honest/expert opinions needed!thinking of going dvc

[MAJPLO]

OP: Noticing that you are from Huntington Beach, would you make GCV your home resort or choose something for WDW? Just wondering since we are Californians as well and are considering what makes the most sense for us.

 

[Mtnman44]

That's a good way of putting it. This is a luxury purchase, much like any travel to WDW is. Whether it is "worth it" depends entirely on how much value you place on this type of vacation.

Here's how it shakes out for my family. Does DVC save us money? Technically, No. We are spending more on Disney vacations now. Is it Worth It? To us, Yes. We have MUCH HIGHER Quality vacations now due to the comfortable accomodations and fun environments. DVC has also enabled us to go more frequently and for longer duration per trip, both of which help increase the quality of our trips due to less rushing to do as much as possible. We are spending more to achieve this, but DVC has allowed us to get to this level of vacation at a much more affordable price than would have been possible otherwise.

So to the OP, if your goal is to reduce your WDW vacation costs as much as possible, I do not think DVC is a good option for that. If you are looking to upgrade you vacation experience as described, DVC may be one way to do that with costs that are discounted and more manageable. This discount however requires many years of vacations before you realize the savings, so you need to be fairly sure about your future palns and wants.

Fair point.

I think it comes down to what you care about. I have a family member who occasionally make snide comments about me having timeshares...like I'm rolling in it and she's tapped out. All the while her husband is on his third car in seven years, all of which were European Luxury brands (Audi, Alfa-Romeo), and she drives her loaded SUV...While I rolled around in my six year old Hyundai. The money he's put down for his cars is quite a bit less than I paid for my timeshare. So bottom line, they like cars and I like vacations.

 

[luvmychaos]

That's a good way of putting it. This is a luxury purchase, much like any travel to WDW is. Whether it is "worth it" depends entirely on how much value you place on this type of vacation.

Here's how it shakes out for my family. Does DVC save us money? Technically, No. We are spending more on Disney vacations now. Is it Worth It? To us, Yes. We have MUCH HIGHER Quality vacations now due to the comfortable accomodations and fun environments. DVC has also enabled us to go more frequently and for longer duration per trip, both of which help increase the quality of our trips due to less rushing to do as much as possible. We are spending more to achieve this, but DVC has allowed us to get to this level of vacation at a much more affordable price than would have been possible otherwises.

That is why it appeals to us,we look longingly at the Deluxes and would MUCH rather be there but trying to stretch a budget for a longer stay means a moderate. But as you said,higher quality vacations due to better accomodations&fun enviroments. We want to go more frequently and with 3 kids, that sort of vacation really appeals to us. That's why I asked it here,figured everyone is way more knowledgable without trying to get the sale

 

[luvmychaos]

And there are other adds with DVC....Some people are more disciplined than others, but these things are not uncommon:

No hotel bill when you check out and dues being paid long ago (or monthly in small amounts) means that its really easy to spend more while you are there. Cirque? Dinner at Jiko? The hotel is "free"....

You have that annual pass - and a few more points - you could squeeze in a long weekend over Food and Wine - or to see the Christmas decorations. Airfare won't be THAT much......

Your dear niece and nephew have never been to Disney - you could invite your brother and sister in law down and pay for their room. They are great people and every kid should get a trip to Disney. Maybe you'll spring for a Character Meal for them to....your brother is nice, but a little bit of a cheapskate........

Before you know it, you've taken trips to Disney when money was tight and without DVC you'd have maybe stayed closer to home - or stayed offsite or in a moderate for THAT trip, you've invited friends or family and 'paid' for the room (hey, you had points), you've added a few trips, done add ons that less frequent guests - or guests with hotel bills - might have decided were outside the budget.

Hilarious but very true. I know how much more we're inclined to spend when we have free. Dining,I can only imagine the "no hotel bill" feeling

 

[luvmychaos]

To give a specific comparison:

7 night stay, JUNE 2012:

• OKW Studio: 99 points
• Coronado Springs, Hotel Room, Standard view: 154 points + $95 reservation fee

AND THAT'S WHY I ASKED HERE!! Duh,of course I'd rather stay in a Dlx studio with amenities instead of MORE points for a lesser hotel! I really had no idea,we had just started poking around their site after our trip this Dec. So I apologize for my ignorance,just trying to weigh every factor before we come close to making a decision. Thanks again!

 

[Deb & Bill]

AND THAT'S WHY I ASKED HERE!! Duh,of course I'd rather stay in a Dlx studio with amenities instead of MORE points for a lesser hotel! I really had no idea,we had just started poking around their site after our trip this Dec. So I apologize for my ignorance,just trying to weigh every factor before we come close to making a decision. Thanks again!

However with a family of five, you wouldn't be able to stay at either location after your youngest hit three years told. Your family is too big for a studio and too big for a standard CSR room.

 

[AJA]

We've been kicking around purchasing DVC for a couple of years now and have spent a long time weighing the pros and cons.

Having 3 kids does seem to be a con. I don't think you could rent a studio after your youngest turns 3, and only a couple of the one bedrooms sleep more than 4. Having enough points for a 2 bedroom DVC resort when you could go with a moderate like POR and free dining there, is a huge price difference kwim?

 

[Brian Noble]

It is a huge price difference. But, the vacation experiences are incomparable for my family. Personally, I'd rather stay offsite in a condo than try to squeeze my family of four in a single Moderate hotel room for a week. I know a lot of people do it, and they like it, but it is just not for us.

 

[crisi]

The long and the short of it is that DVC CAN be a good deal if the commitment (investing $10,000+ or whatever, paying dues EVERY year) doesn't put you in a bind by itself, and if you retain the discipline to use it "within your means" - and what that means is different for everyone.

After ten plus years on this board, and watching two recessions and people sell off in the face of job loss or disappointment in the product - often at a loss - I get nervous when

1) People post looking primarily to "save" money. DVC more often "adds value" - which isn't the same thing at all.

2) Anyone who NEEDS to finance. "We can afford it" and "we can afford the payments" are two very different things.

3) Anyone whose dreams of DVC ownership involving a lot of "not DVC trips" - people who say 'it will be a great way to cruise' or 'we can use RCI to go to Colorado' or 'we can use it for ABD.'

4) Anyone not familiar with the differences between timeshares and hotels - and specifically, staying at a Disney resort (say BWI) and staying in the Villas (say BWV).

5) Anyone who isn't aware the using your points means you won't qualify for deals like Free Dining - or puts a lot of emphasis on deals and benefits that you get by being a member (discounts, pool hopping). Or anyone who LOVES the deal.

6) Anyone who buys in after one or two trips to Disney - there are people who love Disney and make it a lifestyle thing - but I think its more common for people to burn out on it.

7) Anyone who is as happy offsite as on. There are LOTS of nice places offsite that don't carry the cost of Disney offerings (timeshares AND hotels).

There are probably some more, but its early yet and I haven't finished my coffee. If you see yourself in any of the above - put down the pixie dust and step away. Reconsider without the pixie dust in your eyes. Ask "what does she mean" and we'll answer. It still might be a good choice for you - but it isn't a slam dunk. If you read that list with "we are paying from our 'Scrooge-McDuck-room-o-cash,' we've rented points and know what DVC is like, we've been going to Disney yearly for a decade and don't see ourselves stopping, we aren't promotions people anyway" - we've had a few of those over the years and for THOSE people, its a slam dunk.

 

[zavandor]

Really great post, Crisi, thank you!
Your post should be sticky-ed somewhere as a test that everyone should take before buying a DVC timeshare.

I passed almost of it, except a few points:

4) Anyone not familiar with the differences between timeshares and hotels - and specifically, staying at a Disney resort (say BWI) and staying in the Villas (say BWV).

Mmm, differences, I'm not sure I know all. With DVC:
- you do not get mousekeeping every day
- you get full kitchen or kitchenette (depending on size) and other amenities
- reservation must be made a lot in advance (11/7 months windows)
- cancellation policy can cause loss of points (on hold status points)
- can add DDP (and soon TIW) also not buying tickets, but it's never free
- they can take away any perk anytime, even booking at a different resort

What am I missing?

6) Anyone who buys in after one or two trips to Disney - there are people who love Disney and make it a lifestyle thing - but I think its more common for people to burn out on it.

I love Disney. I live in Italy and I went to DLP at least every other year + once to WDW + I'll be back in 10 days for my second time (two weeks this time). I have even a blog about Disney!
I'm quite sure I'll never be burnt out, but my main concern is distance.
However I'm already planning a trip to DL and then it will be time for another trip to see the new Fantasyland and later again for the new WWoHP and Avatar Land. I think I'll be quite busy for a few years

we've rented points and know what DVC is like

This is my second concern (and maybe it could be added as 8th point of the test). I've never been in a DVC resort, but I've been in all hotels in DLP (except one), from Value to Deluxe, I know how much can be more confortable to be in a better accommodation.
Do you think it's really necessary to try renting points before buying? I'm not sure I'd be confortable to rent directly from a member: anything can happen and the idea that my reservation is in the hands of someone else scares me a little. And renting cash from Disney is so expensive that you can repay a good part of the contract not doing it.

 

[crisi]

Really great post, Crisi, thank you!
Your post should be sticky-ed somewhere as a test that everyone should take before buying a DVC timeshare.

I passed almost of it, except a few points:



Mmm, differences, I'm not sure I know all. With DVC:
- you do not get mousekeeping every day
- you get full kitchen or kitchenette (depending on size) and other amenities
- reservation must be made a lot in advance (11/7 months windows)
- cancellation policy can cause loss of points (on hold status points)
- can add DDP (and soon TIW) also not buying tickets, but it's never free
- they can take away any perk anytime, even booking at a different resort

Rooms are not as refreshed as often an amenities may not be the same (sheets, comforter) as on the hotel side. MOST studios are a Queen Bed and a full pullout, at OKW its two Queens. There aren't King beds in studios. You may pay if you want more towels (i.e. if you want your towels refreshed every day) or more shampoo (most members report getting them by asking the mousekeepers and not being charged, but there is a provision to charge you). There may be a few more.

This is my second concern (and maybe it could be added as 8th point of the test). I've never been in a DVC resort, but I've been in all hotels in DLP (except one), from Value to Deluxe, I know how much can be more confortable to be in a better accommodation.
Do you think it's really necessary to try renting points before buying? I'm not sure I'd be confortable to rent directly from a member: anything can happen and the idea that my reservation is in the hands of someone else scares me a little. And renting cash from Disney is so expensive that you can repay a good part of the contract not doing it.

We had never been in a DVC resort and were happy - but I'd suggest at least looking at pictures of rooms on the internet to get an idea of what they are like. I MUCH prefer the Deluxe resorts to a DVC room - if it were just my husband and I. And even there, I'd rather stay offsite at a Hilton where they have better sheets and mattresses than on property (it has been a few years since I've been on the cash side - it may have improved over there). But DVC gives me the ability to put our kids in a different room - and for me, thats worth a downgrade in sheets.

 

[Brian Noble]

My concern: are you going to fly from Italy to the US every other year or so? Because DVC doesn't make that much sense for anything *except* DVC lodging. And, for the most part, that includes Disney-owned but non-DVC hotels. I haven't priced the DLP options very carefully, but I would be surprised if using DVC points for DLP lodging was a good deal.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

This is my second concern (and maybe it could be added as 8th point of the test). I've never been in a DVC resort, but I've been in all hotels in DLP (except one), from Value to Deluxe, I know how much can be more confortable to be in a better accommodation.
Do you think it's really necessary to try renting points before buying? I'm not sure I'd be confortable to rent directly from a member: anything can happen and the idea that my reservation is in the hands of someone else scares me a little. And renting cash from Disney is so expensive that you can repay a good part of the contract not doing it.

We also never stayed in a DVC room prior to purchase although we had toured a few years before. I consider the rooms to be what the Deluxe hotels were before their most recent refurbs and so I wasn't concerned about that and it seemed like a correct assessment after finally staying with DVC. I did take the time to look at pictures of all the resorts. It's been 10 years since I stayed at the Disneyland hotel at DLP but my recollection would place it as similar to DVC room styles but I have no idea what the DLP rooms are like now and if they compare at all.

 

[zavandor]

My concern: are you going to fly from Italy to the US every other year or so? Because DVC doesn't make that much sense for anything *except* DVC lodging. And, for the most part, that includes Disney-owned but non-DVC hotels. I haven't priced the DLP options very carefully, but I would be surprised if using DVC points for DLP lodging was a good deal.

If I'll buy, it will be resale, so using points for DLP is not an option in any case. I'll use my 14 days in Orlando in January also to think if I want to come back every other year or not. And I'll go and visit BWV and AKV, since those are the two resorts with the most appeal to me.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Rooms are not as refreshed as often an amenities may not be the same (sheets, comforter) as on the hotel side. MOST studios are a Queen Bed and a full pullout, at OKW its two Queens. There aren't King beds in studios. You may pay if you want more towels (i.e. if you want your towels refreshed every day) or more shampoo (most members report getting them by asking the mousekeepers and not being charged, but there is a provision to charge you). There may be a few more.....

You always see posts on the Resorts Board asking about when was BWV or BCV renovated last because they look like my Grandmother's House and the BWI and BC both look so nice and refined. And there is always someone asking why there isn't two queen beds in the master bedroom of the one bedroom villa. Or why can't they put in bunk beds like at AKL or WL?

 

[lovin'fl]

I have only read the 1st 2 pages of this thread, so forgive me if I'm being repetitive. Here is how I, a DVC owner who has sometimes been a fan and sometimes not been a fan, feel about buying into DVC.

When we bought, in 2006, we were living within a 9 hour drive to WDW and expected to drive there once or twice each year. We bought the cheapest 200 point resale we could find and that was OKW. The 1st couple of years we were very happy about buying...DDP was a great deal and we did not have to pay for airfare and our kids were still kid prices. Then, we moved 5 hours farther away and DDP was no longer a deal (they no longer included apps and tips and prices went up)...it was more break even. We are a family of 5 (all adults now) and to get park tickets and DDP for a week is @$3000. We just, last week, flew there for the 1st time and actually got a great deal, but it cost us @$1000....so we're up to $4000 and then you have to figure in annual MF...cha-ching...cha-ching! Lets just say that we had become dis-enchanted with the Mouse.

But, we let MIL and FIL pay us for use of 1/2 our OKW points...so they get 100/year and we get 100/year (and they pay 1/2 of our annual MF). And we are now buying a 75 point contract at HHI. Our plan will be to go to WDW every 1/3 year...go to HHI every 1/3 year and do a random vacation (like a cruise)every 1/3 year. When we go to HHI, we don't need to buy park passes or DDP (though we'd be going out to eat for dinner each night, but that would cost considerably less than dining at WDW).

We just did a trip to WDW and did not get DDP, but had TIW and I figured out that just for me (I kept track of what I spent on meals)...we saved $100 (TIW card was $75...so you could take 1/5 of that $75 out of what I saved...for $85 savings) from what I would have paid to get DDP for me. I was very pleased to hear that DVC can now get the TIW card w/out having an AP. We will always do TIW from now on. So, with our new plan...we are once again enchanted with the Mouse...or more like enchanted with vacationing at WDW (the Mouse still irks me). We can fly in every third year, stay in a 2BR villa for a week (DS can bring a friend), get TIW card and park passes and have a nice special trip.

I am thinking about selling our 200 OKW points and just buying more at HHI (would like 300 at HHI). For us, that's the best home resort because we can do the big WDW trip when we want to (booking at 7 month window...just can't be too picky on what resort we stay at, though we prefer BWV, BCV or BLT for location) or we can save some $$ and do a beach trip at the tough to get into HHI.

Anyway...I've gone a bit off topic. Buying DVC is not money saving...but it will kind of pre-pay your resort stay in a nice condo...you can pack lighter (and do laundry), cook meals, sleep better if you have kids with you (it's hard to sleep with kids in a hotel room...my kids move around a lot in their sleep and make a lot of noise) and relax in the jetted tub or out on the balcony. And, by the way, DDP is NEVER really free...they just hike up room rates.

So, while the Mouse is forever finding ways to get into our wallets and doesn't seem to really care about keeping the customer happy (cause he knows he's got you, which totally irks me)...DVC is nice to have to make your WDW trip a little better. Don't buy through the Mouse though...go resale to save some $$ (and keep it out of the Mouse's grubby little fingers).

 

[ELMC]

But am wondering if buying DVC will save us any money or are we better off booking during off season with free dining? I have always scored really good deals on airfare booking through AAA with a package and it seems that any trip I've ever planned for anywhere,airfare separate is always more money than what's included in the pacakages. Am a little scared to think about how much airfare on its own might and THEN the addition of the dining plan,as we really enjoy this. We are a family of 5,E kids under 6 and the idea of Disney vacations for quite sometime is appealing. We love to travel and the thought of being able to bring the kids to Europe again but with a lil "disney magic" thrown in is also appealing.
So are we better just stayung non DVC and booking our good deals or investing in DVC?
Thanks for any info/help/opinion in advance!

I am in the process of buying DVC (waiting to pass ROFR) and I can try to answer your questions as well as share with you my thought process that I went through.

1) I don't think that buying DVC is going to save you money, especially if you stay at values or mods. What it can do is give you a better value for each dollar you spend, even if you do end up spending a little more.

2) If you usually stay deluxe, it will take about 7 trips to "break even", that is, realize a cost savings over simply paying for rooms directly. Think about that, because that's a long time. (This is a bit of an oversimplification...but there is a lot of information on Disboards and other website that breaks down the economics of how long it takes to break even, etc).

3) Keep in mind that the dining plan is not free, even when it is. If you look at the numbers, there is little difference between paying full rate for the room and getting free dining and simply getting a discount on the room and paying for food (or dining plan) out of pocket. I understand that some people love the dining plan, and that's cool, especially if you maximize it by ordering the most expensive thing everywhere you go. But in order to get it you have to pay full price for the room, so you would have to do the math to see how much of a deal you are actually getting with the free dining.

4) Given that some of the options (cruises, Adventures by Disney, etc.) are not a good value for using your DVC points, you may very well be better off buying through resale. You won't be able to do the things mentioned above, but you will also pay up to 50% less for your points.

5) I've been to WDW about 9 times over the past 15 years and don't see myself getting tired of it, especially with two little ones. That being said, I bought points based on going once every three years using the following model:

bank year one + use points in year two (vacation year) + borrow points from next year (year three) = one Disney vacation every three years.

That way I'm not feeling pressured to go to WDW every year or else. The points other posters make about extra costs, yearly maintenance fees, ticket prices, souvenirs, etc. are valid.

6) I would like to echo the sentiment of other posters, I would not recommend buying DVC if you have to finance. This is the dictionary definition of disposable income. If you're hesitant to put out the money or are worried about the cost of annual maintenance fees, you might be better off holding back.

7) One positive is that there are many brokers who deal in rented DVC points, so if you weren't going to use your points you could always have the broker rent them for you. You'll end up getting your maintenance fees back plus a little extra.

8) Lastly, it's great that you are doing the research and asking the questions. In the end, only you know what's best for you. Listen to everybody's opinion and then make the decision that you think is best for your family. It took me a year of research/thinking about it before finally deciding to take the plunge. Now I'm waiting for my contract to be finalized and I couldn't be happier.

Hope you found this helpful and good luck!

 

[SabresFan]

3) Keep in mind that the dining plan is not free, even when it is. If you look at the numbers, there is little difference between paying full rate for the room and getting free dining and simply getting a discount on the room and paying for food (or dining plan) out of pocket. I understand that some people love the dining plan, and that's cool, especially if you maximize it by ordering the most expensive thing everywhere you go. But in order to get it you have to pay full price for the room, so you would have to do the math to see how much of a deal you are actually getting with the free dining.

As an example, on our last non-DVC trip, I had first booked a week using a fairly standard PIN code for about a 28% discount on our stay at the Polynesian. I then got a PIN code that gave us free Dining. I switched our reservation to use that, and on the total price of about $4800 for hotel, tickets, and food, we saved - $28. It was better than nothing, and I was glad to get the additional savings, but it's not like getting free dining made it SO much cheaper to go to WDW.

Just remember that when you get free dining, you must also get a length of stay park pass, and you must pay full rack rate for the room. It does save you a few bucks compared to what you'd get it if you just got a more normal discount off a package, but it's not thousands of dollars in savings.

 

[mousefan1972]

As an example, on our last non-DVC trip, I had first booked a week using a fairly standard PIN code for about a 28% discount on our stay at the Polynesian. I then got a PIN code that gave us free Dining. I switched our reservation to use that, and on the total price of about $4800 for hotel, tickets, and food, we saved - $28. It was better than nothing, and I was glad to get the additional savings, but it's not like getting free dining made it SO much cheaper to go to WDW.

Just remember that when you get free dining, you must also get a length of stay park pass, and you must pay full rack rate for the room. It does save you a few bucks compared to what you'd get it if you just got a more normal discount off a package, but it's not thousands of dollars in savings.

The first part of the bolded statement isn't correct. Currently, those who book the free dining package must purchase a minimum of a 2 day base ticket. Not a length of stay pass. It is correct that the price of the room with free dining is full rack rate.