Girl on plane not able to use bathroom

[sonofanarchy]

I always find it funny - You can't use the bathroom while the plane is on the ground traveling at about 2 miles per hour, yet you can when it's 30,000 feet in the air traveling 500 miles per hour.

 

[sonofanarchy]

The same can be said about unruly passengers who don't think they should follow the rules- Don't Fly

Again, no where did it say the passenger was unruly.

If a passenger was having a heart attack, should the not notify the FA and just wait for the plane to be in the air? Of course, apples to oranges. My point being, obviously, the FA could have done something to help out and chose not to.

 

[EMode]

1.As a parent of a child with a spastic bladder, I can assure you, it's not that simple.
2.What else could be done? Roll done the window?

In this case the child could have been put in a pull-up. That is pretty simple.

 

[jodifla]

Again, turns out the "rules" here are QUITE arbitrary, and the FA has the discretion.

Here's an interesting quote from an actual person in the industry:

"As a member of cabin crew for a major airline I will admit there are a lot of frustrated and unhappy militant types of flight attendants out there. Unfortunately Jet Blue historically has had plenty of sour grapes - which shows there is something not right in the management end of their company. My company, while in training, has informed our crew members to be aware of the needs of the passenger. Furthermore, any experienced flight attendant would've called the flight deck to make them aware the cabin wasn't secure and allowed this child to use the lavatory. "

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/14/urinating-child-jet-blue_n_5495173.html

 

[sonofanarchy]

Posters keep referring to the FA's response. Not having seen any indication of any contact with that or any other FA in any of the articles, all we seem to have is the mother's version of what was said and in what tone.

My guess is JetBlue is telling her to keep quiet. They've had enough bad press over the past few years. They don't need more.

 

[OceanAnnie]

I am amazed at the lack of compassion for a child having an accident and the mother being in a difficult position of comforting her child, cleaning up in tight quarters, and embarrassment. IMO you can't tell the mother's tone. I read it as pleading for a break, not demanding. She wasn't in a position to demand anything. She had to know that because of the situation she was in.

The child was sitting in urine. What would people have her do?

Strange how the mother is not given the benefit of the doubt at any turn.

I agree the mom could've done things differently up front. But then there were a lot of things that could've gone differently.

 

[sonofanarchy]

In this case the child could have been put in a pull-up. That is pretty simple.

I agree, but they weren't. It's not the FA's job to teach parenting though. It's their job to make everybody safe AND comfortable. She could easily have gone to the pilot and at least informed him that the little girl had to go. If nothing else, get the mother a cup.

 

[Gracie09]

Again, no where did it say the passenger was unruly.

If a passenger was having a heart attack, should the not notify the FA and just wait for the plane to be in the air? Of course, apples to oranges. My point being, obviously, the FA could have done something to help out and chose not to.

Except one is a true medical emergency that would necessitate immediate treatment by a doctor and the other isn't. One someone could die if they wait and the other they won't. Pretty easy to disguish the two. Oh except that one "emergency" could have been prevented by purchasing a pull up for about a dollar but the adult in charge didn't

 

[pioneer89]

ETA: I don't fly, so these are legitimate questions. At what point is it an emergency for the person?

The more I think about it, that's a really interesting question.

If an adult passenger were to say to a FA: "If I don't get up right now, I'll go in my pants!" is that an emergency? Now it is up to the crew: let the person soil themselves, delay the flight, or let the person go, and keep the plane moving.

I've flown a lot, and aside from the pre-9/11 people just getting up to go, I've never seen this happen. I'd be very surprised if airlines didn't have FAs practice this exact scenario. I wonder if they have policies, or if this is a 'deal with it the best you can' scenario?

 

[kaytieeldr]

1.As a parent of a child with a spastic bladder, I can assure you, it's not that simple.
2.What else could be done? Roll done the window?

1. Given your awareness of your child's medical situation, you plan ahead. If that means protective undergarments on a flight, that's what it means.
2. See 1.

What you don't do is ignore the instructions of the Flight Crew.

 

[OceanAnnie]

Sounds like you should let your child sit in urine and shut up about it.

Don't let the child cry too much or you will be kicked off.

 

[sonofanarchy]

Except one is a true medical emergency that would necessitate immediate treatment by a doctor and the other isn't. One someone could die if they wait and the other they won't. Pretty easy to disguish the two. Oh except that one "emergency" could have been prevented by purchasing a pull up for about a dollar but the adult in charge didn't

Yes, we are well aware the mother screwed up. The hanging will be in the town square at 12:00PM sharp today.

 

[sonofanarchy]

1. Given your awareness of your child's medical situation, you plan ahead. If that means protective undergarments on a flight, that's what it means.
2. See 1.

What you don't do is ignore the instructions of the Flight Crew.

Come on.....It's a 3 year old kid. Do you have any idea how quickly it comes on? Maybe she was running late. Maybe it just slipped her mind. In any case, she screwed up. Why make the little girl suffer?

 

[Gracie09]

Yes, we are well aware the mother screwed up. The hanging will be in the town square at 12:00PM sharp today.

Is she right next to the fa? Because people seem to be ready to hang her for doing her job and enforcing the rules but let the mom go for deciding not to do her job as a parent.

 

[EMode]

Again, no where did it say the passenger was unruly.

If a passenger was having a heart attack, should the not notify the FA and just wait for the plane to be in the air? Of course, apples to oranges. My point being, obviously, the FA could have done something to help out and chose not to.

I was speaking in general terms not about this particular FA. I totally agree she could have handled the situation much differently.

I agree, but they weren't. It's not the FA's job to teach parenting though. It's their job to make everybody safe AND comfortable. She could easily have gone to the pilot and at least informed him that the little girl had to go. If nothing else, get the mother a cup.

I totally agree but I'm sure there is more to this story than what we are reading. I was wondering how long the delay was, if they didn't return to the tarmac how much longer would they have waited there. I don't believe that was in any of the articles I read. Do we know if she spoke to the pilot and knew they would be taking off soon?
I also put myself in the mind of the FA, if she lets the little girl go, how many others are going to need to go right then and there? Maybe none, maybe everyone.
Taking the plane back to alert security was over the top IMO but the mom had already proven that she was willing to not comply. Like you said the FA's job is to make everyone safe and comfortable (including the mom and her child), what if mom got her kid up in mid flight while the seatbelt light was on for turbulence and refused to sit and buckle?
I don't envy FA's, they have to judge a situation right then and there and have a plane full of passengers to make safe, comfortable and happy at the same time. It can't be easy all the time.

Anyway, there could have been alot of things done to avoid what happened. I don't fault the mom for how she was treated but I do fault her for not being prepared for a (common) situation. And I fault the FA for not being a little more considerate and for going overboard. At the very least JB should have refunded their money and even given them tix somewhere else. I don't think they needed to give 5K to charity, although its a nice gesture. (that we'll all be paying for when they raise their tix prices)

 

[kaytieeldr]

My guess is JetBlue is telling her to keep quiet. They've had enough bad press over the past few years. They don't need more.

I'm sure that just as with any sensible and successful business, company policy prohibits employees discussing things with any medium.

From the Fox link: "One of Deveraux’s daughters, Summers, needed to use the bathroom, and began to cry. When her mother tried to help her to the bathroom, a flight attendant refused to let them stand up, forcing the child to urinate on herself and the seat.

“She snapped at me, ‘No sit down,’” Deveraux said.

Deveraux attempted to stand up again to clean up the mess, and the flight attendant yelled at her a second time. “And I said, ‘please give me a break. My daughter had an accident because you wouldn’t let me take her to the bathroom. After I clean it up I will sit down.’ She turned around and reported it to the pilot,” Deveraux said.

 

[sonofanarchy]

I'm sure that just as with any sensible and successful business, company policy prohibits employees discussing things with any medium.

From the Fox link: "One of Deveraux’s daughters, Summers, needed to use the bathroom, and began to cry. When her mother tried to help her to the bathroom, a flight attendant refused to let them stand up, forcing the child to urinate on herself and the seat.

“She snapped at me, ‘No sit down,’” Deveraux said.

Deveraux attempted to stand up again to clean up the mess, and the flight attendant yelled at her a second time. “And I said, ‘please give me a break. My daughter had an accident because you wouldn’t let me take her to the bathroom. After I clean it up I will sit down.’ She turned around and reported it to the pilot,” Deveraux said.

Remember the FA who worked for I believe it was SW, a few years ago he flipped out on an unruly customer, then quit? That guy wouldn't get off the news. Something tells me he was just waiting for an excuse.

 

[Jennasis]

I always find it funny - You can't use the bathroom while the plane is on the ground traveling at about 2 miles per hour, yet you can when it's 30,000 feet in the air traveling 500 miles per hour.

On the ground, the plane is apt to stop and start abruptly which could toss a person about the lavatory/cabin.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I always find it funny - You can't use the bathroom while the plane is on the ground traveling at about 2 miles per hour, yet you can when it's 30,000 feet in the air traveling 500 miles per hour.

Nobody's going to hit the plane while it's in flight. The plane isn't going to stop short while it's in flight. Again, the regulations are completely about safety.

Sounds like you should let your child sit in urine and shut up about it.

Don't let the child cry too much or you will be kicked off.

Child crying had nothing to do with the plane being turned around. That was instigated by the mother refusing to comply with Flight Crew directions.

Come on.....It's a 3 year old kid. Do you have any idea how quickly it comes on? Maybe she was running late. Maybe it just slipped her mind. In any case, she screwed up. Why make the little girl suffer?

I'm confused. I was responding specifically to the child with the medical condition.

 

[luvsJack]

If you have trained several children then you know they eventually get pretty adept at holding it when need be. By older five year old can probably hd it longer than I can at this point. Is it uncomfortable, sure but it happens. But when we fly I limit there liquid in take for several hours before and have them go right before we get on the plane because you never know when you could get in a flight when the seatbelt light is on the entire time and your stuck in your seat for hours. An adult who cannot hold it is responsible for making their own personal protection arrangements. There are commercials for the items all the time.
It's about personal responsibility.

SOME children do, yes. Not all by any stretch of the imagination.

Not every child (well above potty training age) or adult that has a one time emergency has had a need for personal protection before. It is a little much to assume that no one every is going to have a situation where they are not going to be prepared. The human body doesn't always work that way.

As mentioned before, if you're on a plane and have to stay in your seat, but have to go NOW, notify the FA. Don't get up on your own. The FA (with probable consultation with the pilot) will determine if an exception can be made.

Ok, that makes sense. So there is at least the possibility.



Here's the thing with most rules. No one company can have a policy about every possible scenario. Things happen that throw those rules way out of balance. Someone with a job like an FA has to be able to deal with situations that come up that make it impossible not to go against "the rule". Everything cannot be that black and white when you are dealing with that many people on a daily basis. Part of being good at a job like that is to learn how to deal with curve balls.

Both sides could have done things differently. Neither one needs to be tarred and feathered, both sides can hold some blame.