Is this a change to paying dues with gift cards?

[DonMacGregor]

Gift cards are sold by merchants to stores at a discount, typically around $85-90 for a $100 card. The store then sells it for close to $100 (or, sometimes, with discounts as many here target).

But this means Disney only ends up getting 85-90 cents on the dollar (or however much they sell their cards to retail stores) for this money. If you're turning around and spending it on dues, that's essentially a processing fee of 10-15% for Disney to absorb into maintenance fees somehow.

This right here.

 

[AstroBlasters]

It is a shame for those who do what you and @Phatscott25 do.

If you can try and stock up on some discounted GC now turn off autopay and then apply them and then turn on autopay by the date needed. (Jan 15th I believe so I would turn it on 1/14)
Of course being a new thing I don't know if they will reduce your monthly amount coming out of your account or if they will move the payments forward.

If you have an income that is lumpy (sales, annual bonus, share vestings, etc) then it was helpful to have a monthly at 0% and then pay down a large chunk via GC when there was a cash infusion.

 

[Sandisw]

What T+Cs? I saw someone else ask and I asked as well and I have not seen someone point me directly to the terms that stated it.

Sorry but until I see it and read it won't buy this. People also say DVC can categorically remove benefits which I hold is not accurate as well (and they haven't done previously) based on the actual terms of their Membership Benefits disclosure. I remember all the claims that ticket discounts were gone forever during COVID.

I am not saying they can't change their payment terms I am pushing back on this concept of "they are now enforcing T+Cs". Which by the way if you go long enough without enforcing terms there is a claim the Terms have been waived for the consumer.

It’s posted in this thread or one of the other ones. But, they do not even need to offer a monthly payment option.

I’ll do the search to find it and post here. As they stated at the meeting, the intent behind allowing monthly was a courtesy to owners as a withdrawal from bank accounts. That is why to enroll you had to add the bank account and authorize the monthly withdrawal. .

And it was stated at the meeting that they are simply making sure that monthly payments is working the way it was intended.


https://disneyvacationclub.disney.go.com/home/dues/dues-payment/terms-and-conditions

 

[Phatscott25]

If you have an income that is lumpy (sales, annual bonus, share vestings, etc) then it was helpful to have a monthly at 0% and then pay down a large chunk via GC when they was a cash infusion.

This is exactly me as well. I own a tax business, so I would typically pay it off with GC's in April/May.

 

[eticketplease]

This is exactly me as well. I own a tax business, so I would typically pay it off with GC's in April/May.

Hopefully since you pay it off then you will be able to use the GC. The bad news is we don't know if prepaying now will extend your monthly withdraw until then like you were able to do previously.

 

[Phatscott25]

Hopefully since you pay it off then you will be able to use the GC. The bad news is we don't know if prepaying now will extend your monthly withdraw until then like you were able to do previously.

I'll find that out sooner than later I guess. I already have a credit balance. I paid the anticipated January withdrawal amount on each contract. It's interesting to see how/if they may reallocate the payment and/or if they keep it, will it reduce my January payment?

 

[eticketplease]

I'll find that out sooner than later I guess. I already have a credit balance. I paid the anticipated January withdrawal amount on each contract. It's interesting to see how/if they may reallocate the payment and/or if they keep it, will it reduce my January payment?

Yea I would like to know as well.

Too bad the dues paid with GC are now LLSP instead of LLMP.

I was planning to try the AutoPay GC thing this year since we are going to the land this year as well and hoping to buy the tickets on 1/12 with MMB but now I'll have to gather more GC's for that as I will be using all of them for dues.

 

[VGCgroupie]

Yeah, this is a really big change that will have a material negative impact on us.

I hope they start to also enforce the rules for commercial renting rather than enforcing only the rules that hurt us normal DVC folk like this one.

 

[AstroBlasters]

You’re likely correct about a ‘unit’ structure within Disney, though I wouldn’t have a clue which unit gets charged the losses. The broader point is paying DVC dues is a really inefficient use of Gift Cards for Disney as a whole.

The 85-90 cents on the dollar is fairly typical in the industry. I admittedly kept it simple in my original post but there’s also production, distribution, and integrator costs. There’s also incremental support costs, some fraud losses, and Disney has their own self-serve site to combine/manage gift cards that they maintain (though the site maintenance is probably trivial). Retailers take a cut beyond their own payment processing fees, too.

Where gift cards deliver value for merchants (e.g., Disney) is the redemption delay, which your post highlights well, and incremental sales.

For incremental sales, there’s 4 main flavors:

1. ‘True gifts’ where the recipient wouldn’t have bought the item without receiving the card as a gift.
2. Splurge situations, like getting a larger coffee at Starbucks or a mid-day treat because you have ‘free money’ from a gift card.
3. Discount seekers, where the only way you’ll get them to buy XYZ is if they can get a discount, even if it takes a little work, thus an incremental sale.
4. Customers who prefer the payment privacy or control of gift cards vs credit cards (doesn’t apply to some businesses)

For a DVC member who is buying GCs monthly-ish and redeeming them ahead of the auto payment, Disney gets essentially none of the benefit of the gift card business and all of the downsides.

There’s minimal activation/redemption delay for this payment pattern and how many ‘incremental dues payments’ are there due to gift cards being a payment option? DVC members are going to pay their dues no matter what. And for the edge case where gift cards really are a dealbreaker, that owner will sell (or worse) and be replaced by one where it’s not an issue.

Overall point: the gift card business has significant overhead compared to credit card or ACH payments. There are significant benefits to it for merchants (which is why they all do it), but those benefits don’t really apply for DVC dues payments made monthly.

Some analysis was probably done in Disney about gift card usage and monthly-just-before-autopay DVC dues payments was probably among the least efficient (for Disney) uses across the entire company. I wouldn’t be surprised if paying DVC dues with GCs is generally inefficient for Disney, too.

I purchased many thousands of dollars in Costco Disney gift cards last year to pay dues…. it was glorious.

 

[AstroBlasters]

I hope they start to also enforce the rules for commercial renting rather than enforcing only the rules that hurt us normal DVC folk like this one.

Yes, commercial renters probably are not entering a bunch of $500 gift cards to pay dues every month.

 

[sethschroeder]

The T&C's were posted earlier. Here is the link https://disneyvacationclub.disney.go.com/home/dues/dues-payment/terms-and-conditions

You mean new terms they chose to update to not terms historically in place?

https://web.archive.org/web/2021102.../home/dues/dues-payment/terms-and-conditions/

Yes I agree new terms they have now put in place is different. Which is why I say email them to push back on the rule change. Is anything stopping them from technically changing to AHC processing only to avoid the CC fees they get hit with of roughly 2-3% transaction fee.

1.b. clearly states that monthly payments are only available from a bank account.

1b states that is an option and what it pertains to. As we know Gift Card payment has been allowed for years and nothing in 1b states that Gift Cards can't be used. Gift cards are not explicitly laid out as an option and since annual dues can be over $500 (GC limit) this means they could not be used at all unless you have a roughly 50 point contract only.

 

[Cyberc1978]

Yes, commercial renters probably are not entering a bunch of $500 gift cards to pay dues every month.

I hope they start to also enforce the rules for commercial renting rather than enforcing only the rules that hurt us normal DVC folk like this one.

Thats why you should be careful what you wish for.

Sometimes when DVC change or enforce the rules(as with the GC) it’s not to the benefit of the many but to the benefit of DVC/Disney.

 

[sethschroeder]

I hope they start to also enforce the rules for commercial renting rather than enforcing only the rules that hurt us normal DVC folk like this one.

Thing is they just made this rule up seemingly and now are enforcing it changing something that has been going on for years.

They have basically not tried to balance seasons at all except for like a single year when its their duty to change point per/night to balance demand. As you point out commercial renting would be so easy to find I suspect (at least the major rule breakers).

 

[Cyberc1978]

1b states that is an option and what it pertains to. As we know Gift Card payment has been allowed for years and nothing in 1b states that Gift Cards can't be used. Gift cards are not explicitly laid out as an option and since annual dues can be over $500 (GC limit) this means they could not be used at all unless you have a roughly 50 point contract only.

GC limit is $1,000 but I agree you can’t buy a GC with $1,000 on it.

 

[Cyberc1978]

Thing is they just made this rule up seemingly and now are enforcing it changing something that has been going on for years.

They have basically not tried to balance seasons at all except for like a single year when its their duty to change point per/night to balance demand. As you point out commercial renting would be so easy to find I suspect (at least the major rule breakers).

Renting is allowed for up to 20 reservations per year per membership on a rolling basis.

As far as I know the 20 rule is not directly listed anywhere it’s just an interpretation of the rules by DVC.

 

[eticketplease]

You mean new terms they chose to update to not terms historically in place?

https://web.archive.org/web/2021102.../home/dues/dues-payment/terms-and-conditions/

Yes I agree new terms they have now put in place is different. Which is why I say email them to push back on the rule change. Is anything stopping them from technically changing to AHC processing only to avoid the CC fees they get hit with of roughly 2-3% transaction fee.

No, I mean the terms that are currently in place, https://disneyvacationclub.disney.go.com/home/dues/dues-payment/terms-and-conditions

I didn't even know about those terms until @JackosinDIS posted them.

The only ones that I saw were the ones that @Mommb had referenced that had a date being updated from 1/2024.

I have no idea when they were updated to include the verbiage referencing gift cards but I do know things can and will change.
Another example of a change is the use of a check to pay your dues seems to be missing now.

I certainly don't wish to pay by check but it is something else that has been modified.

Your link that you reference also states "There may be other transactions, such as payments made by check and/or electronic debit that have not yet posted to your account, which when posted may result in an outstanding balance or credit on your Annual Dues account. You are responsible for any outstanding balance due, including, but not limited to, applicable fees and/or accrued interest."

What I'm most concerned with is the webpage has no place to indicate when these changes were modified so we have to look through countless emails or look at our physical mailings to see when it actually became effective. I'm not sure what law it would be following in regards to the notices.

"Changes to these Terms and Conditions or the Payment Services
We may change this Agreement or the Services from time to time by: (1) adding new terms, conditions, services, charges, or fees; (2) modifying or discontinuing existing terms, conditions, services, charges, or fees; (3) changing the available payment methods; (4) changing the payment limits; (5) changing the requirements for the devices necessary to access and use the "My DVC" module; and (6) changing the security requirements necessary to access and use the "My DVC" module. All changes to these Terms and Conditions or the payment service take effect immediately when we post them on our website or otherwise deliver an electronic communication regarding such change, unless the notice states a different effective date. Notice of any change will comply with the notice requirement of any applicable laws. By using the "My DVC" module and/or payment services after the effective date of any change, you confirm your agreement to the change.
"

 

[Sandisw]

Thing is they just made this rule up seemingly and now are enforcing it changing something that has been going on for years.

They have basically not tried to balance seasons at all except for like a single year when its their duty to change point per/night to balance demand. As you point out commercial renting would be so easy to find I suspect (at least the major rule breakers).

The accounting system has been updated because the monthly option payment was never supposed to allow gift cards and reward cards to pay the monthly payment.

The old system blocked CC, expect for pay in full, but these slipped through. Now, they say it won’t.

So, you can still pay due with gift cards during January….but once you want to take advance for the monthly plan, the only valid payment accepted will be auto draft…

ETA: IIRC, we actually have to acknowledge these each year when dues are posted before we can access them….

 

[sethschroeder]

No, I mean the terms that are currently in place

So not really on topic for my original post that someone took issue with.

I stated to email DVC about the change being a negative for DVC Members when they are supposed to be working for us (ie not making rules changes to negatively impact us).

The person responded "Aren't they just opting to enforce the rules?"

I have simply been pushing back against this notion that it was some rule that was incorrectly not enforced previously.

I have never said their newly created rules don't read a different way. My point is they should tear up the new rule essentially and go back to the original process. This from my view is an over reach from Disney who are unilaterally creating rules for their benefit instead of doing their job of looking out for the memberships best interest.

Per your view they can then void all payment methods except by AHC. There are lots of things they can do. Here is the thing they are supposed to work FOR US not against us as we are the ones essentially employing them as a membership group.

 

[sethschroeder]

The accounting system has been updated because the monthly option payment was never supposed to allow gift cards and reward cards to pay the monthly payment.

The old system blocked CC, expect for pay in full, but these slipped through. Now, they say it won’t.

So, you can still pay due with gift cards during January….but once you want to take advance for the monthly plan, the only valid payment accepted will be auto draft…

ETA: IIRC, we actually have to acknowledge these each year when dues are posted before we can access them….

Except how many years has it been. Without a posted policy previously excluding or outlining the limitations of Gift Card payment it essentially has become a standard.

They are now choosing to change it. Which we absolutely can push back against.

 

[Sandisw]

So not really on topic for my original post that someone took issue with.

I stated to email DVC about the change being a negative for DVC Members when they are supposed to be working for us (ie not making rules changes to negatively impact us).

The person responded "Aren't they just opting to enforce the rules?"

I have simply been pushing back against this notion that it was some rule that was incorrectly not enforced previously.

I have never said their newly created rules don't read a different way. My point is they should tear up the new rule essentially and go back to the original process. This from my view is an over reach from Disney who are unilaterally creating rules for their benefit instead of doing their job of looking out for the memberships best interest.

Per your view they can then void all payment methods except by AHC. There are lots of things they can do. Here is the thing they are supposed to work FOR US not against us as we are the ones essentially employing them as a membership group.

Since it was me, the rules I was referring to indicate payments for monthly have to be drafted from the bank account

And when I read the T and C, not the new ones, the old ones, it says that, doesn’t it?

That’s what I meant…if I am reading the current rules incorrectly about gift cards, then I’ll review them.

What I do know is that you can not pay a monthly payment with a CC…

In terms of pushback? Not interested because I prefer to have a monthly option with no fees.

ETA: this clause says monthly come from a bank account…so IMO, they are simply expecting that to be followed.