I Understand Why Animals/Birds Kick Out Their Young

[Robinrs]

You are SO sweet, my Mom would've had him for lunch.

If he's working that many hours it's time for him to be on his own. As for the gf, a grown man living with his parents would ONLY be a turn on for a 22yo girl. A real woman would've sent him packing.

Don't be an enabler, he knows exactly how much he can get away with, ESPECIALLY the deductible. Real men take care of their expenses when they are working, not sponge on Mama.

Sorry, that bird would've had to find his wings by now. I believe in tough love.

You seem to be a great person and I've admired all of your posts, I don't want anyone taking advantage of you...

 

[dakcp2001]

There is a fine line between "helping" and "enabling" and you are dangerously close right now! I am certain if his girlfriend needed 100 bucks, he would come up with it.

Here is what you need to do:

Give a FIRM date that you will begin charging rent, and stick to it. Make the rent enough to make him want to find his own place quicker. Do not "give him a break" on the rent if he has a bad week, you need to make him pay it. You can put it into a savings account or whatever and figure out how to spend the money later, but he needs to have some sort of adult responsibility.Stop being such a softy!


Does he pay for gas? Does he contribute to the household at all, or is he just coasting? With the amount of hours he is working, he can afford to pay a 100 deductable.

 

[wvjules]

So he's only been there for 3 weeks or so? That hardly sounds like enabling him. He's barely gotten 2 paychecks. What is he doing to bleed you dry in that short of a period of time? He definately should have paid the deductible though.

 

[Mkrop]

Hmmm ... he doesn't sound like a bad kid to me . Honestly, I think that your "last straw" was actually a very nice of him to do. I'm glad that he agreed to pick her up and not allow her to drive home drunk.

I think you need to sit and think about what is really bothering you. I'm having a hard time trying to figure how how he's "sucking you dry" in only 2-3 short weeks. I don't think it's the car since it's old and has tons of miles on it and you obviously don't need it yourself. It's not that he's in your basement playing x-box and eating you out of house and home because he's working 60 hours a week.

If it's really the GF, I have to tell you that you can't control that. All the dating rules (for a 34 year old!) in the world won't help and they will, in fact, push him toward her even faster.

I think the best course of action is to come up with a plan on getting him back on his feet and on his own again. It sounds like he is doing a great job at it now so I don't think you'll have a long time to wait. {{hugs}}

I agree with this post. To me he seems like he is doing the best he can, not sponging. I think you have isssues about the GF.


I also think from some of your other posts that you and your DH have gotten use to the empty nest and really dont like having the kids back there, and that is ok. I think your son was the one sho took the older ones hunting and left you with the 4 year old, and you said it was too much to handle.

I think you are struggling with your desire to help and the freedom you like just being the two of you. Talk with your DS and tell him that you need to come up with a better game plan. No need to be confrontational YET. Just have a grownup conversation with him about yours and his expectations of your new living (yet temporary) living arrangements.

 

[holycow]

I haven't read any other replys but I just want to send you a hug.

We too have an older child who 'lives out on her own' but always seems to need help and ends up using our resourses.


It is time to say NO. It is time to say you have "blank' time period to be out.
He can get a used car for CHEAP and finance it. I'm talking 1000 bucks whatever...take the bus...


Good luck! HUGS....been there done that and still have 3 more to go!!!!!!
(they are very young though...4, 11)

 

[eliza61]

As well as her love for drinking and partying. We just don't feel she's really ready for a relationship with our son. Of course we don't say anything to him, because that is really none of our business...until he is taking my car at 2:00 in the morning to pick her up because she's too drunk to drive
It's just so hard to know how much to say, without alienating him. I mean, we don't want him to be mad, but we know we're going to have to make some rules before things get any more out of hand than they already are.

Unfortunatley Grandma, some times tough love is the answer. and there's a reason why it's called tough love. We love our children even when they act like collosal self absorbed idiots.

An coworker of my dh's had to put his adult son out of his house (and called the cops on him, how horrible must that have been) due to drug and alcohol abuse. I ran into his wife a few weeks later and offered my condolences on that. You know what she said, she said that as sad as it was, she felt like a huge weight was lifted off her shoulders. that only when he hit rock botton did he begin to change.
some times our loving our kids so much is not what is best for them.

 

[Silent1CB]

Please, for his sake, please remove the exact name & location of where he worked for 5 mths. Any future employers looking at his resume could easily google that & find this thread & anything else you've said about him and might lead him to not getting the job.

Never ever a good idea to give exact location & job title. Information none of us needed to know.

 

[wdwfan16]

Yes, we have met her a few times. She seems nice, that's not the problem. She's just so very immature. She is only 22 and already has 2 children (I think they are 5 and 4 or something like that) from a previous relationship (she had her first child when she was still in high school). But it seems like other people (the children's father, her own father, her own mother, babysitters, etc.) have her children more than she does herself so that bothers us.

As well as her love for drinking and partying. We just don't feel she's really ready for a relationship with our son. Of course we don't say anything to him, because that is really none of our business...until he is taking my car at 2:00 in the morning to pick her up because she's too drunk to drive home.

It just seems like he's not thinking with the head that he has on his shoulders, if you know what I mean. She says jump, he says how high? With him working such long hours he needs his sleep.

And the age difference wouldn't bother me in the slightest, if she were more mature. Heck, our 16 year old granddaughter has more maturity than this new girlfriend does....sigh...

It's just so hard to know how much to say, without alienating him. I mean, we don't want him to be mad, but we know we're going to have to make some rules before things get any more out of hand than they already are.

I would not be too quick to judge her on this. Your son just turned 34 and he has a 16, 14 and 4 year old. That means he has 2 kid that were 4 and 2 when he was 22. He most likely still in high school when he had his first.

Isn't this the same son who has been living with you when he came to visit the kids?

 

[MIGrandma]

Hmmm ... he doesn't sound like a bad kid to me . Honestly, I think that your "last straw" was actually a very nice of him to do. I'm glad that he agreed to pick her up and not allow her to drive home drunk.

I think you need to sit and think about what is really bothering you. I'm having a hard time trying to figure how how he's "sucking you dry" in only 2-3 short weeks. I don't think it's the car since it's old and has tons of miles on it and you obviously don't need it yourself. It's not that he's in your basement playing x-box and eating you out of house and home because he's working 60 hours a week.

If it's really the GF, I have to tell you that you can't control that. All the dating rules (for a 34 year old!) in the world won't help and they will, in fact, push him toward her even faster.

I think the best course of action is to come up with a plan on getting him back on his feet and on his own again. It sounds like he is doing a great job at it now so I don't think you'll have a long time to wait. {{hugs}}

It was the "last straw" because I feel he doesn't need to be having his sleep interrupted at 2:00 in the morning because his girlfriend is so irresponsible that she drinks too much to drive herself home. Plus she was at her best friend's house doing the drinking, so why not just crash on her couch until morning and then drive herself home and not feel she has to call and wake up my son so he can get out and go take her home? This is just one of the reasons I feel she is very immature.

Where did I say I didn't need my vehicle? Granted, I don't need it every day but in the past couple of weeks I have had several doctor appointments so therefore have to drive DH's truck and I much prefer driving my own car over that. It's the extra miles he's putting on it (yes, he pays for the gas) that are starting to bother us. And yes, it's an older vehicle with a lot of miles on it but it's PAID FOR and we really don't want another car payment for awhile.

And "sucking us dry" is not just from the past 3 weeks. When he decided to go to trucking school he needed to take out a loan for $6500 to do so, but he has poor credit so he asked his Dad to co-sign. He said the loan payments would be automatically deducted from his paychecks, so he would never even see the money. DH co-signed ONLY because of that fact. Had he known that our son would not be making enough $$$ driving the truck to have the payments taken out, he never would have co-signed. As it was, the bank was constantly calling us because they couldn't get their money from him on time. It was always late. And it was starting to affect OUR credit rating so DH decided to pay off the loan to the bank, so then our son would owe US instead of the bank. He did it ONLY because of our credit rating being hurt. But, it came out of our retirement savings. So THAT is one of the major things I meant about "sucking us dry." I probably should have put that in the original post, but the post was already too frickin' long as it was.

We also paid for his DD's varsity coat, at Christmas, and he is paying us back for that as well as the loan. He has made a couple of small payments on the loan, but with trying to get a car of his own and a place to live the loan will have to take a backseat to those. We do have a written agreement with him though about paying it back.

He is our son and we want to help him, but it's just getting to be too much. I hate to do the "tough love" thing with him, but it looks like it's going to have to come to that, as much as I don't want it to.

 

[Jennasis]

She knew she was too drunk to drive and called her boyfriend for help. Sounds VERY responsible to me. It sounds like you have a problem with this girl and I can't for the life of me figure out why. She's not ready to date your DS? Really? I don't get how you know that. At 22, people DO still go out and party. That's not all they do. You also said she is a nurse. Sounds like a pretty good deal to me.



My advice is to tell your son he can't live with you anymore. Period, end of story.

 

[SC Minnie]

I have another take on this. He has only been there a couple of weeks. I think you need to sit down with him and go over the general house rules such as respecting your home. That means not waking you in the middle of the night either coming in or going out, not leaving a car owned by you at a strangers home or any other place. Not having people in your home when you aren't there ie, the GF spending the night or his friends for drinking and partying.

He needs to be more grateful that you are allowing him to live there free. If he can't respect you and your home he needs to find other living arrangement.

 

[MIGrandma]

Please, for his sake, please remove the exact name & location of where he worked for 5 mths. Any future employers looking at his resume could easily google that & find this thread & anything else you've said about him and might lead him to not getting the job.

Never ever a good idea to give exact location & job title. Information none of us needed to know.

Thank you, I never even thought about it when I put that in there.

I would not be too quick to judge her on this. Your son just turned 34 and he has a 16, 14 and 4 year old. That means he has 2 kid that were 4 and 2 when he was 22. He most likely still in high school when he had his first.

Isn't this the same son who has been living with you when he came to visit the kids?

I don't mean to imply that I'm judging her because she had her kids so young, because yes our son was young when his first child was born as well. It's the lack of responsibility that bothers me. Other people seem to have her children more than she has them herself. And I'm not talking about babysitting while she's working, that's completely different and understandable. I'm talking about weekends or when she has a day or two off from work, she is always asking her ex-boyfriend, her mother or her father to take the kids for a night or two for her. This is not an occasional thing. I understand that every parent needs some time away from their kids. But with her it's so often. It just seems very irresponsible in her parenting, to me.

And yes, this is the same son who stayed here with us once a month when he had time off from his trucking job for 2-3 days/month. He had given up his house, which we agreed with. Why pay rent, utilities, etc. when he would hardly ever be there so we agreed to let him, and his kids, stay here when he was home.

We are realizing more and more that the gravy train needs to stop running.

 

[MIGrandma]

She knew she was too drunk to drive and called her boyfriend for help. Sounds VERY responsible to me. It sounds like you have a problem with this girl and I can't for the life of me figure out why. She's not ready to date your DS? Really? I don't get how you know that. At 22, people DO still go out and party. That's not all they do. You also said she is a nurse. Sounds like a pretty good deal to me.



My advice is to tell your son he can't live with you anymore. Period, end of story.

Yes, I have a problem with her when she drinks so much that she's too drunk to drive herself home and doesn't spend the night right where she's at, with her best friend, and then just drive herself home in the morning. The more responsible thing would have been to have one drink or two in the evening, then let them wear off and drive yourself home if you knew you weren't going to spend the night with your best friend, rather then getting so blitzed you can't drive yourself home and you have to call your boyfriend and wake him up at 2:00 in the morning to come and get you and take you home when you know the boyfriend has to be at work at 7:00 the next morning and put in a 10-14 hour day. THAT is irresponsible.

I have another take on this. He has only been there a couple of weeks. I think you need to sit down with him and go over the general house rules such as respecting your home. That means not waking you in the middle of the night either coming in or going out, not leaving a car owned by you at a strangers home or any other place. Not having people in your home when you aren't there ie, the GF spending the night or his friends for drinking and partying.

He needs to be more grateful that you are allowing him to live there free. If he can't respect you and your home he needs to find other living arrangement.

Very good advice, thank you. I think that is exactly what we're going to have to do with him.

 

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

go get him some brochures for the Army, Navy, Marines, and air force.

tell him that going to basic training in the summer is much better than the winter.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Yes, I have a problem with her when she drinks so much that she's too drunk to drive herself home and doesn't spend the night right where she's at, with her best friend, and then just drive herself home in the morning. The more responsible thing would have been to have one drink or two in the evening, then let them wear off and drive yourself home if you knew you weren't going to spend the night with your best friend, rather then getting so blitzed you can't drive yourself home and you have to call your boyfriend and wake him up at 2:00 in the morning to come and get you and take you home when you know the boyfriend has to be at work at 7:00 the next morning and put in a 10-14 hour day. THAT is irresponsible.

No, you are missing the mark. This was a booty call. Duh. Your son left to go have some fun with his drunk 22yo GF, not that I blame him, it is not an abnormal thing to do for a guy.

The thing is he lives with you and you have to experience the comings and goings of a single guy.

 

[Motherofboys]

Booty call, drunken off her *** on a weeknight, whatever -- none of this is the kind of responsible adult behavior that two people 22 and 34 with 5 kids between them should be engaging in!

The fact that OP is providing him with free rent, food, utilities, transportation, paid off the driving school loan, etc -- that is what is enabling him to live like this. And lil girlfriend there might be a nurse, but she doesn't sound like much of a mother and good choice for a future wife, from what has been posted.

I had my first son young too, and you can bet your bottom dollar that that meant any partying, drinking, etc was a thing of the past. That's what becoming a parent and an adult is supposed to mean. Parents that allow that kind of behavior to continue are not doing these young parents any favors.

OP, I would lay the law down with him now. The gravy train is running you and your husband straight off the track.

He needs to buckle down and get back to being a responsible adult -- he has 3 kids to pay child support on and be an example to. That should be his number 1 priority, not booty calls with some girl that already has 2 kids and is only 6 years older than his oldest child!

 

[Jennasis]

Yes, I have a problem with her when she drinks so much that she's too drunk to drive herself home and doesn't spend the night right where she's at, with her best friend, and then just drive herself home in the morning. The more responsible thing would have been to have one drink or two in the evening, then let them wear off and drive yourself home if you knew you weren't going to spend the night with your best friend, rather then getting so blitzed you can't drive yourself home and you have to call your boyfriend and wake him up at 2:00 in the morning to come and get you and take you home when you know the boyfriend has to be at work at 7:00 the next morning and put in a 10-14 hour day. THAT is irresponsible.
.

Well then I guess I am your voice of dissent. There are plenty of reasons why should might not have wanted to (or been able to) stay at her friends house overnight. She did the responsible thing which is to call someone for help. Sorry her responsibility interrupted your sleep. And it's not like she called YOU. She called her boyfriend, who woke you up. My younger sister knew that she could call my parents anytime day or night to come and get her from a club or a party when she was 22. My parents HAPPILY went to pick her up often. No questions asked. I find the notion that ANYONE would be upset at this to be pretty infuriating.

She inconvenienced you. Better that than dead on a roadside, or having killed someone by driving. She called someone she trusted.

I think you need to get over yourself, in regards to the girlfriend that night. Honestly. Not saying she is parent of the year, or even a good mom, or heck even a bad mom, but the drunk at 2am story isn't enough to hang her IMO nor enough to prove her worthlessness. I am, sure there are other things she could be nailed for.

 

[MIGrandma]

go get him some brochures for the Army, Navy, Marines, and air force.

tell him that going to basic training in the summer is much better than the winter.

Believe me, I already thought about it but wonder if he's already too old. Plus he'd need to lose some weight first I'm sure.

No, you are missing the mark. This was a booty call. Duh. Your son left to go have some fun with his drunk 22yo GF, not that I blame him, it is not an abnormal thing to do for a guy.

The thing is he lives with you and you have to experience the comings and goings of a single guy.

You're probably right, that's why further back I said he wasn't thinking with the head on his shoulders.

Booty call, drunken off her *** on a weeknight, whatever -- none of this is the kind of responsible adult behavior that two people 22 and 34 with 5 kids between them should be engaging in!

The fact that OP is providing him with free rent, food, utilities, transportation, paid off the driving school loan, etc -- that is what is enabling him to live like this. And lil girlfriend there might be a nurse, but she doesn't sound like much of a mother and good choice for a future wife, from what has been posted.

I had my first son young too, and you can bet your bottom dollar that that meant any partying, drinking, etc was a thing of the past. That's what becoming a parent and an adult is supposed to mean. Parents that allow that kind of behavior to continue are not doing these young parents any favors.

OP, I would lay the law down with him now. The gravy train is running you and your husband straight off the track.

He needs to buckle down and get back to being a responsible adult -- he has 3 kids to pay child support on and be an example to. That should be his number 1 priority, not booty calls with some girl that already has 2 kids and is only 6 years older than his oldest child!

I completely agree with you. And even though I want our son to be happy, I just feel he makes poor choices in girlfriends. I am so over it that they have all (two previous ones before current one) had children that we get close to and love as step-grandchildren and then they're out of our lives that I so do not want that to happen again.

And I just wish he would make his job his number one priority right now, in order to get back on his feet, and not be so quick to jump every time the new girlfriend says so, you know? I feel like telling him every time he's ready to make a choice or a decision, do an about face and choose or make the opposite decision. Then he'll be making the right one!

I know he's old enough to be making his own choices and decisions, but when they affect us it's hard not to give him advice, wanted or unwanted.

 

[chloelovesdisney]

Oh my. Is she an RN or a nurses aide? I have trouble seeing how a 22 year old could finish nursing school while caring for two babies and partying. I would not be happy if my son or even my brother was involved with her. Best of luck with everything. I don't see her being a doting stepmom to his already 3 kids.

 

[Motherofboys]

Believe me, I already thought about it but wonder if he's already too old. Plus he'd need to lose some weight first I'm sure.



You're probably right, that's why further back I said he wasn't thinking with the head on his shoulders.



I completely agree with you. And even though I want our son to be happy, I just feel he makes poor choices in girlfriends. I am so over it that they have all (two previous ones before current one) had children that we get close to and love as step-grandchildren and then they're out of our lives that I so do not want that to happen again.

And I just wish he would make his job his number one priority right now, in order to get back on his feet, and not be so quick to jump every time the new girlfriend says so, you know? I feel like telling him every time he's ready to make a choice or a decision, do an about face and choose or make the opposite decision. Then he'll be making the right one!

I know he's old enough to be making his own choices and decisions, but when they affect us it's hard not to give him advice, wanted or unwanted.

You have the right to give him that advice! Some would say the duty!

1 - you're his mother
2 - he moved back into your home and is being supported by you and your husband
3 - you guys have paid for his schooling, helped him financially when he got into the hole

By every count have the right to tell him to put his job first and get back on his feet now so that he can get back on his feet and start to really pay you back!

Light a fire under that boy! Age 34...40 is right around the corner and he needs to get on a path to a sustainable career and stop dating party girls! He needs to grow up, he's not going to like to hear it but he sounds like he is moving backwards instead of forward!