I am more disturbed

[MikeB63]

I'm curious ( and this isn't bashing you ahve every right to your opinionand I honestly want to know your reasoning) but if you don't think homosexuality is natural ,then do you think that it is a choice? And if you believe that, why do you think anyone would choose to be so differnet from normal society and to be essentially an "outcast" for lack of a better word. Why would someone choose to engage in something that is discrimated against? And if you choose to be gay, then do you think you choose to be straight?
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Yes, I do believe that it is a choice. Why remains a mystery. I could only propose a few ideas, but their only my ideas or thoughts. People make a lot of choices that people don't understand. Some people seek shelter from perceived places of comfort. Some people have life experiences which point them away from what is thought of as rational. Why do people murder when they can go to jail? Why do people who are abused tend to seek their abuser? Why do people pierce their bodies ( i.e. nipples, genitals, cheeks)? Why are there masochists and sadists? I'm not equating these people with homosexuals, although some homosexuals may fit this description as well. I suppose I believe that this choice is an effect of a cause and/or possibly the result of a perverted curiosity. Maybe this curiosity was the result of exposure to the possibility (i.e pornography) or being deviant to accepted norms ( much like kinkier forms of sexual behavior). I don't think that people make the choice in a way that they think of the possible repercussions. I think it's probably more likely that experimentation happens, it feels good, provides comfort or something that is missing. After this everything else is rationalized to make it acceptable. It's not hurting anyone. It's my life. I'm not a bad person.

I don't believe that straight people make a choice because they don't have to as it is the natural state.

 

[chadfromdallas]

I don't believe that straight people make a choice because they don't have to as it is the natural state.

Go ahead and define natural state for us please.

 

[MikeB63]

I respect your opinion. But did not talked about "marriage". Please tell me about the "other ways that the issues raised above ( insurance, property rights) can be dealt with legally" that won't be legally challenge by family members of the deceased partner.
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Many people have wills that leave people money, property, or gifts. If there are cases where these wills are challenged , then the laws governing the wills need to be examined. Contracts can be set-up with businesses. Businesses can be incorporated and shares left to partners. These issues can be attacked for what they are without the "need" for gay-marriage. IMO there is more behind the gay-marriage issue than these ancillary issues, especially because most of the issues mentioned by TheAnswer, which are the typical arguments, can be addressed in other ways, seperately.

 

[MikeB63]

It iS a civil rights issue. It does not matter if they choose homosexuality or not. The idea that the "mob" can lord it over the minority opinion is repulsive to me. The constitution is designed to protect us from just this kind of thing.
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Murder is considered okay to a minority opinion and the "mob" that thinks it's not okay lords it over them. Is this wrong? Doesn't the constitution protect this mob also?

 

[chadfromdallas]

Originally posted by MikeB63
Murder is considered okay to a minority opinion and the "mob" that thinks it's not okay lords it over them. Is this wrong? Doesn't the constitution protect this mob also?

 

[MikeB63]

quote:
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I don't believe that straight people make a choice because they don't have to as it is the natural state.
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Go ahead and define natural state for us please.

Natural state in that men and women, by nature, without artificial assistance, are required to have relations to propagate the species and are naturally drawn towards each other for this purpose.

 

[Deb & Bill]

I'm sad to see our country of so-called Christians becoming more and more intolerant of diversity. Prayer in school is wonderful to many until it includes a prayer to Allah or Buddha. Didn't Jesus Christ say that to love God was the greatest commandment and to love your neighbor as you love yourself the second greatest commandment? How can we profess to follow Jesus Christ if we don't love all people? How can we deny rights to others - isn't that what our country was built on?

I'm not endorsing allowing others to murder or rape and not be punished for it, but how can we deny others their rights as long as they don't impact our rights?

I'm concerned about a conservative trend that wants everyone to be like them, worship their god, live the way they live, etc.

When they start to legislate marriage, how long will it take until they go further and legislate who can marry?

Why are we more concerned about marriage instead of educating our youth so that they can grow up to be leaders in the world instead of tyrants and bigots?

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by MikeB63
It iS a civil rights issue. It does not matter if they choose homosexuality or not. The idea that the "mob" can lord it over the minority opinion is repulsive to me. The constitution is designed to protect us from just this kind of thing.
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Murder is considered okay to a minority opinion and the "mob" that thinks it's not okay lords it over them. Is this wrong? Doesn't the constitution protect this mob also?

If someone murders you, they are infringing on your rights. If some guy marries some other guy it does not. Clearly different.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by tonyswife
And where oh where did we come up with the idea that modern American marriage is about reproduction?

Um... The first thing that I look for in a woman is child bearing hips.

Next is the ****s for the baby.

 

[ThAnswr]

Originally posted by MikeB63
quote:
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1) Do you believe a person in a long standing gay relationship, who has built a home, built a business, took care of their partner for many years, shared life experiences, etc. should be barred from their partner's hospital bed, have half their home and business sold out from under them, have their written will challenged and discarded in court, lose all parental rights to a child they may've loved and raised, etc?

Yes or no.

That's it.
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I don't think you'll find any answers here.
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I'll give my answer and risk the wrath of those who think differently. IMO homosexuality is morally wrong and not natural. If it were natural, men and women would not be anatomically different and be able to reproduce without the opposite sex. I do not buy into the "born that way" argument/hypothesis. I believe some men are born with feminine traits and some women are born with masculine traits, but I don't believe they're born gay. That being said, making gay marriage legal adds legitamacy to the homosexual lifestyle. It makes it acceptable. How does this affect me? It affects me because as this becomes an accepted norm, our/my children and their children (if they have them) may see this as an acceptable lifestyle, equal with what is natural and moral and it will become more widespread. To me the equal treatment of homosexual lifestyle with heterosexual lifestyle is just another sign of the decrease in morality in society. Do I think homosexuals should be discriminated against? No, tolerance is one thing, acceptance is another. Their are other ways that the issues raised above ( insurance, property rights) can be dealt with legally. Treat the problem not the symptom. I'm sure I have offended quite a few people. I'm sorry, that was not my intent. This is how I feel and someone asked for an answer.

P.S. I'm not an evangelical either.

Honest answer. How do you feel about civil unions? Some of those amendments voted on yesteday also outlawed civil unions.

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Um... The first thing that I look for in a woman is child bearing hips.

Next is the ****s for the baby.

Well you gotta have priorities.

 

[LisaZoe]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Um... The first thing that I look for in a woman is child bearing hips.

Next is the ****s for the baby.

Sounds like you need to keep looking, John.

 

[goofygirl]

Why are some people so threatened by gay marriage? Why do they think gays marrying will "ruin the institution of marriage?" Last time I looked, the heteros were not doing all that well with marriage (50% divorce rate sound familiar?). And how many of the intact marriages are dealing with adultery, abuse and other sins? Really, I do not see how gays can do any more damage to marriage than the straights have already done!

I worked with someone who was so against gay marriage and claimed to be an devout Catholic and conservative. Meantime, she had premarital sex, got pregnant at 18 (and then married because she "had to"), and has since been divorced twice.

And she really thinks gay people can make a bigger mockery of marriage than her?

 

[LoraJ]

goofygirl,
My thoughts exactly!

I just don't get it.

 

[goofygirl]

Um... The first thing that I look for in a woman is child bearing hips.

Next is the ****s for the baby.

Can a woman look for "procreation traits" in you as well? Can she measure your "thing"?

 

[ThAnswr]

Originally posted by tonyswife
What if California put an amendment on their ballot asking voters to decide whether or not to ban Christianity? I mean, if it passes, majority rules, get over it, and turn in your Bibles. Being in the in crowd in a pure democracy is cool, until the mob turns on you and decides to ban whatever it is YOU want to do practice.

It wasn't that many years ago that many states had Jim Crow laws and anti-miscegenation laws on the books and the people in those states were very happy with them. If it had been put to a vote, those same people would've voted to keep those laws.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by goofygirl
Can a woman look for "procreation traits" in you as well? Can she measure your "thing"?

Go ahead. But you'd better take a few steps back cause it's hard to say how big it'll get.

 

[ladycollector]

What if California put an amendment on their ballot asking voters to decide whether or not to ban Christianity? I mean, if it passes, majority rules, get over it, and turn in your Bibles. Being in the in crowd in a pure democracy is cool, until the mob turns on you and decides to ban whatever it is YOU want to do practice.

You know what, that's true, and I hope that never happens. My thing is I just don't agree with Same Sex Marriage because of my beliefs, and others are going to disagree with me. I'm okay with that. But I do get your point, It's definately a good one.

 

[dmadman43]

Originally posted by ThAnswr
Honest answer. How do you feel about civil unions? Some of those amendments voted on yesteday also outlawed civil unions.

I would have voted against any initiative that outlawed civil unions.

 

[tonyswife]

Originally posted by ladycollector
You know what, that's true, and I hope that never happens.

I hope it never happens too because I truely believe in individual liberty for everyone. It's a passion.

My thing is I just don't agree with Same Sex Marriage because of my beliefs, and others are going to disagree with me. I'm okay with that. But I do get your point, It's definately a good one.

Thank you. I sometimes wonder if I make sense to anyone.