How do you feel about this? Columbine Parents...

[Kallison]

The Klebolds said their son was set off by the "toxic culture" of the school, where athletes were worshipped and bullying was tolerated.


I think this sentence says it all! Parents pay attention to your kids and how they treat other kids. Too many parents just don't care when their kids are the popular ones.

 

[poohandwendy]

Its well documented; these boys were ridiculed and harrassed and bullied almost constantly.

Snoopy, (or anyone else)
Do you happen to have a source or link that supports that? I know that is what the media speculated, but everything I have read has suggested that the FBI investigation found that the 2 boys were not bullied. One was depressed and the other was severely mentally unstable (his diary apparently shows that he hated everyone, jocks, geeks, blacks whites, etc). But, from everything I have read, there has been no link to being bullied or unwelcome in the school found.

As to the OP, I think the parents are being insensitive. But I also think the parents of the dead children are also being insensitive by expecting an apology. This is just another sad example that mentally unstable children need to be helped before they go over the edge. There needs to be more education about mental illness and better tools for early intervention. JMHO.

 

[Microcell]

I was picked on every day in Junior high by one boy and it was of a sexual nature- no outright abuse, but comments and at times touching. I was drowning in self pity and dreading school. My sister, who was picked on more than me, saw this and went to my mom who responded that everyone goes through it. I was talking to my friend about maybe committing suicide and I was really down. My sister would not let it go and called my school and LOST it insisting that they move me to another class or she would hurt the boy herself (she would have beat him up, I am sure of that). The guidance counsler moved my class and told the boy she would cut off a certain part of his body if he didn't leave me alone. He never spoke to me again! I kid you not! I will not name names though she has to be retired by now. I was lucky, but I often wonder how I would have survived it if nothing was done. you get pretty low. I dreamed of hurting him, but not murder, that never crossed my mind. Even without parental support. Something was not right with those boys, to the core.

 

[C.Ann]

Originally posted by poohandwendy
Snoopy, (or anyone else)
Do you happen to have a source or link that supports that? I know that is what the media speculated, but everything I have read has suggested that the FBI investigation found that the 2 boys were not bullied. One was depressed and the other was severely mentally unstable (his diary apparently shows that he hated everyone, jocks, geeks, blacks whites, etc). But, from everything I have read, there has been no link to being bullied or unwelcome in the school found.

--------------------------------

If I remember correctly (just jumped out of bed and my brain is still a little foggy - LOL), there were televised interviews with other students from Columbine that verifed the bullying/ostracizing aspect of this tragedy..

 

[Pooh93]

Extremely well said Disney Doll.

 

[danacara]

I do appreciate that they probably would have intervened had they known anything this serious was in his mind. But I don't understand how they missed the bomb building in the garage.

PS - FEELS GOOD to have an articulate "conversation" in English! I have been struggling to speak slowly, clearly, simply over here!

 

[Geezer]

The two young men who killed at Columbine chose to be different. These were young men who dressed in black, called themselves "trench coat mafia", wrote papers and did videos about hurting others. It would seem to me that they could be accussed of being bullies as much as the athletes in the school. They even posted threats on a web site.

But did they chose to be different, or did they "become" different as a cry for help from all the bullying? Kids can be very cruel to others sometimes. I had a speach problem as a kid, and was teased relentlessly. What I see kids doing to each other now is more than just teasing. It is sometimes awful cruelty. I think the "toxic society" is EXACTLY what caused this. I doubt the parents are completely blamless, but I also doubt they could have done anything to stop what happened. Their sons died too, and for that they too should have the support of the community.

 

[tkd lisa]

One thing no one has mentioned in this thread was the other parents who have "forgiven" the parents of the shooters. IMO, it is not those parent's place to forgive the shooters' parents. I do believe that as a part of healing, you have to work through the anger you feel at the person who hurt you. In this case, I think that is the actual shooters. The quotes from those parents saying they have "forgiven the shooters' parents" come across to me as a very holier than thou attitude.

Given all that occurred in this situation, I feel very sad for all the parents and children involved. My DD has gone through some bullying in middle school, and I became very aware of it very quickly and addressed it with the school. I know that teens can become very introverted and private, but part of being a good parent is knowing when your child is just being moody and when there's a real problem. If there is one thing that we should learn from this it's to work very hard to keep open the communications with our children, particularly if they start to exhibit some different behavior.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Originally posted by Geezer
But did they chose to be different, or did they "become" different as a cry for help from all the bullying? Kids can be very cruel to others sometimes. I had a speach problem as a kid, and was teased relentlessly. What I see kids doing to each other now is more than just teasing. It is sometimes awful cruelty. I think the "toxic society" is EXACTLY what caused this. I doubt the parents are completely blamless, but I also doubt they could have done anything to stop what happened. Their sons died too, and for that they too should have the support of the community.

I agree completely, Geezer! Our DD had both a speach problem and a learning problem. She was of normal IQ, but had difficulties with math and spacial organization. Because of that, she had to attend speach therapy and a special math class. She got labeled early by the other students, and they were awful to her. She had a few things she really excelled at though. One of them was reading (and at an early age) and the other was music. Had it not been for band class and a couple of good friends, I worry what she might have done...not to others, but to herself. Her selfesteem has always been very low because of these incidences that lingered through high school. She is now 35 and has suffered a great deal with depression etc. Her life was virtually ruined by "toxic society", and the kids today have it MUCH worse!

 

[C.Ann]

Originally posted by Disney Doll
Don't have kids, so I have no idea how I would have repsonded to my teenage son coming home wearing all black, wearing black lipstick and nail polish, etc. .

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This sentence is very telling.. Until you have been the parent of a child who is bullied and have had to deal with the lack of cooperation from the school, authorities, and the mental health community, you really don't have any idea how complicated and frustrating this matter can be..

Not trying to be critical of you, but it's simply not something that can be understood unless you've been there..

 

[janette]

What is well documented is that the boys had 15 contacts with the police before they started shooting. Many because of threats and their web page. Don't you think at the very least if this was one of your children you'd try to stop the association they had with each other? I believe these parents had a "they'll grow out of it" attitude and put their blinders on. I certainly don't blame them but I also do not put the blame on the school or the kids who might have teased them.

 

[browneyes]

It sounds to me like the parents need (more) counselling. Denial and throwing blame towards others is a sign of deep inner grieving that needs to be let out. I'm sure the mom feels like people are pointing fingers at her and blaming her for what her ds did, but to say, in essence, it's the victims' fault is vindictive.

 

[C.Ann]

Originally posted by browneyes
It sounds to me like the parents need (more) counselling. Denial and throwing blame towards others is a sign of deep inner grieving that needs to be let out. I'm sure the mom feels like people are pointing fingers at her and blaming her for what her ds did, but to say, in essence, it's the victims' fault is vindictive.

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I may have missed that part, but I don't think the parents blamed the "victims" (as in the kids who were shot) but rather a school system that failed to take bullying as a serious issue.. It goes on every single day across the entire country and for the most part the schools only address it AFTER a tragedy such as this..

I think another thing that is getting lost in this bullying scenario is the number of kids who commit suicide EVERY year because they simply can't take the bullying and ostracizing anymore..

 

[poohandwendy]

If I remember correctly (just jumped out of bed and my brain is still a little foggy - LOL), there were televised interviews with other students from Columbine that verifed the bullying/ostracizing aspect of this tragedy..

Can you find a link (or any source) to support this? I can't and I have searched. Snoopy mentioned that it was 'well documented'...I am asking, where?

Where are the incident reports? When did the parents talk to teacher or school officials about their children being bullied? There isn't any record that I can find of any incidences.

All I can find is that these 2 made previous threats of violence. As a matter of fact, the only bullying I can find, and I have searched and searched, came from Klebold and Harris. 2 young men who were mentally unstable and turned horribly violent.

 

[C.Ann]

Originally posted by poohandwendy
Can you find a link (or any source) to support this? I can't and I have searched. Snoopy mentioned that it was 'well documented'...I am asking, where?

Where are the incident reports? When did the parents talk to teacher or school officials about their children being bullied? There isn't any record that I can find of any incidences.

All I can find is that these 2 made previous threats of violence. As a matter of fact, the only bullying I can find, and I have searched and searched, came from Klebold and Harris. 2 young men who were mentally unstable and turned horribly violent.

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Sorry, but I can't provide a link because if memory serves me correct I'm pretty sure it was live televised news interviews with other students at Columbine either right after the incident or perhaps on one of the anniversaries of the incident..

I also used to have an issue of People magazine at home that covered this tragedy at Columbine in quite a bit of depth but I don't know if I still have it or if I sold it with some other People magazines on eBay..

 

[poohandwendy]

Sorry, but I can't provide a link because if memory serves me correct I'm pretty sure it was live televised news interviews with other students at Columbine either right after the incident or perhaps on one of the anniversaries of the incident..

CAnn, come on, you mean that you can't find anything on the net supporting this? I am curious because I can't. You would think there would be some record of a history of these 2 being bullied/harassed.

 

[C.Ann]

Originally posted by poohandwendy
CAnn, come on, you mean that you can't find anything on the net suporting this? I am curious because I can't.

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I wouldn't even know where to begin to look.. It could have been a clip on our local news - could have been one of the national news shows - could have been CNN, FOX - or any other number of sources.. I can't even remember "when" it was - let alone "where" it was.. Sorry..

 

[tiggersmom2]

PAW,

Here is the link I found to support the bullying. The principle, DeAngelis denied the bullying but many students and teachers supported the claims.


http://zanazl.tripod.com/Columbine/Articles/Bullying.html

 

[poohandwendy]

Tggersmom,
your link pretty much supports that Klebold and Harris were the bullies, not that they were bullied by others.

 

[Toby'sFriend]

Interesting Article concerning the FBI investigation of the shootings.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2099203

In their investigation some Psychologists have included that although Harris was a Psychopath, Klebold himself suffered from severe depression and became very much of follower of Kelbold.

There is also an article here that talks about some of the myths regarding bullying, marilyn manson, hit lists, etc surrounding the shooting.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2099203/sidebar/2099208/

I'm not sure what I think of the parents comments. I honestly don't know what you could possibly say or how you would even survive knowing a child of yours reached the point where they committed such an atrocious act.