JonBenet Ramsey - a question for those who follow this story

[CdnCarrie]

I'm not sure why it is sad? Some people are perfectly comfortable being introverted. Some people are like that all of their lives and others come around much later in life. You say he's a great student which indicates to me that he has priorities others his age may not have. It is also VERY difficult for someone who is an introvert to even begin to come out of their shell when they have a sibling who is "outgoing, social, bubbly and just an easy person to talk to." There is no doubt that this boy has heard repeatedly all of his life that his sister is just such a great person. It's hard to follow in those footsteps when you are naturally quiet, shy, and introverted.

Being a shy person myself I know for some of us it can be a struggle. Its hard for him to even have a conversation with relatives - aunts/uncles/cousins. I wasn't anywhere near that level of shyness so I can't imagine.
I mean sad as in so much of basic life is a struggle for someone so introverted compared to someone who's not - interviews, making friends, etc. I'm sure it can be stressful to be that shy and introverted. Simple interactions are stressful for him. That must take a toll.

 

[cabanafrau]

Not to mention he is a psychiatrist (or psychologist, I don't know which as I don't follow him that closely) and should have known how unethical showing the child therapy session taping was. To be able to do that shows how far his code of ethics has fallen for the fame and money IMO. He lost any credibility with me after that.

I haven't actually seen any of it. The show used some of a child therapy session? I'd imagine they took pains to get Mr. Ramsey to sign off on that. Even so, that's morally questionable in my eyes. Makes me think even less of Dr. Phil, if that's possible. Wonder what it says about someone who is so wealthy, yet they'll do whatever it takes to turn a buck?

 

[Tasha228]

He retired from Psychology and let his license lap a decade ago. The California Board of Pysch determined his show is "entertainment" and therefore no license was needed. Something anyone who goes on his show should be made well aware of.

Well, that is interesting. I agree. I bet a whole lot of his guests are thinking he's qualified to help them and don't know that little fact.

Personally, I'm still wondering why that tape was allowed to be shown and who okayed it. It must have been okay to allow it but still seems pretty unethical to me.

 

[Tasha228]

I haven't actually seen any of it. The show used some of a child therapy session? I'd imagine they took pains to get Mr. Ramsey to sign off on that. Even so, that's morally questionable in my eyes. Makes me think even less of Dr. Phil, if that's possible. Wonder what it says about someone who is so wealthy, yet they'll do whatever it takes to turn a buck?

Yes, they did. And then he tried to twist things around to make Burke seem like a mentally disturbed child or something. But, in reality, he just seemed like a 9 year old boy to me. And I was very disturbed they showed it at all...permission or not. I work in healthcare and HIPAA laws are insane so I am sure permission had to have been granted but it still bothers me that he was willing to do what it took to show that tape. Seems all kinds of fame hungry and unethical to me. And, honestly, it served no true purpose.

 

[pryncess527]

I haven't actually seen any of it. The show used some of a child therapy session? I'd imagine they took pains to get Mr. Ramsey to sign off on that. Even so, that's morally questionable in my eyes. Makes me think even less of Dr. Phil, if that's possible. Wonder what it says about someone who is so wealthy, yet they'll do whatever it takes to turn a buck?

I wonder that so often in life

Yes, they did. And then he tried to twist things around to make Burke seem like a mentally disturbed child or something. But, in reality, he just seemed like a 9 year old boy to me. And I was very disturbed they showed it at all...permission or not. I work in healthcare and HIPAA laws are insane so I am sure permission had to have been granted but it still bothers me that he was willing to do what it took to show that tape. Seems all kinds of fame hungry and unethical to me. And, honestly, it served no true purpose.

Agreed. I know Burke is not a child anymore, but sometimes it's the job of healthcare professionals to protect a person from themselves. If a doctor or pysch can't see what good this does Burke, I don't care what he signed I wouldn't be responsible for sharing it.

 

[cabanafrau]

Yes, they did. And then he tried to twist things around to make Burke seem like a mentally disturbed child or something. But, in reality, he just seemed like a 9 year old boy to me. And I was very disturbed they showed it at all...permission or not. I work in healthcare and HIPAA laws are insane so I am sure permission had to have been granted but it still bothers me that he was willing to do what it took to show that tape. Seems all kinds of fame hungry and unethical to me. And, honestly, it served no true purpose.

The purpose was to generate talk and help boost ratings. I thought I understood in this thread that they made two or three episodes out of this, but I might have mixed that up with one of the other shows that are going on about the case. I'm doubtful they had enough for more than an episode, but wanted to milk it for all they could. Believe I heard his show was struggling in the ratings and isn't carried in some places at all. Matter of fact I can't even say if it is or isn't on here. I don't know daytime TV at all anymore.

 

[cabanafrau]

I wonder that so often in life



Agreed. I know Burke is not a child anymore, but sometimes it's the job of healthcare professionals to protect a person from themselves. If a doctor or pysch can't see what good this does Burke, I don't care what he signed I wouldn't be responsible for sharing it.

Absolutely. If you want to pursue a different field and aren't going to practice medicine or psychology anymore, fine, best of luck. It's repugnant to turn around and use that position to exploit vulnerable people -- whether or not you were treating them in a professional capacity or not.

 

[msjprincess]

Not that it really matters, but was it a therapy session? I thought it was an interview by a police psychologist.

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

?????? Where did I even suggest I was part of this investigation? In my eyes if you're going to call out people who've been through an unbearable nightmare you should at least have the common decency to have solid evidence to back it up. Bottom line, there's a dead six year old and they are her family. If they're not responsible these decades of accusation and speculation have to have made things so much worse.

I'm sorry. When you said that you wouldn't take what is here as guidance of how to bring charges, it sounded like you were close to the case.

 

[Tasha228]

The purpose was to generate talk and help boost ratings. I thought I understood in this thread that they made two or three episodes out of this, but I might have mixed that up with one of the other shows that are going on about the case. I'm doubtful they had enough for more than an episode, but wanted to milk it for all they could. Believe I heard his show was struggling in the ratings and isn't carried in some places at all. Matter of fact I can't even say if it is or isn't on here. I don't know daytime TV at all anymore.

I believe it is a 3 part series. They did 2 of them this week and the last airs this coming Monday, I believe. But they could have condensed it to 1 episode easily. I heard it was a season premiere which would make sense to try to bring in viewership for the new season. It worked because I admit I watched and will watch the final episode just to see what else is said and I never watch Dr. Phil. But I won't watch any others so it was just a temporary viewership in my case and did not make me gain any respect for him. In fact, it did the opposite. I'm sure I'm not alone.

Not that it really matters, but was it a therapy session? I thought it was an interview by a police psychologist.

It may have been. Either way, it was with a psychologist and I'm sure patient confidentiality laws are the reason that tape hasn't been seen till now. Plus, if that occured during the time they tricked the friends into letting Burke go with the police then ALL of it was done unethically. It all leaves a bad taste in my mouth the way he was treated and manipulated and is still being done this way 20 years later. I am glad he has had a fairly normal life going to college and earning a degree and such because the media circus and police certainly didn't try to allow for that!

 

[LisaR]

Not that it really matters, but was it a therapy session? I thought it was an interview by a police psychologist.

I am 99% sure that the one that was done when Burke was nine without permission from John and Patsy was done by a psychologist. In the Phil interview (since he apparently isn't a doctor anymore, I think I'll refrain from calling him that) Burke uses the word "doctor" to describe the person. The one done when he was 11 says "Police Interrogation" on the bottom of the clip released from the police department. It still may have been a police psychologist, though.

 

[CdnCarrie]

I am 99% sure that the one that was done when Burke was nine without permission from John and Patsy was done by a psychologist. In the Phil interview (since he apparently isn't a doctor anymore, I think I'll refrain from calling him that) Burke uses the word "doctor" to describe the person. The one done when he was 11 says "Police Interrogation" on the bottom of the clip released from the police department. It still may have been a police psychologist, though.

He's still holds a PhD so can be called Doctor. Doesn't help that his ethics seem to be in decline over the years. I liked him the first year or two. Now he just seems like Jerry Springer.

 

[LisaR]

He's still holds a PhD so can be called Doctor. Doesn't help that his ethics seem to be in decline over the years. I liked him the first year or two. Now he just seems like Jerry Springer.

True! But, yeah, he just doesn't hold up for me either in terms of ethics. I definitely got a Springer vibe.

 

[sunshinehighway]

Dr. Phil is doing an audience q&a about the interview and the case in general. I think it clears up any questions about why Burke would agree to the interview.
Dr. Phil is discussing many of the rumors and things released by police. He even addressed Burke's demeanor.
It's clear Dr. Phil is taking a very pro Ramsey, the police were out get them stance.
One thing he said that was interesting is that someone from the DA testified, under oath, that the Boulder PD intentionally leaked false information to the media in the hopes of pressuring the Ramsey's to confess.
Edited to add:
He's talking about Patsy and the note now. They are saying (dr. Phil, John's attorney and that FBI woman) that Patsy scored between 4/4.5 out of 5 to be eliminated. I guess the scoring system a 1-5 scale with 5 meaning the person is eliminated.
Another thing is, Dr Phil said (i don't know if it's true) that handwriting analysis looks at differences, not similarities.

 

[cabanafrau]

Dr. Phil is doing an audience q&a about the interview and the case in general. I think it clears up any questions about why Burke would agree to the interview.
Dr. Phil is discussing many of the rumors and things released by police. He even addressed Burke's demeanor.
It's clear Dr. Phil is taking a very pro Ramsey, the police were out get them stance.
One thing he said that was interesting is that someone from the DA testified, under oath, that the Boulder PD intentionally leaked false information to the media in the hopes of pressuring the Ramsey's to confess.
Edited to add:
He's talking about Patsy and the note now. They are saying (dr. Phil, John's attorney and that FBI woman) that Patsy scored between 4/4.5 out of 5 to be eliminated. I guess the scoring system a 1-5 scale with 5 meaning the person is eliminated.
Another thing is, Dr Phil said (i don't know if it's true) that handwriting analysis looks at differences, not similarities.

Makes you wonder now how that false information has been twisted, distorted and woven into the theories of why the family did it. It's possible they did. But thus far there's nothing credible making it seem more likely they did it and are not in fact a heartbroken and traumatized family.

 

[msjprincess]

Dr. Phil is doing an audience q&a about the interview and the case in general. I think it clears up any questions about why Burke would agree to the interview.
Dr. Phil is discussing many of the rumors and things released by police. He even addressed Burke's demeanor.
It's clear Dr. Phil is taking a very pro Ramsey, the police were out get them stance.
One thing he said that was interesting is that someone from the DA testified, under oath, that the Boulder PD intentionally leaked false information to the media in the hopes of pressuring the Ramsey's to confess.
Edited to add:
He's talking about Patsy and the note now. They are saying (dr. Phil, John's attorney and that FBI woman) that Patsy scored between 4/4.5 out of 5 to be eliminated. I guess the scoring system a 1-5 scale with 5 meaning the person is eliminated.
Another thing is, Dr Phil said (i don't know if it's true) that handwriting analysis looks at differences, not similarities.

That was mentioned on the A&E special. Like the "fact" that there was snow near the basement window of the house but no footprints. They say there wasn't any snow near the window. The story about John leaving the house for an hour was false. None of the handwriting experts ever said it was Patsy. One said it was inconclusive but none said it was her.

 

[sunshinehighway]

Makes you wonder now how that false information has been twisted, distorted and woven into the theories of why the family did it. It's possible they did. But thus far there's nothing credible making it seem more likely they did it and are not in fact a heartbroken and traumatized family.

He talked about a few.
The snow was the big thing he talked about. That seemed to be something that really stuck with people as to pointing to someone in the house. How could an intruder leave no footprints in the snow. The thing is, there was very little snow, patches not covered ground.
The bed wetting theory was something else he talked about. I guess that was the working police theory. Jonbenet wet her bed and Patsy flipped out and accidentally killed her. There was no evidence that Jonbenet had wet the bed that night. There's a picture of her sheets on the bed with nothing to indicate she'd wet it.

 

[cabanafrau]

That was mentioned on the A&E special. Like the "fact" that there was snow near the basement window of the house but no footprints. They say there wasn't any snow near the window. The story about John leaving the house for an hour was false. None of the handwriting experts ever said it was Patsy. One said it was inconclusive but none said it was her.

He talked about a few.
The snow was the big thing he talked about. That seemed to be something that really stuck with people as to pointing to someone in the house. How could an intruder leave no footprints in the snow. The thing is, there was very little snow, patches not covered ground.
The bed wetting theory was something else he talked about. I guess that was the working police theory. Jonbenet wet her bed and Patsy flipped out and accidentally killed her. There was no evidence that Jonbenet had wet the bed that night. There a picture of her sheets on the bed with nothing to indicate she'd wet it.

If I'm not mistaken some of those very details are cited in this thread from other posters who are convinced that "evidence" points directly at the family.

 

[LisaR]

He talked about a few.
The snow was the big thing he talked about. That seemed to be something that really stuck with people as to pointing to someone in the house. How could an intruder leave no footprints in the snow. The thing is, there was very little snow, patches not covered ground.
The bed wetting theory was something else he talked about. I guess that was the working police theory. Jonbenet wet her bed and Patsy flipped out and accidentally killed her. There was no evidence that Jonbenet had wet the bed that night. There's a picture of her sheets on the bed with nothing to indicate she'd wet it.

I wondered about the bed wetting. Someone on this thread said they were wet. How can people claim that was the motive if they weren't even wet?

I've seen plenty of exterior shots of the home and it didn't surprise me at all that there weren't footprints. Like you said, there was very little snow and it was in small clusters that would be easy to avoid.

 

[JPPT1974]

Just really twenty years since this happened. And really it could take another twenty years or more to be solved or never. But Burke Ramsey from what I hear has something like Asperger's as I have that too. I can be too socially awkward. Like he is but he is or was under a lot of stress to be interviewed by the media for twenty years. Some say he should had kept quiet. But he is no longer a nine-year old boy.