I’m so curious. Is current dissatisfaction with Disney affecting DVC sales?

[BamaGuy44]

I sincerely doubt that is true. Last quarter, Disney+ beat projections by adding more than 11 million new subscribers. Things like the hotel deal are simply designed to create synergy. Ideally they will add a few new D+ subscribers, but it's very unlikely that their numbers are hemorrhaging.

Even if the numbers are bad, Disney isn't Netflix, where the streaming service is the whole company. Disney+ is a rounding error on their books, "Churn" is a problem for all the streaming services. It used to be such a pain to switch TV providers, now it's trivially easy. They are all scrambling to make their services more "sticky"

 

[aboveH20]

So many interesting comments and perspectives. Thank you to all who contributed.

I'm wondering if the week I was there in March was just atypically busy because the lines were horrendous and I left not excited about my annual trip, and I still have three resorts to go!

We were always going to buy DVC when "the check" came -- but it never came -- and we finally decided we're too old to take on a 40 year contract. Actually, I'd probably still buy, but my husband isn't on board.

(I screwed up multi quoting, hope my replies aren't totally unreadable)

https://dvcnews.com/dvc-program/financial/news-34867/5268-vgf-sales-resume-direct-sales-jump-in-march-2022

Tells you all you need to know. VGF2 sales were to current members only and it was only 15 days of sales. Had most single month sales since 2019 total.

Thanks for the link. That's exactly what I've been curious about.

The "current dissatisfaction" as you call it seems to be limited to message boards and blogs...the reality is that the parks are doing record business right now. One would assume this translates to success for DVC.

As a Disney stockholder I'm rooting for Disney. As a WDW lover, there are a few things (lines!!!) I'm dissatisfied with.

While I'm not happy about some of the changes in the parks, owning DVC has made all the difference to us in continuing to enjoy our trips. We only recently bought (2019), but prior to that we probably averaged a WDW trip every 2-3 years. We would have liked to come more often, but you only get so much time off and had other places we wanted to go. As my husband neared retirement, we knew we'd go more often and took the plunge.

Now that he's officially retired, we have been taking multiple trips each year. DVC allows us to do that within our budget. Going that often has removed most of the stress of trying to "do it all", finding that perfect ADR, getting on a certain ride, etc. We know we'll be back in a few months, so missing out on something one trip is no big deal to us. We no longer rope drop. Somedays we don't even go to a park, just enjoy the resort or head to Disney Springs or check out other resorts. We stay in 1 or 2 BR's and love having the space to spread out with an actual kitchen and living room. Our Disney vacations are very different than what they were pre-DVC.

So no, we aren't even considering selling. In fact we have 3 resale contracts in ROFR right now. Addonitis is very real . But that is just us. A lot of DVC owners still only go every couple of years and spend most of their time in the parks. And yes, at least based on what you read on these boards, some of them have become disillusioned and are selling. I think it boils down to where you are in life and how you spend your time at Disney. But for us, the enjoyment is definitely still there.

I agree. I go yearly by myself so I can do what I want when I want and if I miss something, there's always next year. (I'm still waiting for "next year" for Rise of the Resistance.) But this past year the lines were so long I kept walking past, including one of my favorites, Tower of Terror at 135 minutes.

And, the older I get the more I appreciate spending time at the resorts so I can see that as a plus for DVCers.

I think Disney+ is a bigger issues for Disney right now. A LOT of people canceling that. It's way easier to cancel that then DVC. You can tell there has been a big cancelation from Disney+ by the discount they're giving on resorts right now if you have Disney +. They're hoping more people will sign up for that or un-cancel to get the discount.

I've read about the Disney+ issues. Interesting.

 

[tjkraz]

you haven't been paying attention the last week or 2 then..

If there has been some specific news related to Disney+, please share.

However, if you're suggesting that people are canceling Disney+ as a result of recent political happenings, I'm skeptical that they will be lured back by the promise of hotel discounts. If you're disgruntled enough to cancel an $8 per month streaming subscription, you're probably not interested in saving $200 per night on a Disney hotel + theme park visit.

 

[SleeplessInTO]

An interesting question, OP.

DVC is a subset of disney fans. It’s a group that is willing to commit tens of thousands of dollars to vacation at a disney resort (and usually park) for the next 19+ years. Sure, some will sell and intend to do so long before then, but DVC is a long term game for many of us.

I was also at Disneyworld Florida in March of this year. Crowds were large. But we had a very magical trip, with no Genie+ or ILL or dining reservations made before the crack of dawn 60+10 days out.

For me, my DVC gives me a long perspective. Even if I don’t get to ride FOP this trip, that’s fine. I’ll try next time, or the time after that. If I don’t get a reservation for Cinderella’s Royal Table, no problem. I’ve been there before and I will again, someday. Just because some family pushed in front of me in line for my dole whip on a hot day, I didn’t contemplate getting into a yelling match, or worse. I simply took the view that they needed this dole whip much more than I did, and waited an extra 10 minutes. What is 10 mins out of 19 years? No big deal.

It’s much harder to ruin my trip because I’ll be back, and quite soon too. I spend more time at the resorts and less time at the parks, and I am not anxious about what I’m missing out on anymore. The parks are busy these days. They won’t always be busy. There’ll be changes that benefit DVC and changes that don’t.

Overall, 2022 is a blip in the life of my contract. This, too, shall pass.

Also - we just added on 200 points at Grand Floridian. Guess I’m in this for closer to 40 years now.

 

[BrianLo]

These things come and go in waves.

DLP was in an extremely sorry state a decade ago, probably its absolute nadir was 2013. The fanbase is very high on that resort now and the current 30th offerings.

 

[Red Dog Run]

I'm booking one of my 2-week stays at DVC resorts, but I won't hit the parks a single day. Universal bound, a day at each of the 3 home resorts, pool lounging, relaxing with friends at OKW, etc. Hope to parasail, go shopping, enjoy restaurants off-site, have pizza delivered while my husband makes the margaritas from the tequila I packed. No biggie- will be at "home," but I won't have many Disney dollars to spend. I will rent a pair of bicycles at OKW for a couple of hours, if that counts. Change of pace.

 

[DVCsloth]

My biggest gripe with Disney is how crowded the parks are! Owning DVC for the past 7+ years has allowed us to enjoy our visits so much more than before we owned. I will need to adjust my park strategy since they eliminated Fast Pass + which IMO was awesome.

 

[MICKIMINI]

At 26 years of DVC, we are way to invested and comfortable with our trips. I have my opinions on what Disney is (and has) done that I don't like, however our kid trips have turned into adult trips with our son and DIL. It is like a second home to us now and will be our snowbird location for 6 weeks or more soon. We've put too much money and energy into this decision vs buying a second home in FL.

We meet at WDW (we live 3K miles from each other) spring and fall, stay in a 1 BR and a studio usually at the same resort. There is plenty of time carved out for hanging out, pool time, naps and dinners together and since we have AP's we don't stress over tickets anymore. We just bought a contract that should load any day now and two more closing this summer. I think that makes ten. Nope, not going anywhere...

 

[DVCsloth]

Wow, 26 years DVC is awesome! Wish I would have known earlier and bought BCV or Wilderness Lodge when it first opened. We did buy into VGF while it was still active before they offered Polynesian. I was originally interested in Wilderness Lodge, and they told me it was sold out and they were selling VGF instead. Ended up adding at CCV and had no regrets with either!

 

[aboveH20]

An interesting question, OP.

DVC is a subset of disney fans. It’s a group that is willing to commit tens of thousands of dollars to vacation at a disney resort (and usually park) for the next 19+ years. Sure, some will sell and intend to do so long before then, but DVC is a long term game for many of us.

I was also at Disneyworld Florida in March of this year. Crowds were large. But we had a very magical trip, with no Genie+ or ILL or dining reservations made before the crack of dawn 60+10 days out.

For me, my DVC gives me a long perspective. Even if I don’t get to ride FOP this trip, that’s fine. I’ll try next time, or the time after that. If I don’t get a reservation for Cinderella’s Royal Table, no problem. I’ve been there before and I will again, someday. Just because some family pushed in front of me in line for my dole whip on a hot day, I didn’t contemplate getting into a yelling match, or worse. I simply took the view that they needed this dole whip much more than I did, and waited an extra 10 minutes. What is 10 mins out of 19 years? No big deal.

It’s much harder to ruin my trip because I’ll be back, and quite soon too. I spend more time at the resorts and less time at the parks, and I am not anxious about what I’m missing out on anymore. The parks are busy these days. They won’t always be busy. There’ll be changes that benefit DVC and changes that don’t.

Overall, 2022 is a blip in the life of my contract. This, too, shall pass.

Also - we just added on 200 points at Grand Floridian. Guess I’m in this for closer to 40 years now.

First, I'm envious of your magical March trip. Mine was not which left me in no hurry to return and which is what initially sparked my curiosity about how DVC members felt about "having" to return year after year.

I appreciate your perspective that you'll do next time what you couldn't do this time. I expected DVC members to be much more irate about "I paid $XXXXX and can't ___________." In reality it's more accepting of "next time." When my kids were young we could barely afford to go every four years and at that point I told myself 'I've waited four years, I can wait another 50 minutes for a ride'. I go every year now, and don't have to do everything, but still the lines just seemed tooooo long in March.

I'm booking one of my 2-week stays at DVC resorts, but I won't hit the parks a single day. Universal bound, a day at each of the 3 home resorts, pool lounging, relaxing with friends at OKW, etc. Hope to parasail, go shopping, enjoy restaurants off-site, have pizza delivered while my husband makes the margaritas from the tequila I packed. No biggie- will be at "home," but I won't have many Disney dollars to spend. I will rent a pair of bicycles at OKW for a couple of hours, if that counts. Change of pace.

That sounds wonderful!!! Now that I go solo I've stayed at 16 resorts with three more on my list. IF I go next year (I'm a diehard, as much as I left in March vowing not to return I have a feeling I'll mellow in a year) my thought is to triple split and stay at the three remaining resorts and spend more time eating enjoying the resorts and less time in the parks.

My biggest gripe with Disney is how crowded the parks are! Owning DVC for the past 7+ years has allowed us to enjoy our visits so much more than before we owned. I will need to adjust my park strategy since they eliminated Fast Pass + which IMO was awesome.

I think that's my complaint. Park reservations are needed so they have control over how many people are in the park. There should not be so many attractions with consistent wait times over an hour.

At 26 years of DVC, we are way to invested and comfortable with our trips. I have my opinions on what Disney is (and has) done that I don't like, however our kid trips have turned into adult trips with our son and DIL. It is like a second home to us now and will be our snowbird location for 6 weeks or more soon. We've put too much money and energy into this decision vs buying a second home in FL.

We meet at WDW (we live 3K miles from each other) spring and fall, stay in a 1 BR and a studio usually at the same resort. There is plenty of time carved out for hanging out, pool time, naps and dinners together and since we have AP's we don't stress over tickets anymore. We just bought a contract that should load any day now and two more closing this summer. I think that makes ten. Nope, not going anywhere...

Nice! I live in NY and have sons in TX and CA. We tried to connect on a Disney cruise in January. My TX son (with my only grandchild) had no interest in a cruise. We canceled the cruise with our CA son and fiancee two days before sailing because of the concern about testing positive.

I think it's absolutely wonderful that you've able to connect with your kids at Disney. Enjoy every single minute!

 

[Nappy1380]

The "current dissatisfaction" as you call it seems to be limited to message boards and blogs...the reality is that the parks are doing record business right now. One would assume this translates to success for DVC.

Don't conflate record business with satisfaction. There is going to be a huge short term bump in first time guests that can afford that once in a lifetime trip or others who are returning after 5, 10, 15 years, and are finding that what they are experiencing is NOT what their friends told them about a few years ago or not what they experienced years ago.

The amount complaining and/or dissatisfaction you hear just from being in the parks at the hotels or on Disney transportation is a clear indication that people are going, but are clearly not happy.

Just my opinion, but attendance is going to do a 180 in a few years unless there is drastic change in guest experience.

 

[Jonfw2]

Don't conflate record business with satisfaction. There is going to be a huge short term bump in first time guests that can afford that once in a lifetime trip or others who are returning after 5, 10, 15 years, and are finding that what they are experiencing is NOT what their friends told them about a few years ago or not what they experienced years ago.

The amount complaining and/or dissatisfaction you hear just from being in the parks at the hotels or on Disney transportation is a clear indication that people are going, but are clearly not happy.

Just my opinion, but attendance is going to do a 180 in a few years unless there is drastic change in guest experience.

Well said. And not to make this about me, but check out the thread I just started on the “big complaint”. I think you’ll agree.

 

[gregskellington]

No complaints for me, I still enjoy my trips. I definitely have the mindset of "next time". I didn't do much in Magic Kingdom this trip I took a few weeks ago, but I'll just add more next time. The parks were super busy (and will be in July and December when I go back) but I know they haven't always been like that and won't always be like that. I also agree that DVC satisfaction and sales are probably pretty low on the suits' radar.

 

[McCrae]

So many interesting comments and perspectives. Thank you to all who contributed.

I'm wondering if the week I was there in March was just atypically busy because the lines were horrendous and I left not excited about my annual trip, and I still have three resorts to go!

We were always going to buy DVC when "the check" came -- but it never came -- and we finally decided we're too old to take on a 40 year contract. Actually, I'd probably still buy, but my husband isn't on board.

(I screwed up multi quoting, hope my replies aren't totally unreadable)




Thanks for the link. That's exactly what I've been curious about.



As a Disney stockholder I'm rooting for Disney. As a WDW lover, there are a few things (lines!!!) I'm dissatisfied with.


I agree. I go yearly by myself so I can do what I want when I want and if I miss something, there's always next year. (I'm still waiting for "next year" for Rise of the Resistance.) But this past year the lines were so long I kept walking past, including one of my favorites, Tower of Terror at 135 minutes.

And, the older I get the more I appreciate spending time at the resorts so I can see that as a plus for DVCers.



I've read about the Disney+ issues. Interesting.

I visited in March as well. I have never seen the parks as busy in 25+ years of going. I put it down to a mad rush for people to get away after being restricted for so long and Snow Birds coming down to enjoy the surprisingly warm weather.

 

[McCrae]

For those who think the suits don’t care anyone who is aware of the experience of international owners during Covid makes it clear they do care. Owners who had to cancel trips because of US travels restrictions were helped by DVC. Points that otherwise would have been lost were put in a special holding account that were allowed to be used once the restrictions were relaxed. DVC didn’t have to do this. I am guessing they used their own points to support this. In my case I was able to book again a 2 week trip in a 2Br villa at VGF. The value of this help was over $20,000. Not sure if any other companies would be so generous. On the big calls Disney usually gets it right.

 

[gregskellington]

For those who think the suits don’t care anyone who is aware of the experience of international owners during Covid makes it clear they do care. Owners who had to cancel trips because of US travels restrictions were helped by DVC. Points that otherwise would have been lost were put in a special holding account that were allowed to be used once the restrictions were relaxed. DVC didn’t have to do this. I am guessing they used their own points to support this. In my case I was able to book again a 2 week trip in a 2Br villa at VGF. The value of this help was over $20,000. Not sure if any other companies would be so generous. On the big calls Disney usually gets it right.

I personally see a MASSIVE difference between Disney doing something to save face for their timeshare program they need to keep selling and Disney caring if some of their timeshare members don't like the parks right now.

 

[McCrae]

I personally see a MASSIVE difference between Disney doing something to save face for their timeshare program they need to keep selling and Disney caring if some of their timeshare members don't like the parks right now.

DVC did nothing wrong so no need to do any face saving. I am not a fan of Genie +… I expect radical changes once Disney has more time to gather data and feedback from guests. If the feedback is clear that things need to change, a change will be made.

 

[bakerworld]

IMO, the park dissatisfaction hasn't transferred to DVC. DVC members are in for the long haul. We don't need the parks to have fun because 'been there, done that'. Our membership is 14 years old now and I figure we have 6 good park years left in us. We'll keep the contract that expires when we're 86 but 6 years from now we'll sell the contracts that expire 2058.

 

[clarker99]

The boards, twitter and blogs are completely anecdotal and not representative of the masses. Anger/frustration breed clicks and long threads while creating an echo chamber. $DIS is a very data driven company. They send out thousands of survey's a day. They know what the satisfaction levels are for most everything. I am not here to say $DIS doesn't deserve criticism but they are not not making these decisions without understanding that a certain segment will be upset. Occupancy rates and park attendance are showing that $DIS still has a long way to go before people stop going. $DIS is so popular that when they raise Dole whip prices it gets headlines while USF or SeaWorld can raise prices and no one cares bc those companies do not drive clicks.

How do they make the parks less busy? WDW is not even offering annual passes. Outside of doubling park ticket prices I am not sure. Some will say add more attractions and shows (I am on board) but they are not going to expand a parks size and then not increase attendance. Plus, they cannot find enough staff right now. Len Testa said that WDW resorts is at 40% of its pre-pandemic level for chefs for its restaurants. Dining plan is not coming back anytime soon if that number is true,

DVC is going very strong.

Genie+ gets upwards of 50% of parks guest pay for it daily. $DIS only expects you to get 2 (maybe 3) G+ reservations. And maybe pay for 1 lightning lane. That is the same as the 3 'free' ones you used to get if you stayed on property. $DIS has left money on the table for years by not charging. The system has issues and needs work but they will continue to charge for it even if it changes how it works. And let's be honest people complained about free fast pass (locals especially).

Further to some talking about Disney+. It is most definitely not a rounding error for them. $DIS stock is mostly being judged by its subscriber adds (which is silly). Adding availability in several new markets soon. Disney subscribers should include ESPN and Hulu but for some reason Dis+ is the focus. Recurring revenue from streaming is a real boon for the bottom line.

We take for granted that Disney only releases 10 movies a year into the theatre and crushes every other studio in ticket sales. The only reason theatres still exist is largely bc of Disney.

DCL is the best.

Still way more to like about the company than not (IMO) but I understand the frustrations and those who are not wanting to go as much or not at all. I am a sucker for $DIS and live my life in a way that allows my family to go 1 to 2 times a year.

 

[aboveH20]

I visited in March as well. I have never seen the parks as busy in 25+ years of going. I put it down to a mad rush for people to get away after being restricted for so long and Snow Birds coming down to enjoy the surprisingly warm weather.

Finally, someone who agrees that March was busy. I realize we all have different expectations and experiences, but it's still been strange to hear what an amazing time people had in March when my trip left me with no interest in returning -- something I never, ever thought I'd feel. My solo trip to Disney is (was?) the highlight of my year.

The boards, twitter and blogs are completely anecdotal and not representative of the masses. Anger/frustration breed clicks and long threads while creating an echo chamber. $DIS is a very data driven company. They send out thousands of survey's a day. They know what the satisfaction levels are for most everything. I am not here to say $DIS doesn't deserve criticism but they are not not making these decisions without understanding that a certain segment will be upset. Occupancy rates and park attendance are showing that $DIS still has a long way to go before people stop going. $DIS is so popular that when they raise Dole whip prices it gets headlines while USF or SeaWorld can raise prices and no one cares bc those companies do not drive clicks.

How do they make the parks less busy? WDW is not even offering annual passes. Outside of doubling park ticket prices I am not sure. Some will say add more attractions and shows (I am on board) but they are not going to expand a parks size and then not increase attendance. Plus, they cannot find enough staff right now. Len Testa said that WDW resorts is at 40% of its pre-pandemic level for chefs for its restaurants. Dining plan is not coming back anytime soon if that number is true,

DVC is going very strong.

Genie+ gets upwards of 50% of parks guest pay for it daily. $DIS only expects you to get 2 (maybe 3) G+ reservations. And maybe pay for 1 lightning lane. That is the same as the 3 'free' ones you used to get if you stayed on property. $DIS has left money on the table for years by not charging. The system has issues and needs work but they will continue to charge for it even if it changes how it works. And let's be honest people complained about free fast pass (locals especially).

Further to some talking about Disney+. It is most definitely not a rounding error for them. $DIS stock is mostly being judged by its subscriber adds (which is silly). Adding availability in several new markets soon. Disney subscribers should include ESPN and Hulu but for some reason Dis+ is the focus. Recurring revenue from streaming is a real boon for the bottom line.

We take for granted that Disney only releases 10 movies a year into the theatre and crushes every other studio in ticket sales. The only reason theatres still exist is largely bc of Disney.

DCL is the best.

Still way more to like about the company than not (IMO) but I understand the frustrations and those who are not wanting to go as much or not at all. I am a sucker for $DIS and live my life in a way that allows my family to go 1 to 2 times a year.

I agree about DCL. When I left in March I decided to skip WDW next year and do a cruise instead. Funny, I don't feel guilty going to WDW without my husband but I think I would feel guilty going on a cruise solo.

Like you, I'm a sucker for Disney and I think that's why I was so sad about how unmagical my trip was.