Important changes to Rent/Trade Posting Rules

[DVC R/T Board]

After much discussion regarding problems with the Rent/Trade board, the moderating team has decided to implement the following change:

Effective January 12, 2010, Reservation Wanted (RW) threads will no longer be accepted on the Rent/Trade board. All existing/open RW threads will be closed.

If you are seeking a reservation, you will still be able to respond to a "Points for Rent" thread with your requested resort and dates. You may also respond to a Reservation for Rent thread, if your travel dates match.

A reminder that Reservations for Rent may only be posted at 30 days or less prior to check-in date.

 

[Tamar]

Gosh, this seems drastic. I occasionally have some extra points, and prefer to find a renter whose needs suit what I have available, rather than creating my own thread and possibly being deluged with requests that I have to respond to. Is there no other way? I'm not sure what the problems have been...

 

[limace]

I agree with Tamar. It sounds incredibly frustrating for me, as a potential renter, to have to email everyone who has points listed, and for them to have to respond to each email (or not respond, and leave me wondering). I had no idea there had been problems with this facet of the board; had just heard of people posting Reservation for Rent improperly.

 

[Dawn68PA]

Agreed. I wasn't aware of problems but of course I don't visit the rent/trade section unless I'm creating a thread to rent points. It's much easier for me to post that I need X number of points and have someone email me to accomodate my needs, rather than have an owner posts that they have X amount, more than what I need, have me email them, and wonder whether they'll rent to me being I'm not needing all their points or emailing a bunch of owners and determine from a pool of emails who would be best.

Maybe an explanation of why this drastic and inconvenient change would help clear the muddy water?

 

[CarolMN]

Moderating the R/T Board has been taking an inordinate amount of moderator time the past few months (we are all volunteers) due to the number of posters who insist on using it to do spec rentals. They use the RW threads as a way to PM or email those posters with their spec rental offer and bypass the 30 day rule for offering existing reservations. That violates DIS policy and creates unnecessary risk for those who want to rent.

Most of the offenders do not (have not) contributed to the boards in any way. They register only to access the R/T Board. The mods thought the spec rental activity would slow down after the Holidays, but it really hasn't.

The new rule will not completely stop those who are persistent and have no integrity, but it will make it much more difficult for them. It is unfortunate that it also means it will take more effort to rent for those owners who prefer not to post PR threads.

The R/T Board is provided as a service to the DIS DVC community. There is no charge to use it. The DIS asks only that you respect its policies. We don't consider those who will not respect DIS policies to be members of the Community. It is too bad that the rotten apples have to spoil it for the good ones.

Personally, I would not rent from someone who is willing to ignore Board policy & take advantage of the DIS community for their own personal gain. If they'd do it once, what's to say they wouldn't do it to me? It's not worth it to me to possibly save a few dollars and take a chance on those people, when there are so many owners with integrity that I can choose instead. Spec renters have other places they can rent, but those places either do not have the traffic that the DIS has or they cost money. So rather than work a bit harder to rent their spec reservation or pay to advertise it, they ignore the DIS rule and take advantage of the DIS community.

Again, The R/T Board is provided as a service to the DIS DVC community. There is no charge to use it. The DIS asks only that you respect its policies, and I am sorry the change will inconvenience some of you.

 

[Cmbar]

Yes, could you please explain why the change was necessary? Is there some legal problems or is there a way a "form" post can be posted for a rental request? If it is just a matter of people posting the wrong info, could we come up with a standard form that would allow people to post what they need. It seems it is much less traffic on the boards to have posts that have rental specifics and then those renters that can fit the needs (ie, dates, use year, number of points) can contact only the people they can help.

Just an idea.

 

[Dawn68PA]

Pardon my naivety - what is a spec rental? I tried to google it but couldn't find an answer Just curious...

 

[mommacat56]

Agree with all responders...this is going to be very unsettling for those of us who like to get responses which are customized to our requests for particular dates and locations for upcoming vacations. Last minute planning (30 days or less for posted reservations for rent) will be cost prohibitive (airfare is higher without advanced purchase > 30 days) or unavailable (sold out flights during peak travel periods), not to mention extremely stressful for those who plan well in advance so we can sleep at night!

I fear this will also have the effect of clogging up the site's PM/email system as well. I wouldn't be surprised to see the server crash from time to time simply due to the enormous volume of unnecessary emails in both direction.

And, it may have the unintended effect of leaving "Reservations for Rent" unsold due to the reasons outlined above. They will languish on the board and only last-minute people (not me) will be able to take advantage of what will turn out to be fire sale prices.

These are just my opinions, but I too would love to hear the reasons that the moderators felt this action was necessary.

 

[RobDoc]

Agree with all responders...this is going to be very unsettling for those of us who like to get responses which are customized to our requests for particular dates and locations for upcoming vacations. Last minute planning (30 days or less for posted reservations for rent) will be cost prohibitive (airfare is higher without advanced purchase > 30 days) or unavailable (sold out flights during peak travel periods), not to mention extremely stressful for those who plan well in advance so we can sleep at night!

I fear this will also have the effect of clogging up the site's PM/email system as well. I wouldn't be surprised to see the server crash from time to time simply due to the enormous volume of unnecessary emails in both direction.

And, it may have the unintended effect of leaving "Reservations for Rent" unsold due to the reasons outlined above. They will languish on the board and only last-minute people (not me) will be able to take advantage of what will turn out to be fire sale prices.

These are just my opinions, but I too would love to hear the reasons that the moderators felt this action was necessary.

It sounds as though you feel that potential renters have been finding existing reservations from members contacting them outside of the Rent/Trade Board - and that has been the frustration for the board moderators. Many, many exisiting reservations have been offered well in advance of the 30 day limitation.

For those "planning well in advance", reservations are readily available 11 months before arrival and many are willing to make reservations that far in advance for the exact dates desired.

Potential renters should find no real variance with the policy change since they can simply respond to offers to rent with their desired dates. Those mostly affected will be members who chose not to post "Points for Rent" threads and preferred only responding to "Reservation Wanted" threads. This change just reverses the methodology by having potential renters contact those offering to rent directly in the thread itself.

As for the server crashing from Rent/Trade PMs - there is no concern about that being an issue. The server can easily handle the Rent/Trade traffic.

The Rent/Trade Moderators would even like to encourage potential renters to report any contact from posters not using the board itself - as it has also been very evident in recent months that many potential renters are being solicited with offers to rent from some whom have never even posted anything on the DIS.

 

[CarolMN]

Pardon my naivety - what is a spec rental? I tried to google it but couldn't find an answer Just curious...

An owner books a popular time (such as Christmas week or New Year's Eve) at 11 months without having a renter. He/She then looks for a renter, usually after the popular time is totally booked up so that he/she can maximize the price charged. The owner is making the reservation "on spec" - hoping to find a customer later. This is different from having a customer and then making a reservation based on that customer's specific request.

Spec renting is controversial. Some think it is wrong to book popular times that other members may want to use themselves, just to make more money. (There have been many posts on the DIS that complain about that practice). Others say that every member has the same opportunity to book the popular times, renting is within DVC rules, and they have the right to maximize their rental revenue.

The DIS policymakers have decided not to support spec renting. That policy is not up for debate.

 

[culli]

I just want to thank the moderators for supporting the forums and understand it is volunteer time and support your choice. I have used the rent/trade board a few times to get pts. It worked great so thank you for the offering. I'm also glad you are not supporting the "spec rental", I know it is a controversial topic. I personally feel it goes against the spirit of what is allowed in DVC or any TS for that matter. It is the give an inch take a mile philosophy, this is MY OPINION only and don't want to start a war. Just want to thank the moderators for all their work!

 

[LindaBabe]

I just want to thank the moderators for supporting the forums and understand it is volunteer time and support your choice. I have used the rent/trade board a few times to get pts. It worked great so thank you for the offering. I'm also glad you are not supporting the "spec rental", I know it is a controversial topic. I personally feel it goes against the spirit of what is allowed in DVC or any TS for that matter. It is the give an inch take a mile philosophy, this is MY OPINION only and don't want to start a war. Just want to thank the moderators for all their work!

I agree with Culli, 100%. It sure would be nice if you could just ban the offenders, though.

 

[Chuck S]

I agree with Culli, 100%. It sure would be nice if you could just ban the offenders, though.

Unfortunately, the damage is already done before they are banned from the R/T Board.

So there were no easy solutions. It was extremely frustrating, as often they would be reposting immediately upon receiving a warning or infraction points. And removing their access only from the R/T Board, while allowing access to the remainder of the DIS is a manual process, unlike the auto penalties associated with cumulative infraction point totals.

As it was primarily the Reservation Wanted posts/threads that were attracting the spec renters, we feel our best option is to not have RW threads. This in no way is meant to imply that the the original posters of the RW threads were to blame, it was the spec renters that were responding to those posts.

 

[CarolMN]

I agree with Culli, 100%. It sure would be nice if you could just ban the offenders, though.

Unfortunately, the damage is already done before they are banned from the R/T Board.........

Doubt we got them all, but many of them were banned. But it seemed like we were trying to empty the sea with a bucket, LOL.

 

[Cmbar]

I agree also with Culli! Thank you moderators for all you do and I also agree it would be nice to have a way to block the offenders instead!

The bad apples definately spoil it for everybody.

 

[sandieb]

Hooray! I am so glad to hear of the policy change. I don't mind people renting points if they have extra they can't bank, but it was frustrating to see prime reservations being hawked online! Thanks for making the change.
Sandie

 

[WelcomeHome]

Congratulations, moderators! Thank you for protecting the vast majority of the DISboard community that plays by the rules!

I sincerely appreciate the many hours of volunteer work and believe this change represents a small price to pay in order to deter the unfair practice of "spec rentals."

I have rented my points on several occasions and it has always been a mutually beneficial expierence - I have never felt "inconvenienced" by rules designed to maintain a fair playing field. The purpose of the DISboards is to enhance our Disney experience - we should do whatever it takes to protect our community from unscrupulous wolves looking to drain our resources and score an excessive profit any way they can. Keep up the good work!

Best wishes,
Dave

 

[bookwormde]

I can certainly see how trying to “weed out” the spec “reservers” would be a really time consuming job so I understand and support the moderators on there difficult decision. It will take a little more effort for those renting, but I guess that is part of the process. I am just glad there is a “safe” (or at least as safe a practical) place to find people to rent and transfer from and with.

bookwormde

 

[PSC]

Good thread. Thank you Mods for your patient explanations to our questions. This isn't the first policy change that the DIS boards have made since I've been a member. DVC could learn a lot about announcing change and handling feedback from you. Keep up the good work!

 

[Tamar]

I, too, appreciate everything the mods have done and continue to do. It's a shame that the spec renters were abusing the system. I suspect they will still respond to replies to the "points for rent" posts through PMs, but it will be more time consuming to find their prey. Maybe after they all go away we can get back to a more open forum.....