Harry Potter Complete Book Spoiler Thread

[padams]

I was also disappointed with Rowling's writing in HBP. I agree with the poster who said that she seems to have rushed through this one. I hope she takes the time to do a good job with the 7th book. She has a lot of loose ends to tie up.

I read somewhere in the print media that she and her publisher are negotiating for a possible 8th book. If I can find the source, I'll post it. I could see an 8th book being like a Star Wars "prequel" in that we go back to learn more about LV's rise to power, Harry's parents, and their deaths. DD said in HBP that he didn't know much about what LV had been doing since LV left Hogwarts. Perhaps a set up for a future book- I can only hope!

 

[Aneille]

Actually I thought Dumbledore did know that Voldemort had some sort of body but they weren't sure on it.

Harry has that dream or connection into Voldemort's world where Harry see's Voldemort kill that old man that was the caretaker for the Riddle home.

"He as screaming so loudly that he never heard the words the thing in the chair spoke as it raised a wand. There was a flash of green light, a rushing sound, and Frank Bryce crumpled. He was dead before he hit the floor.

Two hundred miles away, the boy called Harry Potter woke up with a start."

I remember that at some point in this story Harry tells people about this dream, but I can't remember who it is. I am searching now. I only remember it because an emphasis was given to the fact that Voldemort could hold a wand.

Maybe he didn't tell Dumbledore but rather Ron and Hermione, but I will look.

Okay I found it. He did tell Dumbledore not about the first time he had the dream and his scar hurt (he only told Sirius and not the details) but the second time when he fell asleep in class.

"So you think . . . that dream . . . did it really happen?"

"It is possible," said Dumbledore. "I would say - probable. Harry - did you see
Voldemort?"

"No," said Harry. "Just the back of his chair. But - there wouldn't have been
anything to see, would there? I mean, he hasn't got a body, has he? But. . . but then how could he have held the wand?" Harry said slowly.

"How indeed?" muttered Dumbledore. "How indeed . . ."

Neither Dumbledore nor Harry spoke for a while. Dumbledore was gazing across
the room, and, every now and then, placing his wand tip to his temple and adding"

So Dumbledore did have a clue that Voldemort had some sort of form now, but it was never confirmed. The gleam in his eye was probably that it was confirmed.

 

[HomeSweetDisney]

I read somewhere in the print media that she and her publisher are negotiating for a possible 8th book. If I can find the source, I'll post it. I could see an 8th book being like a Star Wars "prequel" in that we go back to learn more about LV's rise to power, Harry's parents, and their deaths. DD said in HBP that he didn't know much about what LV had been doing since LV left Hogwarts. Perhaps a set up for a future book- I can only hope!

I don't think so. It's just a rumor. She has said numerous times that she is definately not doing an 8th book. That if anything, she'll put out an "encylopedia" of sorts, like a reference book of the Potter world. She is still toying with the idea and if she does do it, it would be for charity or rather the proceeds would go to charity like she did with the "Quidditch Through The Ages" and "Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them" books.

 

[jwann]

As a previous poster said - Harry is going to have to have a good reason to come back to Hogwarts for his last year - especially with Hermione and Ron having parents that will make them go. Here's my theory - Harry will be the DADA teacher for his last year. He will then create an "army" of his own and the final battle will be at Hogwarts over a horcrux placed there.

 

[GADISNEYGIRL]

Unfortunately, as best I can tell, JKR has NO plans for more HP after Book 7. Most recently she did an interview (which I read in its entirety on an HP fansite) on Saturday, saying she absolutely was not doing any more HP. She has previously ruled out the prequel idea, saying she did not want to do it a la Star Wars. (LOL, with all the parallels drawn there!)

I am not opposed to the "Snape is still good" theory, would make me much happier than I am now. I DO believe DD is dead, though I feel certain that in some way he will still be able to help Harry, even if it is only in preparation. I, too, noticed the flame incident at the funeral, and thought of the phoenix. And I also wonder where Fawkes has gone. Maybe to the OotP Headquarters? After all, he was used as a messenger... So perhaps we will see him again.

I'm happy with all the relationships, and hope that somehow Harry and Ginny will work out, though if he dies in 7, guess it wouldn't much matter! There is bound to be something of interest in Godric's Hollow. There has been speculation before about Godric being Gryffindor's first name, thereby making Godric's Hollow more than just the place Harry's parents died.

As for the book itself, I personally found it much more readable and enjoyable than OotP. And that is spoken not just as a fan, but also as a holder of a degree in English! JKR has said herself that she felt she rambled on too much in OotP, and I agreed with that assessment. On the other hand, HBP was a bit more predictable (in some ways) than I would have thought. I had figured out early on that Snape was the HBP. As to the books being too old for him or any of Harry's parents' friends...hello! This is 20+ years later than their days in school, and they're *still* using the same textbook! I'm also not surprised by DD's death, because we all know that in the end, Harry must face Voldemort one-on-one. I'm just hoping there are not too many casualties along the way!

BTW~Go Tonks!!

 

[GADISNEYGIRL]

One more question...until this book, I wasn't aware that Lily was so adept at Potions... Did Slughorn make a big deal out of this in this book only, or did I miss something in an earlier book?

 

[teacherforhi]

One more question...until this book, I wasn't aware that Lily was so adept at Potions... Did Slughorn make a big deal out of this in this book only, or did I miss something in an earlier book?

Actually, I believe the only thing said about Lily was that she was good at Charms. I just took Slughorn going on about how Harry was so much like his mother in that respect as a way of sucking up to Harry. After all, Lily isn't around to contradict him and Slughorn is the type of person that would want people to think that he was close to someone that was so important that Voldemort killed her personally.

 

[GADISNEYGIRL]

Thanks, teacher, I didn't *think* I had missed that along the way, but you never know. I do recall that her charm work had come up previously, but didn't remember anything about potions!

I'm not sure what to make of Slughorn, anyway. Wonder if he'll have much part in book 7?

 

[stinkerbelle]

I'm not sure what to make of Slughorn, anyway. Wonder if he'll have much part in book 7?

he was representing Slytherin house at the end of the book. I'd imagine he's stay on. I wonder if he'll train Harry to be a metamorphamagi? (or however you spell it) Slughorn turned himself in a couch in the begining...I bet he'd train up Harry in light of his coming adventure.

Um - how did Harry get his firebolt back? Did he get it back at the end of OoTP? (i know - so trivial!) heheh

 

[blueangel]

Well, we always knew Lily was a powerful witch...remember Petunia talking about how special she was and the references to Lily's abilities in Snape's memories, of why James was attracted to her.

I totally agree with the Regulus Black as RAB theory. Kreacher could easily have been the second person in the boat as noted before - and would have had to follow any orders Regulus Black gave him about drinking or making him drink the poision. We have been definitely told that Regulus is dead - soon after he repented his involvement with LV.

As for Hogwarts, I don't doubt at all that most of major action of Book 7 will take place there. For one, as has been mentioned, the school is important to Voldemort, but it is something of a stronghold for the OoP. With Dumbledore gone, McGonagall would move into the headmaster position, leaving an opening for a Transfiguration teacher as well - I see Tonks filling this position more likely than the potions opening, and with other OoP members filling in DADA and potions, Hogwarts could conceivably become the new OoP headquarters since 12 Grimmauld place is still unoccupiable.

 

[blueangel]

Oh, good point about Slughorn staying on with Potions and Slytherin! Still leaves DADA, transfiguration, and Gryffindor...

 

[mcnuss]

I think one of the things that is upsetting me that I haven't really seen mentioned....Fawkes. He really was one of my favorite entities in the book....I wonder where he has gone? Will he come back...will he belong to someone else or will he just be free? Maybe it is because Fawkes left that I felt the truth of Dumbledore's death.

My DD11 came up with this theory: Harry will kill Voldemort with Gryffindor's sword which Fawkes will again deliver to him just when he needs it.

I also think there is more to the Phoenix references and that they are tied somehow to DD. I do not think it is a coincidence that his "pet" was a Phoenix. Finally, I am more convinced than ever that DD was asking Snape to kill him. I believe it fits in with the whole double-agent plot (who is he doubling) plus I think that DD would be all about the protecting the good of the many, vs the good of the few (ala Spock in Star Trek!).

 

[padams]

I also think that DD's army will resurface in Book 7 based on the references in HBP to Neville and Luna missing the DA as well as HP's statement to Scrimgeour that HP is DD's man through and through. Also, the sorting hat's statements about the 4 houses coming together must be significant. I think Draco will be the (or one of the) Slytherin member(s).

I agree that HP will return to Hogwarts for Book 7 for additional instruction and to have his final encounter with LV. Snape tells HP as Snape is leaving Hogwarts that HP still has to learn to close his mind and perform non-verbal spells. I think HP will realize that he needs those skills to fight LV, and actually try to learn them during his final year. I think Draco will be HP's occlumency "tutor", perhaps through the DA. Snape says to Draco that it is clear that Aunt Bellatrix has been teaching Draco occlumency. Snape couldn't figure out exactly what Draco's plans were for his mission. If Snape had known of the plan's details, then I think that Snape would have been with Draco and the death eaters from the outset of the "execution" of Draco's plan. However, as we know from McGonagall, she had sent another professor to get Snape from his office, and from others' recounting of the evening, Snape shows up after the other death eaters and Draco are already in the tower. If Snape is so skilled at occlumency, then why couldn't he "read" Draco's mind to learn Draco's plan. Draco must be quite good at closing his mind, something HP hasn't be able to master yet.

 

[padams]

McNuss- Your dd is brilliant! I like the idea of Fawkes bringing the Gryffindor sword to HP. The heir of Gryffindor defeats the heir of Slytherin (I think HP will discover in Godric's Hollow that he is the heir to Gryffindor).

 

[GADISNEYGIRL]

Luna and Neville will undoubtedly play a part, especially as there is now the notion that they, too, are an "item"!

I definitely think Fawkes will somehow be involved, as well!!

 

[mcnuss]

The heir of Gryffindor defeats the heir of Slytherin (I think HP will discover in Godric's Hollow that he is the heir to Gryffindor).

Oh my goodness, I had not thought of that. Outstanding!

 

[blueangel]

On the RAB question, mugglenet lists Amelia Bones full name as Amelia Susan Bones...

 

[mcnuss]

What about it being someone's maiden name? I would love for it to be a girl or woman!

 

[AmyA]

I reread some of the book last night and reread the death scene twice. I am now VERY convinced that Snape and Dumbledore planned DD's death. There were three things that didn't register as important to me when I read it the first time that I now think are very important.

When Draco has DD cornered and is crowing some about DD leaving Hogwarts that night, DD says (paraphrasing here, because I don't have the book with me at work) "But I came back...after a fashion". It's almost as if DD is saying he is back, but not himself---more than just physically weak. Also, right before the other DEs enter the room, Draco points out that DD is "at his mercy." DD contradicts that by saying (again with the paraphrasing) "No, Draco, the only mercy that matters now is mine." Finally, Snape just about has a kitten when Harry calls him a coward--and Snape killing Dumbledore on Dumbledore's orders, in addition to double crossing Voldy are NOT the actions of a cowardly man.

My theory behind these comments is that DD figured out early on what Voldy had ordered Draco to do. He also knew that if Draco didn't go through with it, then Draco (and probably Narcissa) were dead. So, he made Snape take the Unbreakable Vow and promise to kill him instead of making Draco do it, thus preserving Draco's life...and, more importantly, his soul. Then, when he figured out the location of the cave-dwelling hoarcrux, he figured he may as well destroy another hoarcrux in the process of being murdered.

I am leaning to believing that there may have been 2 hoarcruxes in that cave---the locket AND the liquid. Anyone who drank the liquid to destroy the locket hoarcrux would have suffered a fools mission, as they, themselves, became a new hoarcrux. Thus, by having Snape kill him, DD showed the ultimate mercy on Draco and he destroyed a hoarcrux--himself. I also think Snape's look of loathing and revulsion right before killing DD has nothing to do with his feelings for DD. Instead, I think Snape, through leglimancy, was hearing DD say that is is up to Snape to now be Harry's strongest ally. Until now, DD sort of was able to act as a go between for Harry and Snape. To overcome Voldy though, Snape and Harry are going to have to find a way to trust each other and work together. Snape's magical skill and his inside knowledge of how Voldy works makes him Harry's most powerful weapon outside of himself.

I also could be totally wrong...I love speculating, though!

 

[Aneille]

I also think Snape's look of loathing and revulsion right before killing DD has nothing to do with his feelings for DD. Instead, I think Snape, through leglimancy, was hearing DD say that is is up to Snape to now be Harry's strongest ally. Until now, DD sort of was able to act as a go between for Harry and Snape. To overcome Voldy though, Snape and Harry are going to have to find a way to trust each other and work together. Snape's magical skill and his inside knowledge of how Voldy works makes him Harry's most powerful weapon outside of himself.

I also could be totally wrong...I love speculating, though!

Interesting point about the drink itself being the real hocrux, but then how do you explain RAB getting the locket. Or did RAB steal the locket before it was a hocrux and then Voldmort but the locket and potion back after killing RAB for his hocrux sacrafice, thus making the potion itself the hocrux.

I just re-read the whole last battle scene of HBP as well. And it I never thought of Snape and Dumbledore actually speaking to each other with their minds. It is totally possible that the whole Snape/Dumbledore thing wasn't a plan from the beginning (which I do think is too complicated especially since I think Draco was able to keep Snape out of most of his thoughts), but rather Dumbledore at the scene fills Snape in through thoughts and then tells him to kill him. I think that is more plausable a scenario if who want to believe Snape is really a good guy in disguise. I think it also goes back to the agrument Snape and Dumbledore have that is overheard. Not direct quote but I thought it came down to Dumbledore wanting Snape to try harder and investigate more. I think Snape was hitting blank walls with Draco.

Also in the beginning Snape claims to Nacissa and her sister that he knows the Lord Voldemorts plan, but he actually never says what it is. He could have been bluffing (trying to find out what the plan really is) and then at the moment when he comes to the top of the tower realizes what he agreed to.

Who knows though. Snape really could just be the bad guy.

But I've always got this feeling that Snape is someone that simply struggles with good/evil. I think he has a true hatred towards Harry's father and thus Harry and coming to grips with Harry or death as his only saviour from Voldemort. Because until Voldemort is really gone, Snape will always have to have some ties to the Death Eaters or he will be killed be Voldemort.