If Disney world closes

[mickeychickie]

I think the fact that MS is being allowed to do what they are is wonderful. But we shouldn’t always expect it will happen.

As you said, having the parks isn’t guaranteed and they could have held to the rules.

Very true, but you have to consider, which I'm sure they do, that 1) when they sell you the idea of DVC they use the parks as their "hard sell".. and 2) they want to keep their member base and word of mouth for new members is vital - so I think that's also a driving force to do right by your members I'm sure the last thing they would want is a mass exodus of members cancelling their contracts - plus they are DISNEY - they will do right by us anyway

 

[Sandisw]

Very true, but you have to consider, which I'm sure they do, that 1) when they sell you the idea of DVC they use the parks as their "hard sell".. and 2) they want to keep their member base and word of mouth for new members is vital - so I think that's also a driving force to do right by your members I'm sure the last thing they would want is a mass exodus of members cancelling their contracts - plus they are DISNEY - they will do right by us anyway

I think the thing is that all of what is happening could impact the system more than people realize. It isn’t really Disney allowing this...it is the us, as owners, who have given DVC the ability to make changes like this on our behalf,

So, yes, they are making exceptions, and it is a good thing. Down the road, points that were put back might overload the system, and members can no get rooms and lose points anyway.

Not trying to be a downer and am myself hoping to capitalize on the removal of holding, but if they weren’t offering that, I would have found a way to figure it out.

 

[Sandisw]

Ok, so here is another dilema... if points expire at the end of this month, and you already have a reservation, what are the odds they will wave the expiration date and let you reserve in the future with those points?? I tried calling to find out but the lines are busy and i wonder if the DO, will they let you book it yourself without having to go through them??

If the points expire because they are banked, they are not allowing them to be moved or re-banked.

If the points are just beyond your banking window, but are current UY points, they have been allowing them to still be banked,

If the points are borrowed, they have in some cases, put them back to original UY, and in some cases, I have read they have not,

So, it depends really, on why they are expiring

 

[TraderSamWDW]

I EXPECT disney will do what they can to be as accommodating as possible. The question is if they can mathematically handle the excess points in the future. Normally I would say the impact on their profits would steer them otherwise, but now....those profits are nothing with parks closed and cruise ships sitting in port, and paying cast members. They are losing so much $$$, that I would think being generous to dvc members would be a great customer relations move that basically costs pennies in this grand scheme.

 

[bakerworld]

Another forum is reporting that DVC is returning points are regular - not borrowed/banked/holding - and the points can be banked into the next year as they are 'regular' points. Sounds pretty amazing to me.

 

[Jelly563]

We were there for hurricane Matt. no refunds no accommodations made nothing. in fact, since we had to extend our stay (hotel near Disney Springs) they wouldn't even offer magic express because our check out day was expired.

 

[Sandisw]

I EXPECT disney will do what they can to be as accommodating as possible. The question is if they can mathematically handle the excess points in the future. Normally I would say the impact on their profits would steer them otherwise, but now....those profits are nothing with parks closed and cruise ships sitting in port, and paying cast members. They are losing so much $$$, that I would think being generous to dvc members would be a great customer relations move that basically costs pennies in this grand scheme.

But remember DVC is a timeshare so it has nothing to do with that. I think they are doing this now because it makes sense.

They also have the ability per our contract to suspend banking and borrowing in the future so it may be, since they know that, if what they do for this becomes an issue, there is a way for wthem help alleviate it down the road

 

[sethschroeder]

I would think being generous to dvc members would be a great customer relations move that basically costs pennies in this grand scheme.

Except you are being generous to 4.3% of the membership at the expense of the rest of the membership unless you open up cash booking rooms to points based bookings.

Where did I get the 4.3%? Its the 16 days worth of points where they are currently planned on being closed out of 365 days in the year.

I am not saying they shouldn't do anything but I am also not saying they should do something as I have no clue what options they have at their disposal.

My idea likely would be a refund of the MFs and possibly $1/point given in a gift card for every point that is lost. This would require you to not use the points though and basically have them transferred out of your account.

Waiving expirations, banking dates, holding, and everything else is not fair to the other 94.7% of membership unless Disney is again moving cash based rooms in to the points booking pool of room.

 

[CarolMN]

I think the fact that MS is being allowed to do what they are is wonderful. But we shouldn’t always expect it will happen.

As you said, having the parks isn’t guaranteed and they could have held to the rules.

Very true, but you have to consider, which I'm sure they do, that 1) when they sell you the idea of DVC they use the parks as their "hard sell".. and 2) they want to keep their member base and word of mouth for new members is vital - so I think that's also a driving force to do right by your members I'm sure the last thing they would want is a mass exodus of members cancelling their contracts - plus they are DISNEY - they will do right by us anyway

I think the thing is that all of what is happening could impact the system more than people realize. It isn’t really Disney allowing this...it is the us, as owners, who have given DVC the ability to make changes like this on our behalf,

So, yes, they are making exceptions, and it is a good thing. Down the road, points that were put back might overload the system, and members can no get rooms and lose points anyway.

Not trying to be a downer and am myself hoping to capitalize on the removal of holding, but if they weren’t offering that, I would have found a way to figure it out.

Except you are being generous to 4.3% of the membership at the expense of the rest of the membership unless you open up cash booking rooms to points based bookings.

Where did I get the 4.3%? Its the 16 days worth of points where they are currently planned on being closed out of 365 days in the year.

I am not saying they shouldn't do anything but I am also not saying they should do something as I have no clue what options they have at their disposal.

My idea likely would be a refund of the MFs and possibly $1/point given in a gift card for every point that is lost. This would require you to not use the points though and basically have them transferred out of your account.

Waiving expirations, banking dates, holding, and everything else is not fair to the other 94.7% of membership unless Disney is again moving cash based rooms in to the points booking pool of room.

To continue this convesation:

IMO, Disney/DVC is being generous about cancellations because it is the Members who will bear the expense, not Disney. Those Members getting points back should be grateful to the other DVC Members, not MS. There are now more points in the system than availability can handle. Everyone is going to find it more difficult to use their points as a result.

I am not opposed to this - it makes sense to spread the pain over a larger group. But it does bother me that MS/DVC/Disney is getting credit and that some seem to be assuming that Disney is bearing the cost of the decision to refund. They are bearing the cost for the lost business at their cash resorts/hotels, but we members are paying for DVC's willingness to waive the normal rules for cancelling & rescheduling point reservations.

We are not guaranteed that the parks will be open or even exist. Nor should we expect to be held harmless for events that are out of our control, especially when we choose not to purchase insurance.

JMHO. YMMV.

 

[TraderSamWDW]

Except you are being generous to 4.3% of the membership at the expense of the rest of the membership unless you open up cash booking rooms to points based bookings.

Where did I get the 4.3%? Its the 16 days worth of points where they are currently planned on being closed out of 365 days in the year.

I am not saying they shouldn't do anything but I am also not saying they should do something as I have no clue what options they have at their disposal.

My idea likely would be a refund of the MFs and possibly $1/point given in a gift card for every point that is lost. This would require you to not use the points though and basically have them transferred out of your account.

Waiving expirations, banking dates, holding, and everything else is not fair to the other 94.7% of membership unless Disney is again moving cash based rooms in to the points booking pool of room.

What can I say, I'm a generous person. And it would have to be at their expense(lost breakage income, etc) not the owners. And I did say if the math allowed it,my implication that it would not affect future availability.
Of course the parks could be closed even longer, who knows.

 

[Spridell]

Just got the email that says ALL points used will be returned to current Use Year and NOT holding account and NOT forfeited.

 

[TraderSamWDW]

Note that, should you decide to cancel an impacted Disneyland Resort or Walt Disney World Resort stay – by phone or online, vacation points used for that resort reservation will be returned to your current use year, meaning they will not be placed in a holding account or forfeited. Similarly, cancelling an impacted Disney Collection reservation will return those reservation points to you immediately for your future use as reservation points.

 

[TraderSamWDW]

The should eat this out of breakage

 

[sethschroeder]

What can I say, I'm a generous person. And it would have to be at their expense(lost breakage income, etc) not the owners. And I did say if the math allowed it,my implication that it would not affect future availability.
Of course the parks could be closed even longer, who knows.

Except what they are doing right now will impact future availability.

I know this is harsh but this is why you get travel insurance. Instead now others are impacted because of a subset. Will this now apply to all future instances of park closures such as a hurricane? I know it is 100% not the same but in both instances parks and closed and many do not want to travel to WDW.

The should eat this out of breakage

Breakage doesn't directly come in to play though and from what I understand Disney can proactively grab extra rooms that are likely to not be rented based on the past (which I doubt they have to account for these extra points being put back in to the system). If you typically book a 1BR but now because extra points you were refunded you take a 2BR or a 1BR for twice as long at your home resorts someone else is shut out if you got in before them at 11 months.

The only reason I am not actually mad about this is because in all honestly its unlikely to really have an impact except on those who want to sleep around.

I 100% agree with this:

Those Members getting points back should be grateful to the other DVC Members, not MS.

 

[bobbiwoz]

There is an email regarding present situation!

 

[TraderSamWDW]

Except what they are doing right now will impact future availability.

I know this is harsh but this is why you get travel insurance. Instead now others are impacted because of a subset. Will this now apply to all future instances of park closures such as a hurricane? I know it is 100% not the same but in both instances parks and closed and many do not want to travel to WDW.



Breakage doesn't directly come in to play though and from what I understand Disney can proactively grab extra rooms that are likely to not be rented based on the past (which I doubt they have to account for these extra points being put back in to the system). If you typically book a 1BR but now because extra points you were refunded you take a 2BR or a 1BR for twice as long at your home resorts someone else is shut out if you got in before them at 11 months.

The only reason I am not actually mad about this is because in all honestly its unlikely to really have an impact except on those who want to sleep around.

I 100% agree with this:

I fail to see how if Disney takes points that are broken and leaves then I'm inventory for members, how it can not absorb the refunded points. But maybe I don't know better.

I do know who wins with insurance though,....negative expected value!
Also, doesn't Disney only sell 51 weeks?

 

[sethschroeder]

I do know who wins with insurance though,....negative expected value!

Well people are talking about losing $3-$4k on vacation rentals right now and they likely could have gotten a policy for less than $200? It would take 15-20 years to even out if it was $200.

I fail to see how if Disney takes points that are broken and leaves then I'm inventory for members, how it can not absorb the refunded points.

I am saying they won't do that though because how do they know anyone will book those rooms that they leave behind which also hurts DVC members since that could have went to likely offset some MFs everyone pays. Also those broken points will be for rooms that people likely don't want (Bungalows) or for times that people don't want (mid-July).

The people cancelling right now (for spring break) are likely going to try and book during another high season with more points thus taking inventory out of the system that others might have gotten.

If they are doing this it would be good if they discounted the point requirement for last second booking while the parks stay closed. Possibly locals could at least get a cheaper room and it would help use some of the points pool.

 

[TraderSamWDW]

Well people are talking about losing $3-$4k on vacation rentals right now and they likely could have gotten a policy for less than $200? It would take 15-20 years to even out if it was $200.



I am saying they won't do that though because how do they know anyone will book those rooms that they leave behind which also hurts DVC members since that could have went to likely offset some MFs everyone pays. Also those broken points will be for rooms that people likely don't want (Bungalows) or for times that people don't want (mid-July).

The people cancelling right now (for spring break) are likely going to try and book during another high season with more points thus taking inventory out of the system that others might have gotten.

If they are doing this it would be good if they discounted the point requirement for last second booking while the parks stay closed. Possibly locals could at least get a cheaper room and it would help use some of the points pool.

The expected value on an insurance policy is negative for the insured, positive for the insurer. Its the house and the gambler. In the long run, you WILL lose. Your 200 dollar example illustrates a 20 to 1 payout 200 gets you 4000. Insurance companies know there odd are 30 to 1. Insurance companies MAKE money, they don't lose it. That means the customer loses it.


Disney is being generous in every way.. they just expended annual passes. The refunded cruise fares and cash rooms. They are paying their cast members! This isn't the one and only place there is generosity. They could have not refunded cash rooms canceled less than 4 days out.

But they are being generous here because it doesn't cost them???? That's the reason???? I wonder if royal Caribbeans crews are getting paid

 

[sethschroeder]

Disney is being generous in every easy.. they just expended annual passes

Except Disney is giving away everyone elses value on the DVC side.

The expected value on an insurance policy is negative for the insured, positive for the insurer. Its the house and the gambler. In the long run, you WILL lose. Your 200 dollar example illustrates a 20 to 1 payout 200 gets you 4000. Insurance companies know there odd are 30 to 1. Insurance companies MAKE money, they don't lose it. That means the customer loses it.

And thats the risk you take. Its not my fault you did or did not get insurance on your trip. Yes this is different but what about when there is a hurricane in the future? What if you get really sick last minute. Will they extend this generous new policy to them as well.

It is what it is but I am just calling it like I see it. Like I said if Disney wanted to do something they could easily pay off those who have a reservation or offer to rebook for another time on the cash side for the same number of nights. They didn't though they removed the rule book which was there to protect against unused rooms.

They should also proactively put it out there that in 30 days time if they keep the parks shut they are not extending this policy out as those people should cancel now as well.

 

[DebbieB]

I have a stay at Riviera 4/19 - 4/25. I was looking online today thinking if they extend the close and are closed on my dates, maybe I could move it to May. There is nothing in May. April has a lot of availability, assuming from people who cancelled.

Regarding the email, I have a question of the definition of "returned to current use year". I have April use year, so if I had a March reservation, my current use year would be 2019.