Harry and Meghan Netflix documentary

[TipsyTraveler]

Bare hands digging? Hospital wrapped up a package of human remains and gave it to them?
It sounds creepy, likely illegal and untrue.

Sounds completely true. (Creepy is a matter of personal opinion and illegal depends on California law.) I’d guess he was bare-hands digging because it was in the sand on the beach down the hill from their house. Banyan trees grow in sandy soil. If the miscarriage happened prior to 10 weeks then the hospital would have discharged her to complete it at home. Miscarriages can take hours, days, or weeks to complete. I’ve had a couple that took months. There wouldn’t be much to bury at that stage — a quarter-sized clot, basically. And no, FTR, I’ve never buried the remains of a miscarriage because I’m not sentimental about those kinds of things, but I understand some people are so no judgement from me.

 

[mom2rtk]

I think that you underestimate what the Palace can do. They choose not to press their influence with the papers, there is a difference. And again, we are not talking about the regular press, but the gossip rags. Freedom of speech does not necessarily extend to lies, especially if they can show that it causes harm.

I assume we know this is how it went because Harry and Meghan said so? I'm sorry, but they aren't reliable sources in my book any more.

 

[Lilsia]

I do understand what you are saying, but not sure what you mean by the Royal Family standing behind them. What does that look like? In my opinion they did. There were plenty of stories regarding Meghan in a good light. When dealing with the media, not everything will be positive. Negative sells. Who cares who made who cry at the wedding. It's so dumb. There both are right and both are wrong. It's what happens during weddings. Life comes with drama. To release personal messages is so rude. They know Kate can not and will not be able to respond. I'm sure they both have a stake in the claim. She gave her flowers and said she was sorry so grow up. Why even talk about it. You can't go back, only forward.

Harry and Meghan are putting it all out there to be judged. If they went away quietly, no one would be talking about them.

What do you suggest one is to do with the media? Some of the issues they have will never change. If you feed the media, it won't ever go away. Some things just won't change. I am sure it is almost impossible to figure out who is saying what about who. There isn't enough time in the day. Harry and Meghan are guilty of exactly what they are complaining about. The way the Queen handled things for the most part must have worked because up till now, most rumors and negative press have gone away with little comment from the Palace. Life isn't sunshine and lolly pops.

It is very hard to listen to them whine about Ikea furniture and small houses when most people today are trying to afford to heat their home and feed their kids. It's really ridiculous.

I do agree with you, I'm sure their rich and privileged life comes with all kinds of negative limelight that I would not enjoy. It's just most of the stuff he is complaining about in the book is stupid.

Also, he claims Meghan saved him from alcohol and drug abuse, yet he goes on to say he stole laughing gass during the birth of his son, and he's smoking pot off his balcony. It's just crazy. Some stuff is meant to keep to yourself. I think if they owned some of the behavior as their own fault maybe it wouldn't be so laughable.

In my opinion he is coming off as a brat and not grateful. One must balance the good with the bad. They seem to have lost sight of any of the good.

What I find remarkable is how everyone assumes that they know what is going on. Up until Harry started speaking, EVERYONE blamed Meghan. SHE was the one that was alienating him from his family. She was the one that had all of the issues and dragging poor Harry into it. Funny how now that Harry is telling his story, that now he is a "spoiled brat". So many people are so sure that they just KNOW what is going on behind the scenes and making outlandish statements. It is kind of funny how emotionally invested some are in this situation and how angry some are. You don't even know these people.

 

[Lilsia]

The RF realized long ago that engaging the press/tabloids repeatedly simply opened themselves up for an endless dialogue of -- do you still kick your dog? When they do issue an official statement in response to something it tends to attract attention by virtue of the fact it's not a regular occurrence, drawing attention to a specific boundary that was violated. Why do they need to bother answering petty nonsense that they assume rational people won't accept at face value or private matters that are no one's business and best left unsaid?

IMO when someone takes great pains to go public with bitter claims about the behavior of others and wounds inflicted by their repeated inability to tell the truth it's probably best to begin first by sweeping one's own porch and then step out in a way that demonstrates complete veracity in one's own accounts. Fingers, toes, nose, ears, hands, feet -- all vulnerable in ways requiring substantial medical intervention long before an appendage significantly protected simply by its location. Tabloid writers are tipping their hats to the masterful stroke of not only creating a salacious anecdote to capture eyeballs, but further gilding it by tying it to one of the most significant life events of the archnemesis. I'm no tabloid writer, but I think that might be what they consider a two-fer.

If I were putting money on it I'd wager that the Queen's death did cause changes in the book. Not out of respect, that's painfully clear. Once he knew the person who was capable of dropping the hammer on him in a way the public would respect exited the scene Harry decided to fully flex what he sees as his power. It's really tragic to watch someone with absolutely zero insight race down such a destructive path. Hopefully he manages to stop or slow down before a brick wall or cliff appears in front of him. The history of the royal family is full of tragic figures.

I think that you are misunderstand me. And for the record, we all KNOW that the "palace sources" are the Royal family so let's not play games here. What I was saying is that they could very easily have sent out an official statement standing behind both Catherine and Meghan, condemning any and all lies and rumors about them. That in itself would have made a huge difference. But as it stand now, with no "official" word from the Palace, it is an open market on them. They have squashed plenty of stories that they think mattered to them. The fallacy that some think that the RF has no control over this is laughable, of course they do.

 

[Karin1984]

I think that you underestimate what the Palace can do. They choose not to press their influence with the papers, there is a difference. And again, we are not talking about the regular press, but the gossip rags. Freedom of speech does not necessarily extend to lies, especially if they can show that it causes harm.

No, I don't underestimate it. I understand the reason why the Palace decides not to.

 

[Marrila]

Sounds completely true. (Creepy is a matter of personal opinion and illegal depends on California law.) I’d guess he was bare-hands digging because it was in the sand on the beach down the hill from their house. Banyan trees grow in sandy soil. If the miscarriage happened prior to 10 weeks then the hospital would have discharged her to complete it at home. Miscarriages can take hours, days, or weeks to complete. I’ve had a couple that took months. There wouldn’t be much to bury at that stage — a quarter-sized clot, basically. And no, FTR, I’ve never buried the remains of a miscarriage because I’m not sentimental about those kinds of things, but I understand some people are so no judgement from me.

First, I'm sorry for your loss. I'm commenting because so much is misleading in their story.
I don't believe the hospital gave them a package of human remains to bury as they liked. It's very disturbing if they did chose a public beach.
There are laws in California about how and where human remains are placed or disposed. I believe hospitals follow them.
If the couple wanted the remains legally buried, they only needed to let the hospital know. The hospital would have facilitated the transfer to the couple's chosen funeral home. Then they would handle the details of the interment.

 

[cabanafrau]

I think that you are misunderstand me. And for the record, we all KNOW that the "palace sources" are the Royal family so let's not play games here. What I was saying is that they could very easily have sent out an official statement standing behind both Catherine and Meghan, condemning any and all lies and rumors about them. That in itself would have made a huge difference. But as it stand now, with no "official" word from the Palace, it is an open market on them. They have squashed plenty of stories that they think mattered to them. The fallacy that some think that the RF has no control over this is laughable, of course they do.

Actually I don't KNOW that "palaces sources" are the Royal Family. Do I think that there are times that's the case, yes.

I also think that there are staff who act of their own accord, whatever their motivations may or may not be. If flogging stories about the Royal Family for profit is okay if it's done to take care of your family Harry of all people should understand if staff has done the same over the years.

How is it you KNOW for the record what "palace sources" are with absolute certainty? IMO stating you KNOW for the record when in fact you have no personal knowledge NOT the same as stating what you think you know or what your opinion is. One is suitable for and legitimately accepted on a discussion board where randos from the public with zero connection to the people and events are discussing the matter. The other is simply hyperbole.

ETA I also think it's laughable to suggest that even those with the wealth and influence of the Royal Family have broad control over the media, especially in an era where media includes mainstream, international and social. The Royal Family doesn't even enjoy the same cozy relationship with the BBC as it once did in decades past.

 

[Lilsia]

No, I don't underestimate it. I understand the reason why the Palace decides not to.

Because they prefer the "deniability" aspect of it so they go through "palace sources" instead. If they started making official statements then when something nasty comes out of the palace, they can't use the excuse that they "never comment" on anything. I find that deceitful and petty. They play the game from the background but make no mistake, they are playing.

 

[Lilsia]

Actually I don't KNOW that "palaces sources" are the Royal Family. Do I think that there are times that's the case, yes.

I also think that there are staff who act of their own accord, whatever their motivations may or may not be. If flogging stories about the Royal Family for profit is okay if it's done to take care of your family Harry of all people should understand if staff has done the same over the years.

How is it you KNOW for the record what "palace sources" are with absolute certainty? IMO stating you KNOW for the record when in fact you have no personal knowledge NOT the same as stating what you think you know or what your opinion is. One is suitable for and legitimately accepted on a discussion board where randos from the public with zero connection to the people and events are discussing the matter. The other is simply hyperbole.

Don't be naive.

 

[Karin1984]

Sounds completely true. (Creepy is a matter of personal opinion and illegal depends on California law.) I’d guess he was bare-hands digging because it was in the sand on the beach down the hill from their house. Banyan trees grow in sandy soil. If the miscarriage happened prior to 10 weeks then the hospital would have discharged her to complete it at home. Miscarriages can take hours, days, or weeks to complete. I’ve had a couple that took months. There wouldn’t be much to bury at that stage — a quarter-sized clot, basically. And no, FTR, I’ve never buried the remains of a miscarriage because I’m not sentimental about those kinds of things, but I understand some people are so no judgement from me.

I'm sorry for your loss.
I was thinking about it on my way home. As the pregnancy wasn't announced, most likely Meghan was under 12 weeks along. Whatever is left will not be big. I understand why they want to take it with them and feel the need to bury it for closure. It's that it might be buried in a public place.

 

[Karin1984]

You know when things are bad when your die-hard supporters are saying 'this was not a good idea'.
Both Omid Scobie and Dr. Shola Mos-Shogbamimu have spoken out against some things Harry said.

Prince Harry and Meghan have to be 'careful' in months ahead, warns ally Omid Scobie​

Prince Harry and Meghan Markle need to be "careful" in the months ahead, ally Omid Scobie has said. The royal biographer urged the couple to "move on" to their work in the United States following the release of Harry's memoir Spare.
Scobie noted that the Duke's high-profile media interviews and new book won't help him reconcile with the Royal Family as the Firm "wouldn't trust him".

"I don't know if it is going to help with the reconciliation that he talks about because this is now a family that - we hear from royal sources in the papers today - feel they can't trust him with any conversation moving forwards. I don't know if he thought about that as an outcome of doing this book," he said on ITV This Morning.

Meghan and Harry supporter Dr Shola Mos-Shogbamimu warns the Duke is 'undermining' his own fight against racism and 'needs to unpick his learning about unconscious bias and racism'​

Lawyer and activist Dr Shola Mos-Shogbamimu, who has previously supported the Sussexes, today claimed there is 'absolutely' a 'problem of racism in the Royal Family'. Taking aim at Harry's defence of the late Queen's former lady-in-waiting Lady Susan Hussey after she was accused of racism, she called the Duke's repeated attempts to draw a distinction between racism and unconscious bias in his interviews 'disingenuous'.

She told Sky News presenter Kay Burley: 'He's clearly on a journey of learning and the good thing that he's said is that he's willing to learn. But he needs to unpick his learning about unconscious bias and racism, they are the same thing, there is no difference.

'And him not coming out and clearly stating that there is a serious issue of racism, it undermines his commitment to be part of the solution, and so when he uses examples like Lady Hussey not meaning any harm to Ngozi Fulani, or saying for instance no we didn't say they were racist when they raised concerns about the colour of our son's skin, to me it's just disingenuous'.

 

[TipsyTraveler]

First, I'm sorry for your loss. I'm commenting because so much is misleading in their story.
I don't believe the hospital gave them a package of human remains to bury as they liked. It's very disturbing if they did chose a public beach.
There are laws in California about how and where human remains are placed or disposed. I believe hospitals follow them.
If the couple wanted the remains legally buried, they only needed to let the hospital know. The hospital would have facilitated the transfer to the couple's chosen funeral home. Then they would handle the details of the interment.

Did he claim the hospital gave them remains to take home? I must’ve missed that part. I assumed the remains were passed at home so the hospital wouldn’t have been involved in any disposal.

 

[Marrila]

Did he claim the hospital gave them remains to take home? I must’ve missed that part. I assumed the remains were passed at home so the hospital wouldn’t have been involved in any disposal.

Yes he did. He stated the hospital gave them a package.

 

[Karin1984]

Meghan probably had a spontaneous abortion (miscarriage) at home and they took the contents out of the toilet or something like that. I doubt a hospital was involved.

Did he claim the hospital gave them remains to take home? I must’ve missed that part. I assumed the remains were passed at home so the hospital wouldn’t have been involved in any disposal.

According to the book and to the opinion piece Meghan wrote for the New York Times (6 months after the event) they went to the hospital. Meghan had abdominal pain and started bleeding. They went to the hospital.

Below is a sentence in the article from the Express, they make it sound that it happened in the hospital.
The couple left the hospital clutching a "tiny package" and travelled to a "secret place".

https://www.express.co.uk/news/royal/1719308/Prince-Harry-Spare-Meghan-Markle-miscarriage

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Paul Burrell, Princess Diana’s former butler and friend (ie someone who DOES know these people), speaks out.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...rrell-hits-angry-privileged-Prince-Harry.html

”Paul Burrell today hit back at criticism from Prince Harry, saying he doesn't recognise 'the young man I see today'.

Mr Burrell said: 'I first met him in his mummy's tummy. I don't recognise the young man I see today. That's not the boy I knew.

'What I see now is an angry, petulant, privileged prince who is constantly blaming other people and not taking accountability on his part.'

Mr Burrell, 64, served as a footman for the Queen before working for Diana for ten years until her death in 1997.

Speaking from his home in Florida, he said the Duke of Sussex had 'changed fundamentally' and that his mother would be 'appalled'.

'She would be angry at these personal, vindictive revelations which don't just undermine Harry, but his country, his family, the institution – which his mother was very proud of – and his late grandmother's legacy,' he said.

Mr Burrell blamed Harry's wife, Meghan, for the duke's 'vindictive' behaviour – claiming she was the one 'driving him behind the scenes'.

He said: 'This isn't just a book written by Harry… Meghan's had a huge influence in this book. She's beside him steering him on his path. You can't just blame Harry. You have to blame the both of them.

'I don't like to see the rug being pulled beneath the feet of our King and Harry's brother, who is on his way to being King. And the snipes that have gone forward about Kate [the Princess of Wales]...

'Kate has never put a foot wrong. But the other side of the story will never be heard because the royals believe there's great dignity in silence.'

 

[Pea-n-Me]

According to the book and to the opinion piece Meghan wrote for the New York Times (6 months after the event) they went to the hospital. Meghan had abdominal pain and started bleeding. They went to the hospital.

Below is a sentence in the article from the Express, they make it sound that it happened in the hospital.
The couple left the hospital clutching a "tiny package" and travelled to a "secret place".

https://www.express.co.uk/news/royal/1719308/Prince-Harry-Spare-Meghan-Markle-miscarriage

Well that’s no doubt going to ruffle some regulatory feathers. Though, not sure how CA handles these things.

 

[snappy]

Ok... W.T.F? Is this not a crime? I do hope he owns the ground. And gruesome to think about, but I hope he dug a deep deep grave. What if a child or a dog starts playing and digging around?

Prince Harry details moment he buried unborn child in grave he dug with bare hands​

The Duke of Sussex said the moment was one of only four in which he had felt "totally hopeless".​

Prince Harry has told of the devastating moment he learned his wife had a miscarriage in his new book and his experience burying his child. Writing in Spare, the Prince discussed his hopelessness when Meghan Markle experienced abdominal pains one morning at their new home in the US. And he disclosed the moment he dug a hole with his bare hands and set their "tiny package" into the soil below a tree at a "secret place".

[...]

The Prince said he buried his unborn child under a banyan tree somewhere "only we knew".

He said: "Under a spreading banyan tree, while Meg wept, I dug a hole with my hands and set the tiny package softly in the ground."

Maybe disclosing the above in his book was cathartic for Harry. As a poster said above, it might be difficult for their kids to read the book and see this some future day.

 

[Karin1984]

I'm collecting all the reviews from the bigger news outlets. Some are 2-3 pages long! Are book reviews always this long or is this one special?

 

[cabanafrau]

Don't be naive.

You've repeatedly replied to multiple people that we don't understand, misunderstand, are playing games, are naive and/or are assuming we know what's going on when we couldn't possibly -- yet you KNOW for the record what "palace sources" are. How is it that you have such factual, personal knowledge of the people and the events? You do seem to be taking any hint of disagreement with your statements personally, so I suppose it's technically possible. I'll refrain from sharing my opinion of the likelihood.

 

[cabanafrau]

Maybe disclosing the above in his book was cathartic for Harry. As a poster said above, it might be difficult for their kids to read the book and see this some future day.

It's never easy to change the impression that you're not credible or to be believed. If that's the primary result when all the dust settles that's quite a heavy burden he's laying on his children's heads when they move into the years where they go out into the community at school and try to make friends.