Jon and Kate Plus 8 Official Thread - Part 8

[Dee77]

Respectfully---

My husband and I are not divorced.

You really cannot compare my situation with hers. He is not entitled to see them more than what they agreed to--which evidently is whatever Kate says. I don't agree with that.

But if his custody was weekends only, there is no reason it should have changed just b/c she travels for work.

In any case--she gets all this b/c she is a woman and she is mean. She doesn't get it for any other reason. It's actually sexist (and I'm far from a feminist and far from Kate's corner).

Please don't speak for me. You are the one who made the comparison by stating that "phone calls are not face to face but no parent should be judged." And while I agree that Kate get's a lot of scrutiny it is far from only being for the fact that she is a woman and mean. For years she made herself out to be the end all be all of mothers and no one else matters in comparison, because she has 8, two set of multiples yada yada yada. All the while she alienated her children from nearly all of their extended family and exploited them for her own gain and for those reasons (among many others) I find her despicable.

 

[Dee77]

Respectfully, unless you were there for filming, you didn't witness her first hand for anything.

You were actually watching it 2nd or 3rd hand. It was filmed, it was edited, it was aired---and you saw the picture. It doesn't mean you know her.

I have my opinions of her from watching the show--they are not praiseworthy and "Kate can do no wrong". I was never fooled. Perhaps it is my background. Perhaps it is the lack of tunnel vision when it comes to anything I See on tv that is NOT live (with no cutaways).

In any case--we can all claim that we just "know" based on what we see and read. The truth is, we simply do not have to capability to ever know.

Even those of us with sources.

I believe what we did see was pretty much spot on because the alternative would be that she would allow herself to be portrayed that way just to make a buck, how sad. Also if it wasn't a good reflection of how she really is then why has she been quoted as saying she has no regrets for the shows and the way she comes across?

 

[DMRick]

I totally agree..even with the last sentence!

Bingo! The truth is that Jon and kate and other parties involved each have their own perspectives and truths in the story. Each has their own side and I bet, somewhere in the middle, is where the real truth lies.

All we can do is speculate. Even eyewitness sources have their perception and biases. Im not a fan of either one of them and the only thing I believe is that we simply do not and will not know what the "truth" is. Its all relative.

Personally, Im just not one to take a reality show at face value and believe everything Im shown. Im just tired of the whining and poor me foolishness.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Please don't speak for me. You are the one who made the comparison by stating that "phone calls are not face to face but no parent should be judged." And while I agree that Kate get's a lot of scrutiny it is far from only being for the fact that she is a woman and mean. For years she made herself out to be the end all be all of mothers and no one else matters in comparison, because she has 8, two set of multiples yada yada yada. All the while she alienated her children from nearly all of their extended family and exploited them for her own gain and for those reasons (among many others) I find her despicable.

You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine. Since you decided to comment on my husband--I can and will say what I think.

Men do not get flack, women do--it is a fact of life.

HE got less flack for gallavanting to France with his girlfriend...his soulmate...

Than Kate does for doing a book tour to promote a book to help boost her sales and thus her income.

That's twisted.

(I also noted that she was mean--but I guess you missed that part and honed in on just the woman part even though the defense of your opinion all backs up the "mean" part that I had stated applied to Kate. But then, that wouldn't have left room for your defense of why Kate shouldn't be allowed to do what she does. )

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I totally agree..even with the last sentence!

I could use more of it myself.



I kid! I shut the tv off if Kate sheds a tear.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I believe what we did see was pretty much spot on because the alternative would be that she would allow herself to be portrayed that way just to make a buck, how sad. Also if it wasn't a good reflection of how she really is then why has she been quoted as saying she has no regrets for the shows and the way she comes across?

It was still edited.

Some people don't have a problem with conveying their true selves as Kate did.

Other people hide behind a persona. I never believed that she did. Which is why I find it funny when people try to say she lied--umm, no she didn't.

People apologize for how they come across on Survivor as well or don't if they were fine with it.

I find it all too easy to dismiss the parts that did show her as genuinely kind---but then folks say it was acting. Which I'll never understand--b/c the woman simply cannot act to save her life.

But none the less--it doesn't make it "first hand" information and you really should not present it as such b/c you are misrepresenting yourself. You didn't see anything "first hand" if all you saw was an edited 30 minute episode.

I believe everything I saw as presented regarding her behavior--but I won't claim (b/c it would be a mistruth)--that I saw first hand.

 

[Dee77]

You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine. Since you decided to comment on my husband--I can and will say what I think.

Men do not get flack, women do--it is a fact of life.

HE got less flack for gallavanting to France with his girlfriend...his soulmate...

Than Kate does for doing a book tour to promote a book to help boost her sales and thus her income.

That's twisted.

(I also noted that she was mean--but I guess you missed that part and honed in on just the woman part even though the defense of your opinion all backs up the "mean" part that I had stated applied to Kate. But then, that wouldn't have left room for your defense of why Kate shouldn't be allowed to do what she does. )

You should go back and re-read what was just exchanged before you jump at your keyboard to "correct" me in your supposed "respectful" way.

 

[kidshop]

You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine. Since you decided to comment on my husband--I can and will say what I think.

Men do not get flack, women do--it is a fact of life.

HE got less flack for gallavanting to France with his girlfriend...his soulmate...

Than Kate does for doing a book tour to promote a book to help boost her sales and thus her income.

That's twisted.

(I also noted that she was mean--but I guess you missed that part and honed in on just the woman part even though the defense of your opinion all backs up the "mean" part that I had stated applied to Kate. But then, that wouldn't have left room for your defense of why Kate shouldn't be allowed to do what she does. )

But JUST b/c she's a woman she gets a pass for what some classify as abusive behavior toward Jon as filmed for the show (hitting, verbal abuse). She gets a pass for being a great mom just by virtue of not having reduced her pregnancy, and she gets a pass for lying about just about everything (being poor, Jon did this to me). Just b/c she's a woman, poor me works for her. It works out about the same.

 

[DMRick]

Off topic:
I forgot how cute the Duggars were when the bigger kids were younger. 16 of them are on a road special. They celebrated their oldest boy's birthday. They have been on TV longer than I thought.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

You should go back and re-read what was just exchanged before you jump at your keyboard to "correct" me in your supposed "respectful" way.

I was respectful.

Disagreement is not a sign of disrespect.

If so--this thread is quite full of disrespect by all parties.

 

[DMRick]

But JUST b/c she's a woman she gets a pass for what some classify as abusive behavior toward Jon as filmed for the show (hitting, verbal abuse).

neither of them should get a pass for how they treated each other. Very disrespectful. Both of them.

She gets a pass for being a great mom just by virtue of not having reduced her pregnancy,

I've never said she was a great mom..I don't know too many of those. I followed Dr Spock back in the olden days, and knowing what I know now, I'm sorry I did. Being a mommy didn't come with instructions, we all jus tdo the best we can. I do feel grateful to Kate that she didn't reduce. I'd have missed whichever child would have been 'reduced'.

and she gets a pass for lying about just about everything (being poor, Jon did this to me). Just b/c she's a woman, poor me works for her. It works out about the same.

I wish I could be as sure as you, as to what the lies are.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

But JUST b/c she's a woman she gets a pass for what some classify as abusive behavior toward Jon as filmed for the show (hitting, verbal abuse). She gets a pass for being a great mom just by virtue of not having reduced her pregnancy, and she gets a pass for lying about just about everything (being poor, Jon did this to me). Just b/c she's a woman, poor me works for her. It works out about the same.

I don't give her a pass for any of that.

Anyone who does--well...is watching a very different Kate than I am.

 

[Dee77]

I was respectful.

Disagreement is not a sign of disrespect.

If so--this thread is quite full of disrespect by all parties.

So you believe you were respectful and if not than apparently there are many of us who aren't, that's an interesting analysis.

As for disagreement- it absolutely can be a sign of disrespect when every comment one/all of us makes is picked apart as if you are the only one who knows anything about any range of subjects on this thread.

 

[walden]

I take a couple of days off and the thread goes wild! Catching up . . .

I had the pleasure of meeting Carla's daughter Ashley when she was a student at Liberty University and was dating/friends with one of my students' brothers (I know it's like were sisters ). All of the above is true. Carla was an old family friend (not really Kate's) but indeed was on the TLC/Figure 8 payroll as a gardener/housekeeper and organizer. She stopped appearing on camera as a "family helper" (per Kate's request) and continued working behind the scenes. This was in the last house. I have no idea about the Estate.

WhitneyNC, youu have been holding out on us.

This is consistent with what we saw. Carla was later shown in the Yard Sale and Birthday Party episodes, but not identified, no? Wasn't Ashley also seen in some of the beach scenes as a nanny? She was in the background of some of those Kate in a bikini shots?

What happened to the rumor tha J & K were actually living separately but under one roof as an arrangement for 2 years prior to "separating" publicly? I thought that was partly true because of the rule that no one was allowed to enter their bedroom without permission.

I remember it being widely rumored and discussed here around the new house and "penalty of severeness" comment. I think it also came up when Kate filed for divorce. She checked a box on the papers that implied they had been living "separately" for 2 years.

I think Jons behavior is right on target with that of a freed abused and controlled spouse. I really wish hed get it together. He has dissapointed me so many times

This is true. I've said here before that many previously abused spouses temporarily go right off the rails when they escape from the situation. Jon's behavior is consistent with that. I am also very disappointed by his behavior.

But JUST b/c she's a woman she gets a pass for what some classify as abusive behavior toward Jon as filmed for the show (hitting, verbal abuse). She gets a pass for being a great mom just by virtue of not having reduced her pregnancy, and she gets a pass for lying about just about everything (being poor, Jon did this to me). Just b/c she's a woman, poor me works for her. It works out about the same.

ITA. The slapping was unpleasant, especially after he told her he disliked it and asked her on comera to stop. The constant belittling of him and yelling could certainly be classified as emotional/verbal abuse. But many would disagree with us.

Does anyone have a working link to the Jon's latest attorney's (List?) filing for change of custody, reducing child support. I want to refresh my memory. Did it include any language restricting Kate from moving out of state? I still think that she will try to move if PA files new Child Labor legislation.

Oh and from pages back, re. the person who went to a booksigning and was moved on by Steve Neild: If I came face to face with Kate at Target (which I won't) I'd ask her whether the PA Hearings and the Dept of Labor finding against TLC in the investigation will impact TLC's filming of Kate + 8 too!

 

[DMRick]

All of us pick apart what the other says. Everything I say gets picked apart. Everything you (and that can be general) say gets picked apart. That's what has kept this board going. We all see things different. Those for (for lack of a better word) see things one way and don't get why the other side doesn't see it the same, and those against (again for lack of a better word) don't get why the other side doesn't see it the same. Where it gets sticky, is when someone on either side makes it personal or it gets taken personal. This is just a board about a TV family that none of us really know, that we have been shown just what TLC wanted us to see, and then we watch the parents go on shows that also show us just what they think we should see, and then we all tear it apart and talk it to death and try to figure out what they really said or did, even if we didn't really hear or see it. I enjoy it, because I am stuck at a desk working with a lot of time in bewteen printer sitting.

I think this is one of the most respectful boards about Kate and Jon with both those for and those against and those in the middle I have seen anywhere on the internet.

If it upsets you, or bores you (and that is a general you) or raises your blood pressure, then it might be time to do what both Madge and I and several others have done in the past..take a break from it.

So you believe you were respectful and if not than apparently there are many of us who aren't, that's an interesting analysis.

As for disagreement- it absolutely can be a sign of disrespect when every comment one/all of us makes is picked apart as if you are the only one who knows anything about any range of subjects on this thread.

 

[MAKmom]

So you believe you were respectful and if not than apparently there are many of us who aren't, that's an interesting analysis.

As for disagreement- it absolutely can be a sign of disrespect when every comment one/all of us makes is picked apart as if you are the only one who knows anything about any range of subjects on this thread.

Your in the wrong place if you do not want everything you say picked apart.

 

[whitneyNC]

All of us pick apart what the other says. Everything I say gets picked apart. Everything you (and that can be general) say gets picked apart. ...
I think this is one of the most respectful boards about Kate and Jon with both those for and those against and those in the middle I have seen anywhere on the internet.

If it upsets you, or bores you (and that is a general you) or raises your blood pressure, then it might be time to do what both Madge and I and several others have done in the past..take a break from it.

Yeah, but honestly some are more aggressive than others. And some tend to try and run the show. It takes the fun out. I agree taking a break is sometimes necessary.

 

[DMRick]

Yeah, but honestly some are more aggressive than others. And some tend to try and run the show. It takes the fun out. I agree taking a break is sometimes necessary.

I'm sure you consider me agressive, just in the fact I post a lot on this board and respond often..but then again, I think even that depends on what side you are on. There are a couple I think post a lot, but I really don't see it as agressive..just that they have something to say.
If you are disagreeing, you would tend to think the other person is trying more to get their point across over yours. Add to what we post, all the PM's and obviously some of us are enjoying this thread. Some people didn't like what they thought was the negativity and started a different private board some time back. It isn't much fun with everyone agreeing LOL. Then you have boards that only have the other side..so there is something for everyone.

 

[3prettyprincesses]

I love this thread, both sides too! Sure, I've stepped back and taken a break at times. It's a passionate subject with Kate and the kids. We all have our 2 cents to share and I think some (not all) of us who are moms take some things to heart even more.

Part of the problem with board discussion is that it can be hard to interpret someone's tone through a post. I've apologized in private to people through PM's when I thought I spoke too harshly, etc. Even though we have all these lovely smilies, still it can come across as aggressive. Goodness, there have been times I've used what I thought was a clever smilie and then someone gets offended because I used it wrong! For instance, this little guy can mean a lot of different things! Or this one can be taken sarcastically as well as this one .

Anyhow, this thread has been chugging along for awhile now and not been shut down. I think we can all agree that the discussion here is stimulating (at least I think so). There have been people who've flown by this thread posting a comment or 2 and then condemning us all for hating Kate! If they stuck around, they'd see it's not like that.

 

[DMRick]

I've apologized in private to people through PM's when I thought I spoke too harshly, etc.

Yeah, I've been there too. And truthfully, there aren't many people on this board that I wouldn't want to meet in person in Disney at a meet (just not about K & J LOL).

There have been people who've flown by this thread posting a comment or 2 and then condemning us all for hating Kate! If they stuck around, they'd see it's not like that.

Or for not hating her LOL