HELP: My sister thinks I'm ripping her off, am I?

[kidzrus]

I am not a DVC member, but was wondering if you could help me.

My sister and I have been talking for a while about each of us bringing our kids down to Disney World (She has a 5 yr.old and a 3 yr old. I have a 3 yr old and a newborn). I love the Beach Club but realized we could not afford to split a suite and we are still trying to scrape together the money for DVC. My sister and I had always talked about going down in October, especially for the Halloween party. My sister does not know much about Disney World, so she was leaving it up to me to make the initial plans.

Well, we have neighbors who are owners at the Boardwalk Villas who had a reservation for the last week of October at the Beach Club Villas. They are having financial problems and were going to have to cancel or rent but, after discussing with my sister, we decided to take their reservation. They charged us $2800 for 7 nights for a 2BR at the Beach Club, which is apparently what they would get if they offered the reservation on the internet. Based on my reasonable knowledge of Disney this seemed like a good deal for 8 people. It would be $200 per night for each of us, my sister and me.

Well, a couple of days after saying yes to my neighbors, my very irate sister called to tell me that, based upon discussions with her friends, "she" is getting ripped off by this deal. She implied that either I don't know what I'm doing, or I am charging her more than half of what I am paying my neighbors. My sister, who has never been to Disney, said that she knows for a fact that this is a terrible deal for "sharing a room". When I explained to her (AGAIN) that we would each have our own room and bathroom and just share a common area, she exploded again, saying that she didn't want to "pay extra" to share a "whatever you want to call it" with us (This hurt as we had always discussed getting the cousins together as a priority) When I explained that the location and amenities were nice at the Beach Club, she retorted that her friends said that it was ridiculous to stay near Epcot with young kids as they are only interested in the Magic Kingdom.

My sister now says that she wants to come down only if we get reservations at Cinderella's for breakfast (my niece loves Cinderella) and then she will only stay for one or two nights to do the MK. I do not feel that I should have to accomodate her request.

What bothers me is that my sister areed to the $200 per night until her "friends" turned her head around. I also find it extremely hurtful that she sees no value in all of the cousins staying together and, especially, that she is convinced that I am ripping her off or presenting a bad deal. My sister and I have had an excellent relationship. This is the first rift we have ever had and we are each in our thirties. This is so unlike my sister. I have told her that it is not a problem to just cancel the whole vacation (not that I'm happy about going back on my word with my neighbors. If they have trouble renting at this point we'll just go ourselves). I have also told her that we would be more than happy to pay for her half, but she says she does not want to "owe" us. Bottom line, she is not "forgiving" me for "trying to take advantage of her", even though I feel I have done nothing wrong.

I'm sorry to bother the nice people on the boards with this but I just feel awful that my sister hates me for this. I really had thebest of intentions. I thought she would be happy! What did I do wrong? Is this really a terrible deal? Are my neighbors ripping me off? I had always thought that renting points from timeshare owners was an economical way to go, have things changed recently?

Thanks for your help. I am very very sad and have not slept in days.

 

[Cruelladeville]

I'm so sorry that your sister is so ignorant about Disney, and has listened to a "friend" who is also ignorant about it. Your neighbor gave you the standard deal which she could get for renting her pts, that is, you are paying $10 per pt for a two bedroom villa during a time when accommodations are nearly impossible to get. This is a "cheap" time of year for using DVC pts--it costs less points than at other times of year. What you will be getting with your two bedroom villa is a living room with a pull-out couch, a full sized kitchen with all the "stuff" you will need to cook a meal (a real money saver!), a bedroom with two queen-sized beds and a bathroom and a microwave and mini-frig, a second bedroom with a king bed, and a huge bathroom with a jacuzzi tub and a walk in closet. You were trying to arrange a luxury trip for someone who is both ignorant and cheap, and it won't work. I know, since I've done this my whole life, and they won't get "it" till they try to go on their own. Your sister is being unreasonable, but that's the way she is going to be about this, so my advice is to go on your own, and just to let her stew. You aren't responsible for her happiness, either at home or on vacation, so agree to disagree, and do your own thing. By the way, I have gone to Disney every year at least, since my kids were babies 25 years ago, and yes, they do like Magic Kingdom. But the thing they really like is the pool, so if you go to ANY of the parks in the a.m., and make sure you keep assuring them that they will swim in the p.m. they will be happy wherever you go. My home resorts are at Boardwalk and Beach Club, and this is the choice area to be, for more reasons than I can list here. The cheapest rates available over by the Magic Kingdom right now is at Poly, which will cost $164-$219 per night for a hotel room with an annual passport, which costs an additional $350 to get. Which would you rather have, a hotel ROOM, or a two bedroom apartment with a huge amount of space? If you really want revenge, take the 2 bedroom for your family, and suggest that she could stay outside the parks at $50 or so per night, then invite her--be friendly--to come and visit you. A picture is worth a thousand words!!! Relax and enjoy your trip, you deserve it!!!

 

[kem330]

The points cost for that stay is 282, points rent for $10/point so $2800 is fair. I checked the promotional rates for that time at BWV, they are $199 + 11% tax/night for a studio and $289 + tax for a 1 BR unit- price didn't come up for 2BR. So for less than the price of a studio (taxes would run $154) she would have the studio plus the LR to share with the kitchen, W/D, etc. If she wants to stay at MK hotels, you should check the discount codes and see if you can get a room at the Poly, Cont or GF. But with tax inc.only the Contemporary may be less than $200/night. And that is for a hotel room- not a deluxe 2BR unit. You can save money having some meals in the room. This board is full of people who go to Disney at least once a year, so I hope your sister would take their advice seriously. Certainly if MK is top priority than try one of those hotels- Promos may be gone then due to the popularity of the time. If she wants to save money and stay at a moderate- that's another story- but don't expect any easier access to MK. The bus from BW is very efficient and goes right to the door. Plus you can walk to MGM.

 

[DaveO]

A 2BR 'costs' the owners 282 points. The going rate for a rental point is about $10/pt. So they could rent this for $2820 on these boards.

Her 'friends' do not know what they are talking about. The kids will LOVE the pool and a 2BR is huge compared to a hotel room.

The 'rack rate' for this room is about $690 per night plus 11% tax. Not including tax (11% discount) the room would cost $4830. Or over $5000 with tax.

Quite a savings.

Dave O.

 

[dvc_bwv]

I feel bad that ou sister doesn't "get it." Before we bought DVC we had stayed for 7 nights at Wilderness Lodge (pre Villas) and our best rate for a "hotel room" was $1300+ and this was a good deal!! To get a 2 BR w/full kitchen, washer & dryer, 2 full baths, etc for $1400 each is a great deal, not to mention the $$$ you'd save by having the kitchen and eating some meals in.

As Cruelladeville said...

take the 2 bedroom for your family, and suggest that she could stay outside the parks at $50 or so per night, then invite her--be friendly--to come and visit you. A picture is worth a thousand words!!!

Maybe you should show you sister this post to help her understand. Good Luck and enjoy your vacation with or wihtout your sister!!

 

[zulaya]

I sympathize with you. My parents are exactly the same way, can't fathoom why we would spend so much money for "just a hotel room". They don't get it that there's a lot of amenities and THE SPACE. Your sister's friends are, unfortunately, very ignorant about the true details of DVC. Perhaps you could print out the room layout diagram on the WDW website for BCV, with the descriptions of the amenities. Perhaps someone can point you to a website with pix of SAB. Just because you have young kids doesn't mean you can't stay at a resort near Epcot. I have a 5 and 6 year old. Are we spending a heck of a lot of time at MK? You betcha. Are we going to stay at BCV? Oh, yeah. I love the location, they are little fishes and have a love of pirate ships - which is a little bit of the theme of SAB.

You might ont be able to convince your sister, but I like the other posters suggestion of telling her to stay offsite for $50 a night, where all the beds are in one room, where you have nowhere to go or nothing to do after the little ones go to sleep, and then invite her over for a break inthe day sometime to your 2 BR villa.

 

[nisiemouse]

We just made our first trip to BCV 7/31 and absolutely loved it!Besides the 5 minute walk to Epcot you are also a nice boat ride to MGM. I hope there is a happy ending here and your sister makes the trip with you but I would not let her put conditions on the trip. I hope you use the reservation regardless for your family. As others have said you have a fair deal and the rack rate for this reservation for is much higher. I am so sorry about the effect this situation is having on you. Let us know what happens.

 

[hygienejean]

I will be renting at the BWV's(a 2 bedroom) in May 2003 with my (almost) 3 year old DS and 11 monthold DD. Before I had children, I had stayed in other hotels on WDW property. they were fine for the two of us. With two little ones(sounds like your kids are the same age as mine.) I can't imagine staying in one room! The kids will need to go to bed early.... that means Mom and Dad have to turn in early too. With a 2 bedroom, you can do your own thing, sit out on the porch, eat, what ever! Seems like it will be so much more relaxing. Saving money by cooking some of your own food is a bonus too. Plus! It is a great deal when you see what you would be paying with the rack rates! I hope that you will keep your ressie..it will be great. Maybe if sister is not interested you can do what I am doing....my parents are going to take the second bedroom.

My sister/family, my parents and our family will be going again in April 2004. My sis wants the Poly but for reasons stated above I am going to try to persuade her to rent another DVC resort. My other persuasion is for my husband...I would love to become a DVC member sometime...Maybe when he actually sees the 2 bedroom at the Boardwalk!!

Good luck and I hope your sister comes around!!!!

Jean

 

[Lisa P.]

Kidzrus, this is a shame. Your relationship with your sister is obviously important and you've never had a big falling out like this before. Try to keep the perspective. Whatever she thinks, it's her idea and she's upset. I would not try to convince her otherwise. A trip comes and goes. Your sister will still be there.

Not everyone finds it worthwhile to spend $200 per night for a deluxe room with shared kitchen access - no matter how nice it is. There's no right or wrong here. Perhaps she and her friends experienced sticker shock - especially if any of them have enjoyed Orlando trips at $100 per night for a stay at the All Stars or a nice 2BR offsite. You may see the DVC 2BR as well worth the upgrade - not everyone does.

Right now, if it were my sister, I'd just let her know that I really had thought that she would enjoy it as much as I would and I'm sorry I just did not understand what she expected or wanted. I'd be very careful not to sound condescending. Once you do this, you really need to leave it with her and not let it keep you up at night. She is a grown woman. Easier said than done.

Then I'd get some written quotes from a travel agent or off the internet for a couple of decent alternative options (that I could live with), both more expensive and less. I'd avoid rack rate comparisons to DVC, seeking true "best deals." I'd give them to her and ask her to choose something. When she saw that, she may realize how good the DVC deal had been or she may see something she prefers and realize I was really trying to please her as well as myself.

If you feel that you cannot accommodate her, then cancel the trip together and plan your own. Know that she may continue to feel unresolved about it and so might you. It's going to have to be dealt with, if you want to continue in a close relationship with her.

FWIW, with a 5 yo, two 3 yo.s and a newborn, I think a monorail hotel room or just a very cheap stay may actually work best. If you save a lot on your room, you can better afford to eat in the parks, at air conditioned restaurants, and more character meals - wonderful with those ages. OTOH, if you stay on the monorail, you'll enjoy more convenience.

For the pools and other amenities, those are more for the parents than for very little children. Young ones just like a pool... any pool, really. Unless you start comparing in front of the kids, they won't care whether they swim at BC, Poly, All Stars or Vistana. BTW, some offsite pools are gorgeous!

As for characters... if you cannot get in to the Cindy's Table breakfast, look into the new Princess breakfast in Norway. Don't know if Cindy's there but there are Princesses. Don't forget you may make P.S. for character meals whether you are staying offsite or on or even if you have no reservations yet. Keep track of the calendar.

Lastly, if you still have your heart set on BCV and if you would be considering a shorter stay, try this... ask the neighbors if they can shorten the reservation to only include 5 weekdays (Sun night - Thu night). Then the points usage would be waaaaay less. Perhaps you could each start (& end?) your stay with a night at the All Stars or offsite, spending the bulk of the trip at BCV in the 2BR. Your neighbors may still rent their remaining points to others and you'd get what you really wanted... to share some Disney vacation time with your sister and getting all the cousins together. Wish you well.

 

[manning]

Remind her that meals are not cheap at WDW. Eating in will save a bundle. It will more than make up for the $200.00 per night.

 

[SlyHubby]

Someone else posted on another thread, that after staying 4 nights on DVC points at BCV (Sunday to Friday) in a 2BR they wanted to add an extra day with cash. With their discount they were charged $410 for one night.

No ripoff with your price - it's about right.

 

[cgcw]

This is what I would do....I would tell you sister that these are the arrangements you already made with your neighbor and you will be sticking to them -- provided that you can afford to do that on your own. I would give your sister the option of either staying with you and sharing the cost or I'd offer to make arrangements with another hotel someplace closer to the MK for her and her family. There is nothing stopping you from getting together at each other resorts and at the parks. Being that she doesn't think your getting a good deal, maybe presenting her with other options which are to her liking will soften her to the idea of staying with you. As for Cinderella's breakfast, I would put your sister in charge of securing the PS for that. Explain to her what she has to do, how difficult it might be to get the PS and for her to do it 1st thing in the morning on the day it would be accepted. If she chooses not to go with your advice, then she can't come back to you and say you didn't try or whatever. One other thought but since my DS has been 3 (he's 7 now), Epcot has been his all time favorite resort!! Just goes to show you how children are all different. Good luck!

 

[Terry S]

As far as the cost goes, I think your getting a pretty good deal. Since BCV is new, there haven't been many discount codes available for it and people aren't renting their points out at much under $10 a point.

As far as an Epcot resort goes, my kids are 5 and 6 and they love the Beach Club. (We haven't stayed at our home, BCV yet but have stayed at Beach Club several times and they love it). They would rather be there then a monorail resort any day.

 

[roque]

i think there is something else going on with your sister. i believe you when you say you have a good relationship with her and that this is the first rift. As my grandma used to say there something fishy in the fish market. your sis may be going thru something, and you were the first target. this sounds like it could be resolved easily, you have some really good options presented to you from our fellow Disers and one of them may work for you. However, your sis seems to think her friends know more and well we all know that isn't so. good luck with this and i hope it works out well,

 

[KNWVIKING]

I guess she's too young to be going thru "the change", right ? Because that could explain her sudden loss of rationality.

Any advise I have would be worthless to you because you sound like someone who really cares about spending time with your sister. Sorry,but I wish you luck. Let us know how things turn out.

 

[msdis]

I can understand her sticker shock. I still get it. You may want to order a free DVC video at

http://dvc.disney.go.com/disneyvacationclub/requestinfo/requestinfoindex?id=RequestInformation

This will give you both an idea of what to expect and she will be able to see how nice the rooms are.


Also, check out Deb Will's site at:


http://www.wdwig.com/gallery.htm

She has some really good pics of ALL the resorts.

Hope all gets settled and you all get to have a nice vacation together that everyone is happy to be on. My dream is to some day do a DVC vacation with my sister and her family. Like someone else said, vacations will come and go, but your sister is your sister forever. Best of luck!!!!

 

[Caskbill]

Does your sister know your neighbors most likely paid around $22,000 or so for those points? And their annual fees for the points you'll be using will cost them about $1,050? If they financed a loan for the purchase, maybe at 7% interest, they're paying about $1,500 interest on the loan. So those same 282 points are probably costing your neighbor about $2,550. Renting them for $2,800 is NOT a rip-off.

Another thought. Since the master B/R is so much nicer than the 2nd bedroom, maybe you might offer to take it and pay more of the costs. Maybe split it 60/40 instead of 50/50 if that was your arrangement. That way your sister saves a little (and might not feel quite so ripped-off), and you pay a little more to get the better bedroom.

By the way, forget about what others have said about sending her to one of those $50/night off site hotels.

Send her to one of those $29/night flea-traps on hwy 192.

 

[DebbieB]

I was thinking along the same lines as roque, there is something more going on that you don't know about. Another thing might be that people who have never been to Disney or to a DVC resort just don't "get it". I have a friend who became a DVC member in 1996. I thought she was nuts spending all that money, a regular room is fine. Then she invited me to spend a long weekend in March 1999 in an OKW 2 bedroom, sharing with 2 online friends (actually it was about 10 or 15 women who met in an AOL DVC chatroom who got together for this weekend, most staying at OKW and sharing accomodations. I was the only non-member). I was blown away! I loved all that room, the full kitchen, living room, etc. We had the second bedroom, I didn't even experience the master. Well, 6 months later I was signing by the Mickey Ears (DVC papers). I bet if she saw it, she would change her mind.

 

[donald@home]

Forget trying to talk her into staying at the BCV with you, or rationalizing your thinking and telling her what a great deal it is. I don't think your sister wants to hear any of this. I agree with what others have said. If you can afford it (which it sounds like you can if you offered to pay for your sister), you and your family should stay in the two bedroom at BCV and help your sister find other accomodations. There are many options, from MK area Disney hotels to off site hotels renting for as low as $18 per night. Find out what her priorities are and make a few suggestions and help with reservations. Your sister can come and visit at the BCV and you will have the pleasure of showing her how smart you were by booking such a great deal at one of the finest resorts.

 

[drusba]

Well, I do not know whether this can be salvaged but here goes:

Inform your sister (and copy these if you like) that you have been talking to WDW veterans including this one who has been going for almost 28 years.

Here is the "big rip-off" that she agreed to:

1. The Epcot area is considered the premier area of the world -- you can walk to two parks, Epcot and MGM, and kids like those too. It is just a short bus ride to MK. The other premier area is at MK with the monorail resorts; getting two hotel rooms at one of those MK resorts or one of the Epcot resorts would only cost you between $700 and $1,000 a night after adding taxes.

2. The two bedroom villas are considered by both Disney and guests to be the top of the line rooms; second only to the 3BR villas at some of the DVC resorts (which go for about $1400 a night in October when renting through Disney), and to the huge suites like the 2BR suites at the Grand Floridian or Presidential suites at Boardwalk, and those large GF and BW suites go for the bargain rate of $1800 to $2,200 a night. The 2BR villa that you are paying $400 a night for, runs, if you rented through Disney in October, about $800 a night with taxes. The size of these 2BR villas are close to the size of three separate rooms at the Deluxe resorts at WDW.

3. You get a kitchen and a w/d in the 2BR villas, you don't get that even in those two bedroom suites at Grand Floridian.

4. The Beach Club, of which the villas are a part, has what most consider to be the best pool on site (the villas also have a smaller "quiet pool" to use if you don't want to go to the large one).

In other words, the "big rip-off" is that your sister and you are getting one of the best accomadations Disney has to offer almost dirt-cheap.