Help me decide on DVC or not - convince me!

[dcibrando]

OK I just got back from a FANTASTIC trip to Saratoga Springs Resort and while on the trip we took a DVC tour and were floored by the rooms larger than the studio (like we stay in) and especially the new Animal Kingdom Villa rooms.. .WOW!!!!

Now.. we're are trying to decide whether or not this is right for us now, or whether or not we should wait it out and see.

For 160 points, Disney is offering $1,600 back, 160 points extra from 2006, and of course their own financing at 10.95% (i believe) which they say does not affect your credit score. The cost is a little over $16,000

Looking at the resales, there are several for much lower prices but then comes the question about financing. Is it a good idea (or a logical idea) to put the total say $12,000 or so on a low interest credit card for like 5.99% for the life of the balance and then just pay as much as we can each month? How risky is this? Also, does this give us the option of just paying the interest each month if we get into a bind financially for a month or so for whatever reason?

Ok... our situation is we are a young married couple (no kids yet) but just got back from our 4th trip in a little over 2 years. We have stayed at Pop Century twice, Beach Club, and now Saratoga Springs. SSR was by far our favorite (yes, even over beach club)

We have been kind of disappointed with the somewhat dirtyness of the bathrooms at DVC resorts, mainly due to lack of mousekeeping (like moldy curtains, tiles, etc.) but I understand why it is the way it is.

Onto my next set of questions... the Annual Pass (DVC rate) and the Disney Dining Experience.

If we purchase 1 DDE card, is this good for thr 20% for us both? Will we need 2?

How much do you have to ue the annual pass to really get it's money's worth? I seem to recall the price going down if you renew..how much is that?

If you all could help me out with these questions and help guide me to what is the best situation to do (disney, resale, financing, DDE, annual pass or non-expiring tickets, etc.) I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[jmcdonnell04]

DCIBrando,

I enjoyed reading your enthusiastic post. You will get many pieces of advice but you will have to go with your heart. I have been a member of DVC for over 10 years and just recently completed paying off my initial 150 pt contract. It was a small amount like $ 75 per month -- almost like paying off your student loan. Many will advise not to finance -- only buy DVC if you have the money on hand. This is good advice as well. It is life's difficult decision to determine to save for that rainy day and hope to be around and be in condition to enjoy the fruits of that wait OR live in the moment and take the plunge.

I certainly have enjoyed the 10 years of memories of multiple trips to WDW & DL & Hilton Head and my upcoming trip to Disneyland Paris with my DW and two daughters. We also have been able to take family and friends as well. My DW always reminds that I waited too long to buy from our initial 1992 visit.

We purchased the WDW Annual Pass in June 2006 for a week long vacation, then went again for 5 days in December and again for a week in April. The cost is approx. $ 350 for park hopper only pass. To renew it for another year, it was approx $ 325. We decided to wait and just get another AP after we have our next vacation scheduled so we can get the maximum one year use. I believe a 5-day Park Hopper pass is approximately $ 250.00.

You would only need to purchase one DDE card for the both of you. You can the card for a party of 10-12 (not sure of exact #) if you want to bring friends.

We have only purchase from Disney direct but did not know of the Timeshare Store which have excellent reviews.

 

[rahrah]

For your posting, I am assuming that you are young, recently married, are considering having children, and not independantly wealthy. I am also guessing that you do not own a house.

While a DVC is an attactive thing (and very well marketed), it is a purchase that people make for emotional reasons. To look at it from a more practical perspective:

1) You really have to go to WDW every year for it to make any sense at all. Going to WDW with children under 3 years old is actually very hard on the parents, and the child does not get much out of it. Most three year olds will have as much fun at a local beach. If you have two children, you can expect 4 to 6 years of these "vacations".

2) Between the down payment, annual dues, and prinicpal and interest on your loan, a DVC is really quite expensive. I suspect in 10 years you will have sunk about $32,000 into your DVC. That is actually a pretty decent down payment for a house. Or if you have a house, that would look really nice sitting in you IRA when you retire 40 to 50 years later (probably over $1,000,000). Numbers are base on $16,000 purchase price with a 10 year loan at 9.5% with no down payment and $4 per point annual dues. The $1,000,000 is base on the $32,000 invested at 9% for 40 years (which would put you at 70+ years old). It is even more expensive if you add in air fare, food and park tickets.

3) A DVC is really just a hotel room (ok, a very nice, high-end hotel room). Is the room the real reason you are going to WDW? Is WDW any less fun if you stay in a Moderate resort?

 

[rogerram]

1) You really have to go to WDW every year for it to make any sense at all. Going to WDW with children under 3 years old is actually very hard on the parents, and the child does not get much out of it. Most three year olds will have as much fun at a local beach. If you have two children, you can expect 4 to 6 years of these "vacations".

That is not totally true.You can have it work well only going evey other year also. As for a child not getting much out of it, you are so wrong. My three year old loved it when she got to see the characters she loves and the big smiles are worth it alone. I also have it on video so I can look at it forever .

2) Between the down payment, annual dues, and prinicpal and interest on your loan, a DVC is really quite expensive. I suspect in 10 years you will have sunk about $32,000 into your DVC. That is actually a pretty decent down payment for a house. Or if you have a house, that would look really nice sitting in you IRA when you retire 40 to 50 years later (probably over $1,000,000). Numbers are base on $16,000 purchase price with a 10 year loan at 9.5% with no down payment and $4 per point annual dues. The $1,000,000 is base on the $32,000 invested at 9% for 40 years (which would put you at 70+ years old). It is even more expensive if you add in air fare, food and park tickets.

Although I agree with DVC being somewhat expensive, it is not unreasonable. It is also a luxury of having great vacations set up in advance and staying in much nicer resorts than you might pay for with nearly the same amount of money. You can still invest where you like and if I had $1M dollars at 70, I would probably be spending it at Disney and staying in a DVC resort.

3)

A DVC is really just a hotel room (ok, a very nice, high-end hotel room). Is the room the real reason you are going to WDW? Is WDW any less fun if you stay in a Moderate resort?

It is part of your whole experience. If I am in a nice DVC room with a nice view of the resort, it is much better. Just sitting out on the balcony at night for a while is worth it. Having a full kitchen is great too, although we don't always make full meals in it. Even the studios are nicer than a standard rooms. The park experience will always be the same where ever you stay on property, but DVC resorts making it better for us. Walking the Boardwalk at night, swimming in the pool at SAB, enjoying the extra spacious rooms of OKW, etc.

 

[Deb & Bill]

I guess I am from the concept that if you need convincing, there is something holding you back. When we talked to the Guide the first time, we knew immediately that we wanted to do this. We knew that we could afford the first contract we purchased. We knew we wanted to go to WDW at least every year.

If you need convincing, maybe you need to convince yourself first.

 

[Mule2007]

Convincing -- you've seen a lot of good things mentioned above -- what are the negatives that are holding you back?

Maybe weigh them in this forum.

Mule

 

[Phedre]

When we talked to the Guide the first time, we knew immediately that we wanted to do this.

Just wanted to say that this was not my family's experience with the DVC. My family started looking into it in the 90s and passed on it... and took the tour again and again and again........ and still kept deciding it wasn't the right thing for us.

This year, we bought into AKV. It was finally 'right'!

Just wanted to point out that my experience with it was different, and that even if it doesn't seem to work for your family right now, think about it again in the future perhaps

 

[Liljam]

I don't want to convince you that DVC is a must have for going to WDW because it's not. But it sure will make for lots of trips

If you choose to finance, you will pay more in the long run than paying cash, but that's a personal choice. We financed. We're not millionaires, but we don't do without the things we want and have all that we need. If you finance and pay your bill on time every month, you are no different than a person who paid for their DVC with cash . No one knows anyone else's true financial situations. A person that paid cash may have saved that money for 15 years or they may have saved it in less than one year. (As a side note to those who disagree with financing, I do not mean any of this in a flaming or derogatory way. I'm only giving the other side of this to the OP and I hate typing things like this because messages can't show the sincere on my face. Hence the good vibes and peace, love and pixie dust to all!)

If you do finance through Disney, I think your payments on 160 points would be right under $200 per month if you only put 10% down. Then your dues are going to be around $60 per month or can be paid in full each year. If you won't miss $200 each month, go for it after considering the other added expenses! If you think that there may be times when $200 is not attainable, then I would say hold off. If you go through a credit card company, you still have to consider what that plan would offer in terms of just paying interest and so on.

I have only been a member for about 3 weeks now and already have 3 trips lined up through July 08 so I have personally had to take in to consideration how much money I "need" to have with me during each trip. That includes gas since I don't fly and we use our Suburban right now because it fits us all! That's a big expense in and of itself with gas rates rising every day. As for children, I hope we have some soon too and I don't see them making our trip worse in anyway. I've been going to WDW since the womb so maybe that's why I don't look at it as an issue! We know we will adapt to what our children need and even take family to help with watching so we can enjoy a few hours to ourselves. I consider that one of the perks of DVC because we will book a room that will hold our family who would be tickled pink to take a trip with us AND watch their grandchildren for free ! You will find a bunch of info here on these boards if you do some searching - many people come here asking the same kinds of questions. I came here after I purchased DVC because I like to stay up to date with what's happening and the group of people here are awesome, and it helps to know your neighbors ! DVC is not going anywhere though, take the time to really think things through. My husband and I knew it was perfect for us and we talked about it before we took the tour. We we got in the van to go to SSR it was already a done deal for us. We won't save money by owning DVC other than for room rates - eventually. I know that by going down 3 times in 2008, I'm going to be spending way more than if I hadn't bought DVC, but that doesn't affect me financially or hurt us even if we add a child in to the mix. I would say overall, that is the biggest issue I would suggest discussing. We also know that if there comes a time that we can't make it one year, we'll bank and plan the following year!

As for park passes, I am guessing that anything over 10 day passes and the AP is going to be the better rate. We figured it'd be roughly $650 for the two of us for APs but closer to $1500 if we bought passes each time we went based on our three trips total!

Good luck with making your choice. I hope that I have at least painted a picture of some of the things we considered.

 

[disneymayz]

For your posting, I am assuming that you are young, recently married, are considering having children, and not independantly wealthy. I am also guessing that you do not own a house.

While a DVC is an attactive thing (and very well marketed), it is a purchase that people make for emotional reasons. To look at it from a more practical perspective:

1) You really have to go to WDW every year for it to make any sense at all. Going to WDW with children under 3 years old is actually very hard on the parents, and the child does not get much out of it. Most three year olds will have as much fun at a local beach. If you have two children, you can expect 4 to 6 years of these "vacations".

2) Between the down payment, annual dues, and prinicpal and interest on your loan, a DVC is really quite expensive. I suspect in 10 years you will have sunk about $32,000 into your DVC. That is actually a pretty decent down payment for a house. Or if you have a house, that would look really nice sitting in you IRA when you retire 40 to 50 years later (probably over $1,000,000). Numbers are base on $16,000 purchase price with a 10 year loan at 9.5% with no down payment and $4 per point annual dues. The $1,000,000 is base on the $32,000 invested at 9% for 40 years (which would put you at 70+ years old). It is even more expensive if you add in air fare, food and park tickets.

3) A DVC is really just a hotel room (ok, a very nice, high-end hotel room). Is the room the real reason you are going to WDW? Is WDW any less fun if you stay in a Moderate resort?

I do not own my own home,(how many people really own their home or does their bank own it like mine) I have 2 kids (5 and 6 months), and I only have been married for 6 years. My 5 year old has been there 4 times already. Can I say she remembers everything about it, No. But I can say that she has a great time when we are down there and she remembers a little bit from every trip.
I have put a lot of thought and research into DVC. I have been trying to get a resale. My current one is 70 points at OKW. We go every May so at that time we can go and stay in a studio for a week for 2 years straight, then one year off, and then two more times straight, etc. That is not just staying at OKW everytime it includes Beach Club , Boardwalk, SSR,. My investment will be 6000. Annual is about 310 and a typical May week if paying cash is 2433 (@OKW). If it goes through I will be ahead of the game in 2013. (6000+Dues-cash price+typical hotel cost) We norminally stay at the all-star resorts so I entered 700 for typical hotel cost. Going off of todays rates and saying there is no raise in them (yah right that would happen) by the end 2042 I will be over 10,000 ahead. I looked at it as a all star resort with a frig and microwave.

I like to live in the present. You prob have a 401 through work so If you can afford it go for it and have fun in your life. I used my home equity line of credit which allows me to just pay the intrest if I want which is nice if we have money troubles. I hope this helped some.

 

[pogopossum]

we bought our first points in 1998. we have used disney financing for all three purchases. an advantage to doing that- tax deduction, you will get a 1099 each year for your mortgage interest, and a tax statement for property tax.

as for the expensiveness, the price, including interest, that we paid versus the cost of vacationing, (dvc, dcl or non dvc), has gone down to less than $10 a point this year, and will continue to decline each year that we own, until the very end when it will reach $5-$6 per point for everything that we have done. looking at previous vero beach stay in 2001, which cost 116 pts for four nights in a two bedroom villa, the end cost will be about $550 - $600. that is the beauty of dvc, you lock in a price for rooms in the future at today's rates.

we have two children ages 12 and 5 and we have taken them to wdw at all ages from less than two months old up to last december. and they have a great time everyime that we go, they get to experience something new every trip. there are things geared for so many age groups. and dvc allows us to stay on property for an affordable price. i look at dues as saving up monthly to pay for lodging.

 

[eliza61]

1) You really have to go to WDW every year for it to make any sense at all. Going to WDW with children under 3 years old is actually very hard on the parents, and the child does not get much out of it. Most three year olds will have as much fun at a local beach. If you have two children, you can expect 4 to 6 years of these "vacations".

Ughhhh! back you evil person.

We have children that are teenagers now (16, 16 &13) Are you kidding, they want to go more than we do. Last March we took a solo trip without the kiddies and all h$%$ll broke loose.
In August, I'm going with only the girls, it's the 25th anniversary of our sorority. I can't wait.
We get so much use out of our DVC, every time we go we say "we should have brought more points"
While it is true I can have fun even staying at a value, if I have the choice and the money I will always go deluxe.

 

[tink_about_it]

If you can afford the monthly payments...DO IT!

You won't regret it!

 

[cgcruz]

See, this is why I can't figure out if DVC is worth it, or just something I want because I want to say "I own part of WDW!" (Lease, actually). Even with the prices of WDW hotels going up, WDW usually offers some special incentive to get you to stay in their Hotels (free dining, ticket upgrades, room discounts, etc). Even when they dont, i'm still pbbly going to save on my room rate alone with AAA discount (our next trip).

We dont mind staying at a value right now, but we would also stay in a moderate or deluxe if we really wanted. Lets not forget, you can stay at any DVC resort if you are willing to pay the price. I've talked to a DVC guide and he told me if I wanted to finance for 5 years my monthly dues including Annual Dues THIS YEAR will be around $344 a month, that's about $4,128 a year just in Room Cost. This year alone, I can stay 7 nights at Animal Kingdom for what, around $220 a day in value season? That's about $1,732 for 7 nights. I know they say you save money on DVC in the long run, maybe like 10 years after my initial purchase if I were to finance for 5 years, even longer for 10 years of financing! That's just way too far from today for me to consider it a convinience.

We do like the bigger accomadations in the DVC 1 bedroom + units, but its just more the look than anything. I know we would not be using the kitchen while we are there. We are not going to cook on vacation! Also, free laundry isnt that great of a savings, i'll just spend the $20 on laundry before we leave.

Also, DVC advertises how you can go to many other places beside WDW with your membership, but I bet you can go anywhere DVC advertises and stay in accomadations comperable to what DVC offers for a better price.

Now, if you are an affluent person who just wants to have the luxury of knowing you will always stay in nicer accomadations (even though you can stay at any deluxe too) , it would certainly make sense to buy into DVC.

If we did buy into DVC, we pbbly wouldnt regret it, but realistically, we would not be saving much in the long run (especially with financing).

 

[gkrykewy]

If we did buy into DVC, we pbbly wouldnt regret it, but realistically, we would not be saving much in the long run (especially with financing).

I agree - if people run the numbers, it's not a good deal if you A) finance, especially with disney, and B) are perfectly willing to stay in the value properties.

It IS quickly a good deal if you prefer to stay in deluxe resorts or DVC resorts, especially if you're able to pay cash. A fair analysis, which actually led me to decide to buy, is here: http://www.mousesavers.com/dvc.html

 

[TenThousandVolts]

cgcruz- you seem to have come to the right conclusion for a person in your circumstances- DVC would not make much sense at all.

 

[kend58]

OP The others above have lsited various scenarios for why they did or did not buy at first and how their financing or staright purchase pays off. depending on amount of travel and type of accomadation teh avg seems to be 7 years some save 5 years others as long as twelve years.

My family me DW DD 20 and DS 14 will only stay in two bedrooms or two studios at this point so remember as teh children grow the need for more tahn a studi may appear in your life (I know we could stay in smaller accomdatiosn within I rules I am saying we would not choose to do so)

This is a vacation and at that a deluxe one DVC is upper end accomadations

My reasons for not buying would be that my vacation money is not up to the challenge. Vacation money is after money I have left after Emergency Reserve, Retirment, Housing, Food, Utilities, Taxes, Transportation, Ordinary entertainment (movies dinner out) and luxuries. In other words vacationing is something I do after all of my lifes needs and the majority of its wants have been met. I am currently waiting on my perfect small resale contract at DVC (I want to bank and borrow to be on property every two or three years).

I already own - paid outright at purchase two weeks in two bedroom villas at other TS resorts I can trade into WDW or around the world for a much smaller cost than two weeks worth of points at DVC in a Two bedroom any season points would cost me at any of the resorts in any season. My point is I see DVC as a luxury and therefor something I would only buy after the needs and most of the ordinary wants newer cars, new video systems , flat panel tv's etc in my life are already dealt with. I do see DVC as a desirable purchase and it ahs a place in my overall plan I just don't see any need to rush into the purchase.

 

[bwvBound]

My point is I see DVC as a luxury and therefor something I would only buy after the needs and most of the ordinary wants newer cars, new video systems , flat panel tv's etc in my life are already dealt with.

Not disagreeing with you ... but chuckling a little over the priorities. I was crushed giving up my '95 Bonneville two months ago (a baby at 104k miles); our only TV is a hand-me-down from my FIL's estate (far from a flat panel) and the term "video systems" is new to me. But travel, to us, an "ordinary want."

 

[Kosmc4]

It doesn't sound like it's buy time for you guys. I agree with kend58, you need to get all your other stuff together first. Do you even have kids? By buying points here is just like owning. The rest of the world doesn't know you can get a 5 day stay for 60 points in a studio for $600 bucks, they're all paying $350 a nite. Buy when your kids are 4 & 6.

 

[kend58]

It's not that current travel isn't a competitor for current dollars it's that current travel in my plans has first priority on the vacation dollars and has to leave money behind if I am going to prepay for future travel (I have acquired two TS weeks in the last five years at non-DVC resorts (now bought and paid for) the decrease in travel costs from aquiring them is what enables me to now have a war chest of current travel dollars available to pay for some DVC points with.

I came to the boards expecting to convince myself that buying DVC 160 points at the SSr or AKV resorts would be my best answer. I now know that I will buy fewer points than that at anyone resort at this time and maybe add on more resorts later once I am certain I will want to be on-site that much (I am a SPG member and can get good onsite rates at the Swan and Dolphin and or AP and AAA discounts at Disney Hotels so DVC isn't the only source of on site access I am evaluating but is the only one that requires a long term commitment).

My family loves Disney but I am no longer in "the my room is only a place to sleep (when we were the value resorts were a great choice) we / I will be in the theme parks all the time" stage of my life we now are looking for the complete resort amenities experience as well as the Theme park availability when we go to Orlando (every 2 or 3 years minimum for last 20 years but now three times between Mar 07 and Aug 08) hence my revaluation of Orlando TS in general and DVC in particular. We desire and therfore I plan for us to stay in a 2 bedroom or 1 bedroom and a studio or 2 studios/hotel rooms as our minimum accomadation (personal choice for my family of 4 Me Dw DD 20 and DS 14) we don't want less personal space on vacation than we have at home (i.e. all of us in a 1 bedroom or studio).

I have determined what UY works best for my banking and borrowing plan and what resorts I most desire the 11 month booking advantage at for our travel plans (DW is a teacher so School holiday periods control my schedule at this time and for next 10 plus years). I am now waiting for the right resale contract to be on the market.

 

[boomhauer]

I've been to a few open houses trying to convince myself to join DVC. I finally realized what the problem was.

I wanted to join, because in my eyes, it was a guarenteed Disney trip every year.

The biggest drawback for me, and the reason I have decided not to join (and I'm sorry to those offended by this) - I don't think it's responsible. Right now, I could affod the monthly payments. What if I lose my job tomorrow? What do I do then?

I wrote the numbers down and went over them time and time again. yeah, it may save some money over time, but it's not earth shattering by any means.

On my last tour, the agent made up my mind for me. He said, "these aren't hotel rooms". This may sound stupid, but I like hotel rooms. When I'm on vacation, I wanna feel like it.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, unless you are 100% convinced to join, you shouldn't.