Help with anger issues in 5 year old

[pperfectmom]

I am definitely not someone that asks advice from total strangers but I am at my wit's end. My son, who is turning six next week, is driving us insane. He has always been a difficult, willful child but it has gotten so much worse lately. Every little thing turns into total drama. Just getting him ready for school in the morning exhausts me. He won't eat his breakfast. He won't get dressed. He screams if his sister even looks at him. He is constantly freaking out over the littlest thing and throwing an absolute fit complete with screaming, crying and name calling. We try to send him to his room, a fit ensues and he slams the door when we finally get him to go. We have very rarely ever had to spank either of them but my DH has resorted to it lately just because nothing else works. It is starting to put strain on our marriage just because things get so tense and loud during these episodes. Strangely enough, he seems to have no problems at school and his kindergarten teacher loves him. We try our best to talk to him and convince him that he needs to try a little harder to be good but it goes in one ear and out the other. Any ideas on what we could do differently?

 

[sam_gordon]

A couple things we've done...

1) Have a 'good choice chart'. He gets a sticker every day he behaves (you decide whether he qualifies or not). If he gets 10 stickers, he gets something special (maybe a toy, maybe a trip to McDonalds, maybe a special treat). You can decide if he acts up if he has to start back at 0 again.
2) Tell him his acting up must mean he's tired. Send him to bed 30 minutes early. If he acts up going to bed, it's another 30 minutes earlier the next night. You can decide if you want to allow him to play quietly or if he needs to be in bed. Might mean taking toys out of his room.

Good luck.

 

[pperfectmom]

Those are a couple of good ideas to try. Not sure about the earlier bedtime but it's worth a shot. I do know that he has to be tired a lot because the kids has not slept well(and therefore neither have we)since the little varmint was born. He was never a good napper and to this day, will wake up at night and moan or yell for us to come down there several times a week. You'd think he was still a newborn.

 

[Miss Peach]

My sympathies!!

My daughter was having very similar problems with one of her daughters. At six years old she was still throwing tantrums--regularly. Getting hysterical, completely out of proportion, over minor issues. The entire family was being pulled through a knothole backwards!!

I suggested that my daughter keep a chart of her dd's behavior. And after about four weeks a pattern emerged!!

The tantrums were worst following pizza nights. That led her to experiment with a gluten free diet. Voila!! That was the issue!

It has been about six weeks of gluten free and although it is more expensive, and a pain to make special meals for one person in a large household, the pay off has been worth it.

My granddaughter is so much calmer. Handles life much more smoothly.

You might try it, it may be what is bothering your son.

Good luck,

Cathy

 

[mrsr2ro]

My sympathies!!

My daughter was having very similar problems with one of her daughters. At six years old she was still throwing tantrums--regularly. Getting hysterical, completely out of proportion, over minor issues. The entire family was being pulled through a knothole backwards!!

I suggested that my daughter keep a chart of her dd's behavior. And after about four weeks a pattern emerged!!

The tantrums were worst following pizza nights. That led her to experiment with a gluten free diet. Voila!! That was the issue!

It has been about six weeks of gluten free and although it is more expensive, and a pain to make special meals for one person in a large household, the pay off has been worth it.

My granddaughter is so much calmer. Handles life much more smoothly.

You might try it, it may be what is bothering your son.

Good luck,

Cathy

I couldn't agree with this more -- maybe it's the scientist in me, but definitely keep a chart of sleep, food, etc and see if any patterns emerge. It definitely sounds like there is some factor messing him up - be it diet, sleep, too much screen time, etc.

 

[bigmama67]

So sorry to hear this - I understand completely! My DS was having these issues in first grade. There was a lot going on - we moved, so he changed schools and was "the new kid" - my DD who he adored since she was born, was getting older and more into his stuff...we actually did some short-term counseling and he has settled down very well this year.

I have two suggestions:

1. The spanking does NOT help - it teaches the recipient that it's OK to do something in anger if you're bigger. I know it's hard! There were times I would grab DS' arm harder than I meant to, or I would slap him back if he hit me...it just makes things worse (plus I felt horrible about it too!)

2. Time-outs can (should) be used for calming down and getting your head together...and they are useful for the parent(s) and the child. Explain as calmly and unemotionally as possible that "We need to calm ourselves down " or "We need a break," however you want to say it, and separate. The child can choose their time-out spot - it doesn't have to be a chair. Our friends' DD who is VERY emotional used to go sit on the back steps. It got to where, before the age of six, she used to tell her parents if she needed a minute, and take herself! If you have to choose a time-out place, don't make it any place which should be a comfort for them (like a bedroom)...plus they're likely to just play or read there. Reiterate as needed that once they can be calm and respectful, they can get out and then it's over. Repeat as necessary.

One last thing that my friend (whose children are grown) constantly stresses to me (and it's finally sunk in...mostly, LOL...) is that the punishment, if necessary, should fit the crime. If he talks back to you now and you take away a week of television, it doesn't logically connect in the child's head. If he won't clean his room and he wants to watch TV, you inform him that once he cleans his room you can discuss his TV privileges but until it's done they are suspended. (Hope this makes sense). If you want, offer to help him - always be specific about your expectations. (I tell DS, "Make your bed" or "Put away your Lego".)

I highly, highly recommend a book called 1-2-3 Magic which explains this technique beautifully and gives the child parameters in the form of a countdown - "three strikes". It stresses the importance of being non-emotional and non-punitive.

 

[brergnat]

Talk to the pediatrican and rule out any medical causes of sleep issues (sleep apnea, enlarged tonsils/adenoids, and any possible dietary issues). Then, ask for a referral to a child psychologist. These doctors have a way of figuring out what's troubling young kids, through games, drawings, etc.

The fact that he is a different child at home and school says a LOT! I have one of those, (he's about to turn 5), but he is plagued by speech issues and lots of sensory processing dysfunction. It's not his fault, most of the time. However, he tries to control as much as he can in our home environment because he feels "out of control" of his body most of the time. And, since he cannot communicate as effectively as he wants to, he gets frustrated a lot! At school, he mostly just "sucks it up", and then when he is home, he is free to "let loose", so we deal with the worst behavior.

Spanking won't help. It is basically a form of imposing your will on a child who is trying to impose HIS will on you. It's essentially locking horns in battle, if you will. If you respond to his behavior with negative behavior of your own, you are modeling that behavior and, essentially, telling him that it's okay to react that way. It sends a mixed signal.

Let him make his choices. If he doesn't want to eat breakfast, don't make him. If he doesn't want to get dressed, send him to school in his PJ's. My son went through that phase, and the SECOND I said "well, I guess you will go to school in your pajamas today", he jumped up and got dressed, and it has never been a problem since. If he is dawdling, I simply say "are you going to wear your pj's to school today, or get dressed?" He makes the right choice. Similarly, with breakfast, I put it on the table. I tell him "we are leaving for school in 10 min. If you don't eat your breakfast, you won't eat again until lunch." He eats his breakfast every morning...

Your son might simply have a problem with time management. Not all kids are born knowing how to do this. You have to teach them. Get a timer. Make signs indicating the steps that need to be done for different things during the day, and remind him (a few minutes early) what is going to be happening next. For example, we can't simply tell our kids "bathtime". They will both have a FIT. But, if we say, "bathtime is in five minutes" and we remind them every minute until it's been 5 minutes, they do much better with the transition. We might say "after you finish that puzzle (or whatever), it's bathtime." You have to be really simplistic and concrete sometimes.

Try to stay calm. I know it's rough. Good luck!

 

[mom2att]

Read this book:

The Explosive Child by Ross W. Greene

It helped me understand my son a lot better and gave me strategies for how to help him.

 

[ADKSPiette]

We have similar issues with our DD turning 4.

We worked with a Child Behavioral Specialist, who provided us with ideas - reward charts, etc. But it was always a short-lived solution. She'd figure it out and then the good behavior would turn bad.

We changed daycares and brought her to the school department for pre-school screening to see if there were developmental issues. You betcha there were - She is advanced intellectually, but slightly below average for maturity. We found a facility that worked with "peer models" in the classroom. The director had DD interact with older children who were more mature to teach my daughter how to "act" like a big kid, and since she was with older kids, she was getting the "Intellectual" stimulation she needed.

It wasn't the entire solution because we had to work with a facility with additional behavioral specialists. I have read the "Love and Logic Parenting book" which is helpful in teaching consequences in a loving manner, rather than scolding,yelling, etc.

I think you're moving in the right direction recognizing the issue.
You may want to chart when the behavior takes place. I have noticed that on the weekends, we have to keep to the same snack schedule as the daycare. By 11:00 I can sense my DD melting down and it's because she needs a boost of "FOOD ENERGY." Also, around the full moon, I SWEAR my kids start going off the wall about 2 days before and the day after the full moon. i have been charting this with my oldest for about 2 years now and it NEVER fails!

With my oldest, bedtime was always 8:00 pm, and gradually each week I would decrease it by 5 minutes - nothing major. Now she goes to bed around 7:30 and she definitely wakes up more refreshed.

Sometimes it's just small changes to their routine that can make a more positive impact.
Good luck.

 

[robinb]

I could have written this 6 years ago (and probably did) ... all the way down to the spanking. It worked for a little while but then my DD would just shrug it off and I felt myself escalating the force until I got a hold of myself and stopped. Nothing worked. Time outs didn't work, even when I put a lock on the door. Charts didn't work because she does not have the desire to please me or her father. Toys or candy or treats didn't call to her. FWIW, so was also a difficult one to potty train. She was ready when she was ready and that was all there was to it. I FINALLY found her "currency" when she was older. TV time and play dates did the trick but she still has problems in dealing with disappointment and frustration.

Good luck with your son. I guess I would also second having him seen by a psychologist. We set aside some medical money so my 11-year old can finally be seen for her continuing anger/frustration problems.

As an aside, I do have to snicker a bit over your user name. I used to call people who bragged about their well behaved children who only needed "the look" given to them to toe the line "Practically Perfect Parents". I was NEVER one of them .

 

[pperfectmom]

Robinb, this username has plagued me ever since I chose it. My dd was in a Mary Poppins phase and I thought it funny since I am the farthest thing from a "perfect" mom you would ever find. I always hoped that no one really thought that I felt that way.

Thanks for the advice from all of you. I am going to try some of the ideas like the chart and try to find a couple of these books to read. I don't think I am quite ready to commit to the thought of seeing a therapist or doctor about it. I'm afraid of the over tendency of the medical community in diagnosing ADD and medicating kids and I certainly don't want that. I am also hoping to talk to his teacher sometime soon. The last meeting we had I made sure to ask her about his behavior and she had no concerns at all. Most kids I know DO act a whole lot better at school than for their parents, so I don't think that in itself is strange. My daughter can also be a PITA at home and she does great in school as well. I always have to ask the teachers, "Are you sure you're talking about MY kids?". The difference with her is that she is a nice, sweet girl most of the time and can be reasoned with. I guess at the bottom of it all that is what drives me the nuttiest about my son-the fact that I can't reason with him or get him to even listen to us. It does help to know I'm not the only one out there.

 

[ccgirl]

The biggest thing to remember is different things work for different children. You have to find what works best for your child. Most things didn't work for my DD. Then...I realized if she had to earn t.v. time, play dates etc with good behavior that worked well for her. A slammed door gets the door taken off the hinge in my house. When my DD talked back she got soap in her mouth. My son is totally different, for him spanking seems to help. I am not saying these are the "right" answers only what worked for my child. Good luck, I remember how stressful it was.

 

[princessmom29]

Sounds like attention seeking to me. I had to deal with this with DD when she was about 3. The bst advice anyone ever gave me is "Don't feed the tantrum" Just walk away and do not engage when he is behaving that way. He wants the attention of you trying to clam him down, appease him, get him into his room ect. If his tantrum is not getting "fed" it will wither and die.

 

[robinb]

Sounds like attention seeking to me. I had to deal with this with DD when she was about 3. The bst advice anyone ever gave me is "Don't feed the tantrum" Just walk away and do not engage when he is behaving that way. He wants the attention of you trying to clam him down, appease him, get him into his room ect. If his tantrum is not getting "fed" it will wither and die.

Again, each child is different. "Walk away from the tantrum" is popular advise that I have read in every single book on raising children but does not work for everyone. Consider yourself lucky the standard advise worked for you because it certainly did not work for me!

I did seek the help of a counselor who suggested we use a chart . I should have seen a neuro psych earlier but like the OP I didn't want my DD "labeled" ADD or ADHD or any other acronym. At this time, I don't care what label they might give her as long as I can help her get a better handle on her emotions that still veer out of control.

 

[rchristiansen]

Our DD, now 8, used to be that way - I was at my wits end when she was in kindergarten. At that time, I had no idea what to do - I thought I was just a horrible parent and couldn't figure it out.

Then I stumbled upon this book (I don't even remember where I discovered it) and it turned everything upside down. We still have a few of those outbursts, but we know how to react to them and we have been able to prevent the majority.

This book is a quick and easy read and I HIGHLY recommend it. There are many example stories in the book that I could relate to.

"The Explosive Child: A New Approach for Understanding and Parenting Easily Frustrated, Chronically Inflexible Children"

http://www.amazon.com/Explosive-Child-Understanding-Frustrated-Chronically/dp/0060931027


PM me if you want.

 

[1Mouse2RulethemAll]

Strangely enough, he seems to have no problems at school and his kindergarten teacher loves him. We try our best to talk to him and convince him that he needs to try a little harder to be good but it goes in one ear and out the other. Any ideas on what we could do differently?

I highlighted something important you said in bold. I don't want to offend you, but you really need to quit "talking" to him to "convince" him to try harder. You need to "tell" him to behave or face the consequences. Ask his teacher what kind of disciple is used at school when a kid misbehaves. Do they use time-outs or keep them in from recess; and follow a similar punishment at home. Say the school uses time-outs, then make a timeout spot at home. You give one warning and if he does it again, immediately put him in time-out and keep him there for 1 minute per his age.

Supernanny is a major advocate of this method and you might want to see her show. (BTW I do not advocate learning parenting skills solely from TV, I have a resource with 35 yrs in childcare to call on for advice.)

Good luck.

 

[brergnat]

I don't think I am quite ready to commit to the thought of seeing a therapist or doctor about it. I'm afraid of the over tendency of the medical community in diagnosing ADD and medicating kids and I certainly don't want that. .

This type of attitude is the reason why so many kids don't end up getting the help they need early on, or sometimes ever.

I didn't suggest going to look for a "diagnosis". I suggested RULING OUT a medical condition for the behavior (LOTS of medical issues can cause behavioral problems). And, Psychologists are not authorized to prescribe medications. What they do is try to figure out the root of the behavior, and help YOU with ways to deal with it.

And, there is nothing wrong with a "label". That's all it is. It doesn't change who your child is, but it is a pathway to getting help. Is it better for an alcoholic to never admit to being an alcoholic, and continuing down a destructive path, OR is it better to own the "label", and seek help?

Both my children have "a label" (Autism). It's the best thing that I've ever done for them, as a parent (i.e. seeking help from the medical community to figure out what was wrong with my children). It has allowed them to begin getting assistance (at NO cost to us, at this point in time), since the very early days that we knew something was wrong (around 15 months of age). They have received thousands of hours of therapy, intervention services, and special education placement for school. Without this assistance, I would probably have been committed to a mental hospital and my kids...I shudder to think what they might have become had we not gotten them help early on.

For the record, neither of my children are on any medications. We have dealt with their various issues with techniques and suggestions given to us through books, therapists, and teachers. However, in the future, I suspect medications might be necessary, and that's just fine with me. It is known that faulty biochemistry is the root of most of the "symptoms" of behavioral disorders, and without drug therapy (sometimes), no amount of other interventions can help.

 

[Maggie'sMom]

I will add yet another recommendation for The Explosive Child by Ross Greene.

My DD has bipolar disorder and sensory processing problems. She started throwing fits at just 1 year old that were off the charts. We started working with a child psychologist when she was 4 and the psychologist recommended The Explosive Child. It helped a lot, but wasn't a solution. We had to take the step of a full evaluation and ended up with the BPD diagnosis.

A big difference between my DD and your DS is that my DD had major problems in all environments. She couldn't hold it together in school any better than she could at home.

I would highly recommend you consult with your DS's pediatrician and contact a child psychologist. You may be able to improve the situation through structured behavior mod, sticker charts, and the like. But there might also be something more going on. Since this is serious enough that it's putting a strain on your marriage, I wouldn't wait to contact the doctor.

 

[rchristiansen]

I don't want to offend you, but you really need to quit "talking" to him to "convince" him to try harder. You need to "tell" him to behave or face the consequences.

Good luck.

I will respectfully disagree with you. This does not work. I think the big point the OP mentioned is how they have tried everything to change the behavior.

I 100% understand what you are going through. On the outside it looks like you have a really bratty kid (You may even find yourself jealous of other parents who have "normal" kids or get very angry that no one understands you and they might judge you), but what we have learned is that this type of explosive behavior is not about discipline or "being bad" - it is linked to emotions. We learned there is a clear difference between when our daughter has these explosive episodes and when she is just being naughty. Our daughter has consequences when she is being sassy or naughty. However, the emotional explosions require preventative maintenance and a very different reaction than discipline.

One thing also is that many of these explosive children CAN keep it all bottle inside while at school. Not because they are just behaving better, but because of their emotions. Then at home they "explode".

Once we learned what to do at home (using most of the techniques in "The Explosive Child" book -- at it took quite a bit of time and effort) things changed DRAMATICALLY at home. I can't even begin to explain. However, our daughter then experienced the opposite - she was having these explosive episodes at school and even the school administrators were at their wits end -- it was an emotional time for all involved.

We now over many years have worked with the school and have developed a plan that includes the opportunity for our daughter to remove herself, without question or disciplinary consequences, from any situation that she feels may cause her to have this sort of explosion. We have the support of ALL the teachers, the guidance counselor, school nurse and most importantly the principal.

Another thing I will say is this is A LOT of work. Don't give up.

I read over the other replies and noted that some mentioned how some children's certain behavior's all of a sudden occurred. You mentioned your son has always been difficult. The same was true for our daughter. I just assumed her behavior at age 2, 3 and 4 was all due to being a preschooler --- boy was I wrong! Parents of "normal" preschoolers had it easy compared to what I went through.

I agree if it was a "new" behavior, then to consider the physical aspects - food allergies, etc. But I can not recommend the techniques in that book strong enough --- here are some more links to Dr. Greene's work: http://www.livesinthebalance.org/

 

[rchristiansen]

This type of attitude is the reason why so many kids don't end up getting the help they need early on, or sometimes ever.

I didn't suggest going to look for a "diagnosis".....

Yes, we also used a counselor to deal with not only the explosive behavior, but also for the whole host of issues that go along with gifted children.

Seek out help from the school - they should have a school psychologist or guidance counselor on staff.