High School:Good Grades vs. Challenging Classes

[Christine]

I'm reading this thread closely because my DS will be applying to all the same schools your DD is. I think his top choices are JMU and GMU. He will probably try for VCU and CNU as well. If he doesn't get into one of those, I don't know what we will do. He doesn't want to go to Tech (whew!) and the private schools are out of our reach. Keep us posted on your DD.

Good luck to him and tell him to KEEP THOSE GRADES UP!!!!

 

[Skatermom23]

Good luck to him and tell him to KEEP THOSE GRADES UP!!!!

He does okay. But like so many others we are caught in that "higher GPA or AP classes" problem. He decided to go the AP route but his grades have suffered. I can't fault him either because we are on that ridiculous grading scale of 100-94 A, 93-86 B, 85- 78 C, 77-70 D. So when he brings home a 81% in an AP class but it shows as a C on his report card...how can I fault him for that? The guidance counselors claims that the colleges, especially in Virginia, understand this and take it into consideration, but I wonder. The stress of all this is enough to drive you insane!

 

[punkin]

He does okay. But like so many others we are caught in that "higher GPA or AP classes" problem. He decided to go the AP route but his grades have suffered. I can't fault him either because we are on that ridiculous grading scale of 100-94 A, 93-86 B, 85- 78 C, 77-70 D. So when he brings home a 79% in an AP class but it shows as a C on his report card...how can I fault him for that? The guidance counselors claims that the colleges, especially in Virginia, understand this and take it into consideration, but I wonder. The stress of all this is enough to drive you insane!

A 79% is a C in Montgomery county too, but in an AP class that would be weighted to a B.

 

[agnes!]

He does okay. But like so many others we are caught in that "higher GPA or AP classes" problem. He decided to go the AP route but his grades have suffered. I can't fault him either because we are on that ridiculous grading scale of 100-94 A, 93-86 B, 85- 78 C, 77-70 D. So when he brings home a 81% in an AP class but it shows as a C on his report card...how can I fault him for that? The guidance counselors claims that the colleges, especially in Virginia, understand this and take it into consideration, but I wonder. The stress of all this is enough to drive you insane!

You have the same grading scale that Fairfax County used to? Ack.

agnes!

 

[golfgal]

I'm reading this thread closely because my DS will be applying to all the same schools your DD is. I think his top choices are JMU and GMU. He will probably try for VCU and CNU as well. If he doesn't get into one of those, I don't know what we will do. He doesn't want to go to Tech (whew!) and the private schools are out of our reach. Keep us posted on your DD.

Keep in mind that private schools have a lot more money to give and often end up costing less then public schools. Don't discount them automatically or you may end up paying more for school then you should.

 

[Christine]

He does okay. But like so many others we are caught in that "higher GPA or AP classes" problem. He decided to go the AP route but his grades have suffered. I can't fault him either because we are on that ridiculous grading scale of 100-94 A, 93-86 B, 85- 78 C, 77-70 D. So when he brings home a 81% in an AP class but it shows as a C on his report card...how can I fault him for that? The guidance counselors claims that the colleges, especially in Virginia, understand this and take it into consideration, but I wonder. The stress of all this is enough to drive you insane!

Uuuuggghhh! I'm thinking that it's not going to matter. My DD is on the same grading scale. Yep, her Chemistry class would not have been a failure had we been on the other scale. I know that all those colleges are seeing is that big FAT "F". I doubt they are saying "Oh, but you know she was a student in *Virginia* and, well, you know how much more rigorous they are there." Nope, not thinking that's the case.

I will say that I have "inside" information on the WVU rejection my DD first got. All they did was look at the bottom number. They didn't rate the "rigor" at all.

 

[PlutoPony]

Christine -

We hear very positive comments from kids around us that go to WVU! Nice size school, good variety of major available, and just far enough away to get home when they want. Haven't heard a lot about how hard the school is once you're in, but don't think they lose more than the usual number of students due to grades...

Hope it works out for your daughter

 

[tar heel]

Teaching is such a hard profession to go into right now. You are looking at 700-800 applicants per open position if you can even find an open position.

Some say ECE is even harder to find a position versus other certs. I have two certs, perfect grades from a well established teaching university and great rec letters and I still can't find a position.

I would say get out now from teaching... it's best.

Not in North Carolina. My school system recruits heavily out-of-state (we have a lot of SUNY grads) b/c our universities are not producing enough teachers to replace those retiring. We also have an extensive lateral entry program for people without teaching degrees but years of experience in something else. For example, one of our friends is teaching high school English after 30 years as a newspaper reporter. She had a good idea what she was geting into since her husband, the engineer, teaches high school math.

I expect our economic slowdown to curb the teacher shortage somewhat -- people will stop coming from California and New York if there are not jobs -- but this is still going to be a place where teachers with good credentials are going to get hired. Isn't this the case in much of Virginia, too?

 

[Skatermom23]

A 79% is a C in Montgomery county too, but in an AP class that would be weighted to a B.

I mistyped the 79%...I meant to say 81%. What really kills me is when he gets the 84 or 85% and it still comes up as a C or a weighted B in an AP class. That same 84% would have been a B or a weighted A on a ten point scale! It is enough to drive a normal person nutty!

 

[Skatermom23]

Uuuuggghhh! I'm thinking that it's not going to matter. My DD is on the same grading scale. Yep, her Chemistry class would not have been a failure had we been on the other scale. I know that all those colleges are seeing is that big FAT "F". I doubt they are saying "Oh, but you know she was a student in *Virginia* and, well, you know how much more rigorous they are there." Nope, not thinking that's the case.

I will say that I have "inside" information on the WVU rejection my DD first got. All they did was look at the bottom number. They didn't rate the "rigor" at all.

I know, I can't imagine, with all the applications they get, that they have the time to go through them that carefully. I bet most just look at the numbers unless something else catches their eye. It is rumored that we are going to go to a ten point scale next year. Have you heard anything about it in your county? However that worries me as well. My DS is a Junior this year and these are the grades that will be used. I wish they would go back in and change them all ...now that would be nice.

 

[Christine]

I know, I can't imagine, with all the applications they get, that they have the time to go through them that carefully. I bet most just look at the numbers unless something else catches their eye. It is rumored that we are going to go to a ten point scale next year. Have you heard anything about it in your county? However that worries me as well. My DS is a Junior this year and these are the grades that will be used. I wish they would go back in and change them all ...now that would be nice.

I think the only colleges that really pick apart those Fairfax grades are places like UVA and William & Mary or the ones that are REALLY hard to get into. I do believe that they really examine each and every candidate they pull into those schools and then weight them against each other.

The VCU's, ODU's, Radford's, and the like don't necessarily do so. I heard back so fast from three schools that I know that didn't look hard nor did they even look at her senior grades (which were so much better) or even wait for her semester grades (which the school) mailed to come in and be part of the package.

I live in Prince William and I haven't heard a word on what they are doing. They are very similar to Fairfax's system; however, I think an A starts at 93 versus 94. They also weight their GPA, but I'm not hearing that matters so who knows.

My daughter attends Catholic school in Fairfax--93 is an A there also; however, they do not do weighted GPAs. Her AP class has not done anything for her in the GPA area.

I think the Catholic schools have always been on this scale and I haven't heard that they will be changing. Kind of bothers me.

 

[Skatermom23]

I think the only colleges that really pick apart those Fairfax grades are places like UVA and William & Mary or the ones that are REALLY hard to get into. I do believe that they really examine each and every candidate they pull into those schools and then weight them against each other.

The VCU's, ODU's, Radford's, and the like don't necessarily do so. I heard back so fast from three schools that I know that didn't look hard nor did they even look at her senior grades (which were so much better) or even wait for her semester grades (which the school) mailed to come in and be part of the package.

I live in Prince William and I haven't heard a word on what they are doing. They are very similar to Fairfax's system; however, I think an A starts at 93 versus 94. They also weight their GPA, but I'm not hearing that matters so who knows.

My daughter attends Catholic school in Fairfax--93 is an A there also; however, they do not do weighted GPAs. Her AP class has not done anything for her in the GPA area.

I think the Catholic schools have always been on this scale and I haven't heard that they will be changing. Kind of bothers me.

Ds really wants JMU. I'm not sure how close they look. If they just look at the bottom line, he won't get in. If they examine his stuff, he might. We don't know anyone who has applied there recently. Most kids in our area go to Tech or William and Mary. Neither of which he wants.

 

[agnes!]

Ds really wants JMU. I'm not sure how close they look. If they just look at the bottom line, he won't get in. If they examine his stuff, he might. We don't know anyone who has applied there recently. Most kids in our area go to Tech or William and Mary. Neither of which he wants.

Wow, you know some *really* smart kids. Tech or Wm & Mary? I'm trying to think if I know anyone who is an alumni of JMU or even just applied there....I don't think I do.

To everyone who has come up against their school system's flawed grading systems? Seriously, take a look at Fairgrade's website at http://www.fairgrade.org/. *Everyone* except these parents said it couldn't be done, but they fought "City Hall" and they won. It might be too late for some of our kids, but maybe some of us can get things changed for their younger siblings. In our case I do wish the changes could have been made a year or two earlier - my DD would have a perfect GPA. It's doing pretty ok *now*, but it would have been truly stellar.

We must have a bunch of rabble-rousers in this county. The start-time for our high-school kids is now supposedly going to be tweaked to a slightly later time, that's another thing that people said "couldn't be done". School now starts at 7:30, it's supposedly going to change to 8:00.

agnes!

 

[PlutoPony]

Wow, you know some *really* smart kids. Tech or Wm & Mary? I'm trying to think if I know anyone who is an alumni of JMU or even just applied there..

Don't know anyone who went to JMU last year, but do from years before. Last I hear they were fairly selective - I'm thinking 3.7+ - but I could be wrong. Many more girls than boys at that school I think, so being male may be a plus.....

To everyone who has come up against their school system's flawed grading systems? Seriously, take a look at Fairgrade's website at http://www.fairgrade.org/.

Well, Prince William does like to emulate Fairfax, so that gives us hope fthat a grade scale change may come at some point. There's a big on-line petition going around now (Christine - have you seen it on your end of the county? Let me know if you want the link to it) and the people who are behind know how to get things done. Any change to the start time is further off... I'm on a county-wide committee that among other things, gives recommendations to the Superintendent about stuff and this subject has just been put on our agenda. But it was emphasized that they don't expect any action in the short term, if ever. We'll see. Our HS start times are even earlier - more like 7:10 and 7:20

We're still going back and forth about where DS will go to HS. None of his top 3 choices is optimal, and with looming budget cuts (there will be some cuts of upper level classes) it's hard to say which school will end up being hurt the least. Plus he has no clue what he wants to do in life (perfectly reasonable at this point imo). So we're not sure the best academic option is a great fit - it's a very heavy science program/school and it's not where his interests lie at this time. He should be able to handle it academically but he'd likely be gutting it out at an overcrowded school that's a lengthy bus ride away, in a program that probably doesn't interest him. But he'd have access to like 20 AP classes and a nice variety of math/'science classes. In the end I suspect he'll end up at his base school that has minimal AP classes available, so he would most likely be coming out of HS with great grades (or the potential for that ) in regular college prep classes. Then it's a question of how to get into college with this combination I guess...

Hard to guess the future, isn't it.....

 

[agnes!]

Yes, it is hard to guess the future PlutoPony.

I also tend to think that those of us who live in Northern Virginia are at a disadvantage when it comes to college admissions, sometimes colleges try to get folks in from different places around the country kwim? If two identical candidates are applying and one is from Northern Virginia and one is from around Lynchburg or Roanoke somewhere - sat Southwestern Virginia, who do you think would get the nod? There are so many kids applying from this area, it kind of works against them as a group.

agnes!

 

[punkin]

There are so many kids applying from this area, it kind of works against them as a group.

agnes!

This is true for the Northeast as a whole and all of the DC suburbs. If my DD16 was applying from Wyoming with her grades and advance classes, she would have no real trouble.

 

[agnes!]

...There are so many kids applying from this area, it kind of works against them as a group.

agnes!

This is true for the Northeast as a whole and all of the DC suburbs. If my DD16 was applying from Wyoming with her grades and advance classes, she would have no real trouble.

Kind of sad, isn't it.

Hey, maybe we should all rent a house in Wyoming somewhere and claim it as our residence... just *kidding*. Kind of .

agnes!

 

[PlutoPony]

I also tend to think that those of us who live in Northern Virginia are at a disadvantage when it comes to college admissions, sometimes colleges try to get folks in from different places around the country kwim?

I heard at one time that UVA tries to some extent to balance out entry from all VA counties. Somel people supposedly moved a little further out (like Rappahannock) and that made it much easier for their kids to be admitted since they were judged against kids from their county more than the entrance pool as a whole. IT was interesting to hear because the outer counties didn't typically have much in the way of AP class and general rigor in the HS curriculum (that's probably not as much the case now) so you were trading off HS rigor for a better chance at the best state schools . I've been told Fauquier used to be like that but no more.

This may all be urban legend so take it with a grain of salt.....

 

[Skatermom23]

For those of you in Fairfax...I found this.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/02/AR2009010202430.html

 

[Christine]

Ds really wants JMU. I'm not sure how close they look. If they just look at the bottom line, he won't get in. If they examine his stuff, he might. We don't know anyone who has applied there recently. Most kids in our area go to Tech or William and Mary. Neither of which he wants.

One of my DD's friends just got into JMU. I asked her what type of student she was and she said "Well, she's just one of those where everything comes really easy to her and she does really well in school." I'm pretty sure that she has a fairly high GPA (my DD said she's one of the really "smart ones") and of couse she's involved in all sorts of things. I don't have any real details though, but my DD was totally not surprised she got in.