Homeschooling Debate

[sha_lyn]

Well, I'm not trained in the administation and iterpretation of norm-referenced test...so I guess for I should have said for US that means an outside source.

No you do not have to have the test administered by an outside source. You can test in the home as long as it is in consultation with person trained in the administration and interpretation of the test.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I am curious though, how does college look at home schooling? Is it harder to get expected to certain colleges especially since they are looking at so much more than academics now?

It is highly respected.

Now if you just floated through 12 years and Johnny can read and assume he can get in to college--then I think you are mistaken.

If you look at what your child wants to go to school for---prepare them academically for it....the university will not "deduct points" for them being homeschooled.

Plus--homeschool students tend to have more time to volunteer and do other activities. They tend to be very well rounded.

 

[chrissyk]

(Just an FYI--I have not heard that about Hoover....not that anywhere is immune. Holy moly!).

That's good at least! My school was probably extra-special in the bullying regard, being that it was a private school that essentially took on a lot of the kids expelled from public schools for behavioral issues. Of course, the school kept parents out at all costs, so my parents were not aware of this until it was essentially too late. The entire experience made me super-sensitive to the possibility that my own future kids could deal with this garbage in middle school, though.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

One other comment--I think that homeschooled kids should have to be tested yearly by an independent examination to evaluate their progress, just like kids in the public schools. While most homeschooled kids are at or above grade level, we all know that is not always the case. If a child is behind in an area, then the parents are aware of that and can make modifications to their lesson plans. Right now, there are very few states that have any kind of accountability practices for homeschooling.

Again--varies by state....so I cannot argue for that. I like the accountability---but there are some that do the "unschooling" thing (and no I can't define that...b/c I still cannot grasp exactly what that means). It's not for me--but it is for others and it works great. It is very child led. I will follow my child's lead to determine how to structure her curriculum....but I'm not very good into turning her digging holes in the back yard into a science and math class.

My hubby the engineer is comforted that in our state--we are accountable via portfolio review by a certified teacher OR independent testing (Where mom or dad cannot be the test proctor).

I do not know the laws in every state, I can only defend what I can do in my state. I'm a creature of habit....so even if we moved to a state with lesser restrictions--I would probably keep the status quo of record keeping and accountability that I have now.

I think it is a weak argument to say it should be wrong everywhere b/c of a states whose laws are different. Homeschooling is protected in all 50 states...and since how to educate is left to the states...you cannot have a national law and accountability in place for homeschooling....b/c then you have the federal govt stepping in to do the state's job.

 

[sha_lyn]

Per "sheltering", I think that no one is as sheltered from the "real world" like a kid in school. What is "real" about that situation? My real world is nothing like that.

I think most people accept public/private school as "the real world" because it is socially expected to send your child to school. No one questions the artificial atsmophere of a classroom.

Where else in the "real world" are you hearded into a building for 7 hrs a day with those who live near you? Then you are separated by age and not allowed to be around anyone not born within 12 months of you?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I think most people accept public/private school as "the real world" because it is socially expected to send your child to school. No one questions the artificial atsmophere of a classroom.

Where else in the "real world" are you hearded into a building for 7 hrs a day with those who live near you? Then you are separated by age and not allowed to be around anyone not born within 12 months of you?

Or b/c of age---they are separated...forever relegated into 2 separate grades...all b/c one was born on the 30th and the other on the 1st.

 

[meandtheguys2]

The interesting idea is that since we were reared one way, that is the only way and the best way. "I went to public school and I turned out ok..." No one bothers to look at the Big Picture that the public schools are putting out kids who can't read or do basic math, and thus are not the same schools we went to. They are failing miserably. Standardized tests have been dumbed down quietly so that no one feels bad. Self esteem and diversity win out over facts and figures.

 

[Brier Rose]

Also, just curious, but how is the supposed "small" amount of socializing that a homeschooled child gets via outside classes or activities any less than what a child in public or private school get.

Other than a few 10 min. breaks, lunch, and a few passing words in the hall between classes how do they get so much more?

Does it really add that much to be able to just look over at the desk beside you during class and see someone the same age as you, doing the same thing you are?

 

[Nite0wl71]

I find that this is a very interesting thread.

I don't homeschool and I don't know anyone that does. My idea of HS has changed somewhat by reading this. I have always pictured HS as the kids just sitting at the table doing school work and "field trips" were errands that the parents had to run. I didn't realize about the sports and the co-ops.

I remember when my son was in Cub Scouts, they had to work on their badges as a group. This was because one mother came in with her sons book about 3 months after the start of the program and said he had completed every requirement for every badge. There was no way to prove otherwise so they made it a group thing. That's how I thought of Homeschooling, that the parent just decides when the child is at the next grade level.

I have nothing against homeschool, I just wouldn't do it myself. I would think of it the same as working at the same place as my husband.

When kids in middle school can't write an essay or finish a book without reading it aloud with the teacher, then yes, I think we did have a better experience.

I just want to say that essay writing has become of very big part of the curriculum in the past few years. Also the kids read the book out loud together chapter by chapter, not because they can't finish it by themselves, but because they discuss it after each chapter like a book club. It also helps the child with his speaking skills and helps them get comfortable speaking in front of people.

My DD12 goes to public school as did my older four children, but I wouldn't put anyone down no matter how or where their child was taught.

 

[meandtheguys2]

""I remember when my son was in Cub Scouts, they had to work on their badges as a group. This was because one mother came in with her sons book about 3 months after the start of the program and said he had completed every requirement for every badge. There was no way to prove otherwise so they made it a group thing. That's how I thought of Homeschooling, that the parent just decides when the child is at the next grade level."" niteowl

Don't you hate people like that! I went to school with a bunch of recovering alcoholics...talk about compulsive!

 

[JennyMominRI]

It's been a good 20 years since middle school, and I've NEVER run into people like those bullies again. Like I said, many of them found their way to jail. Society has a way of dealing with people like this once they become adults. When they do what they did to me in middle school as adults, it becomes assault and battery, etc. That sometimes lands them in jail, sometimes on probation, and usually on the fringes of society. Might one of their brethren rob me at gunpoint someday? Sure. Otherwise, I don't hang with that crowd and I have no reason to run into them while out in society at large. Sorry, but I did NOT benefit from the experience of being afraid for my physical safety in middle school. It did not teach me anything other than to fear school because the adults wouldn't/couldn't protect me.

th.

I experienced these things myself,for many years.I certainly didn't learn anything from it.It made me shy and timid.I still have problems talking to other women IRL.I am positive I would have been much better off if I had no dealt with all of those years of bullying

 

[JennyMominRI]

It is highly respected.

Now if you just floated through 12 years and Johnny can read and assume he can get in to college--then I think you are mistaken.

If you look at what your child wants to go to school for---prepare them academically for it....the university will not "deduct points" for them being homeschooled.

Plus--homeschool students tend to have more time to volunteer and do other activities. They tend to be very well rounded.

I wanted to add to this
Statistically speaking a homeschooled child has a better chance of getting into a college than a PS child does. If you compare a hundred PS child that apply to Harvard to 100 Homeschooled chidren that apply to Harvard,more homeschooled kids will get in.>Even Ivy League colleges actively recruit homeschoolers

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I wanted to add to this
Statistically speaking a homeschooled child has a better chance of getting into a college than a PS child does. If you compare a hundred PS child that apply to Harvard to 100 Homeschooled chidren that apply to Harvard,more homeschooled kids will get in.>Even Ivy League colleges actively recruit homeschoolers

Good point--I wanted to say something similar..but didn't have a firm fact on hand. Just stuff I heard.

 

[sha_lyn]

Also, just curious, but how is the supposed "small" amount of socializing that a homeschooled child gets via outside classes or activities any less than what a child in public or private school get.

Other than a few 10 min. breaks, lunch, and a few passing words in the hall between classes how do they get so much more?

Does it really add that much to be able to just look over at the desk beside you during class and see someone the same age as you, doing the same thing you are?

I wonder about the samething. I really think most think back to when they were in school and really don't know how little socialization goes on in PS today.

I can of course only speak from our experience. DS attended PS K-6. K-2 wasn't too bad but we moved for 3rd grade. In the new school lunch,bus duty and the ride on the bus were silent and by assigned seats. There wasn't recess, and PE was structured.

 

[auntpolly]

I wanted to add to this
Statistically speaking a homeschooled child has a better chance of getting into a college than a PS child does. If you compare a hundred PS child that apply to Harvard to 100 Homeschooled chidren that apply to Harvard,more homeschooled kids will get in.>Even Ivy League colleges actively recruit homeschoolers

In my DD's private school, it was the Koreans that had a better chance of getting into the good schools - not to bash Koreans, but the ones at DD's school made sacrifices to get this way that I thought were not good. I'd trade Harvard for a more enriching, well rounded educational experience.

 

[JennyMominRI]

I wonder about the samething. I really think most think back to when they were in school and really don't know how little socialization goes on in PS today.

I can of course only speak from our experience. DS attended PS K-6. K-2 wasn't too bad but we moved for 3rd grade. In the new school lunch,bus duty and the ride on the bus were silent and by assigned seats. There wasn't recess, and PE was structured.

Well see, When the school day ended from my homeschooled kids ,I did an amazing thing. I opened the door and let them play outside.. Since the school students all came from the same area, my kids were outside playing with the exact same kids they would see at school..They had just as many friends then as they did when they went to school

 

[auntpolly]

I wonder about the samething. I really think most think back to when they were in school and really don't know how little socialization goes on in PS today.
.

This was not true at my DDs private school (or hers before HS) or her friends' public schools. Just not true - there was lots of socialization!

 

[Pinnie]

I wanted to add to this
Statistically speaking a homeschooled child has a better chance of getting into a college than a PS child does. If you compare a hundred PS child that apply to Harvard to 100 Homeschooled chidren that apply to Harvard,more homeschooled kids will get in.>Even Ivy League colleges actively recruit homeschoolers

I am doing some reasearch on this topic for my MS. Could you please give me the source for this statistic?

Thanks

pinnie

 

[JennyMominRI]

In my DD's private school, it was the Koreans that had a better chance of getting into the good schools - not to bash Koreans, but the ones at DD's school made sacrifices to get this way that I thought were not good. I'd trade Harvard for a more enriching, well rounded educational experience.

I wouldn't want to go to Harvard myself..It's a bit stuffy for me.. I used it as an example,to point out that homeschooled kids often get into top schools..

 

[auntpolly]

I wouldn't want to go to Harvard myself..It's a bit stuffy for me.. I used it as an example,to point out that homeschooled kids often get into top schools..

I understand, but I used the Korean kids to show that what you have to do to get to a top school is often - debatebly - of value.

There are some kids that are just meant for Yale. You saw it when they were in 1st grade. They'd have gone there if they'd gone anywhere to school. It's the one's who are on some kind of "program for success" that their parents have dreamed up for them to get them into Yale (whether it be a home school parent or a PS parent) are the ones that I worry about.