobility problems, many elderly also have slower reaction times, difficulty in judging speed/distance, vision and/or hearing problems, and some may also suffer from mild dementia due to advanced age.

The OP mentioned the danger of harming innocent bystanders, but there's also the potential for property damage (like knocking over displays, running into walls, etc). Maybe there could be a scooter safety course & accompanying license that would be neededed to rent one (or drive a store loaner)? Seems it should be required to demonstrate the physical and mental capacity needed to safely operate a scooter.

I recently saw two elderly men cruising through a home improvement warehouse together, and it was apparent that one had limited experience with the scooter. They both stopped to look at something, and when one tried to move, it jerked forward and smashed into the front of his friend's scooter. They were both stuck in the aisle until someone helped push them apart.

Disney would most likely be in violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act if they required any type of "proof of need" or "documentation" in order to use their ECVs.

As some have mentioned on here, this is and should be a two-way street. People need to be more aware of their surroundings, especially cognizant at places like Disney that there are people on ECVs. People on ECVs need to be aware of the size of their vehicle, the capabilities of it and how it operates. Accidents can and will happen. When they do, both sides need to exercise patience, understanding and forgiveness.

 

[Tigger_Magic]

Don't judge people in the ECCV's so harshly because it could be you one day and then in between trying to navigate the thing in a crowded theme park you will have to remember your own intolerance and see it returned back to you.

I'd like to suggest that people who've never used an ECV try one out for a couple of hours -- just to experience what it's like to be on one. It'd probably provide a new appreciation of what those who use them live with.

 

[mmcguire]

Disney would most likely be in violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act if they required any type of "proof of need" or "documentation" in order to use their ECVs.

Although you quoted my post, this is NOT at all what I suggested. My recommendation was for a safety course and licensing for ANYONE, regardless of need, who wishes to drive a scooter in public. The "documentation" would only be to prove they can operate a scooter safely, not that they have a need to do so.

I also never suggested that WDW be the responsible party for that process; that would be ridiculous. I meant something akin to how we are required to take driver's education, pass a road test, and get a license in order to prove we are safe to drive a car.